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post #35221 of 35239 Old 02-12-2017, 01:27 PM
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Cross posted in the Definitive Technology Owners Thread and the Subwoofers forum... New to AV, Having issues with sub/amp and need guidance troubleshooting, preparing for appropriate repair, etc.

I have a set of Definitive Technology BP7004 Bipolar SuperTowers for my front left and front right speakers. These speakers each have a standard high-frequency speaker component but also feature a powered sub / LFE. The speaker component of these towers is functioning fine but one of the subs is misbehaving.

These are relatively old but in appearance are in great shape, inherited from a relative who passed away.

One of the pair emits low frequency sub sounds whenever the powered amp is plugged into an outlet (have tried multiple outlets around the house), without any LFE input attached to the tower. The sound is constant, though not consistent in intensity as it fluctuates in how loud it is. Adjusting the sub volume knob does not seem to affect this behavior. Would best compare the sound to when a mic is placed in a windy environment. The sound is quite loud and disruptive and isn't something that could be tolerated or loved with. When not plugged into an outlet, no sub sound, and HFE speaker functionality works without issue.

From the research I've done it sounds like an issue with the powered amp driving the sub--potentially capacitors needing replacement.

2 questions:

1. What steps can I take to further troubleshoot the powered amp/sub? Is this the sort of thing that an electronics/AV store is capable of diagnosing/repairing, and is this sort of repair typically cost effective or recommended?

2. If I don't plug in the tower to an outlet, am I "missing" anything from the HFE? Would the powered amp/sub only trigger with LFE input hooked up or would the HFE speaker input utilize the amp and sub on its own?
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post #35222 of 35239 Old 02-12-2017, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by RKSKYDANCER View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wettems View Post
I'm using all sm65 for my fronts. Sm65 as a center. The audyssey automatically set them as large when I ran it. You saying I should set all fronts to small? That will make my center louder?
It can.

Your a smart man running all 3 identical speakers across the front! Are they all about level with the tweeters at ear level when sitting down? As others have said you may want to set them to small not large and set the crossovers to 60 or 80hz. But this will depend on a lot of other settings and what receiver you have?
Sorry I meant to reply. I'm running the speakers with a marantz sr-5005
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post #35223 of 35239 Old 02-12-2017, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Ohhhtaco View Post
Cross posted in the Definitive Technology Owners Thread and the Subwoofers forum... New to AV, Having issues with sub/amp and need guidance troubleshooting, preparing for appropriate repair, etc.

I have a set of Definitive Technology BP7004 Bipolar SuperTowers for my front left and front right speakers. These speakers each have a standard high-frequency speaker component but also feature a powered sub / LFE. The speaker component of these towers is functioning fine but one of the subs is misbehaving.

These are relatively old but in appearance are in great shape, inherited from a relative who passed away.

One of the pair emits low frequency sub sounds whenever the powered amp is plugged into an outlet (have tried multiple outlets around the house), without any LFE input attached to the tower. The sound is constant, though not consistent in intensity as it fluctuates in how loud it is. Adjusting the sub volume knob does not seem to affect this behavior. Would best compare the sound to when a mic is placed in a windy environment. The sound is quite loud and disruptive and isn't something that could be tolerated or loved with. When not plugged into an outlet, no sub sound, and HFE speaker functionality works without issue.

From the research I've done it sounds like an issue with the powered amp driving the sub--potentially capacitors needing replacement.

2 questions:

1. What steps can I take to further troubleshoot the powered amp/sub? Is this the sort of thing that an electronics/AV store is capable of diagnosing/repairing, and is this sort of repair typically cost effective or recommended?

2. If I don't plug in the tower to an outlet, am I "missing" anything from the HFE? Would the powered amp/sub only trigger with LFE input hooked up or would the HFE speaker input utilize the amp and sub on its own?
1. Contact DefTech, see if they have any amps or at least point you in the right direction for a repair.
2. The powered woofers work with either input, high level or low level, but of course won't work with no power to the amp, just the Mids and Highs will work.

