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Old 09-05-2006, 08:50 PM
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I had a chance to audition the C-100 against the C-3 and contrary to experience of other members found the C-100 a better sounding speaker. At the store they were both running off NAD receiver (T743) with an NAD cd player (C542 I think). The main problem with the C-3 was unbalanced bass. It had a lot of it but it overpowered the highs and wasn't all that controlled. It was rather bloated actually. I didn't like it at all. The highs were pretty good, very detailed but managed to become harsh and very sibilant at various times. The C-100 seemed to simply improve on all of it's characteristics. It didn't have quite as much bass but it the bass felt far more tighter somewhat dryer and far more controlled. I didn't hear the 'midbass bloat' in the C-100. Very smooth all the way through. The highs sounded almost identical except when the C-3 sounded harsh or sibilant the C-100 remained smoother and more pleasant.

I also had the "misfortune" to listen to the RC-10 and it was rather upsetting that I simply didn't have the funds for that speaker as it blew me away. However honestly I also felt that the C-100 is tremendous value. It isn't in the same league as the RC-10 but for 1/4th the cost is offered about '85-90%' of the RC-10 performance.

C-100
Pros: fixed the problems that the previous C-3 had. Bass bloat and harshness
Cons: Would be nice to have deeper controlled smooth bass, but I guess API can't change laws of physics. The previous C-Series looked much nicer.
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Old 09-06-2006, 08:37 AM
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The C-100 is not the upgrade to the older C-3. The current C series are budget energy speakers. The older C-1 , C-3 , C-5 , C-7 , C-9 , C-C1 , C-C3 , C-R1 , C-R3 series is the older connoisseur series that the new RC series upgrades. So the C-100 didn't fix any 'problems' with the C-3. A review of the C-3 here..... http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/energy_c3.htm

It is interesting to hear that you like the newer c-100 more. Go for it then. Everyone should trust their own musical tastes.

I much prefer the older connoisseur series. They were a great sounding speaker. The specs are much better on the older connoeissuer series too. Better response, Higher sensitivity, bigger woofer, and notably heavier.

Some people like the older connoisseur series over the newer RC series.

kw.............
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Old 09-06-2006, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by kwtoxman View Post

The C-100 is not the upgrade to the older C-3. The current C series are budget energy speakers. The older C-1 , C-3 , C-5 , C-7 , C-9 , C-C1 , C-C3 , C-R1 , C-R3 series is the older connoisseur series that the new RC series upgrades. So the C-100 didn't fix any 'problems' with the C-3. A review of the C-3 here..... http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/energy_c3.htm

I've clearly heard problems with the C-3 that the C-100 seemed to have solved. I've listened to them against each other in A/B config for about 1 hour. The C-100 is certainly lighter then C-3 because it's a smaller model.
Perhaps a more fair test would have been the C-200 due to same size woofer, but that wasn't available. Also energy specifies weights different for new C-Series vs old. It looks like the new C-Series specifies speaker weight and in the previous cases they specified shipping weight which I am guessing means in shipping package.


Also I am not entirely sure how do you define 'upgrade' vs 'not upgrade' to claim wether new C-Series is an upgrade or downgrade over the previous Connoisseur series? The new C-Series has a lower entry price then previous models but I think the pricing policy purely reflects the competency of competition enegry has to face today rather then a particular 'level'. In addition the new C-Series is made in China which allows API to save another good chunk of money rather then producing them in Canada like the previous series.

Nothing here implies that it's a downgrade of course its a press release so it's value is limited, would be nice to have someone at energy who can answer: http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/about/news.php?id=287

Quote:


It is interesting to hear that you like the newer c-100 more. Go for it then. Everyone should trust their own musical tastes.

Indeed

Quote:


I much prefer the older connoisseur series. They were a great sounding speaker. The specs are much better on the older connoeissuer series too. Better response, Higher sensitivity, bigger woofer, and notably heavier.

They are a great sounding speaker, I just wish I would see more reviews of the new C-Series.

Quote:


Some people like the older connoisseur series over the newer RC series.

