GoldenEar Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System Experience - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 50Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 05:49 PM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
GoldenEar Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System Experience

GoldenEar Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System Review

Of all the Dolby Atmos speaker systems I've heard over the past year, the most interesting and unorthodox one came from GoldenEar Technologies, a company that specializes in building high-performance speakers and subwoofers. I attended a dozen Atmos demos at CEDIA 2014, and GoldenEar's Atmos demo was among the most impressive there—topped only by a pair of six-figure super systems from JBL and Steinway Lyngdorf. It managed to conjure a grander sense of immersion than any comparably priced speaker systems at the show. One of the most notable qualities of that demo was the realism achieved by the in-ceiling speakers, which consisted of four Invisa HTR-7000s.

GoldenEar's CEDIA demo was strikingly immersive, so I immediately asked for a system to review. Founder and chief designer Sandy Gross agreed to provide it, but there was one sizeable obstacle to overcome: I rent, so I can't cut four big holes in my ceiling, especially since there's no wiring up there to begin with. I knew I needed to hang speaker enclosures from the ceiling, but I was not enthused by the prospect of building the boxes that the HTR-7000s would require.

Sandy's solution to the enclosure problem was simple enough; he suggested I borrow the same sealed boxes used in the 2014 CEDIA demo. The enclosures are designed to take the place of tiles in a standard drop ceiling, but if I could figure out how to hang them, I was welcome to borrow the boxes—which I did. Soon enough, I had a fully functional 5.1.4 Atmos system.

I've used the four ceiling-mounted HTR-7000s in various Atmos systems over the past year—with great success—and I had planned to review a 5.1.4 all-GoldenEar system containing Triton Five and Seven towers, a SuperCenter XL, and twin ForceField 5 subs.

Right around the same time I received the Triton Fives, Sandy called me and asked if I was willing to hang three more boxes from my ceiling in order to try something new. He went on to describe the GoldenEar Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos, which immediately got my attention because it was literally outside the box.

The radical notion here is that in addition to the Atmos in-ceiling speakers, the front left, center, and right channels can be ceiling-mounted. In the configuration I used, only the surround channels were wall-mounted. Depending on a room's size and shape, it's possible to have an Invisa-based Atmos system comprised entirely of in-ceiling speakers (HTR 7000s), including the surrounds.


Here's the proto-installation of Sandy's concept for a Invisa HTR-7000 in-ceiling system.

At first, the all in-ceiling speaker concept sounded implausible. However, Sandy assured me it would work because the ability to serve as front LCR channels is an integral part of the design of the HTR-7000s, which can project a soundstage that appears to be in front of the listener, despite coming from ceiling speakers. Sandy is an audio-industry legend—he's been in the business for many years and is a co-founder of both Polk Audio and Definitive Technologies—so I brushed aside my doubts and agreed to give the all-Invisa in-ceiling Atmos system a shot.

Features

GoldenEar states that the Invisa HTR-7000's are designed for use as front LCR speakers and that they can "achieve open, boxless, three-dimensional imaging that appears to come from across the front wall rather than the ceiling." That's a crucial capability; without it, an in-ceiling Atmos system simply could not work. The concept requires the illusion of a front stage that appears to be near ear level, like what you hear with tower speakers or bookshelf speakers on stands.

The Invisa HTR-7000s combine a 7" woofer and a folded-ribbon tweeter in a package that handles up to 250 watts of power with 90 dB/W/m sensitivity and 8-ohm impedance. Frequency response is spec'd from 25 Hz to 35 kHz, and it requires a 9" cutout for in-ceiling installations.


A close-up of the Invisa HTR-7000.

The surrounds in this system were a pair of Invisa MPX speakers, which feature dual 4.5" woofers and a folded-ribbon tweeter. The performance specs of the MPX are identical to the HTR-7000, aside from requiring a 12-3/4" H x 6-1/4" W cutout instead of a 9" circle. Crucially, the MPX's drivers fire straight forward, instead of at an angle like the HTR-7000s. That makes the MPX a great choice for an in-wall surround speaker.