*Warning* None of my suggestions, ideas or even thoughts have any WAF, in any way!
My Build Thread:
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post #35224 of 35239 Old 02-12-2017, 06:13 PM
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Smile Ordered two Def Tech Sm 65 Speakers

Hello, I want to thank forum users who advised me in this forum, of the option to buy refurb'ed Def Tech speakers from bajawaverunner at a good discount. I did decide to go with Def Tech speakers from the refurb outlet, to replace my now dead Infinity Sm100's and I am looking forward to getting these SM65s and setting them up. I will be using my Marantz 7002 AV receiver with these, and two KEF iQ1 will now be the side surrounds, and the back surrounds will be the Infinity Sterling speakers that should be ok there(not great specs on those).
All of the research and reviews I found on the Def Techs point to excellent sound that is realistic to the instruments and voices, which I want, and I really look forward to setting these up with the Audyssey calibration system to try these out with some classical and acoustic music as well as some great blu ray surround movies.
Thanks, i should receive these two SM 65s around Feb. 22,
Debra
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post #35225 of 35239 Old 02-12-2017, 10:23 PM
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Originally Posted by dgillilan View Post
Hello, I want to thank forum users who advised me in this forum, of the option to buy refurb'ed Def Tech speakers from bajawaverunner at a good discount. I did decide to go with Def Tech speakers from the refurb outlet, to replace my now dead Infinity Sm100's and I am looking forward to getting these SM65s and setting them up. I will be using my Marantz 7002 AV receiver with these, and two KEF iQ1 will now be the side surrounds, and the back surrounds will be the Infinity Sterling speakers that should be ok there(not great specs on those).
All of the research and reviews I found on the Def Techs point to excellent sound that is realistic to the instruments and voices, which I want, and I really look forward to setting these up with the Audyssey calibration system to try these out with some classical and acoustic music as well as some great blu ray surround movies.
Thanks, i should receive these two SM 65s around Feb. 22,
Debra
You're going to be happy with those bad boys. You made the smart choice by going with bajawaverunner. You could never tell they're refurbished.
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post #35226 of 35239 Old 02-14-2017, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by ALtlOff View Post
1. Contact DefTech, see if they have any amps or at least point you in the right direction for a repair.
2. The powered woofers work with either input, high level or low level, but of course won't work with no power to the amp, just the Mids and Highs will work.
Thanks--I've got an amp order played with DefTech (though it's on back order until mid April).

Question: Since each one of my BP7004s has an LFE in, what's the ideal way to connect this from my receiver (Denon X1300)? The Denon has 2 Sub pre-amp outs, should I connect 1-to-1 from the sub pre-amp outs to the BP7004s, or should I use a single pre-amp out and a cable that splits to go 1-to-2 from a single sub pre-amp out to both the BP7004s?
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post #35227 of 35239 Old 02-14-2017, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Ohhhtaco View Post
Thanks--I've got an amp order played with DefTech (though it's on back order until mid April).

Question: Since each one of my BP7004s has an LFE in, what's the ideal way to connect this from my receiver (Denon X1300)? The Denon has 2 Sub pre-amp outs, should I connect 1-to-1 from the sub pre-amp outs to the BP7004s, or should I use a single pre-amp out and a cable that splits to go 1-to-2 from a single sub pre-amp out to both the BP7004s?
Think I answered my own question (sorry can't edit my existing post as I'm a newb). From the Denon owner thread: i. Tower Speakers w/built in sub: When using this type of speaker (eg. Def Tech) and no external sub, connect the LFE cable from the AVR sub preout to a "Y" splitter and then to each speaker's sub. After running Audyssey Setup, you will still want to set the front mains to SMALL (regardless of what the mfr's speaker manual recommends) as there are 8x (MultEQ XT) and 64x (MultEQ) more Audyssey sub filters than speaker filters. This configuration will also then allow you to adjust the sub channel volume to suit your preference. Note with XT32, there are an equivalent number of speaker and sub control points, so without a dedicated sub in the setup, you can go either way with either a LARGE or SMALL setting.
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post #35228 of 35239 Old 02-16-2017, 10:18 AM
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Hey guys,

Just purchased a set of SM65's for L/C/R from bajawaverunner to upgrade my front stage. Was running 3 SM45's and 2 SR808BP's. Moved into a new place with a larger living room and want to use my old SM45's as extra surrounds for a 7.1 setup. My main goal has always been strictly home theater for my living room setups. I now feel I may dabble into multichannel music but still have a heavy emphasis on movies.

