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post #1 of 31 Old 07-03-2017, 09:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Budget under $500 home theater using Denon S510BT

Hi,

I have decided to turn one of my bedrooms into a theater as my living room situation has not worked out.

I have snagged a Denon S510BT receiver, and have two options I would like your opinions on.

The room is 12' x 11'.

1) Go with energy 5.1 system for $310.
2) Go with 15" Dayton Subwoofer 150W - $180
+ Two polk T50 for $200.

I realize one system will net me a 2.1 setup while the other will be 5.1. But If I could get a center, and two rears for another $100, I could swing that later on.

Do you think its worth going with the 2.1 vs. the 5.1 or reckon the differences not noticeable for the additional investment over the Energy 5.1? The Dayton has a 23hz+ range, while the Energy is 33hz+. I'm not a huge audiophile, and may not even notice this. Looking to get a 100" projector and small home theater setup.

Thank you for your time and comments!

-Z
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post #2 of 31 Old 07-03-2017, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Hi,

I have decided to turn one of my bedrooms into a theater as my living room situation has not worked out.

I have snagged a Denon S510BT receiver, and have two options I would like your opinions on.

The room is 12' x 11'.

1) Go with energy 5.1 system for $310.
2) Go with 15" Dayton Subwoofer 150W - $180
+ Two polk T50 for $200.

I realize one system will net me a 2.1 setup while the other will be 5.1. But If I could get a center, and two rears for another $100, I could swing that later on.

Do you think its worth going with the 2.1 vs. the 5.1 or reckon the differences not noticeable for the additional investment over the Energy 5.1? The Dayton has a 23hz+ range, while the Energy is 33hz+. I'm not a huge audiophile, and may not even notice this. Looking to get a 100" projector and small home theater setup.

Thank you for your time and comments!

-Z

I don't think I'd go either route. I'd definitely stay far, far away from Polk T50s. The Dayton sub specs are misleading I believe (or at least read there were for the 12" version)... I think it's more like high 30s (forget exact number)... listed specs are marketing-speak for a lot of companies.

Instead if going with a $300-$500ish budget, I'd probably recommend this:

Two sets of Sony Cores, use one bookshelf as a center if you can fit it. Currently at $148 new per set, or if okay with used, they are $102 used-like new from amazon warehouse (pretty safe bet they are fine).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...E7U53NWQ&psc=1

So $204 for two sets of like new Cores (or $306 if you want a set for surrounds too), use one as a center. Then pick up a Yamaha 8"-10" sub for around $100, or a BasX8 at $200. If you want to splurge, get the emotiva Basx10 for $300.

If you want to stick closer to $300, get the two core sets, yamaha sub, and just scrounge around on CL for an okayish set of bookshelves for like $25. Surrounds don't have to be that good, you can skimp there if you want. Although it's sort of hard to go wrong with cores at $100. I'd probably say get three sets, and go up to $600 if you can for the BasX10.
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Last edited by Doe Doe; 07-03-2017 at 11:45 PM.
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post #3 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 04:43 AM
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The Sony Cores are a good option

Another is the Cambridge SX-50 -- buy 2 pair and use 1 each as a center channel

Subwoofer -- Emotiva BasX S8
https://emotiva.com/products/subwoofers/basx-S8

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Or, 2.1 for a few dollars more

Cambridge SX-60 bookshelf
http://www.accessories4less.com/make...ut-pair/1.html

Emotiva BasX S10 sub
https://emotiva.com/products/subwoofers/basx-s10
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post #4 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 05:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Doe Doe View Post
I don't think I'd go either route. I'd definitely stay far, far away from Polk T50s. The Dayton sub specs are misleading I believe (or at least read there were for the 12" version)... I think it's more like high 30s (forget exact number)... listed specs are marketing-speak for a lot of companies.

Instead if going with a $300-$500ish budget, I'd probably recommend this:

Two sets of Sony Cores, use one bookshelf as a center if you can fit it. Currently at $148 new per set, or if okay with used, they are $102 used-like new from amazon warehouse (pretty safe bet they are fine).

So $204 for two sets of like new Cores (or $306 if you want a set for surrounds too), use one as a center. Then pick up a Yamaha 8"-10" sub for around $100, or a BasX8 at $200. If you want to splurge, get the emotiva Basx10 for $300.