Sandy had a surprise for me in the form of new subs for the Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System: twin SuperSub XXLs ($2000 each). These subs—which debuted at CES 2015 and will ship this month—feature dual-opposed, high-excursion 12" woofers and dual-opposed passive radiators.


Check out this image of the active and passive drivers in the SuperSub XXL.

Each SuperSub XXL has a 1600-watt class-D amplifier (originally developed for the Triton One) controlled by a low-latency 56-bit DSP with a 192 kHz sample rate. Quite literally, each SuperSub XXL is equivalent to two ForceField 5 subs in terms of capability, so the effect of the upgrade was quite noticeable—especially when I cranked the system way up. Look for my review of the SuperSub XXL, which is coming soon.

Setup

I hung all the boxes from the 9-foot ceiling in my studio using a layout that conformed to Atmos specifications for height-channel placement. The only limiting factor was the position of the studs—I didn't want the suspended boxes falling on my head, so I had to limit myself to anchor points with studs behind them. It's worth noting that Invisa speakers do not require back boxes, and their design is optimized for use without them.


One of the enclosures I used to hang the Invisa HTR-7000s.

Using Dolby's Atmos guidelines, I positioned the front heights about three feet in front of my couch, and the rear heights were about two feet behind the couch. I hung the front LCR (left, center, right) speakers near the front of the room, directly above where I'd typically place tower speakers and a center channel, which is about two feet away from the front and side walls (for the left and right channels), with the center directly between the two.

For the surrounds, I used a pair of Invisa MPX speakers ($500 each). They are wide-dispersion in-wall speakers—perfect for surround-channel duty—plus they are a great match for the HTR-7000s in terms of price, frequency response, and sensitivity. I used a pair of tall, shallow enclosures that GoldenEar had built for its CEDIA demo to mount the MPXs; these enclosures serve as a false wall of sorts. Once it was set up, I had the actual system GoldenEar will show at CEDIA 2015 in my studio.


The front and the back of Invisa MPX speakers.

I placed the two SuperSub XXLs in the front of the room, one in each corner. They are handsome subwoofers and great performers, to boot. The SuperSub XXLs play clean, clear, tight, and loud—all the way down to the infrasonic realm. A 20 Hz tone—rendered with authority and without audible distortion—is a thing of beauty, and these subs had no problem pulling it off.


One of the mighty GoldenEar SuperSub XXL subwoofers.

I used a Pioneer Elite SC-85 AVR to provide Atmos processing for the rig, and I employed Dirac Live room correction—courtesy of a miniDSP DDRC-88A processor—to deal with room modes and provide EQ for the subs. The DDRC-88A is limited to eight channels of processing, so I used it on all channels except the surrounds, which I EQ'd manually using REW (Room EQ Wizard). I used a Crestron Procise ProAmp 7x250 to power the seven Dirac-processed channels, while the SC-85 took care of amplification for the two surrounds.


I achieved excellent frequency response with the Invisa+SuperSub system.

Listening

The amazing thing about the Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System was how well it worked right off the bat. I did not have to fiddle with it. Indeed, it sounded so impressive that I quickly realized that writing about how good it sounded was going to be a bit contentious! After all, I felt incredulous at the notion that such a system could work as well as a system with the front channels located at ear level. Nevertheless, I'm certain that anybody who hears this Invisa system will observe the same thing: a front soundstage that creates an absolutely convincing illusion that there are speakers are located right in front of you, even though your eyes confirm that there's nothing there but air.

As an experiment, I placed the Triton Fives on the floor beneath the front-LCR Invisas, and I experienced the uncanny illusion that they were responsible for what I was hearing. Meanwhile, the Atmos height speakers sound like they are above you, just as they should. The virtual front channels, combined with the MPX surrounds—which were physically located just above ear level—provided a sense of immersion that was seamless and enveloping.

At the risk of provoking incredulous responses in the comments, in my opinion, the Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System sounded better than the vast majority of speaker systems I've heard to date. I don't have any qualifiers to add to that claim—it's that good. When playing music or movies, whether the volume was set down low, way up, or somewhere in between, the fidelity and overall effectiveness of the system repeatedly astounded me.