My question is whether or not I should use the bipolar SR8080's as surrounds or surround backs. Or if I should even use them at all based on my room and listening preferences. I enjoyed the bipolar surrounds while they were used in my 5.1 setup. I'm not sure if my tiny apartment living room really took advantage of them or if the small space was beneficial. I did appreciate what I can only assume was the "diffuse" effect people speak of.

My "room" is 20x14x9. The main listening area is 11' from the tv and is centered in the 20' dimension. My plan is install a heavy stage like curtain a few feet behind the listening area to essentially act as a wall. The actual room is more along the lines of 20x50. I'm not using the entire space but if I need a little more room behind the listening area to really make the surrounds backs useful that's fine.


Thanks

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post #35229 of 35239 Old 02-16-2017, 10:31 AM
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Loving my new 7.1 set up!

Pioneer Elite VSX-90
Def Tech SM45 front L/R
ProCenter 1000
ProMonitor 800 sides & rears
SVS PB-2000
Def Tech ProMount 90 wall mounts
Rocketfish banana plugs
VTI RF Series 29" speaker stands
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post #35230 of 35239 Old 02-16-2017, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
Loving my new 7.1 set up!

Pioneer Elite VSX-90
Def Tech SM45 front L/R
ProCenter 1000
ProMonitor 800 sides & rears
SVS PB-2000
Def Tech ProMount 90 wall mounts
Rocketfish banana plugs
VTI RF Series 29" speaker stands
Hey I just got the Galveston entertainment center with the left and right towers. Finally someone else has it. Glad your loving the new rig.
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post #35231 of 35239 Old 02-16-2017, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by spitfire91104 View Post
Hey guys,

Just purchased a set of SM65's for L/C/R from bajawaverunner to upgrade my front stage. Was running 3 SM45's and 2 SR808BP's. Moved into a new place with a larger living room and want to use my old SM45's as extra surrounds for a 7.1 setup. My main goal has always been strictly home theater for my living room setups. I now feel I may dabble into multichannel music but still have a heavy emphasis on movies.

My question is whether or not I should use the bipolar SR8080's as surrounds or surround backs. Or if I should even use them at all based on my room and listening preferences. I enjoyed the bipolar surrounds while they were used in my 5.1 setup. I'm not sure if my tiny apartment living room really took advantage of them or if the small space was beneficial. I did appreciate what I can only assume was the "diffuse" effect people speak of.

My "room" is 20x14x9. The main listening area is 11' from the tv and is centered in the 20' dimension. My plan is install a heavy stage like curtain a few feet behind the listening area to essentially act as a wall. The actual room is more along the lines of 20x50. I'm not using the entire space but if I need a little more room behind the listening area to really make the surrounds backs useful that's fine.


Thanks
Since you already have them simply try them in both positions and see which you like best, even with the curtain the bi-poles may be a benefit in the rear of you, but usually it's bi-poles as surrounds and mono-poles as rears, honestly it's probably going to have more to do with placement than anything.
Bit while your at it experiment with both in a 5.1 as well.

*Warning* None of my suggestions, ideas or even thoughts have any WAF, in any way!
My Build Thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-gen...formation.html

Last edited by ALtlOff; 02-16-2017 at 02:42 PM.
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post #35232 of 35239 Old 02-17-2017, 10:37 AM
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Hi all. Long-time lurker here. Need some advice. Having a new house built and am likely picking up a pair of BP-9040s and a CS-9040. Already have a generic 10" sub that will likely be in the mix, with my rears planning to be a pair of ProCenter 1000s (I already own one as my current center channel).

A few questions:
  • Will my existing Yamaha RX-V473 receiver (5.1) be enough to power everything above? (until I upgrade).
  • Will a pair of ProCenter 1000s work well as rears?
  • How much of a performance difference between CS-9040 and CS-9060?
  • Speaker wire - I don't even know where to start. Recommendations, please?
  • For the price, would you recommend anything better/comparable? This is for the Family Room. The wife is already anti-floor speakers as it is.. and the fact that these need to be about 10" away from the wall is a tough sell. Though I must've listened to the BP9020s and BP9040s (along with the 60s and 80s) many times now at Best Buy and am completely in love. So at this point, it might be tough for me to be talked out of 'em.