And some people like masochism (not that I am comparing) but just trying to explain the rationale of such a statement.

Actually here is another review that complains about this very same issue i pointed out:
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...s-11-2002.html
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Old 09-06-2006, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigsegv0x0b View Post

I've clearly heard problems with the C-3 that the C-100 seemed to have solved. I've listened to them against each other in A/B config for about 1 hour.

You clearly heard sound differences between the two, and you liked the C-100 better. That's about it. Everything else is a personal statement

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Originally Posted by sigsegv0x0b View Post

Actually here is another review that complains about this very same issue i pointed out:
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...s-11-2002.html

Here is a link of c-3 measurements. Objective 3rd party measurements, not personal attributes. http://www.soundstagemagazine.com/me...onnoisseur_c3/
Note the smooth overall response (for which energy speakers are known for) with no big bass or midrange bloat.

So what did you hear? A/B'ing, while useful, is often a compromise. It appears that the speakers were not A/B'd in identical positions, so already room acoustics are a significant variable. I'd hypothesize that the speakers were not positioned very well and room responses were contributing to the issues you heard. It is an artifact of the set up and listening environment, not the speaker.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sigsegv0x0b View Post

Also I am not entirely sure how do you define 'upgrade' vs 'not upgrade' to claim wether new C-Series is an upgrade or downgrade over the previous Connoisseur series? The new C-Series has a lower entry price then previous models but I think the pricing policy purely reflects the competency of competition enegry has to face today rather then a particular 'level'. In addition the new C-Series is made in China which allows API to save another good chunk of money rather then producing them in Canada like the previous series.

Nothing here implies that it's a downgrade of course its a press release so it's value is limited, would be nice to have someone at energy who can answer: http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/about/news.php?id=287

Marketing, the great foundation of our consumeristic society. New is better and new is different and therefore we all need new. IMO, I am wary of 'marketing'. Some of the greatest speakers for audiophiles are old or at least older. Newer does not equal better.

The C series are built differently beyond being assembled in china. The woofer construction is different (fiberglass on the C series and homopolymer on), and cabinet design, even amount of drivers in the larger speakers, etc. I was under the impression that the old connoisseur series was also built in china. Only the veritas series has been made in Canada since the orginal c-2,c-4,c-6 connoisseur series. My point was that the older connoisseur series were made to a different price point (signficantly higher) and the cabinets, drivers, etc reflect that.

So, imo, the c series speakers are a downgrade from the older connoisseur speakers. But personal tastes will ultimately rule which a person prefers.

kw............
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Old 09-06-2006, 11:48 AM
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So if I want to try and match the quality of my Connoisseur C-9's.... (in a different room)

I should listen to the RC-?

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Old 09-06-2006, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by kwtoxman View Post

You clearly heard sound differences between the two, and you liked the C-100 better. That's about it. Everything else is a personal statement

Here is a link of c-3 measurements. Objective 3rd party measurements, not personal attributes. http://www.soundstagemagazine.com/me...onnoisseur_c3/
Note the smooth overall response (for which energy speakers are known for) with no big bass or midrange bloat.

So what did you hear? A/B'ing, while useful, is often a compromise. It appears that the speakers were not A/B'd in identical positions, so already room acoustics are a significant variable. I'd hypothesize that the speakers were not positioned very well and room responses were contributing to the issues you heard. It is an artifact of the set up and listening environment, not the speaker.

The auditining setup was fine, both speakers were standing side by side on stands there was quite a bit of distance to all the walls (which shouldn't matter *that* much for the front ported C-3) in the middle was the eqiupment shelf with the amp and cd player. So I really don't think the "room" was a major factor in my test. I have listened to C-1 and C-9 (at a friends house) and have looked at them and they are both INDEED "Made In Canada" so that automatically has a rather large increase on cost over the new C-Series which are "Designed and Engeenered in Canada" and "Made In China" as per text near the binding posts. So the cheaper cost of the new series is no way an idication of them being lower level. That is I fail to find the 'lower range' features you see about the new C-Series vs the old series.

