Energy Owners Thread - Page 254 - AVS Forum
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post #7591 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 03:00 AM
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Nice setups, man I can't wait. Yea, I love the look of the marantz, the 6003 is even hotter, it doesn't have all the buttons and front inputs out there, they are behind a cover, but since this is in my cabinet and nobody will see it most of the time, not to mention the extra 150 bucks, I went with the 5003. Here's somebody's pic from the marantz owners...

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post #7592 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 03:26 AM
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I'm really starting to like my kefs, as they're starting to break in the sound better. These things walk all over my energies as far as music goes. I never really was happy with the energies for music. For home theater, it's close as they're simply different sounds. The energy speakers will engulf you in depth but lack detail, but the kefs have extreme clarity, and detail but lack down depth. Maybe if I play with the sub a bit more, I can get better fepth out of the kefs.

These kefs get really LOUD too, especially for their size. I'd imagine the kefs would be able to fill a room better than the c-300s.

The kefs are also more forgiving with seating position. It still sounds good even when I'm not in the primary listening position.

Having a decent subwoofer is very important with the kefs. With my c-300s, I could actually go without a subwoofer altogether, and it would still sound decent.
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post #7593 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L54 View Post

Kind of nervous because I never got to listen before purchasing (only real option for auditioning electronics is Best Buy), but based on this thread and the prices I purchased a c-c100, 2 pairs of c100, and a pair of c300s.

I now have a couple of newb questions.
1) I have some 18 gauge speaker wire, and according to the roger russell chart my span should be ok (less than 32 feet), would I notice a difference if I bought something bigger? (from monoprice of course)
2) In my current entertainment center the center speaker will be a tight fit, will that matter?
3) Any advise for some speaker mounts that would let me mount the c100's one foot from the wall facing 90 degrees away?
4) Can I use an old mini hifi sony player (sony MHC-310AV) to break in my speakers while I choose a receiver (at reasonable volumes of course)? Its current speakers are 8 ohm. Will it hurt the speakers or the system?

Thanks for helping me out.

This thread has been good, expensive but good!

Anyone?
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post #7594 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 07:27 AM
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1) Probably won't notice a difference, but... My span is less than 32 feet. I was coming off some cheap HTIB speaker wire. After upgrading my speakers I purchased 12 gauge speaker wire. I think it helps, but since I am using new speakers I am unsure if the wire is helping to contribute to the improved sound. But I was able to get 100' of quality 12 gauge speaker wire for $10. Being this cheap I couldn't afford to not upgrade my speaker wire. And it probably does help to some extent even in shorter <30' distances.
2) I don't know and don't want to give you some BS answer. I would try listening to the C-C100 out of the cabinet at the same height and distance level with my eyes closed and then again inside the cabinet to see if you notice any difference.
3) Again, I can't help you as I don't use speaker mounts, but I would think that there would be something out there that would work.
4)This will not hurt the speakers.
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post #7595 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tweaver1 View Post

Not sure were that came from... got it as a house warming gift some 25 years ago..when I had my Big Cerwin Vega's speakers

Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

I want the framed art above your tv. Where did you get that if you don't mind me asking?

It's the old Memorex add... Very famous pic

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...rexAdPhoto.jpg
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post #7596 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 09:26 AM
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You can get the Memorex 'Blown Away' poster here: http://search.posterunlimited.com/se...FQEoGgodjywbbQ
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post #7597 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 10:04 AM
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guys would it be weird to have a cc100 center, but with c50s around?

just a question...don't look too deep into it lol
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post #7598 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 10:06 AM
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no (deep enough? )

if HT is your main priority having a bigger center channel with smaller satellites is a perfectly fine route...

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post #7599 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 11:50 AM
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My C-C100 just arrived at my work. Guess I'll be going home for lunch to hook it up!

Afro GT
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post #7600 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

I want the framed art above your tv. Where did you get that if you don't mind me asking?



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post #7601 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 01:08 PM
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Lol, nice!

My bookshelves arrived, gotta track my center channel...I might have to call into work...:P

Edit: It just hit toledo @ 318pm, so it will be here tomorrow! Aw crap, Wed. is Faith Weavers for my wife and two eldest, definitely won't be able to wire up everything with the little one running around like a crazy person <3. Still waiting on my sub cable too. Ah well, won't be too long now folks
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post #7602 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

I'm really starting to like my kefs, as they're starting to break in the sound better. These things walk all over my energies as far as music goes. I never really was happy with the energies for music. For home theater, it's close as they're simply different sounds. The energy speakers will engulf you in depth but lack detail, but the kefs have extreme clarity, and detail but lack down depth. Maybe if I play with the sub a bit more, I can get better fepth out of the kefs.

These kefs get really LOUD too, especially for their size. I'd imagine the kefs would be able to fill a room better than the c-300s.

The kefs are also more forgiving with seating position. It still sounds good even when I'm not in the primary listening position.

Having a decent subwoofer is very important with the kefs. With my c-300s, I could actually go without a subwoofer altogether, and it would still sound decent.

A friend just got some older reconditioned Kef's to audition at home. I told him I thought they were very "musical speakers." His, though, are mini-towers and have a really unusual woofer design. They can go pretty deep. I've heard several Kef models, and I've always thought they sounded great with music.

Joe Clark

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post #7603 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by mouettus View Post




Put a scarf on a person in the computer chair and you could recreate that poster, or give him a concussion.

Joe Clark

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post #7604 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 03:31 PM
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Went home for lunch and connected my C-C100. Man, that's a big azz speaker! Bigger than the Athena AS-C1 it replaced. At least I now have a box in which to store the Athena until I sell it along with my AS-B2 and B1 bookshelfs.

