Definitive Owners Thread - Page 888 - AVS Forum
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post #26611 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 11:26 AM
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Is anyone else having issus in the 100-300Hz area with their BP700X? Audyssey always wants to increase the dB in that area 6+dB when looking at the flat and Audyssey settings. Even on my REW graph it seems to dip there. When I have the speakers against the long wall it seems much better. I'm just not sure what's causing the issues. I can only move the speakers so far from the back wall and the sides walls, flip them, etc and it doesn't seem to help. I wonder with my center console is causing the sub to cancel out the lower mid bass??!
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post #26612 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by truwarrior22 View Post

Is anyone else having issus in the 100-300Hz area with their BP700X? Audyssey always wants to increase the dB in that area 6+dB when looking at the flat and Audyssey settings. Even on my REW graph it seems to dip there. When I have the speakers against the long wall it seems much better. I'm just not sure what's causing the issues. I can only move the speakers so far from the back wall and the sides walls, flip them, etc and it doesn't seem to help. I wonder with my center console is causing the sub to cancel out the lower mid bass??!

I am also having some bass issues with audessey. i am planning to re-install the bp7000's with the subs facing out to see if this fixes the problem. My definitive dealer also felt that this is worth a try - as well as others on the forum. My issue was below 100hz though. i dont think the internal subs are crossed to the mids that high? maybe someone else on the forum knows.....I was also lookng into sound treatments as a last resort.....

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post #26613 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathan18 View Post

Guys I have a mythos STS FL FR mythos ten C and two grm xl doing surround duty, I'm contemplating changing my vsx-1120K SV Receiver and I'm looking into the Denon 3312ci.

But I wanted to read what you guys are using to power these kind of speakers, I love playing xbox, ps3, movies, all kind of music (usually flacs from sacd), but the most use I give the setup is Movies.

I want something with pre outs so in the future maybe I can put a stereo or multi channel amp

Up until very recently, I was using the denon 4311 to power my ST system and it never seemed to break a sweat. Always sounded very clean. I also used an Integra receiver with my st system with great results. I think you would be very happy with Denon, Integra/Onkyo, and perhaps even the new Marantz deserves a look. Happy hunting.

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post #26614 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 05:08 PM
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James M, you've been upgrading quite a bit! I wish I could fit additional towers into my setup

Here's the latest rendition for my humble setup. Still running CLR2000 for the center, BP30s for mains, CLR2000s for side surround. Dual Supercube IIs for my subs. I'll be swapping out the Yamaha RX-V3900 receiver for a Pioneer Elite VSX-53 within the next few days. Emotiva XP3 amp still powers the front soundstage while I let the receiver handle 2 channel for the side surrounds. And swapped out my 52" Sony XBR4 for an Elite PRO70X5.

I may upgrade the center to a CLR3000 one day since I finally can put the center channel on top of the cabinet rather than housed in the shelf. This really helped the center channel sound since it's higher than it was before. I don't know how I would fit this, but I really want to ditch the dual Supercube IIs I have now for one HSU VTF15.

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post #26615 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 05:35 PM
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Scott,
Your system looks great nice to see pics so do you have the CLR2000's on stands. If you change your mind I have a set of BP30's for sale I sold my other pair..lol
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post #26616 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathan18 View Post

Guys I have a mythos STS FL FR mythos ten C and two grm xl doing surround duty, I'm contemplating changing my vsx-1120K SV Receiver and I'm looking into the Denon 3312ci.

But I wanted to read what you guys are using to power these kind of speakers, I love playing xbox, ps3, movies, all kind of music (usually flacs from sacd), but the most use I give the setup is Movies.

I want something with pre outs so in the future maybe I can put a stereo or multi channel amp

I love my Denon 2808ci. Never really had an issues with it. That 3312ci looks nice, I wish I had dual HDMI outputs Looks like Denon is starting to release some new models, my next AVR will need to support atleast 4K video upscaling...mmm...4K.... lol
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post #26617 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post

I am also having some bass issues with audessey. i am planning to re-install the bp7000's with the subs facing out to see if this fixes the problem. My definitive dealer also felt that this is worth a try - as well as others on the forum. My issue was below 100hz though. i dont think the internal subs are crossed to the mids that high? maybe someone else on the forum knows.....I was also lookng into sound treatments as a last resort.....

