Swap out my q100/q200c for CCB8 LCR - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 25 Old 09-01-2017, 02:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Swap out my q100/q200c for CCB8 LCR

So I'm doing my first theater in a 16x14ft den. There's an 8x2 ft closet in the back right corner that's housing the AV, and a 6x2 ft vestibule.

I've got q100 fronts and surrounds with a q200c, SVS elevations on ceiling, and a VTF3 MK3 for a 5.1.2. Ive got an x3300w that can do dual subs with sub Ed and audyssey xt32.

So the acoustical treatments, blackout velvet, carpeting etc are about to go in. I'm getting the itch to order 3 CCB8 for LCR and a VTF2 MK5 (another ported 12inch) to see what happens. I know it should be louder. Am I wasting my time in a room that size? I do like a loud, dynamic experience tho...

Thanks for your input.
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post #2 of 25 Old 09-01-2017, 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Category5 View Post
So the acoustical treatments, blackout velvet, carpeting etc are about to go in. I'm getting the itch to order 3 CCB8 for LCR and a VTF2 MK5 (another ported 12inch) to see what happens. I know it should be louder. Am I wasting my time in a room that size? I do like a loud, dynamic experience tho...
I'd wait for the room treatments to go in before proceeding.

What exactly do you find lacking in your current setup, that you're hoping to get with the CCB-8s and additional sub?

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #3 of 25 Old 09-01-2017, 07:01 PM - Thread Starter
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I bought the KEFs based on online research and reading a lot on these forums...and amazon had them on sale so I got them for 300/pair. I havent heard any other speakers in my room. Nor did I really audition any elsewhere. I looked around for the q100s but no audio shops had them. So a big part is just my curiosity. Theyre both coaxial design. The CCB8 have larger midwoofer, horn tweeter, higher efficiency. I think it would be a good A/B comparison because I guess I don't know which sound I like at this point. I'm not an audiophile but I like to learn and test things.

With the sub, All I ever hear is that 2 subs are better or more accurate and less localized. The sub I have now I bought locally off Craigslist and I'm very impressed with it. So why not go all engines. I think I'm gonna end up deep in this game and never getting out.... ???

And the OCD part of me likes the idea of having an all HSU upfront scheme.
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post #4 of 25 Old 09-01-2017, 11:27 PM
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The Kef's are neutral and not the most efficient speakers out there. If you like loud and your main focus is HT, consider higher sensitivity speakers. Even though my use is 60/40 HT/music, I went with Kef because the musical end is more important than HT. That being said, I'm not a big fan of bright speakers and the Kef despite not being incredibly efficient can get quite loud with my cheap low end AVR. Movies are immersive and dialogue clarity is excellent.

Nothing wrong with exploring other options. You should go to Best buy or Fry's and listen to many different types of speakers if possible. Though the listening environment isn't the greatest, it would give you a better idea of what works best for you. The knowledge gained would help make an informed decision on which speakers you'd like to audition in home.

mpk1970 recently did a multi speaker shootout. It's a lengthy thread but maybe worth reading through.
Live Updates- 7 speaker brand challenge
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post #5 of 25 Old 09-02-2017, 05:21 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm probably 80/20 HT/Music. And there is nothing I can point to at the moment with the KEFs and say that I don't like. They can certainly play louder than I've pushed them. My girlfriend certainly thinks they can get 'too loud'.

Yes I've looked at that speaker shootout where he didn't like the chane a2.4 then they magically woke up and played brilliantly, cooked him a steak dinner, and ripped his pants off. I was imagining myself at home with all of those speakers trying to compare in a short time. It would be fcrazy fun but in the end I think my head would be spinning. Plus I'm aware of bias hidden in me from reading all over these forums. So unless it's a blind test, it's fun to read but I take it with a grain of salt. It's one mans journey. Granted, it's a journey we're all on at some level by spending time on these forums and pursuing this hobby. (Stares off into distance, pondering life...and cut!)
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post #6 of 25 Old 09-02-2017, 06:36 AM
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That's the trouble with this forum. You may already have a good setup but keep hearing about other peoples setups and recommendations and start wondering if they would be better than yours. On the plus side, you'll get much more honest advice here than 80% of audio shops and 95% of big box stores.

