*EDIT* Best towers OR bookshelves for front speakers under $1,000? Under $500?
I need to upgrade front speakers and I would like towers (I think) OR bookshelves but on a limited budget at the moment. I'm about to upgrade my sub and maybe even go duals so trying to decide best move here. If I upgrade fronts I could move my 800's to the sides and just sell a pair of the 600's.. ???
Pioneer Elite VSX-90 7.2 AVR
Definitive Technology ProCenter 1000
Definitive Technology ProMonitor 800 L/R
Definitive Technology 600 satellite surrounds and rears
Martin Logan Dynamo 500 sub
Are you happy with that rather small center channel?
To be honest I'd get Def Tecs very very well regarded stand mount Studio Monitors on some nice looking stands.
A huge upgrade from what you have now for L/R.
If the Studio 65s are too much at $900/pair I'd get the very well regarded 55s at $600.
Good news is you can buy them at Best Buy and return them if not happy with them.
Here's what Stereophile had to say about the 55s:
"Summing Up
Definitive Technology has produced a detailed and uncolored bookshelf speaker that provides superb value for the money. And in terms of its midbass definition and high-level dynamic drama with orchestral works, you'd probably have to spend more than $1000/pair to exceed its performance. I'm sorry I waited so long to review a Definitive Technology speaker. Next time, I won't wait."
I've had both generations of the Def Tech SM line, and I has a hell of a time getting the SM45s or SM65s to sound good in my rooms. Both of them were just a boomy dull mess in 4/5 rooms. Meanwhile the SM350 and SM450 have worked time and time in different locations.
Seemed to be just my experience, but maybe their is more too it.
This center speaker sounds fine to me. Although I haven't really heard anything else bigger. I went from an old Sony (in a box) surround sound to the Def Tech 600. I bought the Def Tech ProCenter 1000 and sold the 600. It is louder and more full than the 600. Also, no other center I've found will fit in the console where this one is. I can't put a center on top because it's covers up the tv. If I could find a center under 5 1/2" tall I'd consider it.
I have the same center in my family room and I also have ProMonitor 800 speakers flanking my TV as well. I have observed from my setup that dispersion of these speakers is a little lacking. If you sit dead center it sounds solid but if you move anywhere else dialog does not sound as clear and sound effects don't sound as cohesive when watching a scene that takes advantage of multiple speakers.
I know you you have an ML sub but for I while I used the sub that came with the set (ProSub 800). It use to drive me crazy when every morning my daughter would watch Frozen and in a particular scene this ice creature is stomping around and the sub would literally shake and rattle and slightly move across the floor as it struggled to play low frequencies. I've since moved the sub over to 2.1 duty for a different setup.
Anyways I just wanted to share my thoughts on a similar setup.
Because now you've exceeded your budget that you presented in your "SVS? Hsu??" Sub thread.
Another reply is correct, if you get new left and right, get a complementary center channel or you'll be hating life. THAT is why I suggested a 3.1 setup from Hsu, or Prime left, right and center speakers from SVS.
IMHO you should not be shopping for two new speakers, but three. Focusing just on left and right would be a doofus mistake.
Huzzah. I'm glad you're opening up to alternatives to what you started the thread to propose.
Here's my advice. You've got $1000 to spend, right? Let's try something that's not too extreme (like ginormous towers with so-called built-in subwoofers). We could economize by continuing to use your ML Dynamic 500something, but frankly, I'd resell that or return or something.
Replace the front stage with compatible speakers. Mike's right, the center channel works hard (dialog, sound, some music), the surrounds can too but you won't mind so much if helicopters and cars and doors and infrequent dialog aren't incredible sounding.
Option 1. Hsu.
3.0 speaker package in satin black. $519.
VTF-1 in satin black. $399.
Shipping.
PM HsuKevin for some help on the shipping cost (buying multiple stuff) so you can come in on budget. He's here on this forum (check the Hsu support threads). He also answers sales assistance on their site IIRC. Super helpful guy. He talked me out of buying a lesser sub and mid-bass sub for what would've been more money (and helping clear out a discontinued model). He did it because he was confident I'd be happier with what he recommended. I trusted him because he was putting my satisfaction before gross sales revenue. (BTW, a customer on one of these forums mentioned meeting Dr. Hsu at a convention, and he was super friendly. SVS guys were "business as usual.") Results have been incredible. I have a Jim Keltner drum solo demo track that the sub makes sound like he's right in the room. =
Option 2. SVS.
Prime bookshelf speakers $500 ($249 ea).
Prime center speaker $349.
Sub: well, to come in on budget, keep using your ML, or $500 for SB-1000 (weensy bit less range and SPL from PB-1000, but smaller cabinet).
Ask SVS if they can give you a break on price for building a 3.1 system and cross your fingers. Tell them you heard about them on this forum. Say pretty please with sugar on top.
Install them building that triangle we were talking about (or that the Dolby article does). You'll need to improvise stands for now to put them at ear level when sitting on that nice couch. Use the boxes.
Do a subwoofer crawl, or just run the sub out to a corner of the room (6" from each wall). It's EASY.