What's your bass issue? A bump around 50-40Hz? I think that's where the radiators are tuned and I have that too, tritraps didn't help any. I guess you have to think of these speakers have HT first then music. Might be better off with a higher crossover and a sub for music then run them full for HT.
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post #26618 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMES MCHUGHES View Post

Scott,
Your system looks great nice to see pics so do you have the CLR2000's on stands. If you change your mind I have a set of BP30's for sale I sold my other pair..lol

I have the CLR2000s side surround using the Power Monitor stands. It's not the prettiest but places the speaker at the perfect height for me. I've been looking at some wall brackets to mount the speakers up but haven't seen anything that works well plus I'm not sure how it will sound once I have the speaker firing at a downward angle rather than already at ear level when seated.
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post #26619 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 08:03 PM
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Anyone with a iPad, iPhone, etc, there's cool free app called clapir for measuring room reverb
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post #26620 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 09:28 PM
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I have friend selling a pair of bp2002 for $350. Do you guys think this is a fair price? Are there any issues I should be aware of? I will try and check them out on Wednesday.
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post #26621 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by truwarrior22 View Post

What's your bass issue? A bump around 50-40Hz? I think that's where the radiators are tuned and I have that too, tritraps didn't help any. I guess you have to think of these speakers have HT first then music. Might be better off with a higher crossover and a sub for music then run them full for HT.

I think my issue is definitely room related. I have a null in the front left part of my room and Audessey is trying to over-compensate for this by increasing bass output on my front left speaker. I have noticed the bass output greatly increased in the front left speaker when audessey is on and confirmed that there is a big dip between 25 and 50 hz on the audessey curves my denon shows. I have simply turned down the volume gain on the back of the speaker and crossed the fronts over at 60 hz (still doesn't completely go away) and this helps. I have very good subs, so there is no need for the fronts to go super low anyway - I am more concerned about blending and avoiding bad noises coming from the towers during crazy lfe movies like Inception. I find it more satisfying to cross my fronts over at 60 for music and movies and do not prefer full range in my room. Again, I think this is due to that darn null. I am in the middle of making some changes so when I put the bp7000's back in fornt, I am going to make the internal subs face out instead of in to see if that improves things a bit.

More than anything, placement and room issues seem to really have an affect on my speakers. My imaging is really satisfying so I am hesitant to move the fronts around for the bass issue- going to try flipping the speakers.

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post #26622 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 09:57 PM
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Here is my setup so far. I don't have a sub yet and we are missing a lot of lfe. I will try and check out the bp2002 on Wednesday.

Attachment 245955
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post #26623 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 10:16 PM
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Check check all the drivers to ensure they are working, specially the sub. Maybe bring a frequency check CD. Ensure the subs don't pop when playing bass heavy material.
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post #26624 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post

I think my issue is definitely room related. I have a null in the front left part of my room and Audessey is trying to over-compensate for this by increasing bass output on my front left speaker. I have noticed the bass output greatly increased in the front left speaker when audessey is on and confirmed that there is a big dip between 25 and 50 hz on the audessey curves my denon shows. I have simply turned down the volume gain on the back of the speaker and crossed the fronts over at 60 hz (still doesn't completely go away) and this helps. I have very good subs, so there is no need for the fronts to go super low anyway - I am more concerned about blending and avoiding bad noises coming from the towers during crazy lfe movies like Inception. I find it more satisfying to cross my fronts over at 60 for music and movies and do not prefer full range in my room. Again, I think this is due to that darn null. I am in the middle of making some changes so when I put the bp7000's back in fornt, I am going to make the internal subs face out instead of in to see if that improves things a bit.

More than anything, placement and room issues seem to really have an affect on my speakers. My imaging is really satisfying so I am hesitant to move the fronts around for the bass issue- going to try flipping the speakers.

I see and you may have better luck with some bass traps with that issue. Attached is the EQ my Denon 2808 is generating for the Audessey flat. My subs where at about 11 o'clock. The right speaker is about the same, just .5dB lower 125Hz and 200Hz range

Don't get me wrong, they still sounds really good, but something just seems off with the position/setup.
LL
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post #26625 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 11:15 PM
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Yeah I really wish I lived in the states where I could go to a fancy store and test drive the receivers, I have to buy deaf so to speak....