Quote:


Marketing, the great foundation of our consumeristic society. New is better and new is different and therefore we all need new. IMO, I am wary of 'marketing'. Some of the greatest speakers for audiophiles are old or at least older. Newer does not equal better.

That is true, however I fail to find understand *why* you claim the new C-Series is *NOT* better and is infact *WORSE*.

Quote:


The C series are built differently beyond being assembled in china. The woofer construction is different (fiberglass on the C series and homopolymer on), and cabinet design, even amount of drivers in the larger speakers, etc. I was under the impression that the old connoisseur series was also built in china. Only the veritas series has been made in Canada since the orginal c-2,c-4,c-6 connoisseur series. My point was that the older connoisseur series were made to a different price point (signficantly higher) and the cabinets, drivers, etc reflect that.

I do not see the case of them being made to a signficantly higher price point, I see them being much more expensive to make due to place made in (Canada) and what that level of technology cost in late 90s early 2000s.

Quote:


So, imo, the c series speakers are a downgrade from the older connoisseur speakers. But personal tastes will ultimately rule which a person prefers.
kw............

Indeed, but you're implying that the new C-Series is inferior with such vigor that I am wondering what is it you know about them that makes you so certain, because I basically want to know also, and will perhaps learn something I do not know if you provide your reasoning.
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Old 09-06-2006, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by HiHoStevo View Post

So if I want to try and match the quality of my Connoisseur C-9's.... (in a different room)

I should listen to the RC-?

You should find the C-3 or C-1 to *match* them because chances neither the RC series nor the new C-Series will actually match your C-9s. Of course while we arguing various interesting points to each other earlier on in the thread we both clearly stated that the only way to find a speaker that you like is to audition it. So do that
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Old 09-06-2006, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by sigsegv0x0b View Post

The auditining setup was fine, both speakers were standing side by side on stands there was quite a bit of distance to all the walls (which shouldn't matter *that* much for the front ported C-3) in the middle was the eqiupment shelf with the amp and cd player. So I really don't think the "room" was a major factor in my test.

Rooms make a big difference in listening, especially in bass regions where you have some complaints. Ever hear of room resonances or room nulls? That is why anechoic chambers are so important in speaker design, and for some in testing. That is why parametric EQ's and sub response curves are used by so many in the sub forum with their virtues extolled. If speakers aren't placed in exactly the same position, then the room will affect the measured response. And then it isn't a true a/b test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigsegv0x0b View Post

Indeed, but you're implying that the new C-Series is inferior with such vigor that I am wondering what is it you know about them that makes you so certain, because I basically want to know also, and will perhaps learn something I do not know if you provide your reasoning.

I can't explain it any better, and I fail to see the vigour as I qualified everything with IMO. The old connoisseur speakers were their mid range, and are now updated to the reference connoisseur. The C series are the budget speakers in the energy line, as is easily seen in the manufacturer literature and website itself. The C series was never designed to update or overtake the old connoisseur range. It was designed as the budget range with a completely different price point that being made in China alone cannot cover. And I'm sure they are good speakers.

I have seen Energy call the RC series updates of the original connoisseurs and in their opinion better than the original connoisseur series. I have not seen Energy call the C series better than the original connoisseurs. I'd imagine they would tout that if they felt that way, considering they did it for the RC's.




HiHoStevo,

As I understand you, you want similar speakers for SQ in another room. You aren't trying to go 5.1 or whatever in a single room.

All of the speakers that energy makes are to the same philosophy. Energy speakers are designed to attain three important characteristics: flat on-axis frequency response with wide bandwidth, wide and constant dispersion at all frequencies, and low distortion and resonance.

If you like the C-9's, other than finding some used, I'd recommend listening to the other Energy products and pick the ones that meet your sound goals and budget. The RC's are considered the updates to the connoisseur line. I'm sure you'll find something that does it for you.

kw...........
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Old 09-06-2006, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by kwtoxman View Post

Rooms make a big difference in listening, especially in bass regions where you have some complaints. Ever hear of room resonances or room nulls? That is why anechoic chambers are so important in speaker design, and for some in testing. That is why parametric EQ's and sub response curves are used by so many in the sub forum with their virtues extolled. If speakers aren't placed in exactly the same position, then the room will affect the measured response. And then it isn't a true a/b test.

