Behringer Eurolive B215XL 15" 2-Way as L/R Mains - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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post #541 of 710 Old 12-07-2014, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by DocOrange88 View Post
I have compared them directly to QSC and while QSC has some deep punch, the mid and highs sound very muddy(we are talking about a 600+ dollar speaker self powered). The B212XL have a level of clarity I've not heard. It really bothers me now on other peoples setups where you have to turn stuff up and down because stuff gets too loud suddenly.

I did run a Boston VR12 as my center before switching completely to the B212XL's up front. The VR12 honestly sounded pretty good and matched up nicely.

I'm interested in seeing what people think of the B212's as surrounds. I'm running 8330A's as my surrounds and wonder if switching to the B215 for my front left and right and moving the B212XL to my rears and setting my 4 8330A's to my left and right surrounds will make a more impactful experience.

I hate turning stuff up and down and these speakers fix that problem.

Once you start going top tier I don't think you'll have as much problem mixing speakers. I wanted a setup where I could watch movies and mix surround for films all at home, I have that now. You are going to get a theater like experience from the B's, when I get done watching a movie I have to pitch myself to remember I'm at home not at a movie theater.

P.S. 125" 1080P 3D helps sell that last bit as well.
I'm going to a/b them with Ascend CBM-170SE which I've been using for surrounds. They're really nice speakers with high efficiency (91db); actually tested these as mains compared to the Sierra 2's and they kind of spanked them for movies; certainly woke me up as far as appreciating dynamics as I never used them for mains until recently.
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post #542 of 710 Old 12-07-2014, 06:17 PM
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I have mixed and tested the LSR2325p's with their matched subwoofer and they did not give me the accuracy I needed. I would have been served better with the B212XL's. Taking things from my current setup to a full blown JBL theater...I get accurate sound to what I get at home now. Maybe that is a good enough reason...
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post #543 of 710 Old 12-07-2014, 06:41 PM
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I have mixed and tested the LSR2325p's with their matched subwoofer and they did not give me the accuracy I needed. I would have been served better with the B212XL's. Taking things from my current setup to a full blown JBL theater...I get accurate sound to what I get at home now. Maybe that is a good enough reason...
I had the same speakers before the B212XL. I kept the 10" sub, because its awesome. I mix for surround sound for film. Cinema JBLs batch well. I am running JBL 8330As for surround.
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post #544 of 710 Old 12-07-2014, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
Has anyone directly compared the Mackie to the Behringer?
I'd too love to see the Mackie c200 and/or c300z compared head to head to the Behringer B212XL and/or B215XL.
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post #545 of 710 Old 12-08-2014, 09:18 AM
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I'd too love to see the Mackie c200 and/or c300z compared head to head to the Behringer B212XL and/or B215XL.
I look forward to seeing what is heard(I think that makes sense). I do expect most systems to sound muddy as they push too much bass to the low end and garble up the highs. Mackie from my experience is notorious for adding too much bass. Resulting in many of the mixes I've worked with in the past to sound rather flat without any low end on a regular system. I switched to JBLs LSR 5" studio monitors away from Mackie anything because for film its too much boom and you won't get it in a real theater setup. Just my thoughts please check it out and let us know.
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post #546 of 710 Old 12-08-2014, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
I used to thing infrasonics were important but recently I've applied a high pass filter at 30 Hz to my subs EQ and it's put an end to a number of room rattles, yet I'm hard pressed to find anything missing from the overall listening experience.
Back at the dawn of subwoofing, the engineers at Universal did tests to determine the low-end extension necessary for Sensurround. They concluded that response below 30 Hz was superfluous -- did not add much to the experience (not to mention the additional burden on the system). The effects subsystem, HPF and speakers were designed accordingly.

