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Picking out small room music system

838 views 34 replies 9 participants last post by  mthomas47 
#1 ·
I am looking to find some recommendations on a system that I am setting up. I want to have a system of speakers for my 90% music, 10% movie habits. I am thinking of doing it 7.2, I already settled on the subwoofers but have been indecisive with picking out a good line of speakers.

What I have done:
The subwoofers that I plan to purchase soon are a pair of SVS SB13 ultras. I also am pretty sure that I am going to get the Emotiva Xmc-1 and Xpa Gen 3 to replace the Yamaha mentioned below. My current room is 11 by 13 feet with 7 foot ceilings and no treatment, which I know sounds hilarious, however its mostly dedicated with little furniture, its closed off and will expand in the future. I currently have a strange piecemeal system consisting of:
Mains: Pioneer SP‑FS52
Sides: Radioshack realistic Mc 600
Rear: Bose 201 series V
Center: Phase tech pc 3.1
Sub: Phase tech 10 inch pc sub
Amp: Yamaha RX-V661

What I have to do:
My preference would be that the pair of towers in the line are around $2000. Which usually leads to the rest of the speakers being within a budget I can manage. I listen to a large range of music, if I had to focus it I would say the indie genre. I don't need the towers to have deep bass because of the subwoofer situation, I am looking for something with really tight midrange and treble. However size and looks hardly matter as long as if they are sacrificed performance is gained. I was looking at (in order of current preference):
SVS ultra series
Aperion Verus Grand
Goldenear system

I am totally open to suggestions though, otherwise why would I be here.

Sorry for the heap of details, I just tried to be as specific as possible to try to make it easier.

Thanks in advance.
 
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#2 ·
Might want to add these to the list.

http://www.nhthifi.com/products/165...er-speaker?category_id=1964844-tower-speakers

http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages/products/speakers/SRT/srt.html

http://philharmonicaudio.com/slims.html

Some more choices in your price range

http://www.crutchfield.com/g_12000/Floor-standing-Speakers.html#&nvpair=FFBrand|Monitor Audio&nvpair=FFBrand|PSB&nvpair=FFBrand|Sonus Faber

As others respond the list will get even longer.

The very best thing you can do is demo as many as you can in your own room. It can be time consuming, maybe cost you some interest charges etc... but it is the only way to know for sure which YOU like best.

Most of the companies listed have at least 30 day trial periods with shipping both ways covered or reduced return shipping.
 
#3 ·
Tons of good speaker options mentioned already. I think you could just explore them :)

Given the size of your room, I don't know that I would rush out to by a separate amp and processor, particularly given that your main interest is music listening. You could spend about half as much on a top level Denon or Marantz receiver, and likely it would have enough power for your listening volume at the listening position. I'd give the Yamaha a try first and see what you think. On the other hand, if you do like it loud, you might also consider some of these: http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/mtm-210t. Very high sensitivity speakers designed to play loud.

Since you are considering 7.2, might want to consider 5.2.2 as well.
 
#4 ·
I really like the NHT series, I wasn't aware that they even made that series and it makes a great competitor to the ultra series. I was/am unsure of the ultra towers because of the port and reviews saying it had a lack of treble finesse. The acoustic suspension and aluminum tweeter in the NHT fits what I am looking for well. I will as soon as I solidify a competitive top three order the towers from each brand and try them all out. I dont mind interest and shipping charges if it means I can make a better decisions, I dont want to live with regret.

The PSA system also looks great, in its own way of seeming in the same spirit of svs, I wonder why. I think I would rattle the walls down if I go with that option, which doesn't sound all that bad. I will definitely play with atmos and look around PSA, I worked myself down from a 11.2.4 system realizing my budget and tiny room wouldn't agree with that.

Thank you for the quick responses.
 
#8 ·
Those Sonus Fabers are a good prospect, it would be cool to have interchangable side panels and I heard a few of their other speakers and they were fantastic. Also I had looked at the Martin Logans but I think the rear port would cause problems in my currently small room, which will get bigger but I'm not sure by how much. The Monitor Audio and PSB models I haven't looked into enough to figure out how well they would work. Thank you for the suggestions and articles backing them up.
 
#9 ·
If I were in the market to replace my much loved Usher V602's I'd be looking at Sonus Faber.

I'd have DEFINITELY have recommended the Usher replacement which are the N6311's for $1590/pair but the chances of you being to audition them unless you are is southern California are virtually nil.

I don't want to recommend something so impossible to audition...but as they are very similar to my V602's I'm sure they are delightful...if underwhelming visually/spec wise with their number of drivers. Front ported though.