The test that I conducted was precisie enough for me to make my decision.

Quote:


I can't explain it any better, and I fail to see the vigour as I qualified everything with IMO. The old connoisseur speakers were their mid range, and are now updated to the reference connoisseur. The C series are the budget speakers in the energy line, as is easily seen in the manufacturer literature and website itself. The C series was never designed to update or overtake the old connoisseur range. It was designed as the budget range with a completely different price point that being made in China alone cannot cover. And I'm sure they are good speakers.

I have seen Energy call the RC series updates of the original connoisseurs and in their opinion better than the original connoisseur series. I have not seen Energy call the C series better than the original connoisseurs. I'd imagine they would tout that if they felt that way, considering they did it for the RC's.

You did listen to the C-Series right? I'm just wondering what are the differences you found in it's sound vs the Connoisseur series?

I tried to describe my expirence, I wish there were more reviews, if you have listened to the speaker please give me the differences you found. I still have 4 more days of 'refund' time on the C-100, so I am able to still exchange them for the C-3 (price is the same). I can go re-audition tomorrow I guess to see if my opinion or perception changed.
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Old 09-06-2006, 07:07 PM
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It's simply conjecture if you don't atleast listen to both thoroughly and compare. I think the older C-3 SHOULD be better then the newer C series stuff, but that doesn't necessarily mean it is. And by better, I mean a majority of listeners have a similar preference after comparing.

As for the older series, me and a friend bought new in box and demo energy c series of old only 2 months ago (a rare find and at crazy discounted prices):

C-9s, C-5s, C-3s, C-1s, C-C1s, C-C3

He has enough for 2 x 5.1 setups, and I got C-3s and C-C1 for the front. So it's theoretically possible you may still find them at some remote dealer, if not, I would go used.

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Old 09-06-2006, 08:30 PM
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It's simply conjecture if you don't atleast listen to both thoroughly and compare. I think the older C-3 SHOULD be better then the newer C series stuff, but that doesn't necessarily mean it is. And by better, I mean a majority of listeners have a similar preference after comparing.

As for the older series, me and a friend bought new in box and demo energy c series of old only 2 months ago (a rare find and at crazy discounted prices):

C-9s, C-5s, C-3s, C-1s, C-C1s, C-C3

He has enough for 2 x 5.1 setups, and I got C-3s and C-C1 for the front. So it's theoretically possible you may still find them at some remote dealer, if not, I would go used.

Well my question is for anyone who actually A/Bed C-Series vs the older C series (C1/3/6). What did they find? I actually did it and described my expirence in the post above after having done such.

So I'm looking for what other people who have actually listened the speakers off one another thought.
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Old 09-07-2006, 03:56 AM
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I own all three different series- ie. Connoisseur Series, new C-Series and new RC-Series. After my own personal experience I've come to believe, or realize, they are essentially three different design's with their own respective sound characteristics. Moreover, I believe, there may be some, mis-information, or confusion, regarding the new C-Series' expectations as opposed the their actual performance.

Four years ago I was using C-1's and C-3's with Yamaha receiver's (50W per/chan), primarily for 2-channel music. Both, the C-3's and C-1's, were very nice, mostly crisp and clean sounding, with good imaging, to put it simple- especially for bookshelf type models. I recieved several good comments while playing music in my house. My son now has all this equipment and is very happy with it (say's all his friends can't believe how good the speakers sound).

Three years later (2005) I purchased C-5's, a C-C1 center, an S8.3 sub, along with a Yamaha RX-V1500 reciever (120W X 7), through a liquidation sale. I thought the C-5's had very nice, clear, hi's, with good mid-range (much like the C-1's and C-3's), however, with un-believeably smooth, deep, bass response. My first experience using floorstanding tower's. 2-channel music sounded [even] nicer, with more full-range bass. Also, Home Theater surround was a whole new amazing experience, clean and explosive sounding, with very nice imaging.