As advised above, waiting for room treatments do be done before shopping around would be best.

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post #7 of 25 Old 09-02-2017, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Category5 View Post
So I'm doing my first theater in a 16x14ft den. There's an 8x2 ft closet in the back right corner that's housing the AV, and a 6x2 ft vestibule.

I've got q100 fronts and surrounds with a q200c, SVS elevations on ceiling, and a VTF3 MK3 for a 5.1.2. Ive got an x3300w that can do dual subs with sub Ed and audyssey xt32.

So the acoustical treatments, blackout velvet, carpeting etc are about to go in. I'm getting the itch to order 3 CCB8 for LCR and a VTF2 MK5 (another ported 12inch) to see what happens. I know it should be louder. Am I wasting my time in a room that size? I do like a loud, dynamic experience tho...

Thanks for your input.
If you were looking for more volume I'd think you would be on the right track.

As you are not I think the difference would be marginal; the KEFs get excellent reviews from AVS members and Pro Reviews across the board.

I'd sell your current sub for what you paid for it and get identical dual HSU subs!

HSUs of that vintage you own have been known to have amp issues so I'd make the switch ASAP and get dual VTF2 MK5s for $1159 while they are on sale.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #8 of 25 Old 09-02-2017, 04:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Looks like I can get just one of the VTF2 for $509 on the Labor Day sale. I think that's done. Not going to sell the other one because it might have issues. I'll take my chances at this point.
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post #9 of 25 Old 09-02-2017, 05:31 PM
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I can very much sympathize with you. I have the kef q300s as mains, and a vtf3.5, run off the same receiver as you. I love them, have since I got them. But, like you, I kept reading. Now I've had many different speakers through my house since then, just in this 10 months. Def tech's, nht, q acoustic, emotiva, jamo. I now have 3 rooms set up with different sets, and if it's any comfort to you, my favorite by a good margin is still my kefs with my Hsu on my denon. The sound is so smooth all around that I often find myself pushing upwards of 0db to 5db, but then I back off because, rationally, i don't want to go deaf, but at no point is it painful from distortion or harshness.

Nice as my nht and qa are, I can't say the same about them.
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post #10 of 25 Old 09-03-2017, 06:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Always nice to hear someone with a similar setup that's been down the path and still comes back to it. Yeah like I said there's not much I can say bad against the kef/HSu/denon combo. And Im only just getting to the room treatment / EQ stage. So hopefully only better from here. At this point I'm just going to add another sub so I can see if I can find that dual sub magic.

My problem is too is that I'll start breaking out of budget and want to test Ultras or Revels and get myself stuck in some territory where it will sound a bit better but I'll regret spending big for a little bit of performance. Just want to get to that point where everything's dialed in and I can just sit back and not think about it.
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post #11 of 25 Old 09-03-2017, 08:50 AM
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My problem is too is that I'll start breaking out of budget and want to test Ultras or Revels
Keep in mind that only 20% of your usage is music; during the 80% HT usage those kinds of speakers would be a total waste of money. For predominantly HT usage I wouldn't spend more than $300 per speaker, unless you have a huge room and like to listen at super loud volumes in which case something like PSA speakers might be justified.

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #12 of 25 Old 09-03-2017, 03:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, good point. I have to remember that there was a reason I landed on the KEFs in the first place also. One major thing was that they are front ported and generous with placement near boundaries.
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post #13 of 25 Old 09-04-2017, 01:52 PM - Thread Starter
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VTF2 MK5 purchased!
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post #14 of 25 Old 09-04-2017, 02:18 PM
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Love my Hsu. You won't be disappointed.
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post #15 of 25 Old 09-04-2017, 02:25 PM
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Yes, good point. I have to remember that there was a reason I landed on the KEFs in the first place also. One major thing was that they are front ported and generous with placement near boundaries.
Your problem is you already have very good speakers!