One of the most interesting things I noticed when experimenting with the Invisa speaker system was how Atmos significantly improved the illusion of an ear-level main front soundstage. When I turned off Atmos processing, the front soundstage seem to lift up a bit, as if I was listening to six-foot-tall speakers.

When Dolby Atmos was active, the front soundstage lowered down to ear level. To my ears, it was as good as any speaker system that relies on a center speaker positioned underneath or above a TV. With Atmos, the Invisa system provided the illusion of voices and sounds coming right out of the TV screen, just as you would experience with an acoustically transparent screen in a front-projection setup.

When I played some of Dolby's Atmos demo clips, I could scarcely believe how clear and precise the system sounded. I heard properly rendered Atmos effects, featuring both ambience and object-based specificity. I could easily visualize where each and every discrete sound object was located within 3D space, and ambient sounds created the illusion of environments larger and smaller than the actual room. It was the very definition of immersive.

I used Mad Max: Fury Road as my reference for cinematic Atmos soundtracks. Ralph Potts says it's the best immersive audio mix he's heard in a movie, and I agree. The climatic chase scene near the end of the movie demands a resolute system that can handle complex layering while offering excellent dynamics with deep and powerful bass. Thanks to the twin SuperSub XXLs, there was no shortage of physical impact to the presentation. Additionally, no matter how high I turned up the volume knob, the sound coming out of the Invisas remained crisp, clear, and non-fatiguing.

Dolby demo clips and movies mixed in Atmos are great for testing immersive speaker systems, but I also enjoy using the Dolby Surround upmixer to listen to music. On album after album, I could scarcely believe what I heard—music sounded real. The most profound example was how realistic live jazz recordings sound when played through the system. I'm sure you've read speaker reviews that describe a sense of musicians being right there in the room with you. Well, with the Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System, I experienced the illusion of being in the venue with the musicians, whether it was a jazz club or a concert hall. The system's ability to re-create the ambience of other spaces is truly impressive.

Conclusion

I'm going through withdrawal. I'm not sure if I should thank Sandy Gross or blame him for spoiling my ears with his seemingly absurd concept for an Atmos speaker system. I only had my hands on the system for about two weeks, but that was long enough to make me miss it already. Needless to say, there's a family and pet-friendly aspect to in-ceiling speaker systems that make them appealing to non-enthusiasts, but in this case, there's nothing lost in going that route—such is the fidelity of the Invisa HTR-7000 and MPX speakers.

Based on what I heard during the time I had them, the Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System ranks in the top tier of sound systems I've had in my studio. Certainly, any preconceived notion I held that an in-ceiling speaker system would not be able to perform as well as one based on tower speakers was shattered.

Ultimately, the GoldenEar Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System turned out to be so awesome that I have a sneaking suspicion it's going to amaze people who hear it at CEDIA 2015—which is now just two weeks away. If you are attending CEDIA, don't miss the GoldenEar demo; you'll likely be amazed by what you hear.

REVIEW SYSTEM

Source

Samsung BD-H6600 Blu-ray player

Amplification and Processing

Pioneer Elite SC-85 AVR
Crestron Procise ProAmp 7X250 Amplifier
miniDSP DDRC-88A Dirac Live processor

Cables

Monoprice 12-gauge OFC speaker cables
Mediabridge Ultra Series HDMI cable
Monoprice RCA-to-XLR interconnects
freeman4 and toddman36 like this.

Mark Henninger

Last edited by imagic; 10-03-2015 at 07:30 AM.
imagic is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 06:13 PM
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Star of the Northern Hemisphere
Posts: 17,034
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7012 Post(s)
Liked: 3546
WoW Mark; that looks like serious overhead sound!

Subscribed.
ellisr63 and imagic like this.
NorthSky is offline  
post #3 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 06:34 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: United States
Posts: 1,455
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 641 Post(s)
Liked: 750
You had me at hell
18Hurts is online now  
 
post #4 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 06:39 PM
Senior Member
 
JohnstownFlood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Central NY
Posts: 382
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 185 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Awesome, been looking forward to this! I'm going all GE for my theater - MPXs for the sides, 7000s for heights and either T5s or T2s for the LCR. One of the things I wasn't 100% on was the volume of space needed for the 7000s, even after reading the manual and talking to Sandy himself. At least according to your "clouds" I think I got it pretty close. Were these built by GE for the specific use of testing?
JohnstownFlood is offline  
post #5 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 06:40 PM
Advanced Member
 
DaveyMac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 686
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 570 Post(s)
Liked: 104
Excited to see this review! I Recently with with all GE speakers except heights. Been very pleased with the 5 so far and looking forward to adding the Atmos ones.