I was totally impressed with the design form & function of the Connoisseur Series- unique front baffle design, magnetic grill fasteners, nice quality finish, excellent sound- great overall package for the price.

However, last fall (2005), I read the press announcement on the Energy web-site in regards to their releasing a complete new Energy C-Series product, it sounded very intriguing to me. The drivers consisted of fiberglass composite cones (actually fiberglass molded cones laminated to a poly-type rear layer for extra stiffness). While the tweeters are based on their popular Aluminum Hyperdrive dome design. Moreover, the Energy web-site stated- "the new C-Series is intended to replace both the XL Series and Connoisseur Series", and further went on to claim- "The C-Series C-500 is capable of greater extension, slam and impact than its C-5 predecessor, with less distortion and better articulation." I was completely excited and could'nt wait to try them. Pricing was even better than the Connoisseur Series.

So I purchased new C-Series speakers (C-300 front's, C-C100 center, C-200 rears) in February (2006), along with a (new) Yamaha RX-V1600 receiver (120W X 7). After burning-in over 100 hours I was fairly impressed with the system, Home Theater surround was excellent, clean and explosive sounding, overall, for both DVD's and digital cable. However, 2-channel audio, in "PURE" mode, was not as clean sounding (as the Connoisseur series) playing through the C-300 fronts, I thought. The hi's were more "veiled" or "muffled", as if the tweeters were different. Although, mid-range and bass was very good. I experienced the same characteristic later switching the C-200's to the front, very good mid-range, but not as clear hi's (wish I could have tested C-3's at same time). Later, I bi-amped the C-300 front's and, I thought, they sounded better overall- more open mid-range, with deep, smooth, bass response (not bad for a single 6.5in woofer, 2-way, floorstander). After a few months I bought an NAD C272 amp (150W X 2) to power my C-300 fronts (using Yamaha RX-V1600 as pre-pro) and they sounded even better, slightly cleaner overall sound, with even nicer bass response.

Overall, I thought the new C-Series are good, and more than worth the price. Very good design form & function- beautiful laquer finish on front baffle, seamless outer vinyl laminate, decent grills (no magnets though), good accessories (spikes, etc.,..). Good sound, maybe not as clean-sounding as Connoisseur Series? However, mid-range and bass as good (I thought), with excellent imaging/soundstage. Home Theater surround performance is very (surprisingly) good, while 2-channel audio characteristic's may vary depending on power source.

In May (2006) I swapped my (new) C-Series for the new RC-Series (RC-30 fronts, RC-LCR center, RC-Mini rears), and I'm beyond impressed with the overall design & function, definitely a step above the Connoisseur Series & new C-Series in sound quality and fabrication. Much better overall clarity and transparency. Clean hi's, good mid-range, with deep, smooth, bass response. Home Theater surround, and multi-channel music, is excellent! 2-channel audio is excellent!

RC-Series feature magnetic fasteners on grills, nice accessories (spikes, etc.,...), beautifully laminated (real wood) veneers, kevlar cones, all for an excellent price! I'm very content now with my system.

I would definitely prefer the RC-Series out of the three series, and would'nt be so "hung-up" with finding older Connoisseur Series models. The new C-Series definitely make for a great first-time Home Theater on a budget.
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Old 09-07-2006, 07:11 AM
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MY impression of the C-3s when I first got them was"what is with the bass on these". I was surprised at how much bass output came from these speakers, especially after comparing them with the Ascend 170s, which to me had very little bass. After comparing the 2, I preferred the C-3s, but I can understand what he meant by slightly bloated bass. If I could find a complaint about these great speakers, it would be that. I kept them well away from room boundries, and they are front ported also, so I don't think that was a factor.
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Old 09-07-2006, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Doc99 View Post

I was surprised at how much bass output came from these speakers, especially after comparing them with the Ascend 170s.

I think the different cabinet volume measurement's account for the differences in bass response:
Ascend 170's = 1080 cubic in @14lbs
C-3's = 1381.4 cubic in @17.5lbs
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Old 09-07-2006, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwtoxman View Post

The C series was never designed to update or overtake the old connoisseur range. And I'm sure they are good speakers.