I've used audissey multieq in automotive setting and was very impressed with it. That is why I'm looking into Denon.

which receiver from integra?
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post #26626 of 31459 Old 05-08-2012, 11:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leviathan18 View Post

Yeah I really wish I lived in the states where I could go to a fancy store and test drive the receivers, I have to buy deaf so to speak....

I've used audissey multieq in automotive setting and was very impressed with it. That is why I'm looking into Denon.

which receiver from integra?

I'm sure they are nice, but I like the look and functionality of Denon. I personally haven't had much luck with Audyssey and my def tech so I leave it disabled.
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post #26627 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 05:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truwarrior22 View Post

I love my Denon 2808ci. Never really had an issues with it. That 3312ci looks nice, I wish I had dual HDMI outputs Looks like Denon is starting to release some new models, my next AVR will need to support atleast 4K video upscaling...mmm...4K.... lol

i wonder if Mitsubishi will ever come out with a 4K rear projection DLP

All this noise about noise.
♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫
Finding the acoustic sweet spot.
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post #26628 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 05:36 AM
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i wonder if Mitsubishi will ever come out with a 4K rear projection DLP

Not sure but I love the picture of Mitsubishi DLP projectors. I hope the next one I get will be LED to save power, run cooler, and last longer.
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post #26629 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 07:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post

I think my issue is definitely room related. I have a null in the front left part of my room and Audessey is trying to over-compensate for this by increasing bass output on my front left speaker. I have noticed the bass output greatly increased in the front left speaker when audessey is on and confirmed that there is a big dip between 25 and 50 hz on the audessey curves my denon shows. I have simply turned down the volume gain on the back of the speaker and crossed the fronts over at 60 hz (still doesn't completely go away) and this helps. I have very good subs, so there is no need for the fronts to go super low anyway - I am more concerned about blending and avoiding bad noises coming from the towers during crazy lfe movies like Inception. I find it more satisfying to cross my fronts over at 60 for music and movies and do not prefer full range in my room. Again, I think this is due to that darn null. I am in the middle of making some changes so when I put the bp7000's back in fornt, I am going to make the internal subs face out instead of in to see if that improves things a bit.

More than anything, placement and room issues seem to really have an affect on my speakers. My imaging is really satisfying so I am hesitant to move the fronts around for the bass issue- going to try flipping the speakers.

Hello Yosh,
Yes, dips in the bass frequency response are a bear. Of course, Audyssey cannot totally fix a dip - no Eq can - but you can try flipping the L&R, as you suggest. Sometimes dips are fairly severe at one point in the room, but not so bad at others. Have you tried moving your couch / listening position up or back by a foot or two? You may be able to re-adjust the speakers to get the imaging at its best for the new position. I hope this helps - best, Joe
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post #26630 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Joe@Definitive View Post

Hello Ferrari,
You have described one of the most popular configurations that we sell. The ProMonitor 800 is a great speaker, and of course the center channel is the most important of the 5 (or 7, or 9...) in a Home Theater set-up. This is a solid system. Just play around a bit with the crossover point to the sub, and invest some time in speaker / sub placement if you can. Let us know how it sounds, Ok? Best, Joe

Hi Joe,
Thank you for the input on my posting. I'm ending up getting the ProMonitor 1000's for the four speakers, with the ProCenter 1000 for the center. By the way, I'm getting the speakers, minus the sub as I already had it, from a seller here on AVS Forums. The sub is a BIC F12.

What setting would you recommend for the speakers ? 80 Hz ? Sub at 120 Hz ? I'll let my Pioneer VSX 1014TX do the initial surround set up using it's MACC system at first. I can't recall if it does let me set speaker Hz or only small / large as it's been a while since I've set up speakers on this reciever.