I prefer the Usher tweeter to the much lauded folded ribbon in my Martin Logan LX16's which I really like...but the Usher dome tweeter is better IMHO.

http://usheraudio.us/?wpsc-product=n-6311

Some prior posters have given excellent suggestions also.

I'm intrigued by Philharmonic Audio also.

I kinda wish I was in your shoes! :p
 
#10 ·
After reading through all of the suggestions and doing some research of my own I think I can boil it down to:
(not in order of preference)
SVS Ultra tower
Salk Songtower
NHT C4
PSA MTM 210t
Aperion Verus Grand
Sonus Faber Chameleon T

I can probably audition 3 or 4 of those, to anyone reading new or returning to this thread. I have a few that I am unsure about on that list. I'm not sure of the quality of the highs in the Aperion and SVS. I hardly know anything about the NHT's, I don't think there are any reviews besides two on amazon, they seem great but I cant fully make that call with such little review. Lastly I question whether the Salk could keep up with the subs at high volume levels without distortion or damage considering my occasional movie application. I don't see any potential dealbreakers with the PSA or Sonus Faber though. All of that might be me being picky after seeing occasional reviews about each, I just wanted to ask if anyone had live experience with any of those problems, or if anyone can refer me to a review on the NHT's.

Thanks for everything so far.
 
#11 ·
The NHTs are a new model as are all the current NHT "classic" speakers. They are similar to the previous line but have a slight redesign so there won't be any reviews to speak of.

You can get an idea by reading reviews of the Classic 3. The C4 tower is the current C3 (classic 3 replacement) sitting on top of the additional woofers. So the mids and highs are the same between the 2 only differing in low end extension and output. I wouldn't expect the current C3 to be all that much different than the previous version.

http://www.nhthifi.com/products/165...category_id=1968128-c-series#customer_reviews
 
#12 ·
On the topic of the subwoofers, I genuinely thought that I would be happy with the pair of sb13u's but right before I pulled the trigger on them I was looking around the PSA website and had second thoughts, one PSA T18HT costs the same as dual SB13U's. I know its usually better to have 2 small subwoofers vs one large one, but if I have it in such a small room I don't know how much that would still apply. The benefit of the SVS path is that its dual, it has nicer amp controls, and I have read probably every glowing review there is on that subwoofer. The benefit of the T18HT is that it can hit 9hz and would probably be louder in general and especially in the deepest frequencies compared to the pair. The PSA website claims that it would take four of the SVS older brother the PB13U to equal one T18HT. Thanks for all the advice so far and sorry to be so indecisive.
 
#13 ·
I'm not quite understanding the number of speakers desired and on that budget and listening preference. 7.2 for 90 percent music and 10 percent tv/movies?

Why oh why are you not starting with a better 2.1 system over a mediocore 7.2 system?

I've been building my system for years and still haven't made it to 7.x and not sure I ever will.

If it were me I would redirect my funds to a smaller scale set-up but higher quality and build out over time if wanted especially at 90 percent music.

But good luck- slow and steady wins the race in my experience.
 
#14 ·
I know I didn't explain my budget or time layout very well. My plan was to get this class of system with amps and subs that could last me awhile and then be enjoying this one while I save up for a much nicer one. You have a very good point and I know its wiser to slowly build up a system of good parts then to assemble a mediocre one immediately. I can currently bring in a budget of $2000-$3000 a year. I in the future would love to have a focal system or 6 GoldenEar triton ones. To address why I would be doing surround for mostly music, my optimal system would be a surround of full range towers, I just like to hear the music from all sides. Maybe I only say that because I haven't heard a large enough soundstage, that was just my reasoning behind that.

What my current plan is:
This year: sb13u pair
Nest year: xmc 1 and xpa gen 3
Third year: $2000 towers
Fourth year: $3000 finish system

Then with that in place start saving up for a nicer system.

Should I just wait a few years after the amps and subs to get a nicer system or should I stick to what I had in mind?

Thank you for your help.
 
#15 ·
To address why I would be doing surround for mostly music, my optimal system would be a surround of full range towers, I just like to hear the music from all sides.
Doesn't always work well to use towers for surrounds as often people have trouble placing them such that furniture blocks them at the listening position.

But, if that's where you want to head, I'd say go for towers for 3.0 right now. Wait on the subs and everything else. :)
 
#17 ·
Three of the exact same speaker is better than two towers (or bookshelves) and a matching center. Center speakers are compromised designs that people use because they can't accommodate a matching horizontal speaker. But if you want the absolute best sound when using 3.0 and can afford it, go with all three the same without a doubt :)

BTW: While they may list them for sale as pairs, many of the Internet direct vendors will gladly sell you three of the same. If you don't see it on the website, you just have to call them.
 
