Energy Owners Thread - Page 1749 - AVS Forum
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post #52441 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by jgminder View Post
Got a pair of Energy RC-10s in perfect condition along with a pair of Energy V-Surrounds. PM me if you're interested. I have the boxes and everything.
Black ash, or otherwise?
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post #52442 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by sanjoelo View Post
Black ash, or otherwise?
Black Ash RC-10s. Black Energy V-Surrounds.
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post #52443 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by dsskid View Post
I'm running CF-30s fronts, CC-5 center, and CB-5s surrounds with an S10 sub, powered by a Denon 1911 receiver in my small den, and am pleased with the performance.
Nice, I looked at those as well for a smaller application but haven't pulled the trigger yet. Good to hear.

CC-10 Center
CF-50 Fronts
Pioneer SC-71
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post #52444 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by furchtlos View Post
I don't see many people with the C-10 or C-50's? Anyone else have these? I enjoy them quite a bit, they are running from my SC71. The only thing they really lack is bass, but that is to be expected.
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I'm running CF-30s fronts, CC-5 center, and CB-5s surrounds with an S10 sub, powered by a Denon 1911 receiver in my small den, and am pleased with the performance.
I once ran a setup consisting of 2 x CB-20s, 1 x CC-5 and 2 x CB-5s. I quickly upgraded the center to a CC-10 afterwards which was much better. The whole series is rather bright so maybe that's why you find them lacking in bass. The CB-20s were alright bass-wise although I always used a sub to complement the setup (first an Energy ESW-C8 which is not worth the cost, and afterwards an SVS SB12-NSD). At the time I had a Pioneer 1020 running it.

I since sold the whole setup to a friend, and it's still running fine. The only caveat being finish: it seems that in a varying humidity environment, the finish has a tendency to peel away and fade a bit. They're not as pretty as they once were.

Nonetheless, I'm now in the process of building a secondary setup for a kid's playroom / parent's training room. The setup is all-new, with 4 x CB-10 and a CC-10. A PSA XS15se subwoofer will add the needed oomph. An Onkyo 818 will provide the wattage to the speakers and the signal to the sub. I've yet to test the setup though, but in Canada, owing to deep discounts found at FutureShop, it's pretty hard to find a better deal than Energy's C-series.

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post #52445 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 12:33 PM
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Kind of curious if Energy will get into making Dolby Atmos type speakers. I like Pioneer's design with the top mounted driver aimed at the ceiling, and the idea of running speaker wire to an existing location instead of figuring out ceiling options.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...akers/SP-EFS73
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post #52446 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by rpkelly View Post
I've posted in here before about selling my speakers, but have kept them because I've enjoyed them. However, I could now use the money. Are cherry Rc-10 and RC-LCR still in demand at all? Searching on craigslist, I didn't see any other cherry so wasn't sure if I'd be wasting my time.

Thanks.
I don't know how much demand there is but I think they look better than black ash. I have RC-70's, RC-10s and RC LCR in black and then in another setup I have RC-10s, RC Mini C, RC Mini's all in cherry.

The Cherry finish definitely looks better in my opinion.

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post #52447 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by mobileES View Post
Kind of curious if Energy will get into making Dolby Atmos type speakers. I like Pioneer's design with the top mounted driver aimed at the ceiling, and the idea of running speaker wire to an existing location instead of figuring out ceiling options.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...akers/SP-EFS73
Fat chance. You can effectively consider Energy speakers dead in terms of interesting new product development. The only thing they've put out since being lobotomized by the Audiovox takeover are crappy subs and soundbars.
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post #52448 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Fat chance. You can effectively consider Energy speakers dead in terms of interesting new product development. The only thing they've put out since being lobotomized by the Audiovox takeover are crappy subs and soundbars.
Yeah but what about a crappy ATMOS soundbar?

That being said, I agree about the crappy subs but I'm not sure whether Energy's soundbars are crappy as far as soundbars go.