Last edited by DaveyMac; 10-01-2015 at 10:33 PM.
DaveyMac is offline  
post #6 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 06:41 PM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnstownFlood View Post
Awesome, been looking forward to this! I'm going all GE for my theater - MPXs for the sides, 7000s for heights and either T5s or T2s for the LCR. One of the things I wasn't 100% on was the volume of space needed for the 7000s, even after reading the manual and talking to Sandy himself. At least according to your "clouds" I think I got it pretty close. Were these built by GE for the specific use of testing?
They were build by GoldenEar for use in its CEDIA demos! But that was done so they do not disturb their neighbors. It's worth noting the HTR-7000 and MPX are designed to work without enclosures.
JohnstownFlood likes this.

Mark Henninger

Last edited by imagic; 10-01-2015 at 07:16 PM.
imagic is online now  
post #7 of 123 Old 10-01-2015, 08:12 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
mmiles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Delaware
Posts: 3,205
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 465 Post(s)
Liked: 214
GE will be showing a similar system at CEDIA.

7.2.4 under $10K
imagic likes this.

Mike Miles
mmiles is offline  
post #8 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 06:40 AM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmiles View Post
GE will be showing a similar system at CEDIA.

7.2.4 under $10K
I shipped the whole thing to Denver a couple of weeks ago. The electronics will be different, and GE will have two more surround speakers than I did, but the bulk of the system will be the exact same gear i.e. these enclosures, these subs, these speakers. The post will be ready soon...

"We will have the exact system you had, literally." - Sandy Gross

Mark Henninger

Last edited by imagic; 10-02-2015 at 03:59 PM.
imagic is online now  
post #9 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 11:07 AM
Senior Member
 
Pelly_NV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Anxious to hear how $4000 worth of subs handle some movies.
imagic and toofast68 like this.
Pelly_NV is offline  
post #10 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 04:00 PM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelly_NV View Post
Anxious to hear how $4000 worth of subs handle some movies.
I'm going to publish a separate review of the SuperSub XXLs, but I do discuss their contribution to this system in this (coming very soon) piece.

Mark Henninger
imagic is online now  
post #11 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 04:03 PM
Senior Member
 
Pelly_NV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
I'm going to publish a separate review of the SuperSub XXLs, but I do discuss their contribution to this system in this (coming very soon) piece.
I'm embarassed with the number of times I've hit refresh on this thread. Anxious to hear your impressions!
Pelly_NV is offline  
post #12 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 05:26 PM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelly_NV View Post
I'm embarassed with the number of times I've hit refresh on this thread. Anxious to hear your impressions!
Done, posted.
DaveyMac likes this.

Mark Henninger

Last edited by imagic; 10-02-2015 at 06:14 PM.
imagic is online now  
post #13 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 06:17 PM
Senior Member
 
Pelly_NV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Done, posted.
Thx! Great read.
Pelly_NV is offline  
post #14 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 06:58 PM
Advanced Member
 
DaveyMac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 686
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 570 Post(s)
Liked: 104
That's very impressive, thanks for the great review.

I know you demo'd Triton 5's recently. Do you think the 7000's would work well with those as the front speakers?
DaveyMac is offline  
post #15 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 06:59 PM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveyMac View Post
That's very impressive, thanks for the great review.

I know you demo'd Triton 5's recently. Do you think the 7000's would work well with those as the front speakers?
Yes, I can tell you that combo definitely works.
DaveyMac likes this.

Mark Henninger
imagic is online now  
post #16 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 07:42 PM
Senior Member
 
JohnstownFlood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Central NY
Posts: 382
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 185 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveyMac View Post
That's very impressive, thanks for the great review.