#18 ·
Ah, I see what you mean now, I was for some reason under the impression that I needed a matching center rather than a tower. Could I in theory have 7 towers in a room with only towers and a chair or do you think the law of diminishing returns would come into play at that point?
 
#19 ·
If the choices were

Lower model speaker series with 5 towers (or 7 towers)

vs

Higher model speakers series (better sound) with three towers, the rest bookshelves in the series.

I'd definitely go for the latter. The front soundstage is most important :)

Plus, you'll have killer subs to take care of any bass that the surrounds can't. I'd probably look for bookshelves in the same speaker series rated for a low end of 60hz +/- 3db or lower, and then cross them at 80hz. The reason being that is speakers tend to have more distortion in bass below their tuning point. So if you go for 80hz as the crossover, generally best to pick speakers that aren't rolling off in output already.
 
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#20 ·
Yeah, one of the benefits of those subs is that they can handle frequencies up to 400hz, although that would be foolish in most cases to use that because then you could localize them. I have yet to hear those 6 speakers that I determined to be the best solutions, but since they are all in that price range I could in a few years get 5 or 7 of them.
 
#21 · (Edited)
I am looking to find some recommendations on a system that I am setting up. I want to have a system of speakers for my 90% music, 10% movie habits. I am thinking of doing it 7.2, I already settled on the subwoofers but have been indecisive with picking out a good line of speakers.

What I have done:
The subwoofers that I plan to purchase soon are a pair of SVS SB13 ultras. I also am pretty sure that I am going to get the Emotiva Xmc-1 and Xpa Gen 3 to replace the Yamaha mentioned below. My current room is 11 by 13 feet with 7 foot ceilings and no treatment, which I know sounds hilarious, however its mostly dedicated with little furniture, its closed off and will expand in the future. I currently have a strange piecemeal system consisting of:
Mains: Pioneer SP‑FS52
Sides: Radioshack realistic Mc 600
Rear: Bose 201 series V
Center: Phase tech pc 3.1
Sub: Phase tech 10 inch pc sub
Amp: Yamaha RX-V661

What I have to do:
My preference would be that the pair of towers in the line are around $2000. Which usually leads to the rest of the speakers being within a budget I can manage. I listen to a large range of music, if I had to focus it I would say the indie genre. I don't need the towers to have deep bass because of the subwoofer situation, I am looking for something with really tight midrange and treble. However size and looks hardly matter as long as if they are sacrificed performance is gained. I was looking at (in order of current preference):
SVS ultra series
Aperion Verus Grand
Goldenear system
Hmmm, what an interesting set of parameters... your room is quite modest in size, your current system is even more modest in quality, and yet your proposed upgrade is a HUGE leap in both budget and size/capacity/quality!

Questions:
1. Have you ever heard any speakers IN BETWEEN the $2K/pair range that you're proposing? What I mean is, if you have not and are basing your proposed speakers entirely on pricetag, how do you know that you might not be perfectly happy with speakers costing 1/2 or even 1/3 as much?

Especially given your modest room size and the considerable upgrade in power source you have in mind, as well as the addition of such abundantly potent subwoofers for that modest space---abundantly potent given your 90% music rather than 90% HT usage and the fact that "indie" music is not exactly bass-intensive at all. Speakers with "tight midrange and treble" are not difficult to come by, and these days for much less.

Ascend is one company that you should definitely look closely at, including its plain-Jane less expensive models like the 340SE since you wrote that aesthetics are not of paramount importance to you, because they definitely focus on midrange and treble accuracy, with great success especially in terms of maximum bang for the buck. Chane is another one, along with NHT.

2. When you say the space "will expand in the future" what exactly might that entail? Are you going to knock down some walls to double or triple the size of the space? Or is the current "11 x 13" space you describe only part of a much larger open plan, e.g. opening up into larger adjacent areas? If so then your current proposal would be less puzzling.

Just curious...
 
#22 ·
dolby labs sound room example

 
#23 · (Edited)
I'll add Dynaudio and Chane to the list. Both tend towards accuracy across the frequency range (Chane a bit more upper-treble forward). There are many options, many have been delineated within this thread. That said, I would tend to agree with a prior poster, who counseled you to consider speakers of lesser cost. In a room of that size, the need for high efficiency speakers or high output speakers is dubious. High cost speakers should be confined to the front stereo pair, or perhaps those and the center.

In addition, two subs of the size you are considering. is massive overkill in a room of that size. You would be much better off with one or two sealed Rythmik subs. With a small room, reinforcement is already present in the lower octaves, and using subs with high output in those regions just begs for muddy and thick bass. Rythmik is called the music sub for a reason. If music is the focus, that is where I would look.