Thanks in advance!

Last edited by Chodite; 02-17-2017 at 10:51 AM.
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post #35233 of 35239 Old 02-17-2017, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Chodite View Post
Hi all. Long-time lurker here. Need some advice. Having a new house built and am likely picking up a pair of BP-9040s and a CS-9040. Already have a generic 10" sub that will likely be in the mix, with my rears planning to be a pair of ProCenter 1000s (I already own one as my current center channel).

A few questions:
  • Will my existing Yamaha RX-V473 receiver (5.1) be enough to power everything above? (until I upgrade).
  • Will a pair of ProCenter 1000s work well as rears?
  • How much of a performance difference between CS-9040 and CS-9060?
  • Speaker wire - I don't even know where to start. Recommendations, please?
  • For the price, would you recommend anything better/comparable? This is for the Family Room. The wife is already anti-floor speakers as it is.. and the fact that these need to be about 10" away from the wall is a tough sell. Though I must've listened to the BP9020s and BP9040s (along with the 60s and 80s) many times now at Best Buy and am completely in love. So at this point, it might be tough for me to be talked out of 'em.

Thanks in advance!
  • Yes.
  • Yes, providing you mount or sit them horizontally.
  • Personally I think the difference is considerably noticeable.
  • Any decent 14ga or larger (16ga really would be ok) no need to go crazy something from MonoPrice is fine.
  • Tough one, if you really like the Towers and she's letting you get them, if say you may want to just take advantage of the situation. If you weren't sold on the Towers our other go-to would be the SM-65's, esp the referb's from Bajawaverunner.

*Warning* None of my suggestions, ideas or even thoughts have any WAF, in any way!
My Build Thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-gen...formation.html
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post #35234 of 35239 Old 02-17-2017, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Ohhhtaco View Post
Cross posted in the Definitive Technology Owners Thread and the Subwoofers forum... New to AV, Having issues with sub/amp and need guidance troubleshooting, preparing for appropriate repair, etc.

I have a set of Definitive Technology BP7004 Bipolar SuperTowers for my front left and front right speakers. These speakers each have a standard high-frequency speaker component but also feature a powered sub / LFE. The speaker component of these towers is functioning fine but one of the subs is misbehaving.

These are relatively old but in appearance are in great shape, inherited from a relative who passed away.

One of the pair emits low frequency sub sounds whenever the powered amp is plugged into an outlet (have tried multiple outlets around the house), without any LFE input attached to the tower. The sound is constant, though not consistent in intensity as it fluctuates in how loud it is. Adjusting the sub volume knob does not seem to affect this behavior. Would best compare the sound to when a mic is placed in a windy environment. The sound is quite loud and disruptive and isn't something that could be tolerated or loved with. When not plugged into an outlet, no sub sound, and HFE speaker functionality works without issue.

From the research I've done it sounds like an issue with the powered amp driving the sub--potentially capacitors needing replacement.

2 questions:

1. What steps can I take to further troubleshoot the powered amp/sub? Is this the sort of thing that an electronics/AV store is capable of diagnosing/repairing, and is this sort of repair typically cost effective or recommended?

2. If I don't plug in the tower to an outlet, am I "missing" anything from the HFE? Would the powered amp/sub only trigger with LFE input hooked up or would the HFE speaker input utilize the amp and sub on its own?
While I can't solve all of our problems I can offer you a few bits of advice. In my secondary theater I have a CS-8080HD center channel (i.e., the previous top-of-the-line center channel), a pair of Studio Monitor 55's in the front (which will eventually be replaced with a pair of Studio Monitor 65's), a pair of Surround 8080's in the rear, and and SVS subwoofer. If you are unaware the center channel has a powered 5"x10" racetrack style "subwoofer" with two passive 5"x10" "subwoofers" on the top. When I received the speaker direct from DefTech the amp was not working. They were a pleasure to deal with and sent me a new amp for free. Replacing it was very easy - I simply removed a few screws, pulled out the "board" which houses the components, removed a wire or two, connected them to the new board, slid it in, and screwed it back in. The repair probably took me no longer than three minutes. So, if the amp is indeed shot, I would take care of it yourself.

