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post #1 of 51 Old 05-01-2014, 06:35 PM - Thread Starter
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I was looking for speaker cable for my setup and have a few questions. I'm using:

Infinity Primus p363, pc351 and p163 hooked up to a Yamaha RX-V675.

My basement is 11x21x8. The longest run would be around 30'. Due to this I was thinking 14gauge instead of 16?

Also, most of the speaker wire I'm finding on amazon is not full copper, but rather CCA. Is this an issue?

Finally, I plan to use Sewell Deadbolt banana plugs. Is "regular" speaker wire fine or am I better with the in wall wire for the plastic jacket vs the rubberized insulation on regular wire?

Thanks!

Yamaha RX-V675 | Primus 363s fronts | Primus 163 rears | Primus 351 Center | Rythmik LV12R Sub
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post #2 of 51 Old 05-01-2014, 06:51 PM
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If you are already doing your own termination, I have been using the 'Marshall Soundrunner' bought in bulk. They just pretty flexible ofc cable from 14gauge to 10gauge.
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post #3 of 51 Old 05-01-2014, 11:49 PM
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Monoprice in my opinion has the best price to performance available.
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post #4 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 02:45 AM
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Originally Posted by rtheen View Post

Monoprice in my opinion has the best price to performance available.

+1 on Monoprice. They make great speaker cables at extremely reasonable prices.

Blue Jeans Cables are also good but in my experience, they cost a bit more than the cables from Monoprice. In a completely non-scientific test performed in the real world environment of my basement home theater, I've not been able to detect a difference between cables from the two manufacturer's.

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post #5 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 04:05 AM - Thread Starter
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I usually use monoprice for everything but the shipping kills me. It's damn near half the price of the product for 5 day shipping :/. That's why I was looking for alternatives :/.

However, even monoprice sells on wall vs regular cable. Which work better with banana plugs?

Thanks!

Yamaha RX-V675 | Primus 363s fronts | Primus 163 rears | Primus 351 Center | Rythmik LV12R Sub
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post #6 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 05:04 AM
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I've always used the regular 12guage monoprice wire with their gold rear screw-in banana plugs. No complaints, running them through walls, or having them last. Just bought a 300' run last week.

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post #7 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jnick1 View Post

Also, most of the speaker wire I'm finding on amazon is not full copper, but rather CCA. Is this an issue?
It is, as it requires a larger gauge with CCA to give the same result as with copper. CCA is becoming almost pervasive, because it's cheaper to produce but being labeled as 'speaker wire' the average consumer is willing to pay more than they should for it.
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I usually use monoprice for everything but the shipping kills me.
Go to your local hardware store and buy plain old zip cord. It's pure copper, and functions just as well as 'speaker wire'. The main difference is that zip cord doesn't use color coding of the conductors for identifying polarity, but if you look on the jacket you'll see it's embossed, so you can still tell which conductor is which.

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post #8 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 08:46 AM
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If you are running cables in-wall, you should consider using cable specifically rated for in-wall use.
  • In the event of a house fire, the Insurance company may try to use non code wiring as an excuse to deny the claim.
  • When selling the house, non code wiring may be an issue on a home inspection.
  • An additional benefit of the covering on in-wall wire is that it makes it easier to pull through the wall.

More information: Understanding In-wall Speaker, Video and Audio Cable Ratings

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post #9 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 09:33 AM
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OP, you should take a look at some audiophile cables. They really do make a nice difference. There are many great companies which offer products for any budget, i.e. Transparent, MIT, AudioQuest, Blue Jeans, etc.
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post #10 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 09:37 AM
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OP, you should also note that Nagysaudio makes and sells custom "boutique" speaker cables.
Just to be fair and honest here, since he refuses to identify in his signature that he is a dealer.
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post #11 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 09:38 AM
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OP, you should also note that Nagysaudio makes and sells custom "boutique" speaker cables.
Just to be fair and honest here, since he refuses to identify in his signature that he is a dealer.

I certainly do and my identification is in the name itself. How much more clearer can that be?
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post #12 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:10 AM
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You should read this:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

That will tell you just about everything you need to know about wire. There is no point in buying anything expensive, unless you like throwing away money on pretty wires that do not sound any better than ordinary wires.
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post #13 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Jack D Ripper View Post

You should read this:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

That will tell you just about everything you need to know about wire. There is no point in buying anything expensive, unless you like throwing away money on pretty wires that do not sound any better than ordinary wires.

And everyone should understand that this is only in Russell's very primitive understanding.
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post #14 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:18 AM
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And everyone should understand that this is only in Russell's very primitive understanding.