Thanks for any help and suggestions.
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post #26631 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 08:42 AM
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Joe,

Just curious but has there ever been any thoughts of providing an upgrade package so owners previous of older models could upgrade to the latest drivers and crossovers? Maybe even provide it as a service resellers could provide to customers? It's easier to justify then upgrade to all new speakers especially if the cabinets and subwoofers are in good shape, especially the subs in the BP7000SC
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post #26632 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truwarrior22 View Post

Joe,

Just curious but has there ever been any thoughts of providing an upgrade package so owners previous of older models could upgrade to the latest drivers and crossovers? Maybe even provide it as a service resellers could provide to customers? It's easier to justify then upgrade to all new speakers especially if the cabinets and subwoofers are in good shape, especially the subs in the BP7000SC

i wonder if the BDSS mid-drivers from the new sm55 could "drop in" to the 7000/7001/3000/2000 towers and the clr3000

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post #26633 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truwarrior22 View Post

Joe,

Just curious but has there ever been any thoughts of providing an upgrade package so owners previous of older models could upgrade to the latest drivers and crossovers? Maybe even provide it as a service resellers could provide to customers? It's easier to justify then upgrade to all new speakers especially if the cabinets and subwoofers are in good shape, especially the subs in the BP7000SC

I've seen drivers and crossovers on sale on ebay by bajawaverunner who I believe is a refurbisher for def tech.

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post #26634 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 09:17 AM
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I've seen drivers and crossovers on sale on ebay by bajawaverunner who I believe is a refurbisher for def tech.

i think he was interested in using the latest generation drivers in older models

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post #26635 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 12:56 PM
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Exactly, I understand the drivers might be a different distance apart which could pose some issues, etc. but I'm thinking it could be correct with crossover adjustments or slight driver revisions by the Def Tech engineers. Heck NAD does it with their AVR's why not with speakers?
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post #26636 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by truwarrior22 View Post

Joe,

Just curious but has there ever been any thoughts of providing an upgrade package so owners previous of older models could upgrade to the latest drivers and crossovers? Maybe even provide it as a service resellers could provide to customers? It's easier to justify then upgrade to all new speakers especially if the cabinets and subwoofers are in good shape, especially the subs in the BP7000SC

What an awesome idea. There needs to be a way to upgrade our speakers - visually and acoustically - this seems like it would be a great way to add revenue for Definitive. There could be a new MTV show called "Pimp my Speakers." Color endcap choices again, multiple color sock choices, exposed drivers, clear cabinets that show the crossovers and internals, digital sub-volume gains with remotes, upgradable amps, detachable power cords and on and on and on. There could be a "base" value model that could be upgraded with mods over time.

Seriously, this IS a great idea. I'm sure many of us would gladly update crossovers or drivers at some point.

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post #26637 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post

What an awesome idea. There needs to be a way to upgrade our speakers - visually and acoustically - this seems like it would be a great way to add revenue for Definitive. There could be a new MTV show called "Pimp my Speakers." Color endcap choices again, multiple color sock choices, exposed drivers, clear cabinets that show the crossovers and internals, digital sub-volume gains with remotes, upgradable amps, detachable power cords and on and on and on. There could be a "base" value model that could be upgraded with mods over time.

Seriously, this IS a great idea. I'm sure many of us would gladly update crossovers or drivers at some point.

I actually upgraded my caps to Clarity MR, wasn't cheap and unfortantly I don't have the proper equipment to ensure it's still in spec

PS, I want the LED ambient lighting upgrade with multi colors depending on my mood lol
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post #26638 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 05:31 PM
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they could upgrade by going back to the old original Vifa drivers

All this noise about noise.
♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫
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post #26639 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 08:25 PM
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Everything I read says that in-walls should have enclosures. Most of the deftech's do, but not the BP/As. Is the enclosure not as necessary for surrounds?
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post #26640 of 31459 Old 05-09-2012, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otk View Post

they could upgrade by going back to the old original Vifa drivers

Ouch! lol Are the BP7000SC's drivers Vifa? They sound really good, very natural, but I like he new mids too, not sure if the tweeters are different.

ATM, currently fighting bigger issues. It seems that I have a mode in the lower mid range in what I planned would be my main listening positioning. I'm currently aways sitting on the left side of the room by the left speaker, which sounds good, just no stereo imaging. When I go in he middle of the room between the speakers, it seems to thin out a bit unless I walk toward the speakers....might have to replan things, but I feel kinda funny sitting 6-7 feet away from BP7000SC towers lol
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