Hi everyone. I was wondering if anyone had any thought or advice on the Revel f208 vs the B&W CM10s vs Kef R900.
I’ve listened to them at different stores with different setups. Personally leaning towards the Revel’s as they seemed the clearest overall and also had more bass. The B&W had a lot of clarity but I thought the bass was not as impressive. The Kef’s seemed nice but they didn’t blow me away. To be fair it was in an open room with a lot of background noise so it was harder to listen. Price wise the Revel’s were the most expensive going at about $4800 cdn. The integrated Unico Nuovo amp about $2500. The Kef’s will end up being significantly cheaper with the R900’s about $3500 and they will probably give me a better deal on the amp. The B&W were about $4000.
One thing I’ve heard people say that the Revel’s need a more expensive amp to drive them than the other two. Could anyone shed some light on that. Obviously I don’t want to spend more than I have to, unless its really worth it.
As aside I will be using the system for both music and movies. Right now I think I like the idea of just having a 2 channel system and maybe adding a subwoofer later. But is it better to just buy a 5.1 channel receiver incase we want to upgrade to a better home theatre system?
Also we have a really old system from Sony from the 90’s. It has a SONY POWER AMPLIFIER 55ES and Pre amp is the Sony 1000ESD. Does anyone know if they would still be worth using? The B&W guy said it probably could be used to drive the CM’s. I just don’t know whether its worth trying or better to just buy something new.
Also we have a really old system from Sony from the 90’s. It has a SONY POWER AMPLIFIER 55ES and Pre amp is the Sony 1000ESD. Does anyone know if they would still be worth using?
That setup will be fine to drive any of the three speakers to their potential. The only reasons to buy new electronics if yours isn't broken are to go to multichannel or to get advanced room correction.
Someone wanted to sell you (or other potential Revel F208 customers) a more expensive amp. There's nothing to the comment beyond hack salesmanship.
That setup will be fine to drive any of the three speakers to their potential. The only reasons to buy new electronics if yours isn't broken are to go to multichannel or to get advanced room correction.
Lol thanks for the advice. Both the Revel salesman and the B&W salesman said that about the Revels. But the B&W guy said the old amp would probably work for the B&W’s.
How does advanced room correction work? Is it something that is really worth it?
I was on the same boat ,trying to decide between Kef R and Revel ,but I pull the trigger on the Revels,the Revel have a more balanced and neutral sound.
That’s really good to know. The Revels definitely sound better to me but they cost significantly more than the Kef’s. The Kef dealer has dropped it down to $3090cdn just for this weekend. Just not sure if the Revel’s are really worth $1700 more. I don’t want to feel like I overpaid for what I got.
Personally I'd narrow it down to the Revel and KEF, and I'd drop the B&W - for reasons of looks, sound, and design issues.
Then I'd try to get the Revels and KEFs in your room so you can compare them for yourself and make your own decision based on how they sound in your room.
If that's not realistic, tell us more about your room dimensions, where the speakers will be, and where you'll sit. The KEFs have narrower dispersion in the 2-5kHz range. You may or may not prefer that, depending on your tastes and your room layout.
Unfortunately, I don’t think I’d be able to get them home to compare.
The room is about 20ft by 30ft with 9ft ceilings. It will be going in either side of a wall mounted 65inch tv and the main listening spot will probably be about 10 ft away.
What do you mean by narrower dispersion? Out of curiosity do you consider the B&W’s to not be in the same league?
I was on the same boat ,trying to decide between Kef R and Revel ,but I pull the trigger on the Revels,the Revel have a more balanced and neutral sound.
Personally I'd narrow it down to the Revel and KEF, and I'd drop the B&W - for reasons of looks, sound, and design issues.
Then I'd try to get the Revels and KEFs in your room so you can compare them for yourself and make your own decision based on how they sound in your room.
If that's not realistic, tell us more about your room dimensions, where the speakers will be, and where you'll sit. The KEFs have narrower dispersion in the 2-5kHz range. You may or may not prefer that, depending on your tastes and your room layout.
If there is a RBH dealer nearby, try to audition the SX-8300 towers (MSRP $5K, street price $3800).
It has a feature that none of those towers have - the ability to ACTIVELY BI-AMP the bass with an external amp. Thus, you could easily adjust the bass level without messing around with any EQ.
Out of curiosity is the Kef r900 considered in a similar league as the Revel f208? I guess what I am trying to know is it worth the extra $1700. Or are they close enough that in real world settings I wouldn’t notice much difference?
You probably should be looking at a new amp but for $2500 I'd be looking at what I could get in McIntosh or Bryston. You could use the Sony preamp for now with a new power amp then upgrade the preamp later.
