Speaker location for a 17'x30' theater? Wall, ceiling or ? (photos attached) - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Speaker location for a 17'x30' theater? Wall, ceiling or ? (photos attached)

I originally posted this in the design area, but think it might be a better question for here. The room is 17'x30' and so far I've raised the floor and wired some wall and stair lighting (BTW, the window will be blacked out too). I already have a Epson 5020 projector. Thinking about getting a Yamaha 2040 receiver. I need help with the speaker locations for a 7.2 system. What would be the best set up for this type of theater room? Should they go in the wall, on the wall, ceiling or both in the wall on on the ceiling?

I've attached a few photos to help explain the layout. My thought was to place 4 Definitive Technology UIW RCS II's in the walls for the side surround and 2 more in the rear. Also, place a Definitive Technology Super Cube in the floor under the seats and one more near the front under the theater screen. However, I'm open to other brands of speakers and installation locations. What would you do if this was your room?

Thanks in advance for any help.





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post #2 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 01:19 PM
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First off the only true proper way to place a subwoofer is waiting to room is complete and doing subwoofer crawl or REW measurements. I have rarely ever seen pre-build planned locations for subwoofers work out.

Second Supercubes are way over priced for the amount of bass output you get. This is a dedicated theater room why not look for a subwoofer from Outlaw, HSU, PSA, Rythmik, Reaction Audio or SVS. Internet direct companies will yeild you alot more bass for your money.

As for placement of the speakers that sounds good except for subwoofer. 2 on back wall and 2 slightly behind or to side of middle row

If you want us to recommend other speakers please provide us with a total budget of what you are willing to spend on speakers and/or receiver.
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post #3 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 01:28 PM - Thread Starter
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YES, I want your help with the speakers and receiver. The only items I have already purchased are:

Projector = $2,400
Seating location and 12 theater seats = $5,100
TOTAL SPENT = $7,500

I have around $7,500 left to spend on the following items (next to them is what I think they will cost):

-Receiver (around $1,200)
-2 Subs (around $1,100)
-4 Surround Sound Speakers (around $2,000)
-2 Rear Speakers (around $1,000)
-Center Channel Speaker (around $900)
-2 Front Speakers (around $1,300)

Things I have not budgeted for but might need to find some money for is a screen in case the speakers need to go behind it. I was just going to finish the drywall out smooth and use the wall as the screen.

My reason for getting a Super Cube was my brother has a friend that sells them and can get me a couple of 4000 for around $520. He can also get me Yamaha RX A 2040 for $1175. However, I'm COMPLETELY open to other brands and prices, so yes the budget above can be modified if needed.

If this was your theater room, where would you place the speakers? What ones would you use with the budget range I'm in?


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Originally Posted by crazyrob425 View Post
First off the only true proper way to place a subwoofer is waiting to room is complete and doing subwoofer crawl or REW measurements. I have rarely ever seen pre-build planned locations for subwoofers work out.

Second Supercubes are way over priced for the amount of bass output you get. This is a dedicated theater room why not look for a subwoofer from Outlaw, HSU, PSA, Rythmik, Reaction Audio or SVS. Internet direct companies will yeild you alot more bass for your money.

As for placement of the speakers that sounds good except for subwoofer. 2 on back wall and 2 slightly behind or to side of middle row

If you want us to recommend other speakers please provide us with a total budget of what you are willing to spend on speakers and/or receiver.
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post #4 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C O D Y View Post
I originally posted this in the design area, but think it might be a better question for here. The room is 17'x30' and so far I've raised the floor and wired some wall and stair lighting (BTW, the window will be blacked out too). I already have a Epson 5020 projector. Thinking about getting a Yamaha 2040 receiver. I need help with the speaker locations for a 7.2 system. What would be the best set up for this type of theater room? Should they go in the wall, on the wall, ceiling or both in the wall on on the ceiling?