If you want to stick closer to $300, get the two core sets, yamaha sub, and just scrounge around on CL for an okayish set of bookshelves for like $25. Surrounds don't have to be that good, you can skimp there if you want. Although it's sort of hard to go wrong with cores at $100. I'd probably say get three sets, and go up to $600 if you can for the BasX10.
Thank you for your response Doe Doe and zieglj01.

If using a pair for the center, I'd wire them in series correct to not make the ohm rating 3 in parallel? I've also read that I should lay them flat, adjacent to each other to limit noise/wave distortions (someone used a fancy term for this), have any of you experience this when using two center speakers?

Thank You!
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post #5 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 06:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Thank you for your response Doe Doe and zieglj01.

If using a pair for the center, I'd wire them in series correct to not make the ohm rating 3 in parallel? I've also read that I should lay them flat, adjacent to each other to limit noise/wave distortions (someone used a fancy term for this), have any of you experience this when using two center speakers?

Thank You!
You would only use one as a center. You can keep one as a spare or do a 4.1 setup. Buying the pair is still more cost effective than buying the dedicated sony center which is reportedly not that great.

Alternatively, you can go with NHT super Zero which are sold singly, but would end up costing the same. You can get a pair of Dayton Audio B652 for $40/pair to use as surrounds.

The Dayton sub will provide low end boom, but is not in the same league as the Emotiva Bas-X subs recommended by Doe Doe and Ziegl.
https://www.amazon.com/NHT-SuperZero...s=nht+speakers
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton...-pair--300-652
You can save money on the receiver through accessories 4 less if you're not already planning on getting one from them.
http://www.accessories4less.com/make...eceiver/1.html
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post #6 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Doe Doe View Post
So $204 for two sets of like new Cores (or $306 if you want a set for surrounds too), use one as a center. Then pick up a Yamaha 8"-10" sub for around $100, or a BasX8 at $200. If you want to splurge, get the emotiva Basx10 for $300.
This.
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post #7 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 07:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Thank you for your response Doe Doe and zieglj01.

If using a pair for the center, I'd wire them in series correct to not make the ohm rating 3 in parallel? I've also read that I should lay them flat, adjacent to each other to limit noise/wave distortions (someone used a fancy term for this), have any of you experience this when using two center speakers?

Thank You!
As stated only use 1 each for use as a center -- having a spare speaker is worth it at the good prices.

The Sony or Cambridge are solid choices for overall good sound on a budget.
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post #8 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 09:01 AM
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Your receiver might even support 4.1 with only one speaker centered in the rear for surround.

If the Sony Cores are too big look at two pairs of these:

https://www.qacoustics.com/bookshelf...aker-pair.html

Buy the BasX S8 as mentioned above or, assuming you have an AVR, one of these at less money is a good option, (I have two in my secondary room).

http://www.accessories4less.com/make...er-port/1.html
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post #9 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 01:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Awesome!

Thank you all.

I am going to go ahead and get the Sony bookshelf speakers. I found a site selling them @ $133 a pair. (Ubertronica.com) Sorry I cannot post a link as my post count is insufficient.

I will get the dayton B652 pair for the surround. I am still debating on the Yamaha 10" sub or the Basx S8. But it sounds like both will work just fine.

As for the center, I will look for a used Sony core as a center.

Are there any issues with mixing the different brands for surround and FR/FL?

Again, thank you all for your help and responses. This has been a very welcoming forum, one I am happy to have joined.

-Z
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post #10 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Awesome!

Thank you all.

I am going to go ahead and get the Sony bookshelf speakers. I found a site selling them @ $133 a pair. (Ubertronica.com) Sorry I cannot post a link as my post count is insufficient.

I will get the dayton B652 pair for the surround. I am still debating on the Yamaha 10" sub or the Basx S8. But it sounds like both will work just fine.

As for the center, I will look for a used Sony core as a center.

Are there any issues with mixing the different brands for surround and FR/FL?

Again, thank you all for your help and responses. This has been a very welcoming forum, one I am happy to have joined.

-Z

I saw Ubertronica too, just never heard of them before, so no idea how reliable they are as a company. If it was me, I'd just get the amazon warehouse like-new ones at $102... the speakers should be fine, only issue may be the packaging, but nobody would care about that. Another option if you just have to have new ones is to use a discover it pricematch, and just buy the speakers new locally at BB, or wherever.

And probably not a big deal mixing different brands for the surrounds, unless you plan to do some gaming, then having the same speaker all around is a benefit. Still... at $102, I'd probably say just get cores for the surrounds too.