If Roger Russell's understanding is primitive what the heck does that make yours since his credentials far outweigh yours?
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post #15 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:21 AM
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If Roger Russell's understanding is primitive what the heck does that make yours since his credentials far outweigh yours?

Possibly a more real world experienced opinion, instead of prehistoric textbook opinion?
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post #16 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by NagysAudio View Post

Possibly a more real world experienced opinion, instead of prehistoric textbook opinion?

Fantasy worlds don't mean a lot. Roger has actual chops in audio.
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post #17 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by NagysAudio View Post

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Originally Posted by Jack D Ripper View Post

You should read this:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

That will tell you just about everything you need to know about wire. There is no point in buying anything expensive, unless you like throwing away money on pretty wires that do not sound any better than ordinary wires.

And everyone should understand that this is only in Russell's very primitive understanding.

What nonsense. Russell has a very good background for this issue, and his position fits the evidence that others have also presented regarding this issue.

If you have any double blind listening tests to back up your claims about wires, please give us the links or references. But if you have no real evidence, then no one with any sense will pay attention to your claims. People claim all sorts of nonsense in audio, and so a claim without evidence to back it up is completely worthless. Of course, if you have no evidence, we can probably expect more irrelevant and fallacious arguments from you, like your pathetic argumentum ad hominem against Russell. You simply insult him by calling his understanding "primitive," yet you give absolutely no evidence for that claim, or for the idea that you know anything at all about the subject. I expect you will likely insult me as well, given the fact that you have done nothing more than that so far.

God willing, we will prevail in peace and freedom from fear and in true health through the purity and essence of our natural fluids. God bless you all.
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post #18 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NagysAudio View Post

Possibly a more real world experienced opinion, instead of prehistoric textbook opinion?
Russell's page references articles from the 80s, 90s, and 2000s. Hardly "prehistoric". Oh, and it also references real world listening tests, not simply "opinion". You, on the other hand, talk only about subjectivist opinion.
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post #19 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:38 AM
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What nonsense. Russell has a very good background for this issue, and his position fits the evidence that others have also presented regarding this issue.

If you have any double blind listening tests to back up your claims about wires, please give us the links or references. But if you have no real evidence, then no one with any sense will pay attention to your claims. People claim all sorts of nonsense in audio, and so a claim without evidence to back it up is completely worthless. Of course, if you have no evidence, we can probably expect more irrelevant and fallacious arguments from you, like your pathetic argumentum ad hominem against Russell. You simply insult him by calling his understanding "primitive," yet you give absolutely no evidence for that claim, or for the idea that you know anything at all about the subject. I expect you will likely insult me as well, given the fact that you have done nothing more than that so far.

Don't look for someone stupid. The subtle insults were thrown by you and your peers around here, as it usually is. All I did was politely offer advice to OP. Here's my original statement: OP, you should take a look at some audiophile cables. They really do make a nice difference. There are many great companies which offer products for any budget, i.e. Transparent, MIT, AudioQuest, Blue Jeans, etc.
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post #20 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:39 AM
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The is a world of cables available to you that is for sure. Look, have some fun with the cables you buy. Whether you can hear the difference between one set of cables and another is a topic that could fill 1000s of pages of messages. I would urge you to give some of the smaller manufactures a look. I use Signal Cables for my speaker cables to my front speakers. I use Audio Art for my interconnects. Then I use Better Cables for my subwoofer. They are far from being the most expensive cables on the market. Of course you can't go wrong with Monoprice and Blue Jean but again, there are lots of other cable providers worth a look .If price is the only consideration in life, then we would all be wearing the same clothes, driving the same car, eating the same food and on it goes.Boring! Heck, my Rolex keeps the same time as my Timex. The fun of being a audio enthusiast is that you can customize your system to your tastes. So can build a system the reflects who and what you are. Spend your hard earned money anyway you want. If you like a certain cable that is a bit pricey, go for it. Bottomline, have fun.
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post #21 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:40 AM
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They really do make a nice difference.
Only in the minds of some listeners, not as objective fact.
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post #22 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:42 AM
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Only in the minds of some listeners, not as objective fact.

In your opinion. Of course.
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post #23 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:50 AM
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In your opinion.
Data obtained using the proper application of the scientific method doesn't change based on "opinion", unlike subjectivist perception.
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post #24 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NagysAudio View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack D Ripper View Post

What nonsense. Russell has a very good background for this issue, and his position fits the evidence that others have also presented regarding this issue.

If you have any double blind listening tests to back up your claims about wires, please give us the links or references. But if you have no real evidence, then no one with any sense will pay attention to your claims. People claim all sorts of nonsense in audio, and so a claim without evidence to back it up is completely worthless. Of course, if you have no evidence, we can probably expect more irrelevant and fallacious arguments from you, like your pathetic argumentum ad hominem against Russell. You simply insult him by calling his understanding "primitive," yet you give absolutely no evidence for that claim, or for the idea that you know anything at all about the subject. I expect you will likely insult me as well, given the fact that you have done nothing more than that so far.