I have not seen Energy call the C series better than the original connoisseurs. I'd imagine they would tout that if they felt that way, considering they did it for the RC's.

This is where, I think, Energy has caused some confusion, or deception. Their website makes some mis-leading statements- ie.

"Many reviewers and listeners heralded the Energy C-5 (the precursor to the C-500) as the leader in performance in this category, but that is about to change. The C-Series C-500 is capable of greater extension, slam and impact than its predecessor, with less distortion and better articulation."

http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/pr...age.php?id=291

"This new series has been designed to offer unparalleled performance and aesthetics, at an affordable price point. Intended to replace both the XL Series and Connoisseur Series"

http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/about/news.php?id=287


I do think the new C-series are aesthetically nicer than the Connoisseur series. However, sound characteristics comparison will vary, although, I think the new C-series are excellent for the price.
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Old 09-07-2006, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

This is where, I think, Energy has caused some confusion, or deception. Their website makes some mis-leading statements- ie.

"Many reviewers and listeners heralded the Energy C-5 (the precursor to the C-500) as the leader in performance in this category, but that is about to change. The C-Series C-500 is capable of greater extension, slam and impact than its predecessor, with less distortion and better articulation."

http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/pr...age.php?id=291

It's hard to verify this statement since energy themselves do not provide any sort of frequency sweeps and no one has yet officially reviewed the new C-Series.

I would love to see the graphs as a point of reference.

Quote:


"This new series has been designed to offer unparalleled performance and aesthetics, at an affordable price point. Intended to replace both the XL Series and Connoisseur Series"

http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/about/news.php?id=287

As I stated earlier I did A/B C-3 vs C-100 with relativly good equipment (NAD T734 and C5xx) and in my expirence is basically is that C-3 has some sort of problem with bass as it 'drowns out' the mid-range and detail at various points, while with the C-100 such didn't happen. The C-100 did not go as low as the C-3 with bass extension but the main point is that bass stayed tight and controlled where with the C-3 felt like it was basically overpowring the rest of it and highs and mids becoming muddy.

Now as far as detail, I was really paying attention to detail and C-100 appeared as detailed as the C-3, if not more so at various moments because it didn't have the bass 'overpowering' it. In addition the C-3 managed to sound harsh and sibiliant a few times, painfully so, while the C-100 maintained it's composure and managed to play same pass without hurting my ear.

I had a chance to audition a C-1 later on and honestly found that speaker better balanced then C-3, it had an abundance of bass however it sounded very tight and controlled. And never managed to drown out the highs and mids. It still seemed to go harsh and sibilant at various times, but that didn't bother me as much as bass causing problems.

What is upsetting is how many people seem to bash the new C-Series without actually A/Bing it against the older speakers.

Quote:


I do think the new C-series are aesthetically nicer than the Connoisseur series. However, sound characteristics comparison will vary, although, I think the new C-series are excellent for the price.

I actually think the previous Connoisseur looks more attractive, the new C-Series looks like black boxes.
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Old 09-07-2006, 10:03 PM
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What is upsetting is how many people seem to bash the new C-Series without actually A/Bing it against the older speakers.
.

exactly! I believe, after some time, you will see more reviews and resultant popularity.

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Originally Posted by sigsegv0x0b View Post

I actually think the previous Connoisseur looks more attractive, the new C-Series looks like black boxes.

I think the cherry C-300's (and C-500's) look elegant, especially on wood floors. The new RC-Series's look even better.
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Old 09-07-2006, 10:27 PM
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exactly! I believe, after some time, you will see more reviews and resultant popularity.

I'm guessing people are assuming due to much higher initial price point backwhen on the Connoisseur series people are assuming that they're basically getting the previous model of whatever today is the "Reference Connoisseur" series. And are equating the old Connoisseur to the current RC series.

While the new C-Series is an unclear position. Being price targeted as an entry level speaker. Sadly energy isn't clear enough about it themselves they vaguely stated that "sort of, kind of, maybe the new C-Series is better then the older Connoisseur series". So they themselves aren't playing a fair game. In addition there isn't any reviews of them that I can find. Which is a bit upsetting.
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Old 09-08-2006, 10:25 AM
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It is confusing.