Rerun the YPAO or other automated speaker setup in your AVR.
In your AVR, set the speaker sizes to "small" (if not already) which enables bass management. Set the bass crossover to about 20Hz higher than the lowest rated freq for the new speakers (probably 100Hz or 120Hz).
Let 'er rip. Play some music. Put on a movie with some great front soundstage action, like Star Wars Ep IV or The Hunt For the Red October or the BD of Sex, Lies, and Videotape (no joke, the image and sound restoration for this release was phenomenal). Put on some jazz or rock or something, and walk around the room.
Tell me if I'm full of it, or steered you right. If you don't like it, you can ship 'em back (free with SVS, cost of shipping for Hsu), and I'll apologize profusely.
I'll bet you like this and grin from ear to ear. It's a sucker bet because upgrading your front stage with a good sub will certainly give you the general bass you think you're missing (not just the subaural stuff that hits you in the gonads).
If you get bigger speakers, you'll need a bigger TV. I'm sorry, that's the rules, I don't make 'em, I just follow 'em. UHD 70 looks great if you're wondering.
If you get new mains, get whatever matches for a center. Install a shelf over the TV and point the center down at your listening position a little if you have to.
If you get bigger speakers, you'll need a bigger TV. I'm sorry, that's the rules, I don't make 'em, I just follow 'em. UHD 70 looks great if you're wondering.
I am fine with my 55" 4k for now. It's only 6 months old. I sit only 9' from the tv...
But I don't have room right now for a big center speaker. This Def Tech ProCenter 1000 will surprise you. It has (2) 4.5" woofers with (2) 4.5" bass radiators and a 1" tweeter. Most centers I've looked at under $300-$400 have 4.5"-5.5" woofers and aren't much more "wattage" than this one. Also, if I get towers, after I run the MCAAC Pro I could always adjust the center if needed...? It plays and sounds bigger than its size.
Which is why I suggested the Def Tec monitors; they have a far better chance of matching up sonically with your center than other brands...but you could always call Def Tec to get their input.
Some here say anything goes with the front three but I think if you like the center why not try and get as close as possible a sonic match.
The Def Tec 8020 tower is in your price range but it needs far more room than you have away from walls to function properly and would be a poor choice for your space.
I'm seriously considering some Def Tech bookshelf speakers now.. maybe the Studio Monitor 55's? They are $299 each but if I go to the same BB store that same manager will give me at least 20-25% off. So maybe I could get two of them for $500 or less.. ??? and the stands for around $110-$120 maybe. But then again, I can get two SVS Prime bookshelves for $500...
Buyt you can also start with the matching Left and Right for that center for less than $400/pair.
They play down to 47hz (deeper than the tower) so they should give you more impact than the ones you have now that only barely play down to 80hz...if that.
I am considering both those options.. either get the PM 1000's or the SM 55's and put them on speaker stands or get towers. I'm gonna use the PM 800's as my side surrounds and maybe get another pair of 800's for rears and sell my 4 600's. Then I could change my AVR crossover to 100hz or maybe even 80hz instead of 150hz and still be fine. But I don't need "sub" towers because I'm gonna upgrade sub(s) anyway. I just don't like the glass base on the Mythos.. :/
Ok so.. I just left a BB Magnolia center. I listened to some Def Tech's.. the ProMonitor 1000, Studio Monitor 45, and Studio Monitor 55.. listened with and without a sub. I have to say of the three the SM 45 sounded the best. Of course I had to listen to the Bowers & Wilkins equivalent and they sound really good. But, I'm not paying $600 (each) for a 4-4.5" bookshelf! I listened to the Def Tech towers also but don't want built-in subs. I wish I could hear some KEF Q300's, Elac, or SVS Prime (although more than I want to pay).
Crutchfield has a very reasonable return shipping for bookshelves ($10-15 per pair of bookshelves). SVS has FREE return shipping if you decide you do not want the speakers.
Oh snap! I think I just decided!!! They went on sale starting today for $159 each ($199 retail) and I can get them for around $140-$150 each! Time to find speaker stands?? I think this is a big upgrade from my PM 800's and staying within budget!
Def Technology Studio Monitor 45
150 watts 5 1/4" driver 1" tweeter
6.25"w x 11.75"h x 11.75"d
The Def Tech SM45's sound good with the PC1000. They don't overpower the center. I listened to them together last night at BB. I believe I'll be happy with those and they're good quality especially for the money! Def Tech owners know this to be true..
Why would I want to buy a refurbished speaker? Especially when I can buy them brand new for $20 more? And, if I decide within 30 days I don't like them (which I don't see happening) I can take them back for a full refund!
I was going to ask on here what holds the speakers on the stands??? Do you just sit them on there evenly and hope for the best? Hope no one bumps them? Possible options...?
The SM65 is more than I want to pay and actually the SM45 sounded better to me than the SM55. Plus, I can get two SM45's new for around $280! The stands will cost me $100-$140 and a PB-1000 for $500! I will have upgraded front speakers, moved my fronts to sides for bigger side surrounds, and upgraded my sub for a total of less than $1000!
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