I've attached a few photos to help explain the layout. My thought was to place 4 Definitive Technology UIW RCS II's in the walls for the side surround and 2 more in the rear. Also, place a Definitive Technology Super Cube in the floor under the seats and one more near the front under the theater screen. However, I'm open to other brands of speakers and installation locations. What would you do if this was your room?
First, I would celebrate! What a great room! For surround placement, I would go directly to the sides of the second row, two to three feet above seated listeners ears in the primary listening position (first row) as Dolby Labs recommends. That would put them between 90 degrees (directly to side) for second row and 110 degrees (slightly behind) for the first row - again, as Dolby Labs recommends. The third row is not going to be optimal, but you already know that with the seats against the rear wall (like my room!).

The Def Tech UIW (series II) speakers are great - I really like mine. The UIW RCSII are intended as in-ceiling speakers to be used as left / center / right - used in the ceiling across the front - they are angled down so the sound aims at you from the ceiling. You could use these for the fronts, but you would be a lot better off using floor standing towers and a great three-way center - even if they were from a different company that would be OK - fronts should match each other and surrounds should be the same but they don't have to be same front and rear. Give us a budget and what look you want and we will make suggestions.



For surrounds, I would recommend using the Def Tech UIW RSSII which have a large angle Bipole baffle design and two sets of drivers to spread out the sound without sounding hollow like Dipole speakers - very nice! I have two for surrounds (mine are in the ceiling pointing straight down - yours on the side walls will be better) and two in the back wall.



Previous suggestions about internet direct subs are right on - my favorite is SVS and since I like music and movies I like their sealed subs - not as loud and don't go as low - but very smooth, tight bass. Get two of them and they will impress you and your movie watchers. Sealed or ported - they have discounts for buying two!:

SVS SB-2000, 500 Watt DSP Controlled, 12" Compact Sealed Subwoofer
SVS PB-2000, 500 Watt DSP Controlled, 12" Ported Subwoofer

2-Ch (HT L/R): Oppo BDP-105 BD, Adcom GFP-750 pre, Bryston 10B Sub Xover, Bryston 4BSST2 / Paradigm Signature S4 v.2 (L/R), (2) SVS SB12-NSD (Subs)
Home Theater: Bryston 4BSST2 amp / Paradigm CC-590 (C), Outlaw 7700 amp / (4) Def Tech UIW-RSSII (LS/RS/LB/RB), Samsung 46” 3D LCD
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post #5 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 02:11 PM
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For the front three, I really like Paradigm speakers - great for music and for movies. Their Monitor series towers sound great and are somewhat affordable, but most importantly they have a great matched center channel speaker. In my opinion Paradigm center speakers are among the best available - very intelligible for clear dialog anywhere in the room. The primary reason is that there is a vertical mid-tweeter array which improves horizontal dispersion and makes the sound very coherent (focused) at every seat in the house.

Paradigm front 3 suggestion - $1800 list but you can usually get about 20% discount:

Mains: Paradigm Monitor 9 - $599 each
Center: Paradigm Center 3 - $599



2-Ch (HT L/R): Oppo BDP-105 BD, Adcom GFP-750 pre, Bryston 10B Sub Xover, Bryston 4BSST2 / Paradigm Signature S4 v.2 (L/R), (2) SVS SB12-NSD (Subs)
Home Theater: Bryston 4BSST2 amp / Paradigm CC-590 (C), Outlaw 7700 amp / (4) Def Tech UIW-RSSII (LS/RS/LB/RB), Samsung 46” 3D LCD
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post #6 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 02:18 PM
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Comments that I had about Def Tech UIW-RSSII speakers for a previous question:

Quote:
I have four of the Def Tech UIW-RSSII and I really like them - amazing amount of sound, fit into 2x4 wall (unlike a lot of others with back box), very efficient, and I like the wide angle bi-pole design which spreads the sound out a little without sounding hollow like Dipoles. When I first got them, I set them on my front speaker stands and hooked them up to my Bryston 4BSST2 amp and wow! I couldn't believe an in-wall speaker could put out that amount of sound - try that with a regular in-wall speaker. I was worried about the small (4x) 4.5" mid drivers (which is one of the reasons I went with the RSSII instead of the cheaper RSSIII) but no reason to worry - they even have great bass comparable to most bookshelf speakers. And at that price, they should!