Although I am not quite up to date on the latest developments in the cinema houses, I would be surprised if much has changed. Audible output below 30 Hz is much more easily obtainable in a small room or pressure chamber (van) than it is in a large free-field auditorium. Although infrasonics may be present on the soundtrack, they are surely processed differently in the cinema versus some of the more extreme vertigo-inducing HT rigs here.
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post #547 of 710 Old 12-08-2014, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocOrange88 View Post
I look forward to seeing what is heard(I think that makes sense). I do expect most systems to sound muddy as they push too much bass to the low end and garble up the highs. Mackie from my experience is notorious for adding too much bass. Resulting in many of the mixes I've worked with in the past to sound rather flat without any low end on a regular system. I switched to JBLs LSR 5" studio monitors away from Mackie anything because for film its too much boom and you won't get it in a real theater setup. Just my thoughts please check it out and let us know.

The PA speakers of yesteryear are not the PA speakers of today. My cheap $200 Mackies claim -3dB from 89hz to 20khz.

I've measured them to be close to that in my room with the ominimic. Room reflection descrepancies and all.
Mackie C200 - under the hood
Post 31


I think that's the message on these various PA speakers for cinema enthusiasts! These aren't the PA speakers we are familiar with from a decade ortwo ago. Which was basically “bad sound loud”. These are still inexpensive, but the sound quality is way higher, the specs much tighter, the SPL limits beyond what a reasonable person could need. The Behringer and Mackie, and likely any number of other cheaper PA speakers can now be a serious contender for not only a boisterously loud home theater - - - but a very clean sounding and accurately loud home theater --- FOR CHEAP.
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post #548 of 710 Old 12-09-2014, 07:30 AM
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The question is did PA finally bridge the gap from DIY?
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post #549 of 710 Old 12-09-2014, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
The PA speakers of yesteryear are not the PA speakers of today. My cheap $200 Mackies claim -3dB from 89hz to 20khz....

I think that's the message on these various PA speakers for cinema enthusiasts! These aren't the PA speakers we are familiar with from a decade or two ago. Which was basically “bad sound loud”.
That may be somewhat true in the aggregate, but the better MI/Pro speakers of yesteryear will hold their own with the modern molded enclosures -- which, it is worth noting, were pioneered by the JBL Eon twenty years ago (and its ElectroVoice counterparts).

The main refinements from those early models involved cheaper outsourced components (offshore injection-molded cabinet tooling and CDs). Although the molded cabinets reduce production costs, the clunky old-school braced plywood cabinets provided better, less resonant sound. Judging from the Behringer, the crossover networks are similar.

I am surprised, with all of the DIY activity here at AVS, that it took so long for WAF-free audio enthusiasts to discover the merits of MI/pro gear.
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post #550 of 710 Old 12-09-2014, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by PrimeTime View Post
That may be somewhat true in the aggregate, but the better MI/Pro speakers of yesteryear will hold their own with the modern molded enclosures

key difference = price...

Quality may be similar. Price favors current market by a long shot! The $200 ish price point makes these speakers accessible to the budget minded enthusiast, and the sufficient current sound quality compared to cheap PA speakers in the past swings the tide.

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post #551 of 710 Old 12-09-2014, 03:19 PM
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I have all my subs turned down to 1/4th power output(My SC-37 AVR would kept telling me to turn them down) on the speakers themselves....this is making me want to turn them all up half way and break some stuff...nevermind this random comment....Just a few Godzilla foot steps...

Anyway, I think the primary thing is that you don't need the bass to come from these speakers and they are over designing there, the B212XL and B215XL don't waste anything in that range which I believe in a A/B test you'll hear the cleaner sounds. The QSCs frankly suck in clarity when compared but do have more bass even with the smaller woofer. I believe you'll likely hear the same things from the Mackies, I know it was true for the studio monitors of the same year.
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post #552 of 710 Old 12-09-2014, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimeTime View Post
That may be somewhat true in the aggregate, but the better MI/Pro speakers of yesteryear will hold their own with the modern molded enclosures -- which, it is worth noting, were pioneered by the JBL Eon twenty years ago (and its ElectroVoice counterparts).