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post #52449 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:35 PM
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Well my writing was grammatically ambiguous but I meant the adjective "crappy" to refer only to the subs

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post #52450 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Fat chance. You can effectively consider Energy speakers dead in terms of interesting new product development. The only thing they've put out since being lobotomized by the Audiovox takeover are crappy subs and soundbars.
This sucks, I'm in the process of converting my 7.1 setup to Energy except the sub. So far with the C2 mains, C-C1 center, C-R100 side surrounds, Sony rears, and Sony sub it sounds pretty awesome. I would have to look at some speaker options to do Atmos and keep the Energy's still in use.

I remember hearing the C2's back in '97 in the a/v store I was working at, they were absolutely jaw dropping. Glad I bought a pair as they are scarce now.
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post #52451 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by mobileES View Post
This sucks, I'm in the process of converting my 7.1 setup to Energy except the sub. So far with the C2 mains, C-C1 center, C-R100 side surrounds, Sony rears, and Sony sub it sounds pretty awesome. I would have to look at some speaker options to do Atmos and keep the Energy's still in use.
I know nothing about ATMOS but... can't you use regular speakers e.g. in-ceiling speakers or tilted speakers for ATMOS purposes? Surely speakers with mids aimed at the ceiling are not optimal?

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post #52452 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by mobileES View Post
This sucks, I'm in the process of converting my 7.1 setup to Energy except the sub. So far with the C2 mains, C-C1 center, C-R100 side surrounds, Sony rears, and Sony sub it sounds pretty awesome. I would have to look at some speaker options to do Atmos and keep the Energy's still in use.

I remember hearing the C2's back in '97 in the a/v store I was working at, they were absolutely jaw dropping. Glad I bought a pair as they are scarce now.
Yes, the way to go now is to buy vintage Energy speakers which are a shockingly good value if you know what to look for. The "even number" Connoisseurs are phenomenal, I actually just sold a pair of the C-2's (along with some assorted other speakers) and they are just fabulous. I would also highly recommend the RVS speakers if you want matching L/C/R, or their replacement the AC-300 which is the "true" matching center for those speakers (the C-C1 is for the next gen "odd number" Connoissuers).

Sony subs aren't really highly regarded so that should probably be your next upgrade, since I'm spending your money

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post #52453 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by neutro View Post
I know nothing about ATMOS but... can't you use regular speakers e.g. in-ceiling speakers or tilted speakers for ATMOS purposes? Surely speakers with mids aimed at the ceiling are not optimal?
Upward-firing "virtual" height speakers are a compromise for those who can't physically install speakers on/in the ceiling. Obviously, if you CAN put physical speakers up there it's a better option for implementing Atmos.

The only exception would be if the speakers are so low that the physical speakers would be too "distracting" and "directional" because of how close they are to the listening postition. In this case the more diffuse sound of the reflected speakers can be preferable.

It's sort of like the decision between monopole (precise and directional) vs. dipole (diffuse) surround speakers. The virtual speakers by their nature won't be able to image as precisely as a physical speaker, but the diffuse sound may be subjectively preferred for greater "envelopment".

The reason for them however is because many people aren't going to chop up the ceiling and walls to run wires and install speakers up there. If Dolby depended on this it would probably doom Atmos to be a commercial failure for home use. Thus they spent a lot of time inventing the technology to make these virtual "Atmos enabled" speakers effective in simulating the experience of real overhead speakers. The advantage of course is that you it makes adoption MUCH easier in terms of physically locating the new speakers.

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post #52454 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 02:43 PM
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I know nothing about ATMOS but... can't you use regular speakers e.g. in-ceiling speakers or tilted speakers for ATMOS purposes? Surely speakers with mids aimed at the ceiling are not optimal?
Unfortunately due to landlord restrictions I am limited to what I can do to the walls in my place. I think I may have to try the angle speakers that project toward the ceiling.