4.1 is an option too if your receiver can manage it... reuse the spare Sony as a surround, and with the money saved go for a BasX10.
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post #11 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 02:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I saw Ubertronica too, just never heard of them before, so no idea how reliable they are as a company. If it was me, I'd just get the amazon warehouse like-new ones at $102... the speakers should be fine, only issue may be the packaging, but nobody would care about that. Another option if you just have to have new ones is to use a discover it pricematch, and just buy the speakers new locally at BB, or wherever.

And probably not a big deal mixing different brands for the surrounds, unless you plan to do some gaming, then having the same speaker all around is a benefit. Still... at $102, I'd probably say just get cores for the surrounds too.

4.1 is an option too if your receiver can manage it... reuse the spare Sony as a surround, and with the money saved go for a BasX10.
Thanks Doe Doe.

I am not sure if Denon S510BT can do 4.1, I tried looking around and could not find it. I have purchased a set of the sony for $102, and if I can find that it can do a 4.1 setup I'll spring for another set.

Good thing you responded so quickly as I was just in checkout! is the Basx10 that much better than the Basx8? What do you think about having just the sony cores as front/surround without a center? Is having that center noticeable?

Last edited by zabijecie; 07-04-2017 at 02:16 PM. Reason: :: Additional Info
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post #12 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Thanks Doe Doe.

I am not sure if Denon S510BT can do 4.1, I tried looking around and could not find it. I have purchased a set of the sony for $102, and if I can find that it can do a 4.1 setup I'll spring for another set.

Good thing you responded so quickly as I was just in checkout! is the Basx10 that much better than the Basx8? What do you think about having just the sony cores as front/surround without a center? Is having that center noticeable?
I'd think you'd prefer a center if possible. You can of course do the phantom center thing (no center), but that only works for one sitting position. Make sure you can fit a bookshelf in as a center too ... not everyone can.

You probably need at least two sets of Cores, using one as a center w/ spare. If you can't fit it, you'd need to go with a different model for the center (mention exact dimensions here). So I wouldn't base the decision on a 2nd (or 3rd) set on if your receiver can do 4.1. Simply base it on if a bookshelf will fit as a center. If you get 2 sets you can experiment... try it as a center, and if no good, just use them as surrounds.

As for BasX10 vs BasX8, I know some here upgraded to the 10 and said it was worth it to them. If you like action films or anything w/ bass, I'd guess the 10" would be worth it to you. I haven't heard them myself, so can't say firsthand.

I've heard the Sonys before though and they seemed good to me, especially for the price.
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post #13 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Thanks Doe Doe.

I am not sure if Denon S510BT can do 4.1, I tried looking around and could not find it. I have purchased a set of the sony for $102, and if I can find that it can do a 4.1 setup I'll spring for another set.

Good thing you responded so quickly as I was just in checkout! is the Basx10 that much better than the Basx8? What do you think about having just the sony cores as front/surround without a center? Is having that center noticeable?
If you don't sit too far back and the mains closer together like 5-6 apart, you can probably get away without having a center. If having a spare bother's you, though not ideal,You can always get a single NHT super Zero as center even though it doesn't match. your receiver's room correction will account for that and level match. The Dayton's will be just fine as surrounds, though I'd personally rather have a center (preferably the matching one to my mains) and hold off on the surrounds which can be added later.

The Bas-X 10 will have more output capability than the Bas-X8. Frequency response is almost the same. You can place the Sub nearfield (right next to the couch) for more effect without having to turn it up to it's limits.
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Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
I am not sure if Denon S510BT can do 4.1, I tried looking around and could not find it. I have purchased a set of the sony for $102, and if I can find that it can do a 4.1 setup I'll spring for another set.
For 4.1 -- in the menu you just answer No or None for the center channel
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post #15 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 02:55 PM
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For 4.1 -- in the menu you just answer No or None for the center channel
Actually what I (and assume Geoff) was referring to probably isn't traditional 4.1. I meant a regular front three, and surround r/l being sent to a single surround speaker. Sort of what old fashioned prologic does.

Not ideal, but if he wants to save some money and reuse that spare sony, one option.