No one carries the C series Energy near me in stock.

The whole idea of the new reference connoisseur line from the hi-fi store I spoke with was that it is the updated connoisseur line. Hence connoisseur ---> reference connoisseur.

Everyone has different tastes for listening. And as I said earlier, generally what I have read from people indicate that they like the old connoisseur more than the new c series. But that is only a generalization, and everyone has their own tastes.

WestCoastD provides some detailed input on how he likes the 2 channel critical listening output of the connoisseur series over the new C series. He also likes the new reference connoisseurs more than both.

And UHF magazine likes the old connoisseurs more than the new reference connoisseur.

And sigsegv0x0b likes the c series more than the old connoisseur.

All of these opinions are different.

I don't think anyone here has been bashing the C series. Just comparing and relating them, and the opinions are going to vary.

kw.............
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Old 09-08-2006, 12:34 PM
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It is confusing.

No one carries the C series Energy near me in stock.

Where you located? In the GTA area there are a few Energy dealers.

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The whole idea of the new reference connoisseur line from the hi-fi store I spoke with was that it is the updated connoisseur line. Hence connoisseur ---> reference connoisseur.

That might be true, but doesn't seem to be so according to confusing energy documentation.

Quote:
Everyone has different tastes for listening. And as I said earlier, generally what I have read from people indicate that they like the old connoisseur more than the new c series. But that is only a generalization, and everyone has their own tastes.

WestCoastD provides some detailed input on how he likes the 2 channel critical listening output of the connoisseur series over the new C series. He also likes the new reference connoisseurs more than both.

My problem is actually with C-3 specifically, I also was able to listen to C-1 and C-9 and both of those speakers are excellent, I did not A/B C-1 vs C-100 (which is it's basic 'decendant') But I recall C-1 sounded great, it might have been a tad harsh but overall I liked it a lot. As opposed to C-3 where I immedietly found characteristics I didn't like.

Quote:
And UHF magazine likes the old connoisseurs more than the new reference connoisseur.

It would be nice if they were to review the C-Series, but I guess that is far 2 low for their level

Quote:
And sigsegv0x0b likes the c series more than the old connoisseur.

This statement isn't accurate for I only have A/Bed C-100 vs C-3. And prefer C-100 to the C-3. I have had a lot of time listing to C-1 and C-9 and I can't recall them suffering same issues as the C-3. However I never A/Bed C-1 or C-9 against C-100.

Quote:
All of these opinions are different.

I don't think anyone here has been bashing the C series. Just comparing and relating them, and the opinions are going to vary.

kw.............

Well, yes, but to compare and relate them you first have to *listen* to them against something.
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Old 09-08-2006, 12:38 PM
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What is today's equivlant the C-9's that I have now? (if RC... which model)

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Old 09-08-2006, 01:15 PM
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I know of energy dealers, having bought energy speakers, but none with c series stock.

Western GTA

kw..........
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
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I know of energy dealers, having bought energy speakers, but none with c series stock.

Western GTA

kw..........

I'm in Richmond Hill.

BayBloor Radio carries Energy and has C-Series and RC-Series right beside each other. (And has them all in stock). So if you're in the downtown core drop by Baybloor if you wunna listen to C-Series or RC-Series. They all out on the showroom floor.
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:54 PM
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thx,

Never been to bbr, but knew about them and energy. I don't get down there much, but I'll check it out when I do.

kw.............
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Old 09-08-2006, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
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It is confusing.

Related or not, I honestly believe Energy (actually API Group Inc) has been, and is still, going through much in-house "dysfunction" since early this year, with Klipsch aquiring API and all. I think it has directly effected current product development & production plans. All during a time, co-incidentally, when their [new] China manufacturing operation has been launched.

http://www.klipsch.com/news-center/p...rnational.aspx

For example, I noticed the release of the EnergyPro line became sort of non-existent all of a sudden. Bryston, the official EnergyPro dealer/partner, used to have an EnergyPro web-page included on their site which has been removed. Although API still claims Bryston will be their "official" EnergyPro dealer. The EnergyPro line shares some of the form-factor from the new C-Series line, however, fitted with higher-end (kevlar) drivers, with many being active systems. They should be interesting.