The main refinements from those early models involved cheaper outsourced components (offshore injection-molded cabinet tooling and CDs). Although the molded cabinets reduce production costs, the clunky old-school braced plywood cabinets provided better, less resonant sound. Judging from the Behringer, the crossover networks are similar.

I am surprised, with all of the DIY activity here at AVS, that it took so long for WAF-free audio enthusiasts to discover the merits of MI/pro gear.
WAF caught up to me... Had to sell the 212's. Going to go back to in-walls when I can afford to build Tux's in-walls.
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post #553 of 710 Old 12-09-2014, 08:20 PM
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As to WAF, one of the earlier posters nailed it: In a home theater environment, if an AT screen can be accommodated, the Behringers can be heard but not seen -- the perfect solution.
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post #554 of 710 Old 12-10-2014, 04:10 PM
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For stands, I thought 12x12 pavers would work but idk, need a bunch for 16' ea. Anybody have any good ideas for good 16" stands for these things. I spent a bunch on steel series stands (centers b/c of switch from sierra 2 to Horizon that I now have to sell) and now these monsters. Thanks.
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post #555 of 710 Old 12-11-2014, 02:11 AM
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I wonder if anyone use karaoke type speakers for movies

http://en.akihabaranews.com/128061/s...peaker-cs-x080
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post #556 of 710 Old 12-11-2014, 08:05 AM
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I guess anything is possible but the specs for those Pioneers specify that the tweeter is "cone" (whatever that means). It certainly looks much less capable than a horn compression driver (to me at least). Also seems to be some sort of bipole arrangement to spray sound across the room - use for surrounds maybe? haha


http://www.otaiweb.com/syosaipic/pioneer/csx08_1.jpg

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post #557 of 710 Old 12-11-2014, 09:41 AM
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I wonder if anyone use karaoke type speakers for movies
Or how about the Monoprice PA speakers? (Sorry I can't post link or image yet) From their website: "This Passive PA speaker features a huge 15" main driver and a 1" exit driver. It handles a massive 500 watt (RMS)/1000 watts (peak) of power at 8 ohms impedance. The speaker has a 50 Hz ~ 20 kHz (-10dB) frequency response and boasts 97dB sensitivity (1 watt @ 1 meter) with a peak sensitivity of 126dB. The crossover is at 3.3 KHz. The cabinet measures about 27.5" x 19.0" x 15.0", weighs about 37.3 lbs, and has an internal capacity of 5.3 cubic feet of air." $159 and same WAF as the B215XL.
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post #558 of 710 Old 12-11-2014, 11:54 AM
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Just get stuff that is legit, buy some JBL 8330A's or JBL 8340 or JBL 8340A's