If you choose not to plug in your towers you will be leveraging your receiver or amp's power to drive the tweeters, mid-range, and low-end drivers. This is can be a lot to ask of a receiver or amp. I would recommend trying them unplugged just to see if your issue persists, understanding that this is not a long-term solution. It sounds to me like your amp(s) is/are shot. Give DefTech a call and see what they say.

Please post an update - I'm curious to see how this shakes out.
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post #35235 of 35239 Old 02-17-2017, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
Loving my new 7.1 set up!

Pioneer Elite VSX-90
Def Tech SM45 front L/R
ProCenter 1000
ProMonitor 800 sides & rears
SVS PB-2000
Def Tech ProMount 90 wall mounts
Rocketfish banana plugs
VTI RF Series 29" speaker stands
That's a beautifuL set up!
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post #35236 of 35239 Old Yesterday, 06:47 PM
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Just picked up another Powerfield 1500 today, this one makes 5.
(2 up front 3 in the rear, in a "W" pattern)
I'd still like to have one or two more.
(2 front, 2 rear, 2 sides, or 2 front, 3 rear & 2 sides)

But of course I'd still love to have a pair of Trinity's

*Warning* None of my suggestions, ideas or even thoughts have any WAF, in any way!
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post #35237 of 35239 Old Yesterday, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by ALtlOff View Post
Since you already have them simply try them in both positions and see which you like best, even with the curtain the bi-poles may be a benefit in the rear of you, but usually it's bi-poles as surrounds and mono-poles as rears, honestly it's probably going to have more to do with placement than anything.
Bit while your at it experiment with both in a 5.1 as well.
Sounds good. Just wanted to see if there was a standard or norm for placing those. Can definitely experiment with placing these.

Did have another question regarding the manual mentioning not using an auto setup function for the bipolar surrounds. I actually have in the past and felt as though it was effective but not sure if it had an ill effect. Is definitive advising using the auto setup for everything else and just tweak those particular speakers manually or just not running auto setup in general and level match and eq the speakers all individually?
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post #35238 of 35239 Old Yesterday, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by spitfire91104 View Post
Sounds good. Just wanted to see if there was a standard or norm for placing those. Can definitely experiment with placing these.

Did have another question regarding the manual mentioning not using an auto setup function for the bipolar surrounds. I actually have in the past and felt as though it was effective but not sure if it had an ill effect. Is definitive advising using the auto setup for everything else and just tweak those particular speakers manually or just not running auto setup in general and level match and eq the speakers all individually?
The biggest reason to not use any auto-setups is distance calculation (which controls the delays and effects movement around the room) because of the reflections bi-poles create, they can throw off the AVR's ability to calculate distances accurately.
You can always run the auto-setup and simply double check actual distances with the calculated ones, it still won't be perfect since actual distances can still be different than the perceived distance that the sound travels, but it will at least give you an idea if it's throwing things off a lot, or a little. Biggest problem is that normally, every time you run the auto-setup, you'll likely get a different result, but at the same time, if you don't get vastly differing results, you'll know that the reflections aren't throwing off the program.

*Warning* None of my suggestions, ideas or even thoughts have any WAF, in any way!
My Build Thread:
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post #35239 of 35239 Old Today, 05:18 AM
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The biggest reason to not use any auto-setups is distance calculation (which controls the delays and effects movement around the room) because of the reflections bi-poles create, they can throw off the AVR's ability to calculate distances accurately.
You can always run the auto-setup and simply double check actual distances with the calculated ones, it still won't be perfect since actual distances can still be different than the perceived distance that the sound travels, but it will at least give you an idea if it's throwing things off a lot, or a little. Biggest problem is that normally, every time you run the auto-setup, you'll likely get a different result, but at the same time, if you don't get vastly differing results, you'll know that the reflections aren't throwing off the program.
So what if you run the auto program and then make changes to accurately present the actual distance in manual? Will changing the auto screw up anything? Or should you just use an old radio shack sound meter and check all levels? I have bipolar everywhere except center.
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