I know you demo'd Triton 5's recently. Do you think the 7000's would work well with those as the front speakers?

Thanks again, Mark! I seriously need to stop reading reviews like this...it's making me take shortcuts in my theater build. My GE's ain't doing no good sitting in boxes!


I'd love to dig into the psychoacoustics of how in the heck the 7000s can project an ear level sound and an overhead sound simply based on their distance from the listener.
imagic likes this.
JohnstownFlood is offline  
post #17 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 07:46 PM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnstownFlood View Post
Thanks again, Mark! I seriously need to stop reading reviews like this...it's making me take shortcuts in my theater build. My GE's ain't doing no good sitting in boxes!


I'd love to dig into the psychoacoustics of how in the heck the 7000s can project an ear level sound and an overhead sound simply based on their distance from the listener.
That is the trick. I can (probably) coax some comments out of Sandy. Maybe at CEDIA.
DaveyMac likes this.

Mark Henninger
imagic is online now  
post #18 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 08:42 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
gene4ht's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Troy, MI
Posts: 1,708
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked: 736
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Based on what I heard during the time I had them, the Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System ranks in the top tier of sound systems I've had in my studio. Certainly, any preconceived notion I held that an in-ceiling speaker system would not be able to perform as well as one based on tower speakers was shattered.

Ultimately, the GoldenEar Ultimate Invisa Lifestyle Atmos System turned out to be so awesome that I have a sneaking suspicion it's going to amaze people who hear it at CEDIA 2015—which is now just two weeks away. If you are attending CEDIA, don't miss the GoldenEar demo; you'll likely be amazed by what you hear.
For the better part of a year now, early HT Atmos adopters in several threads here have been asking about and looking for the "best speaker for Atmos." IMO, it was a premature question. Although Atmos in theaters had reached maturity, questions/challenges for the home environment had not yet been asked or addressed. Speaker manufacturers attempted to answer and respond with their "off the shelf ceiling speakers" by marketing FR and wide dispersion specs, etc. It appears now that speaker manufacturers are actually purposefully designing and building speakers for 3D sound. To my knowledge, it appears AT and now GE have actually advanced the technology. Based upon the results and your (Mark's) favorable review, I suspect that other manufacturers will be following suit in the coming year...a win for all of us!

Epson: 5040UB | Elite: 115" Fixed Frame CinemaScope (2.35:1) | Denon: X6300H (7.2.4) | Klipsch: RF-7 II's, RC-64 II, RS-62 II, RB-61 II MICCA: M-8C (Atmos) x 6 | SVS: PB16-Ultra x 2 | Philips: BDP7501 Oppo: UDP-203
gene4ht is offline  
post #19 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 09:26 PM
Advanced Member
 
DigitalAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: United States of Advertising
Posts: 676
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 68 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Hey Mark!

1) Did you toe in the front L/R 7000's at all?

2) How did you have the 4x height 7000's pointed? All directly at MLP? Did you try different listening positions to see how the effect holds up?

3) So you used Dirac Live on L/C/R/Hx4 (so, on all of the 7x 7000s), then manually EQ'd the side surrounds (2x MPXs)? Did you use the Pio MCACC on top of that at all?

4) Can you think of ANY reason at all (sound quality-wise) one would still go with an AT screen with L/C/Rs behind? If not, this is an incredible breakthrough that would literally save thousands!

5) Great review, as always!!
ellisr63, mtbdudex and DaveyMac like this.

DigitalAV is online now  
post #20 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 09:33 PM
Advanced Member
 
DigitalAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: United States of Advertising
Posts: 676
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 68 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by gene4ht View Post
To my knowledge, it appears AT and now GE have actually advanced the technology.
The weird thing though is they are COMPLETELY different...the AT IC-6 OBA is wide dispersion and pointed straight down (to mimic multiple higher speakers), while the GE HTR 7000 is angled and very much direct-fire!

It's hard to wrap my head around which would be "better" in what environments, and why? Room size? Multiple rows? Placement?? Oh my!!
mtbdudex likes this.