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Yes, the way to go now is to buy vintage Energy speakers which are a shockingly good value if you know what to look for. The "even number" Connoisseurs are phenomenal, I actually just sold a pair of the C-2's (along with some assorted other speakers) and they are just fabulous. I would also highly recommend the RVS speakers if you want matching L/C/R, or their replacement the AC-300 which is the "true" matching center for those speakers (the C-C1 is for the next gen "odd number" Connoissuers).

Sony subs aren't really highly regarded so that should probably be your next upgrade, since I'm spending your money
Hmmm........ would I really hear a huge sound quality difference between my current C2's and C-C1 L/C/R setup and the RVS speakers? Reason I ask is that I am extremely happy with my C-series speakers and I just got the center a few weeks ago.

Yea, the Sony sub I have had since forever (early 90's, 120W 12"), I was looking at replacing that with a Velodyne unit.
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post #52455 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 03:00 PM
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Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that the RVS are much better than the C-2 (they aren't, they are approximately equal I would say). I was just making a general comment that they are an awesome value if you can find them used, especially if you can find three of them and get a perfect timbre match across the front three speakers.

In your case I wouldn't go upending the current C-2 / C-C1 setup at all; the subwoofer is then next domino to fall

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post #52456 of 52463 Old 09-18-2014, 03:56 PM
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No worries, good to hear they are equal, I'd hate to start all over again shopping for a front setup. The C-C1 was the closest center I could get as a match for the C2's.

I love my Sony, however after hearing a friends Velodyne, I was sold.
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post #52457 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 10:31 AM
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RC70s - $349.95ea @ futureshop.ca

4 left as of the time of this posting. Must have found some more stock...
I bought two of those. The boxes were terribly dusty and beat up. One of the speakers had minor damage to the rear corner of the base/plinth, but some black touch-up paint easily cured it. Free shipping too. They are much nicer sounding than the bookshelf speakers they replace.
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post #52458 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 10:45 AM
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Looks like one of my post got lost in the interwebs; anyway thanks for the explanation batpig.

Are ATMOS speakers with mids on top equipped with two inputs (e.g. as is the case with stereo ceiling speakers)? I guess so... In that case you could just add small satellites and aim them to the ceiling if you don't want or can't install ceiling speakers? Perhaps we're about to see speaker mounts that are easily aimable updwards.

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post #52459 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 10:50 AM
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Looks like one of my post got lost in the interwebs; anyway thanks for the explanation batpig.

Are ATMOS speakers with mids on top equipped with two inputs (e.g. as is the case with stereo ceiling speakers)? I guess so... In that case you could just add small satellites and aim them to the ceiling if you don't want or can't install ceiling speakers? Perhaps we're about to see speaker mounts that are easily aimable updwards.
Yes, they are two separate speaker channels as far as the AVR is concerned. In the case of something like those AJ Pioneer speakers they two speakers are in one cabinet, but they are still two separate speakers, with two separate inputs.

While in theory you can just aim a random pair of satellite speakers at the ceiling (I've actually tried this myself) it won't work as well as the "real thing" for a couple of reasons:

1. The "Dolby enabled" speakers have a special filter network inside which shapes the HF to enhance the perception of them actually being overhead
2. They also have specific directivity requirements so the sound "beams" and the overhead reflection isn't smeared by direct sound from the speaker

That said, if you have a receiver with auto room EQ the calibration software will take care of #1 since the HF "notches" are built into the target curve (if it wasn't, something like Audyssey would just flatten out the special filtering). So even a non "Atmos enabled" speaker when calibrated with Audyssey or the like will have the freq response shaped as per Dolby's specs. So that just leaves the directivity problem.... In my experiments (I had an extra pair of Take LCR speakers that I was aiming at the ceiling) the non-Atmos speakers still produced a nice sense of "height" and extended the ambience of the soundtrack overhead when upmixed with the new Dolby Surround upmixer. I didn't have any native Atmos content to test but I will re-try when I get my test disc.
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post #52460 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 11:07 AM
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Pretty interesting stuff. Not only did you already thought about using spare Takes to make an ATMOS setup but you already *did*. Awesome. As for #1 , I guess most ATMOS-enabled AVRs right now have auto room EQ; as for #2 , well that's a smaller problem IMHO. However most speakers are designed to have a large spread so that goes against the directivity requirements.