PSA is considered a "major" step up but, really, only if you can't get distortion free performance at your current volume levels as per Mark Heninger's recent review of the MT110s.

Note where he says a good bookshelf at lower volume levels is every bit as good.

http://www.avsforum.com/%EF%BB%BFpow...system-review/

Geoff A. J., California
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post #16 of 25 Old 09-04-2017, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Love my Hsu. You won't be disappointed.
Do you have duals? I already had an old vtf3 mk3 i picked up used.

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post #17 of 25 Old 09-04-2017, 03:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Your problem is you already have very good speakers!

PSA is considered a "major" step up but, really, only if you can't get distortion free performance at your current volume levels as per Mark Heninger's recent review of the MT110s.

Note where he says a good bookshelf at lower volume levels is every bit as good.

http://www.avsforum.com/%EF%BB%BFpow...system-review/
Yeah I threw In the UHD atmos bluray of Pacific Rim last night because Id only ever seen it once on my computer during a plane flight. The sound blew me away. Im not even 2/3 of the way up on volume. Great atmos/bass movie.

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No, I just have the vtf3 mk5 in my living room. I do have two other subs in my house, may try one of them in there with it, just to see how much difference it makes, but the Hsu alone is more than enough.
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post #19 of 25 Old 09-05-2017, 02:08 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm regretting my profile name. Irma and MK5 due on same day. ????

Question is which one hits harder?!?!?
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post #20 of 25 Old 09-05-2017, 02:10 PM
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Hahaha!
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post #21 of 25 Old 09-05-2017, 02:31 PM
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I'm regretting my profile name. Irma and MK5 due on same day. ????

Question is which one hits harder?!?!?
I have friends and family in Miami who went through Andrew; it was NOT pretty as you well know.

Don't be afraid to evacuate.

The Hurricane with the most similar path at the moment was Donna in 1960.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Donna

I really hope that the sub hits YOU harder than Irma hits anyone!

Geoff A. J., California
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post #22 of 25 Old 09-05-2017, 04:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Sage advice! Packing up the car and leaving after my girl finishes teaching tmrw. So she asked where are we going? Given model track variation, (I'm actually a penn state meteorology grad) I said a bit west. How far west? Well, there's this home theater thing in SAN Diego I'd want to check out. Want to go listen to some speakers????

So we may be traveling to CA. Turning a bad situation into an impromptu vacation. Fed Ex will just have to hold onto that sub for me!!
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post #23 of 25 Old 09-05-2017, 04:59 PM
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Sage advice! Packing up the car and leaving after my girl finishes teaching tmrw. So she asked where are we going? Given model track variation, (I'm actually a penn state meteorology grad) I said a bit west. How far west? Well, there's this home theater thing in SAN Diego I'd want to check out. Want to go listen to some speakers????

So we may be traveling to CA. Turning a bad situation into an impromptu vacation. Fed Ex will just have to hold onto that sub for me!!
I live in north county san diego..... what home theater thing????

2000 watts of power and climbing

-Fred
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post #24 of 25 Old 09-05-2017, 06:15 PM - Thread Starter
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post #25 of 25 Old 09-18-2017, 12:06 PM - Thread Starter
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So I took an evacucation from Irma up to Asheville NC for a few days and came back to the new VTF2 and hooked it up. I've been listening to more music so I'm running both subs with two ports open. I ran audyssey even tho I still don't have room treatments up so I could get the subs eq'd. I pulled my q100s a foot further out into the room and played with the toe in so I've got them imaging on point.

The 2nd sub has really helped pull the whole sound stage together. I've got a symmetrical ..L sub C sub R... set up. No more bass localization. I've got fuller cleaner bass at lower volumes and when I push it, everything just sounds better. I'm using the 'Flat' audyssey setting for music. For movies I'm using 'Reference'. Even to my non audiophile ears I can tell that it's rolling off the higher frequencies. But it's allowed me to push the volume and the presentation seems more cohesive. The bass is more controlled, nothing in the room rattles save my bones. It has me questioning the need to go through with all the room treatments...
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