DigitalAV is online now  
post #21 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 09:38 PM
Senior Member
 
JohnstownFlood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Central NY
Posts: 382
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 185 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalAV View Post

4) Can you think of ANY reason at all (sound quality-wise) one would still go with an AT screen with L/C/Rs behind? If not, this is an incredible breakthrough that would literally save thousands!

For GE's, the Triton towers use a larger tweeter than the golden colored folded ribbon you see at the front of the 7000 and in the center of the MPX. I'm completely speculating here, but I would imagine that the larger tweeter would simply be able to create that much wider of a soundstage - more "air" in the mix, everything that tweeters do...or I could just be talking out of my butt.


Mark's demo'd both...I'd be interested to know as well!
DigitalAV likes this.
JohnstownFlood is offline  
post #22 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 10:06 PM
Senior Member
 
nitro28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Omaha, NE
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 131 Post(s)
Liked: 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnstownFlood View Post
For GE's, the Triton towers use a larger tweeter than the golden colored folded ribbon you see at the front of the 7000 and in the center of the MPX. I'm completely speculating here, but I would imagine that the larger tweeter would simply be able to create that much wider of a soundstage - more "air" in the mix, everything that tweeters do...or I could just be talking out of my butt.


Mark's demo'd both...I'd be interested to know as well!
I've heard both and I still like having the Triton 2 towers for listening to music. I play around with how I toe them in which is different than listening to music. That is the reason I decided to keep the two towers out from behind my AT screen. I then just have the supercenter XL behind it.

I like seeing these threads about GE and atmos, mainly since my all GE theater is nearing completion. I actually bought the demos used at GE's booth last year so several of you may have actually already heard my speakers I built boxes for 6 overhead even though only 4 will be used now and each of the 4 MPXs has a 1.5 cu ft box for sides and surround. I've played around with them a little, but can't wait to get this thing fully operational.
DaveyMac likes this.

James

My theater build 2015 (Circle N theater)
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/19-ded...ter-build.html
nitro28 is offline  
post #23 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 11:08 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
gene4ht's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Troy, MI
Posts: 1,708
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked: 736
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalAV View Post
The weird thing though is they are COMPLETELY different...the AT IC-6 OBA is wide dispersion and pointed straight down (to mimic multiple higher speakers), while the GE HTR 7000 is angled and very much direct-fire!
Agreed...no doubt different ways to skin different cats perhaps...just happy to know that cats are being skinned (not literally of course)...also eager to hear what Mark's further discussions with Sandy at CEDIA will yield.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalAV View Post
It's hard to wrap my head around which would be "better" in what environments, and why? Room size? Multiple rows? Placement?? Oh my!!
No doubt, it will be obvious that one size will not fit all. We're now seeing ceiling speakers as well as Atmos Enabled speakers. Eventually, as manufacturers understand the home environment challenges better, we should see product offerings addressing these differences and variances...hopefully sooner rather than later...then we can make better and easier informed decisions.
DigitalAV likes this.

Epson: 5040UB | Elite: 115" Fixed Frame CinemaScope (2.35:1) | Denon: X6300H (7.2.4) | Klipsch: RF-7 II's, RC-64 II, RS-62 II, RB-61 II MICCA: M-8C (Atmos) x 6 | SVS: PB16-Ultra x 2 | Philips: BDP7501 Oppo: UDP-203
gene4ht is offline  
post #24 of 123 Old 10-02-2015, 11:44 PM
Advanced Member
 
bkeeler10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Utah
Posts: 783
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 296 Post(s)
Liked: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmiles View Post
GE will be showing a similar system at CEDIA.

7.2.4 under $10K
I shipped the whole thing to Denver a couple of weeks ago. The electronics will be different, and GE will have two more surround speakers than I did, but the bulk of the system will be the exact same gear i.e. these enclosures, these subs, these speakers. The post will be ready soon...

"We will have the exact system you had, literally." - Sandy Gross

I do hope you shipped them to Dallas instead lol
bkeeler10 is online now  
post #25 of 123 Old 10-03-2015, 02:06 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
mtbdudex's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 5,754
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 78 Post(s)
Liked: 689
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalAV View Post
Hey Mark!

1) Did you toe in the front L/R 7000's at all?