I'd think easiest solution for now would be to get two sets of cores, try one out as a center. If all good, then either get a 3rd set for surrounds, daytons, or whatever he can find on CL -- or maybe by luck he finds someone selling a single core. Then depending on money he has left to spend, the sub.
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I'd stick with the Basx8 and use the additional money to get the second set of Sony Cores. In that small room, the 10 will be overkill and additional LF Extension negligible. Just keep the unused speaker until you want to upgrade, using them for the four surrounds with a new front 3 ....
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I would go with the Used - Like New Sony Cores for $102/pr. Get two pair and use in a traditional 4.1 setup with a phantom center.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-list...&condition=all

Then add the BasX 10" sub for $299. You'll spend $503 for a very good 4.1 setup in your smallish home theater room.
https://emotiva.com/products/subwoofers/basx-s10
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Doe Doe, zieglj01, pase22, RayGuy, gajCA, Zorba922, afrogt

Thank You!

I've read neelesh and his experience with the s8, and upgrading to s10. I think like RayGuy said, I will be happy with the s8 for the room size. (11x10)

I have ordered two sets of the Sony speakers, and the BasX S8.

I'll try using it as a front and see if I like it, then order the B652 Daytons ($46 shipped). Otherwise I'll run them as surround and look for a cost effective center later on.

All in: S510BT - $167 (shipped)
SSCS5 - $109 (w/tax shipped) x2 = $218
Basx S8 - $199 (shipped)
$585.

This will leave me with some change to get speaker wire, connectors, and any other misc.

Thank you all for your help! Happy 4th for those in the states!

P.S. I will update on my thoughts on the Basx S8. There arnt any youtube videos, and very few reviews. Maybe it'll help others decide.
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Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Doe Doe, zieglj01, pase22, RayGuy, gajCA, Zorba922, afrogt

Thank You!

I've read neelesh and his experience with the s8, and upgrading to s10. I think like RayGuy said, I will be happy with the s8 for the room size. (11x10)

I have ordered two sets of the Sony speakers, and the BasX S8.

I'll try using it as a front and see if I like it, then order the B652 Daytons ($46 shipped). Otherwise I'll run them as surround and look for a cost effective center later on.

All in: S510BT - $167 (shipped)
SSCS5 - $109 (w/tax shipped) x2 = $218
Basx S8 - $199 (shipped)
$585.

This will leave me with some change to get speaker wire, connectors, and any other misc.

Thank you all for your help! Happy 4th for those in the states!

P.S. I will update on my thoughts on the Basx S8. There arnt any youtube videos, and very few reviews. Maybe it'll help others decide.
I think you did pretty well! you'll have a very decent setup that sounds good for <$600. If you're not getting the surrounds right away, may as well save up for another set of sony's to have a full matching 5.1. While the Dayton's will work just fine and provide the surround effect, having a full matching 5.1 is ideal whenever possible to get uniformity of sound all around.
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post #20 of 31 Old 07-04-2017, 05:54 PM
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This will leave me with some change to get speaker wire, connectors, and any other misc.

Thank you all for your help! Happy 4th for those in the states!

P.S. I will update on my thoughts on the Basx S8. There arnt any youtube videos, and very few reviews. Maybe it'll help others decide.

Looks like a good plan to me. Curious how you like the BasX8 too. And not trying to get you to spend more money, but if down the road you feel like you need more bass, there is always the option of picking up another BasX8 and going with 2 subs.

I agree with pase, if you like the Sonys upfront, spend the little extra for Sonys in the back too (or maybe check ebay/cl for someone selling a single speaker). Maybe check the classified here too.

For wire, look at monoprice 14 ga ... pretty cheap and decent. If you need stands, look at sanus at < $50 or check locally on CL... quite often you can find stands at halfprice from someone.
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post #21 of 31 Old 07-05-2017, 06:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Doe Doe View Post
Looks like a good plan to me. Curious how you like the BasX8 too. And not trying to get you to spend more money, but if down the road you feel like you need more bass, there is always the option of picking up another BasX8 and going with 2 subs.

I agree with pase, if you like the Sonys upfront, spend the little extra for Sonys in the back too (or maybe check ebay/cl for someone selling a single speaker). Maybe check the classified here too.

For wire, look at monoprice 14 ga ... pretty cheap and decent. If you need stands, look at sanus at < $50 or check locally on CL... quite often you can find stands at halfprice from someone.
So I actually just called up Emotiva, and switched it for the BasX10. The rep agreed that the BasX8 will work well for the room and its size, but that its meant to fill the low end void the other speakers cannot do. It'll have a punch, just not as big as the 10". More of a theater feel with the 10 compared to the 8. Now some of this may have been sales pitching but he sounded genuine and not "out to get you to upgrade" kind of feel.