I assume by what you are describing you are looking at a 2 channel music setup? If this is for serious music listening disregard previous advice on Room Correction - that's the worst thing you could to a music listening setup IMHO.
??????? A 150 watt Bryston is over 4 grand. Mcintosh........ more. Much more. You are either have a time machine or you are referring to used equipment. Halo A21 is $2495 and is 250watts x2.
If you do have a time machine, lets go back and buy some Mac 7270 amps!!!!!!
Why B&W went with big silver hula hoop rings is beyond me. Wharfedale did that. Looks like something out of Claire's Boutique.
The Revel and KEF are both very good speakers. KEF coaxial driver is fantastic. Revel is very well balanced. It really comes down to personal preference. I would lean towards KEF with sub. If no sub will be used then Revel. Just my opinion.
Try the Goldenear Tritons or Martin Logan Motion. Less money. Tweeters are fabulous.
I agree with previous post regarding the upgrading of the amp. You will want more power. Cary, Simaudio, Mcintosh, Anthem, NAD, Parasound, are some good choices.
Good luck and post whatever you end up getting!!!!
Get a processor and a good seperate amp if you are going multichannel.
If you are going 2 channel pair a nice tube pre with a SS amp. The combo is hard to beat.
You are buying Revels not Bose. You appreciate sound quality so get some good sounding quality electronics to drive them. You will be much happier.
Would the amp in either situation be different? Any particular brand/model recommendations? The salesman was suggesting a Marantz processor and a Anthem 2 channel amp. Then adding a 3 channel amp later if I decide to add more speakers.
I was looking at the same speakers except it was prior to the CM10 and was the CM9 and also threw the B&W 804s into the mix. I ended up going with the KEF R900 - to me they were the most balanced as to my ear the Revels were a bit brighter in the high end though I though the Revels were excellent as well. When I was looking the F208 and R900 would have essentially been the same price. I thought both the Revels and KEFs sounded significantly better than the B&W CM series. The 804s sounded great as well but they were $2500 more than both the R900 and F208 and I didn't think they were that much better to justify the price difference - I was able to use that savings to get the R600 center. I've been very happy with the KEFs but I don't think you can go wrong whichever you choose - comes down to what ultimately sounds better to your ear.
The main reason I was considering Kef is that the dealer was giving a significant deal on them (almost 2 grand off the normal price). The Kef’s are from a discount store while the Revel’s are being sold at a much higher end store so its harder to negotiate with them. Sound wise everyone in the family preferred the Revel’s so even though they are a lot more it makes more sense to go with them.
The 804’s were great too but like you said I didn’t think they were worth the $2500 markup-- the sound on the CM10’s did get close.
Out of curiosity-- has anyone had experience with Bluesound? Most of my songs are in my iTunes library. The Revel dealer was suggesting getting a bluesound vault and using that as a CD player. He says there is a difference between a dedicated CD player vs using a bluray player? Do you guys thing that is some thing that is really noticeable?
Out of curiosity-- has anyone had experience with Bluesound? Most of my songs are in my iTunes library. The Revel dealer was suggesting getting a bluesound vault and using that as a CD player. He says there is a difference between a dedicated CD player vs using a bluray player? Do you guys thing that is some thing that is really noticeable?
Dealers will always say things like this. They might actually believe it, or they might not, but it's good sales tactics on their end. Not so good for you though, because it's highly doubtful that you could hear a difference between the two.
Being a B&W fan and owner for better part of 20 odd years, I feel the CM series is worth it from a performance/price ratio. Can't comment on Revel as I have 0 experience with them. I've lately begun appreciating KEF speakers especially due to dealer price slashing. No doubt in part to poor marketing from KEF US. I find the KEFs are revealing speakers. Not as coloured as B&W. I am not of the camp that coloration is bad. B&W make great wonderful speakers.
In the B&W realm, I'd either hit the 683 (good deal), skip over CM and go straight for 804s. In fact I'd look into a pair of older 804S.
KEFs as I said above make wonderful speakers. I wish they didn't go all boxy. With that kind of price, I won't mind a sense of occassion rather than a box. I do miss their previous Reference and iQ curved designs. Performance wise you get all of your money's worth and more.
In the end, irregardless of your choice, it comes to your room accoustics. What you hear at the audio store will not reflect the same experience as at home.
I wish there was an easy way to test the speakers at home but most places won’t let you.
I actually quite liked the CM10’s and found them comparable to the 804’s. We took our old amps in to test them and they worked very well with them. My sister who ended up coming out with me to check them out ended up getting them and she is just going take our old processor and amp. I really liked the look of the Revel’s.