Don't waste your time on questionable surrounds. Maybe the B212XLs work just fine? Anyone tested them yet?
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post #559 of 710 Old 12-11-2014, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MatthewTyson View Post
Or how about the Monoprice PA speakers? (Sorry I can't post link or image yet) From their website: "This Passive PA speaker features a huge 15" main driver and a 1" exit driver. It handles a massive 500 watt (RMS)/1000 watts (peak) of power at 8 ohms impedance. The speaker has a 50 Hz ~ 20 kHz (-10dB) frequency response and boasts 97dB sensitivity (1 watt @ 1 meter) with a peak sensitivity of 126dB. The crossover is at 3.3 KHz. The cabinet measures about 27.5" x 19.0" x 15.0", weighs about 37.3 lbs, and has an internal capacity of 5.3 cubic feet of air." $159 and same WAF as the B215XL.
I might have to ask Monoprice for a pair to review. I have a meeting with the comapny at CES 2015. Thanks for the heads up.
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post #560 of 710 Old 12-12-2014, 04:50 AM
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Will the 3.3khz crossoverpoint in the monoprice PA's be a weakness?
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post #561 of 710 Old 12-12-2014, 07:45 PM
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Upon receiving three 15"'s and two 12"s, I discovered one of the 15's was blown or something (XO?). Props to Musician's Friend for sending me a new one out asap and a prepaid label (even sending out before they receive dud). In addition, I didn't notice they sell the 15's as a pair for $400 (MF sorted this out-seriously effortless CS). This equals $332 (17% off right now) for a pair which is a pretty good deal in my book. So 3X15's and 2X12's =$780, no tax nor shipping. Just a sweet PSA. I got MF 3 year warranty for 5 speakers for 70 bucks (17% off). Cranked them last night for giggles. Wow they are loud, effortless...and insanely clean. Pretty scary coming from Sierra 2's as they will spoil you I had so much fun cranking them going through all sorts of music (e.g., Pantera, Daft Punk, Stones, good vocal appearances like Fleetwood's live big love, etc.). While I never heard compressed drivers in this environment, I did at local high end HT place (Klipchs I believe) and they were noticeably different. Whatever the hell they were, they were not $330 bucks and failed to impress at all while these weren't even set up close to right. I was just hoping they would suffice for cinema. Really surprised how musical they were and the midbass slam was off the fing charts. Can't wait to set up properly tomorrow. Was a bit apprehensive after buying but MF does have a 60 day return policy. Thanks Mark!

Edit: In packing the defective B215Xl, I noticed which I had forgotten, a broken styrofoam corner piece. Pretty confident this speaker took a pretty hard hit in transit.

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post #562 of 710 Old 12-13-2014, 04:41 AM
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Received my 2xB215XL (fronts) and 2xB212XL (rears), but unfortunately only one Behringer B1800D-Pro Eurolive sub.
The other one will be sent in January since it's not in stock
Hooking it all up this weekend

The first thing I saw was that these are VERY compact and small speakers compared to other 15" tops and 18" subs.
Had such a setup about 10-12 years ago with a Warfedale PA and those boxes had much larger dimensions.
The Behringer 18 inch sub is comparable to 15 inch subs from many other brands when it comes to dimensions.

Will post some pics when I'm allowed to (think new forum memebers must have 3 posts or something to do this).
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post #563 of 710 Old 12-13-2014, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by DocOrange88 View Post
Here is a shot of what I have going on at the moment.
Hey Doc. Any issues with laying the 212 on its side? Unshure if I will go for center at all but if I do it will be the 212. (I use 212 as LR) I used an AT screen before, but now I don`t and I "feel" that the sound is coming from under the screen (which it is of cource). Did not give this a second thought before the AT screen, but now it is an issue. Unshure if it is just my DIY center or something I will experience with all centerspeakers from now...
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post #564 of 710 Old 12-13-2014, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by gogothedodo View Post
I used an AT screen before, but now I don`t and I "feel" that the sound is coming from under the screen (which it is of cource). Did not give this a second thought before the AT screen, but now it is an issue. Unshure if it is just my DIY center or something I will experience with all centerspeakers from now...
Thankfully our brains are smart enough to know whether we should jump or duck.
Its only when speakers are placed where they don't belong that it becomes a problem.

.
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post #565 of 710 Old 12-13-2014, 01:46 PM
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Thankfully our brains are smart enough to know whether we should jump or duck.
Its only when speakers are placed where they don't belong that it becomes a problem.
Maybe I`m slow today, but I didn`t catch your point.. (might be "lost in translation)
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post #566 of 710 Old 12-13-2014, 02:04 PM
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Maybe I`m slow today, but I didn`t catch your point.. (might be "lost in translation)
Maybe I misunderstood your post. I thought you were asking if a speaker placed too low will always sound too low.