Lastly, I would consider a 5.2 or 5.1 as your starter system. With such close quarters, you may not find the improvement from two surrounds to four surrounds to be worth the effort, especially if you will be sitting against the rear wall.

You will get plenty of help to spend money here. Folks like to spend other people's money! However, nobody here can speak to your taste in sound, you will have to learn that for yourself by getting out from behind the keyboard and doing some serious and lengthy listening to a wide variety of speaker options. Is it worth the additional thousand dollars for the front pair? Only your ears can decide that!
 
#24 ·
To answer a few questions:
1: I know I have a very strange listening room and system at the moment
2: I have heard a few speakers around the $1000-$1500 but I plan to definitely hear some more before I pay more
3: After hearing some of the subpar soundbars and cheap home theater bundles I would already be plenty happy with this system, I just caught the upgrade bug after hearing some Sonus Faber Venere 2.5's coupled with a SVS sb13u
4: The reasons I opt for such potent subwoofers are that I really like to have bass headroom, after worrying about my phase on some bass heavy songs I would like to just have subs that could handle anything I could possibly throw at them, and I would like to be able to hit around 20hz without distortion, I will look at the Rhythmik sub selection though
5: I like the sound of Chane, Dynaudio and Ascend, I don't want to pay more to have my speakers look better, no nonsense is appealing
6: When I say expand the room I mean that I might in the future move into a house with a bigger room or possibly get to design a room from the ground up, currently it looks like a expansion is likely but only a small one, the room most likely will always be sealed and small-medium sized
7: Although people seem to enjoy giving advice on here, I still do appreciate it a lot

I think what I might go with at this point is a 5.2 system consisting of all towers or 3 towers 2 bookshelf depending on the brand I go with. I'll try to post whenever I get the chance to audition a bunch of speakers and really start getting into finer details.

Do you have any Rhythmik models that you recommend that could hit 20hz with authority while being more musical and modest?, the appeal of the ultras is headroom and authority.
 
#30 · (Edited)
To answer a few questions:


Do you have any Rhythmik models that you recommend that could hit 20hz with authority while being more musical and modest?, the appeal of the ultras is headroom and authority.
There are a lot of sealed options at Rythmik. I would start with the F12 and F15. ONE of these should be enough in that room. You can always add another, if and when the room expands or you move to a larger space. You have a 45 day trial period, so you can always add a second one or upgrade if you find the response is not up to your volume control proclivities. ;)

FYI, the reason to add additional subs is not usually for more volume, but for a more even frequency response within the room. This is often necessary in rooms that have a wide or deep seating area. In smaller rooms, with a limited seating area, you can usually get a good response curve with just one sub (but there are no guarantees, as each room has it's own idiosyncrasies).

Once you have chosen your mains, you should contact Rythmik and seek their advice as to the best option for you to start. It is going to be incredibly loud and clean with an F12. With an F15, you get +4.5 db of output, which should be enough to implode your eardrums. :eek:

One of the real benefits of Rythmik is their many options for integration with your main speakers. With music, integration is the most important quality a sub can have. Again, this is a conversation to have with Rythmik, when you are ready.
 
#25 ·
I have listened to 1000's of subwoofers in my car audio competition days. Today you can listen to alot of speakers/subs via youtube, but obviously its not the same...but with bass, you might be able to hear some god awful sounding subs that are high dollar...I wont mention any names. bass is bass, there isnt really soundstage or imaging, etc to deal with, but not all bass sounds the same, and most high output subs I have heard sound like ****, but thats just my 2 cents.

if you can find some speakers that totally disappear and provide a huge stage wide and deep without being harsh you have a keeper no matter price unless high spl is required. good luck with search.
 
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#28 ·
With the subs, I think the only competition I would be willing to sacrifice the svs pair for would be a pair of Rhythmik F15HP's. I do really like to be able to feel the bass but I like the tightness and musicality of sealed subwoofers. Either option is knowingly pretty overkill, in my small room would I still be able to get the punch and power I desire while gaining musicality if I went with the Rhythmiks?

On a side note, I looked at the wharfedales and they are yet another option that looks good, I just need to go and hear some speakers. Which leads me to the question, if I have never auditioned speakers in home, is there a way to audition 6-7 towers in home at once? Meaning is there one place I could borrow them from or one shop that I could utilize a return period? I still plan to get towers first I was just curious about the subs.
 
#29 ·
Another sub choice in the same price range. It will have the most output of the bunch. Great warranty and trial period.
http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/s3000i

As for demoing speakers in your home your best bet is to order the ones you're interested in and take advantage of their trial periods. Check with Crutchfield on their return policy for towers as to the return shipping. They offer a 60 day trial period and sell Sonus Faber if that's what you're interested in.
 
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