Also, I noticed the new RC-Sub series has been slow to hit the show-rooms, although, I believe one model is now available (RC-Sub10 ?).

I'm sensing there are some communications issues going on, maybe the result of management being shuffled around?

Just keep an eye on Energy's web-site over the next month or so and check to see if there are any product "news" announcement's. Energy, like many other companies, very consistently, almost alway's has new product announcements/enhancements around fall.

Hope Klipsch does'nt ruin a good thing.
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Old 09-08-2006, 08:13 PM
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Usually companies undergoing acquisition talks try to pretty up the balance sheet by pushing out projects that will cost a lot to introduce.

They also tend to make a lot of vaporware announcements without delivering most of them anywhere near when they were announced to make the company's new product pipeline look better.

I think API has been doing both these things
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Old 09-10-2006, 07:42 AM
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Ok, I could use some help. I just picked up a pair of eXL-25s off of craigslist for $140, along with other stuff (yamaha receiver/cd player/banana plugs even monster speaker wire ) I would like to keep these, but need some bookshelves to pair with these. The criteria I am looking at is

I would like the bookshelves down to 50hz in the low end
Depth can be no more than 10inches
Prefer they match sonically as much as possible with the XL-25s
Cheap is always good.

These were manufactured in 1999 it looks like. I can wait for an older model to appear on Ebay at some point, if that is what it takes.

I wonder if there is a sister brand that would possible match up with these. Thanks in advance for any input I receive.
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Old 09-10-2006, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
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I just picked up a pair of eXL-25s
I would like the bookshelves down to 50hz in the low end
Depth can be no more than 10inches
Prefer they match sonically as much as possible with the XL-25s
Cheap is always good.

you can get [new] C-Series very cheap- ie. C-100's (play down to 50Hz), or C-200's (play down to 43Hz). Aluminum dome tweeters are somewhat similiar in design to the eXL's, and may provide close voice-matching.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabbit97 View Post

I wonder if there is a sister brand that would possible match up with these.

could'nt tell you, myself, about any known sister-brands, that are close sonic match. Otherwise, you can check for used product.
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Old 09-10-2006, 09:40 PM
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I posted this thread in the main forum, but I think it probably belongs here, so I'm moving the thread here.........
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I currently have the Energy Veritas V2.2 speakers. Feeling the need to upgrade as I felt I could could do with more low end oomph.

As I see it, there are 2 options:
a) stay with my V2.2 and add a sub woofer for the low end oomph.
b) upgrade to Energy Veritas V2.3

which is a better option ?
The sub will of course go lower then the V2.3, can't beat a 10" driver (sub) with a 6.5" woofer (V2.3). My only concern is how well the sub integrates with the the main speakers.
The V2.3 option will ensure a better integration of the low end with the rest of the audio range. But can I really hear the difference the extra woofer makes vis a vis the V2.2 ?
I listen mainly to pop and rock music and movies.

Caveat: budget does not permit upgrade to V2.3 and a sub woofer.
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Old 09-10-2006, 09:52 PM
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I am going to be purchasing speakers soon for my new HD system. Have been looking at quite a number of speakers (at least on the internet). The names that come up with good reviews are paradigm, revel and B&W. Of course these are more pricy than energy's listings. I will be getting a new 60 inch SXRD XBR2. My living room measures 12 x 18 and I will be using it for 75 % movies and 25% music. The reference Connoisseur RC-70 system got a great review on Ultimate AV. I was wondering though if I bought the veritas system would it be even better or am I just buying cosmetic changes with only slight audio improvements. By the way I am considering either the Pioneer elite vsx-84txsi or the new Yamaha rx-v2700 av due out this month. Of couse I will get the 12 inch sub should i get this system. Any thoughts???
Thanks in advance for your time and consideration.
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