Don't look for someone stupid. The subtle insults were thrown by you and your peers around here, as it usually is. All I did was politely offer advice to OP. Here's my original statement: OP, you should take a look at some audiophile cables. They really do make a nice difference. There are many great companies which offer products for any budget, i.e. Transparent, MIT, AudioQuest, Blue Jeans, etc.

It is amazing that you post something that everyone who reads this thread can see is completely false:
Quote:
Originally Posted by NagysAudio View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack D Ripper View Post

You should read this:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

That will tell you just about everything you need to know about wire. There is no point in buying anything expensive, unless you like throwing away money on pretty wires that do not sound any better than ordinary wires.

And everyone should understand that this is only in Russell's very primitive understanding.

You claim not to insult, and yet there it is for everyone to see. Do you really expect people to believe you when you prove beyond all doubt that you state falsehoods? Do you imagine that when you call someone's understanding "primitive," that you are not insulting them?

The most telling thing, though, is the fact that you still have offered absolutely no evidence for your position. You just post irrelevant BS, apparently in the hope that no one will notice that you have offered no basis for anyone to believe anything you have stated.
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post #25 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Jack D Ripper View Post

It is amazing that you post something that everyone who reads this thread can see is completely false:
You claim not to insult, and yet there it is for everyone to see. Do you really expect people to believe you when you prove beyond all doubt that you state falsehoods? Do you imagine that when you call someone's understanding "primitive," that you are not insulting them?

The most telling thing, though, is the fact that you still have offered absolutely no evidence for your position. You just post irrelevant BS, apparently in the hope that no one will notice that you have offered no basis for anyone to believe anything you have stated.

Yadda, yadda, yadda.
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post #26 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 12:34 PM
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The most telling thing, though, is the fact that you still have offered absolutely no evidence for your position. You just post irrelevant BS, apparently in the hope that no one will notice that you have offered no basis for anyone to believe anything you have stated.
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post #27 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 04:53 PM
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So let me get this right. OP has less than $600 invested in his speakers and a cable seller wants him to spend $$$$ on cables? That makes perfect sense to me. rolleyes.gif I'm guessing if the OP had that kind on money he or she probably wouldn't be buying the Infinity Primus speakers to begin with.

OP, no offense intended. I have the Primus speakers as well and recommend them often. They are great speakers that sound better to me than speakers I've heard at many times their price.

If you need in wall rated wire try this:

http://www.amazon.com/Cable-Matters-2-Conductor-Speaker-Copper/dp/B00BWSCXT0/ref=sr_1_4?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1399070845&sr=1-4&keywords=Cable+Matters+2-Conductor+In-Wall+Rated+%28CM%29+12+AWG+Speaker+Cable

If you don't need in wall rated wire:

http://www.parts-express.com/wired-home-skrl-12-100-12-awg-ofc-speaker-wire-100-ft--100-025

I chose 12AWG because the 14AWG was only a couple dollars cheaper at the same length. You can go with the 14AWG version for ease in cable concealing. I personally no longer recommend MonoPrice due to the problems I've had with both their products and customer service.

BTW, not all municipalities require in-wall rated wiring in residential buildings so check yours. Not that the price difference matters in this case, but just to let you know. In my city they couldn't care less what type of wire you put in your house walls for low voltage applications like A/V wiring. They don't even require permits for it.
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post #28 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 08:31 PM
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I certainly do and my identification is in the name itself. How much more clearer can that be?

It doesn't say NagysAudioShop, or NagysSpeakerWireSales so no, it's not clear. Any enthusiast could have Audio in their ID.

Put something clear on your signature and then people will stop calling you out on that.

And calling what Roger Russell's understanding primitive? How low can you go? I would love to see you debate him on the topic!!
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post #29 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:03 PM
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It doesn't say NagysAudioShop, or NagysSpeakerWireSales so no, it's not clear. Any enthusiast could have Audio in their ID.

Put something clear on your signature and then people will stop calling you out on that.

And calling what Roger Russell's understanding primitive? How low can you go? I would love to see you debate him on the topic!!

Maybe it's not clear to you, but don't speak for the majority. Sure, I'll debate him. Why not? Sounds likes fun thing to do.
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post #30 of 51 Old 05-02-2014, 10:56 PM
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The "cables make a difference" argument? People still fall for this? Do people also still shell out an extra 2k for "clear coat" on new cars too?

Holy moly.
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