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post #52461 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 02:12 PM
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Thanks for the pic! I JUST got back from my house - wanted to see if it was as easy as you say to swap them out, and to verify the part number. It was even easier... 10 seconds tops. The part number is correct. I've been corresponding with the seller in France and will order 3 of them (one spare) as soon as I can figure out how to order multiples of it off of eBay - I might just have to place three separate bids I guess.

So - for $450 I'm going to get a working set of 2.3s that I know and will match the rest of my setup - plus have a spare new woofer to help with other failures down the road. We'll see how this works - Fears4Ears on this thread gives a good report of the seller - going to try it.

The Microstar 12.1 sub is REALLY powerful. It rocked the entire store when I was shopping for it. I have had zero issues with it in the decade I've had it. Its reputation was that it was pretty decent for music (my main interest at the time) as well as movies. It has not disappointed. I like subs to blend in with the speakers, and it does that well with these Veritas speakers. It just seems to fill in nicely - but when called upon, it delivers. Woof! It was the store demo - which they said Energy had discontinued - something about a patent dispute with Carver over the amp design. Don't know if that's true - I tried to attach the pdf of the owner's manual that has some info on it but it's too big (2mb) - if you send me your email address (pm?) I'll forward that on to you.

Really - thanks for your help on the Veritas and the Denon X5200W... it is genuinely appreciated!
Quoting myself here- sorry. Wanted to report that I successfully ordered three new woofers fro the eBay seller in France. There was a little language barrier, and his ad wasn't set up for multiple woofer sales, but we sorted it out - anxiously awaiting them- can't fully run Audyssey until all the speakers are working. (I tried fooling it by moving a good speaker to where the bad one was, but it wasn't having it... Too smart for me.
I just hated the prospect of putting these Veritas 2.3 speakers out to pasture- now I can restore them, and I know a place that can rebuild them in the future.
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post #52462 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 03:35 PM
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Quoting myself here- sorry. Wanted to report that I successfully ordered three new woofers fro the eBay seller in France. There was a little language barrier, and his ad wasn't set up for multiple woofer sales, but we sorted it out - anxiously awaiting them- can't fully run Audyssey until all the speakers are working. (I tried fooling it by moving a good speaker to where the bad one was, but it wasn't having it... Too smart for me.
I just hated the prospect of putting these Veritas 2.3 speakers out to pasture- now I can restore them, and I know a place that can rebuild them in the future.
Great! I'm really hoping it all works out for you. I love my 2.3 towers.

Did you confirm that this place has actually had experience repairing these particular Veritas woofers? Did they give you a clue how they were going to do it? It might be worth it to take one of your bad ones in there to have that fourth backup. Also, I would think that there is going to be a market for these woofers for a while, if you end up not needing it. Mostly, I'm just curious to see if they can actually be repaired.
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post #52463 of 52463 Old Yesterday, 07:58 PM
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Great! I'm really hoping it all works out for you. I love my 2.3 towers.

Did you confirm that this place has actually had experience repairing these particular Veritas woofers? Did they give you a clue how they were going to do it? It might be worth it to take one of your bad ones in there to have that fourth backup. Also, I would think that there is going to be a market for these woofers for a while, if you end up not needing it. Mostly, I'm just curious to see if they can actually be repaired.
I was thinking of doing exactly that - when the new ones come, send one of the bad ones off to them. It's called The Speaker Exchange in Tampa, FL. I found them because they came up on a Google search for that part number. I guess they used to have new ones. I wrote and asked them about repairing and they told me that for $125 they would put new voice coils in. I don't know enough about speaker anatomy to know if this makes sense - does it to you?
Thanks again for writing that you had used the people in France - it helped make the decision!
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