I just purchased the Revel F208's and love them. You can get them in some major cities at a reduced rate (PM me). I never heard the KEF's, but after many auditions, I found the Revel F208's truer in the mid's and highs and wonderfully tight (and beefier) in the bass compared to the B&W CM10's. There is a certain bright/forward charm to the CM10's initially, but probably more fatiguing after extended listening.
I have a Marantz sr7009 as a pre-amp and an Emotiva XPA 5. So far I can't tell a difference in audio quality, but I notice the Marantz runs a LOT (20 degrees) cooler with the external amp. I also just purchased a Rythmik 15 inch sealed sub and it's a great combo, especially for 5.1 surround. I'm guessing the bigger center (C208) is probably worth the money. I also preferred the F208's to the 206's for pure 2 channel music listening.
I didn’t know you could add an amp to a receiver? I was told a receiver alone wouldn’t be powerful enough to drive the speakers and thus would give suboptimal sound quality. But why not just get a receiver and then add an amp if needed? Is there any difference in sound quality with a processor vs a receiver?
I just purchased the Revel F208's and love them. You can get them in some major cities at a reduced rate (PM me). I never heard the KEF's, but after many auditions, I found the Revel F208's truer in the mid's and highs and wonderfully tight (and beefier) in the bass compared to the B&W CM10's. There is a certain bright/forward charm to the CM10's initially, but probably more fatiguing after extended listening.
I have a Marantz sr7009 as a pre-amp and an Emotiva XPA 5. So far I can't tell a difference in audio quality, but I notice the Marantz runs a LOT (20 degrees) cooler with the external amp. I also just purchased a Rythmik 15 inch sealed sub and it's a great combo, especially for 5.1 surround. I'm guessing the bigger center (C208) is probably worth the money. I also preferred the F208's to the 206's for pure 2 channel music listening.
I've heard the CM10 at the dealer, very unimpressive, pass. R900 owning right now looking for replacement. Revel F 206, haven't heard it but is probably the only dome based towers I'd ever consider getting due to its true engineering roots other than the KEF R which turned out a disappointment.
The F208 is 88db efficient. I would not go from an A series amp rated at ~225 Watts per channel to a receiver that is rated 60 watts per channel w/all channels driven.
Revels like power. They will perform better with a reasonably powered amp. Revel recommends 50-350 watts of amplification. The receiver will barely get you by.
My Goldenears are very efficient. I prefer them on my Anthem/NAD versus the Denon 100 watt receiver they started on. The extra power makes a significant difference.
Im not trying to start a pi$$ing war but Ive been there and done that. The cheap way out usually ends up being the expensive way out when all is said and done.
The F208 is 88db efficient. I would not go from an A series amp rated at ~225 Watts per channel to a receiver that is rated 60 watts per channel w/all channels driven.
That's nice. You don't seem to think Revel is competent to make recommendations for their products. As you note, 60W is within Revel's own recommendation. I disagree.
Furthermore, a more sophisticated analysis would note that when driving two channels - the application discussed by the OP - the previous generation MRX300 clipped at over 100W/ch with two channels driven. There is nothing of which I know to suggest that the amp channels in the '310 are degraded relative to the 300. The difference between that and 225W is barely over 3dB of headroom.
At any rate, with my suggestion provides the best widely-available room correction software, whereas using an NAD AVR or pre-pro relegates one to an obsolete version of a second-tier room correction system. So in my view the prudent path is to start by getting the most important thing in modern audio electronics - the room correction - right, and then add more power later if needed.
Ditto. The only difference is, I expect I've done it with a little more rigor. Have you ever actually measured the voltage output required to reach a given level in your room, for instance?
I ordered the Revel f208s with the Marantz 7702 and the Anthem A2. I may have got suckered into salesman hack but he seemed pretty confident that this would sound good in my room. He really discouraged the pure receiver idea. They didn’t have Anthem MRX310 AVR to test out. But I did notice a sound difference between lower power integrated amps and higher ones so I am erring on the side of caution. I don’t know-- I hope its good.
Is room correction that important? I am thinking I might advise my sister to try out the Anthem MRX310-- she needs a new AVR for her built in home theatre system as her current yamaha receiver is not working that great. That way I can borrow hers and know for myself if it makes a difference for future reference
^Unfortunately, he could have read that myth in any number of places. It's one of those myths that many people believe, and one that the industry itself tries to support.
How dare him prefer a processor to an AVR!!!!! Does he not know that all of this equipment sounds identical? Audio nirvana is reached at $399 with an AVR!!! Anything beyond is illusion and marketing hype!!! Im sure someone can show him the err of his ways with a blindfold and spl meter!!!! What an Audiophool!!!
If you are referring to my comments maybe you should read again. I never said all equipment sounds the same (at any price point). If over priced determines high quality we should all buy a Bose system.
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