Thank you Doe Doe, I will definitely check out monoprice and the stands you listed. This is my first setup, so I need to do a bit more work on my end understanding running wires, connectors, etc.

Hate to beat a dead horse now, this thread served its purpose! Would it be best to ask any hookup / other related questions here or could I PM some of you?

Again, will report my experience with the Sony & Basx10 once they come in. (hopefully by end of next week).
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post #22 of 31 Old 07-05-2017, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post
Hate to beat a dead horse now, this thread served its purpose! Would it be best to ask any hookup / other related questions here or could I PM some of you?

Again, will report my experience with the Sony & Basx10 once they come in. (hopefully by end of next week).
Ask here in the thread -- there are many who can help
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post #23 of 31 Old 07-05-2017, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post

Again, will report my experience with the Sony & Basx10 once they come in. (hopefully by end of next week).
Excellent.

Just checked your manual and no, you cannot just use one speaker as a single rear surround with your particular receiver...but the Dayton Audios, (which I owned and gave to another AVS member), will do just fine as a pair of rear surrounds for beer money.
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post #24 of 31 Old 07-05-2017, 10:35 PM
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Keep your questions and observations here. It will be a learning tool for the next guy who comes along ...
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post #25 of 31 Old 07-05-2017, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by gajCA View Post
Excellent.

Just checked your manual and no, you cannot just use one speaker as a single rear surround with your particular receiver...but the Dayton Audios, (which I owned and gave to another AVS member), will do just fine as a pair of rear surrounds for beer money.
Actually the Dayton's cost less than a case of beer in Canada
I agree though, the Dayton's are a very good option for surround duty.
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post #26 of 31 Old 07-10-2017, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Update 7.10.17:

Just received 4 sony SSC5 Cores, BasX 10, Denon 510BT reciever, 14ga copper oxygen free wire (monoprice), and my ht2050 projector.

I did a "trail" run in the living room, imitating the setup before I cleanout the actual theater room just to see if 4.1 phantom center is what i'd like vs. 3 up front with a center.

With the 4.1 the surround sounds really good! I am in no way an audiophile, nor really care much about sound quality but it makes a difference. A noticeable one at that for whoever may be on the fence on planning their design. It also could be that these speakers are so damn clear!

I did notice that without a center, the L/R pick up more of the "slack" so to speak, but you can definitely tell that there is something missing. As recommended, having a center is very much worth it.

Since its amazon prime day, I picked up another core set for an additional 20% off, so it was $82. Can't beat that! The "used like new condition" by amazon warehouse are legit, and these speakers are actually brand new, just the box is damaged. (who cares?)

So in all, I am going to end up with 6 SSC5 (one as a backup, or future 7.1 setup if I ever move into a bigger house )

As far as the BasX10, I am glad I upgraded. Thank you again for that suggestion. The subwoofer is heavy, but it is very well built and from the limited testing (auto setup on Denon, and a few songs) it sounded very deep and theater like. I only had it turned up to about 45-55% but it was good enough for me! (house ceiling light felt it )

Overall, I am very pleased! I am building some acoustical panels for the room (2'x40")x5 with 8lb rock wool (roxul safe'n sound) insulation. (local hardware store, you have to order 3 pieces, but can return the other two as they wont be needed).

I've attached some pictures of the subwoofer, and the speakers in the living room as I was testing them for anyone who wants a visual.

Once this entire project is done, I will edit the first post.

Next steps:
- 2 Wall mounts for the surround sound bookshelfs ($22)
- Build two approx. 30" tall stands for the front L/R bookshelfs. (free, have shed wood lying around)
- Surge protector (tripp lite $26)
- Acoustical panels
- Build Projector screen
- Ceiling Mount projector
- Get used sofa/recliners seating on Clist.

Thanks again fellas! You guys rock!
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post #27 of 31 Old 07-10-2017, 09:30 PM
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Continue to enjoy the adventure
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post #28 of 31 Old 07-11-2017, 02:53 AM
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Is that BasX sealed?

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post #29 of 31 Old 07-11-2017, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NuSoardGraphite View Post
Is that BasX sealed?
It is slot ported.

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post #30 of 31 Old 07-11-2017, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabijecie View Post

Thanks again fellas! You guys rock!
You did great.

Another BasX owner that attests that they are a tremendous bargain as are the Sony Cores.

It is great that you can use one vertically for a center channel.
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