.
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post #567 of 710 Old 12-13-2014, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JW6 View Post
Upon receiving three 15"'s and two 12"s, I discovered one of the 15's was blown or something (XO?). Props to Musician's Friend for sending me a new one out asap and a prepaid label (even sending out before they receive dud). In addition, I didn't notice they sell the 15's as a pair for $400 (MF sorted this out-seriously effortless CS). This equals $332 (17% off right now) for a pair which is a pretty good deal in my book. So 3X15's and 2X12's =$780, no tax nor shipping. Just a sweet PSA. I got MF 3 year warranty for 5 speakers for 70 bucks (17% off). Cranked them last night for giggles. Wow they are loud, effortless...and insanely clean. Pretty scary coming from Sierra 2's as they will spoil you I had so much fun cranking them going through all sorts of music (e.g., Pantera, Daft Punk, Stones, good vocal appearances like Fleetwood's live big love, etc.). While I never heard compressed drivers in this environment, I did at local high end HT place (Klipchs I believe) and they were noticeably different. Whatever the hell they were, they were not $330 bucks and failed to impress at all while these weren't even set up close to right. I was just hoping they would suffice for cinema. Really surprised how musical they were and the midbass slam was off the fing charts. Can't wait to set up properly tomorrow. Was a bit apprehensive after buying but MF does have a 60 day return policy. Thanks Mark!

Edit: In packing the defective B215Xl, I noticed which I had forgotten, a broken styrofoam corner piece. Pretty confident this speaker took a pretty hard hit in transit.
I'm glad you had this experience. Isn't it amazing? The B215XLs make it tough for me to review speakers because I'm always thinking about what you get for your money with the Behringers, and how often speakers costing several times as much fall short in terms of performance.
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post #568 of 710 Old 12-14-2014, 11:07 AM
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Maybe I misunderstood your post. I thought you were asking if a speaker placed too low will always sound too low.
No, yes, I don`t know. I should have asked if the 212 worked as a "normal" center (or better). It is imposible to answer my question for anyone else than me I suppose. I have an (expensive) DIY 2-way center today. I don`t use it because it draws my attention down below the screen. It`s been several years since I used a conventional center below the screen as I have used AT. Hmmmm.. Maybe I should buy two and put one over and one under the screen..?
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post #569 of 710 Old 12-15-2014, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gogothedodo View Post
Hey Doc. Any issues with laying the 212 on its side? Unshure if I will go for center at all but if I do it will be the 212. (I use 212 as LR) I used an AT screen before, but now I don`t and I "feel" that the sound is coming from under the screen (which it is of cource). Did not give this a second thought before the AT screen, but now it is an issue. Unshure if it is just my DIY center or something I will experience with all centerspeakers from now...
In short no, zero issues. However I do wish I had it directly behind the screen. When I'm testing things I tend to stare at it, not sure why. However watching 3D movies tends to solve that problem completely. It sounds great and allows me to fit everything in as tight as I can go. I am considering getting two B215XL's for my front L/Rs and leaving my B212XL for my center. My B212XL beats out my Boston VR12, but again its a close margin. The B212XL gets louder easier without becoming "loud".

I'm stuck in an apartment at the moment, so I do what I can, but I have been able to get louder and keep the sound inside my space much easier also.

Go with it in the center it'll work fine.
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post #570 of 710 Old 12-15-2014, 03:58 PM
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The Monoprice near clones (at least in looks) of the B215xl are on sale right now for $128.79 each. There is an additional $15 off for orders over $100 today only.
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Behringer B215xl Passive Speaker Pair , Pioneer Elite Sc 55 Sc55 9 1 Channel 3d Ready A V Receiver , Pioneer Andrew Jones Sp Fs52 Flr Stand Loudspeaker , Behringer , B 52 Lx 1515v3 1000w Dual 15 Pa Speaker , B 52 , Behringer Eurolive B212d Active 550 Watt 2 Way Pa Speaker System With 12 Inch Woofer And 1 35 Inch C
Gear in this thread - B212d by PriceGrabber.com



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