I got one pair of mine for below $400 each (new from eBay, probably no warranty) but paid a little more for the others from an authorized dealer. The list price is $650 each, but I got mine for $449 each special ordered from OneCall.com - they have them listed at a higher price now, but give them a call maybe they will match my price. PM me if you need details of my order - you can say your "friend" got them for $449!

2-Ch (HT L/R): Oppo BDP-105 BD, Adcom GFP-750 pre, Bryston 10B Sub Xover, Bryston 4BSST2 / Paradigm Signature S4 v.2 (L/R), (2) SVS SB12-NSD (Subs)
Home Theater: Bryston 4BSST2 amp / Paradigm CC-590 (C), Outlaw 7700 amp / (4) Def Tech UIW-RSSII (LS/RS/LB/RB), Samsung 46” 3D LCD
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post #7 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 02:21 PM
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First, I just wanted to say that your Home Theater looks like it will be absolutely amazing! Simply wow! And congratulations for your due-diligence. So apply that same due-diligence when thinking about your speakers and subwoofers.

You seem to have a fairly generous budget, and even for the price you will be getting the Def Techs for, there are better choices. Those Def Techs probably play a lot better in a small living room or family room environment (under 1,500 cu. ft.), where no one wants peak SPLs any louder than 80 dB. The Def Techs are small, very attractive, and if you multiply Def Tech's low frequency response specification by at 1.5 times, you will understand what they really bring to the table. That 16 Hz spec is simply ridiculous and not achievable even with cabin gain (which won't happen in your large volume area). Sound and Vision tested that specific sub and the results were 26 Hz to 94 Hz plus/minus 3 dB, which is not exactly earth-shattering. But that's Def Tech for you. They exaggerate all their specs, which I will never understand because they make some really nice speakers (their subs, however ….).

Look at the Internet Direct companies such as Hsu, Outlaw, PSA, Reaction Audio, Rythmik and SVS for your subwoofer needs. Send each an email and a room description and they will offer solid suggestions. And if you really want to impress, look at Seaton, JTR and Funk Audio … or save a bundle and go D.I.Y. You may also want to look at some of these I.D. company's speaker selections as well.

Lastly, you will get a lot of suggestions, and 9 times out of 10 they will be excellent suggestions. It's up to you, however, to actually audition them and determine what is right for you.

Last edited by dsrussell; 08-07-2014 at 03:19 PM.
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post #8 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 02:25 PM
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Any chance you can wait a month or so to check out how Dolby Atmos does? That may change your receiver/speaker requirements, type, placement, etc.

You new construction could be ideal to set up a system like it. I guess it all depends on how the home Atmos does, but you'd have to wait for reviews to be out.

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post #9 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C O D Y View Post
I have around $7,500 left to spend on the following items (next to them is what I think they will cost):

-Receiver (around $1,200) - Denon: $800 - $1000
-2 Subs (around $1,100) - SVS Dual PB-1000: $949.99/ Dual SVS SB-2000: $1,299.99
-4 Surround Sound Speakers (around $2,000) - Only 2 needed - Def Tech UIW-RSSII
-2 Rear Speakers (around $1,000) Def Tech UIW-RSSII
-Center Channel Speaker (around $900)
-2 Front Speakers (around $1,300)

Things I have not budgeted for but might need to find some money for is a screen in case the speakers need to go behind it. I was just going to finish the drywall out smooth and use the wall as the screen.

My reason for getting a Super Cube was my brother has a friend that sells them and can get me a couple of 4000 for around $520. He can also get me Yamaha RX A 2040 for $1175. However, I'm COMPLETELY open to other brands and prices, so yes the budget above can be modified if needed.