2) How did you have the 4x height 7000's pointed? All directly at MLP? Did you try different listening positions to see how the effect holds up?

3) So you used Dirac Live on L/C/R/Hx4 (so, on all of the 7x 7000s), then manually EQ'd the side surrounds (2x MPXs)? Did you use the Pio MCACC on top of that at all?

4) Can you think of ANY reason at all (sound quality-wise) one would still go with an AT screen with L/C/Rs behind? If not, this is an incredible breakthrough that would literally save thousands!

5) Great review, as always!!
I also am curious the toe-in ability, can they be rotated "room inward" easily or the toe-in needs to be determiner prior to final screwing them in?
On thing is for sure, no SBIR issue to contend with.

AT screen's have been touted here at AVS for their ability to have the sound coming from the "image onscreen", plus acoustics management.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalAV View Post
The weird thing though is they are COMPLETELY different...the AT IC-6 OBA is wide dispersion and pointed straight down (to mimic multiple higher speakers), while the GE HTR 7000 is angled and very much direct-fire!

It's hard to wrap my head around which would be "better" in what environments, and why? Room size? Multiple rows? Placement?? Oh my!!
I posted about the AT IC-6 OBA in this post http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1574386-official-dolby-atmos-thread-home-theater-version-638.html#post31583289 ,
markus and otherts pretty much had negative things to say about them.
I'm not sure how their usage was realized in real world.
DigitalAV likes this.

Last edited by mtbdudex; 10-03-2015 at 02:10 AM.
mtbdudex is offline  
post #26 of 123 Old 10-03-2015, 06:18 AM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkeeler10 View Post
I do hope you shipped them to Dallas instead lol
Oh snap! Yeah I did.
DaveyMac likes this.

Mark Henninger
imagic is online now  
post #27 of 123 Old 10-03-2015, 08:51 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
LowellG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Helotes, TX
Posts: 2,140
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 523 Post(s)
Liked: 203
OK, I have always been interested in the GE line, but it that really a fair comparison of in ceiling speakers. They were all boxed.

Lowell


The MarvelAtmos Home Theater: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/19-ded...e-theater.html
LowellG is offline  
post #28 of 123 Old 10-03-2015, 09:04 AM - Thread Starter
Assoc. Editor @ AVS Forum
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10,807
Mentioned: 163 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4940 Post(s)
Liked: 8364
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowellG View Post
OK, I have always been interested in the GE line, but it that really a fair comparison of in ceiling speakers. They were all boxed.
As a reviewer, I'm simply not in a position to cut holes and run wires in order to try out a concept speaker system for two weeks. However, is it fair? Yes, absolutely it is. Installations will vary in terms of ceiling height, room size, and whether or not back boxes are used. Based on my experience, such a system will cover a wide variety of installation scenarios. According to Sandy Gross, if anything the speakers should perform even better without back boxes, since they were designed to do without. But if you do use one, the company recommends an enclosure between 1 and 1.5 cubic feet for the HTR-7000.

Mark Henninger
imagic is online now  
post #29 of 123 Old 10-03-2015, 10:11 AM
Advanced Member
 
DigitalAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: United States of Advertising
Posts: 676
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 68 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post
I posted about the AT IC-6 OBA in this post http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1574386-official-dolby-atmos-thread-home-theater-version-638.html#post31583289 ,
markus and otherts pretty much had negative things to say about them.
I'm not sure how their usage was realized in real world.
Interesting. Makes sense what markus lays out, but I couldn't quite tell if they actually listened to them, or was this all theoretical? Did Dave Vaughn ever follow up with actually installing/using them (EDIT: looks like he likes them: http://www.soundandvision.com/conten...art-2-page-2)?


Last edited by DigitalAV; 10-03-2015 at 10:18 AM.
DigitalAV is online now  
post #30 of 123 Old 10-03-2015, 11:41 AM
Member
 
Ryan Hendry's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 90
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Loving this article Mark. Great job!
imagic and DaveyMac like this.
Ryan Hendry is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Speakers

Tags
atmos , Goldenear , htr-7000 , invisa , supersub xxl
Gear in this thread



Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off