If this was your theater room, where would you place the speakers? What ones would you use with the budget range I'm in?
Your budget is very realistic. I don't think you should have to spend $1200 for an AVR (you could almost get separates for that) and most on AVR are recommending the Denon AVR-X2000 and Denon AVR-X3000 over the Yamaha because of better room correction - you can spend the rest for your screen.

I would get front towers and place them to the sides of the screen and the center below it - build or buy a stand if needed. You only need two (2) surround speakers and two (2) back surround speakers (not 4 and 2), so there is some budget there for the screen as well. Four of the Def Tech UIW-RSSII would be about $2000 - $2400. Your front and center speaker budget is OK - I'm sure others will have suggestions.

2-Ch (HT L/R): Oppo BDP-105 BD, Adcom GFP-750 pre, Bryston 10B Sub Xover, Bryston 4BSST2 / Paradigm Signature S4 v.2 (L/R), (2) SVS SB12-NSD (Subs)
Home Theater: Bryston 4BSST2 amp / Paradigm CC-590 (C), Outlaw 7700 amp / (4) Def Tech UIW-RSSII (LS/RS/LB/RB), Samsung 46” 3D LCD
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post #10 of 14 Old 08-07-2014, 03:16 PM
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Wow! that is going to be a great theater space, I am looking forward to seeing it completed! I would suggest you look at diy audio group, since you are obiously handy with the tools. They have some great speaker kits that won't be to hard on the pocket book.

If you don't want to go the diy route, I suggest looking at the JBL pro theater gear. These are the speakers that actual theaters use and are not as pricy as you might think. You could use 3 3677s for the front LCR and some 8320s for the surrounds.

I would sugges that you go with an accoustically transperent screen and place the speakers behind it.

For subwoofers I would definitely go diy. Check out the diy speaker section in the forums for some proven formulas.

Epson Home Cinema 3010 Projector____Paradigm 9SE MK II Main LR
Yamaha RX-V667 AVR_______________Paradigm CC-270 V.3 Center
Emotiva UPA-5 Amplifier______________Dual Stereo Integrity 18" Infinite Baffle
Sony BDP-570 Blu Ray_______________DIY Sound Group Volt 10
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post #11 of 14 Old 08-08-2014, 10:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Looking at the JBL's they look like a fantastic fit for my space!!!!!! Thanks very much for all the help guys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by action_jackson View Post
Wow! that is going to be a great theater space, I am looking forward to seeing it completed! I would suggest you look at diy audio group, since you are obiously handy with the tools. They have some great speaker kits that won't be to hard on the pocket book.

If you don't want to go the diy route, I suggest looking at the JBL pro theater gear. These are the speakers that actual theaters use and are not as pricy as you might think. You could use 3 3677s for the front LCR and some 8320s for the surrounds.

I would sugges that you go with an accoustically transperent screen and place the speakers behind it.

For subwoofers I would definitely go diy. Check out the diy speaker section in the forums for some proven formulas.
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post #12 of 14 Old 08-08-2014, 09:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Last week I didn't even know what Atmos was and now it's all I want! lol Thanks for the help.
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post #13 of 14 Old 08-08-2014, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C O D Y View Post
Looking at the JBL's they look like a fantastic fit for my space!!!!!! Thanks very much for all the help guys.
If you decide on the JBL's, you can usually get them less than msrp. Just call a dealer and get a quote. I know Full Compass caries them and a few others.
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post #14 of 14 Old 08-08-2014, 10:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Right now I'm thinking I'll go with JBL's for LCR (3677's) and the 8320's for the sides and rear. Thinking about putting Def Tech UIW RSS II's in the ceiling too. Got to find a good sub for behind the screen and under the seating. Everyone that posts on this site and shares information have been a big help.



Quote:
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If you decide on the JBL's, you can usually get them less than msrp. Just call a dealer and get a quote. I know Full Compass caries them and a few others.
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