Since it was lunchtime I only tried it quicky with an XM station thru my DirecTV receiver. Sounds nice and clear in 5 channel stereo, also turned to ESPN and demoed using Logic 7 and Dolby PLIIx. It'll be a while until I fully break it in but the initial impression is two thumbs up! I'm using the included port ports since my center is on a shelf next to the wall.

For the $280 I spent for the center and 4 C-100s, this is a pretty impressive setup. Pairing them with a used Energy e:XL-s10 sub I purchased off ebay for cheap a couple years ago.

I'm pretty happy and the system isn't calibrated yet. I'll break out the SPL meter in a few days.

If you guys are wavering between a C-C100 and C-50 and have room for the big center, definitely get it! $113 is a great price from buy.com.

Afro GT
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post #7605 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottns View Post

It's the old Memorex add... Very famous pic

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...rexAdPhoto.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by michdanderson View Post

You can get the Memorex 'Blown Away' poster here: http://search.posterunlimited.com/se...FQEoGgodjywbbQ


Thanks guys... I'm going to get one along with a thx, dolby tru hd, and dts hd master plaque for my theater room
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post #7606 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottns View Post

It's the old Memorex add... Very famous pic

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...rexAdPhoto.jpg


Actually its Maxell, not Memorex. You can clearly see that on the framed picture above the couch.

Afro GT
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post #7607 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post

A friend just got some older reconditioned Kef's to audition at home. I told him I thought they were very "musical speakers." His, though, are mini-towers and have a really unusual woofer design. They can go pretty deep. I've heard several Kef models, and I've always thought they sounded great with music.

The woofer looks a bit weird with the tweeter smack in the middle of the woofer. It definately is different.
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post #7608 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

I'm really starting to like my kefs, as they're starting to break in the sound better. These things walk all over my energies as far as music goes. I never really was happy with the energies for music. For home theater, it's close as they're simply different sounds. The energy speakers will engulf you in depth but lack detail, but the kefs have extreme clarity, and detail but lack down depth. Maybe if I play with the sub a bit more, I can get better fepth out of the kefs.

These kefs get really LOUD too, especially for their size. I'd imagine the kefs would be able to fill a room better than the c-300s.

The kefs are also more forgiving with seating position. It still sounds good even when I'm not in the primary listening position.

Having a decent subwoofer is very important with the kefs. With my c-300s, I could actually go without a subwoofer altogether, and it would still sound decent.


Wasn't the KEF system altogether a good $300-400 more than the energy system was? I have to wonder how much I'm missing with music as my C-300s really bring some acoustic jazz to life (maybe my room is just small).
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post #7609 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ProjectEF View Post

Wasn't the KEF system altogether a good $300-400 more than the energy system was? I have to wonder how much I'm missing with music as my C-300s really bring some acoustic jazz to life (maybe my room is just small).

The kef system costs around that much more which is why I'm thinking these are better compared to the RC line. The kefs are significantly better in all types of music but more so with instrumental, acoustic, and vocals. Which I guess acoustic jazz would fall into that category. The higher range of the c-300s sound tinny, and rough compared to the kefs. The kefs are much more detailed in the mid-range, and higher end. When it comes to music, the kefs are in a whole other league. With simply home theater, I think you'd be happy with both. SACDs, and DVD-A sound very good on the kefs.


I'll break down the prices for what I paid for both systems.

Kef:

2 x Iq5 towers -$400
2 x Iq1 surrounds- $230
1 x Iq6c center- $450

Total: $1080

You could probably get away with the Iq2c center instead of the iq6c which is only $100 shipped which would bring the total to $730.

Energy:

2 x c-300 towers - $250
2 x c-50 surrounds-$100
1 x c-c100 center- $170

Total: $520

The c-c100 could be had for about 60 bucks cheaper from buy.com which would bring the total to about $460.

I would also like to point out that the iq1s are fairly big, and heavy bookshelves, and are probably more comparable to the c-100s in size. Although, the iq1s are probably heavier than the c-100s.

I used a pa-120 sub with both setups.
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post #7610 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 05:48 PM
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Its been a while since I could enjoy music, TV, and the like. Now that the kiddies are teens I can get back into an old passion. I have been upgrading slowly so that wife doesn't get overwhelmed by the costs involved. A year and a half ago upgraded my reciever from an old Denon purchased 1982 ish to a AVR3808. A year later the TV from an old 32" POS to a Pioneer 6020, me likey very much! My old Pioneer HPM60 from 1980 are now on their way out which brings me to this thread.

I have just purchased, have not yet recieved, a set of new Veritas 2.2i and the center 2.0ci. Will i like these? More than likely I will be with these for the next decade, that's when they will be paid off! Not sure what I'm going to do about surrounds yet, not a major concern at this time. Please tell me I wasn't to impulsive.

After a little reading I hear that bi-amping is the way to go. After reading the maunal I see that if i do that I will lose my Zone 2 on my AVR. I was hoping to use that zone for outdoor speakers. Will it make that much of a difference without bi-amping? I guess I could always use the old Denon as a dedicated outdoor amp.
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post #7611 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post

Put a scarf on a person in the computer chair and you could recreate that poster, or give him a concussion.

HAHAHA That would be FUNNY as hell! lolllll
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post #7612 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by midlifer View Post

Its been a while since I could enjoy music, TV, and the like. Now that the kiddies are teens I can get back into an old passion. I have been upgrading slowly so that wife doesn't get overwhelmed by the costs involved. A year and a half ago upgraded my reciever from an old Denon purchased 1982 ish to a AVR3808. A year later the TV from an old 32" POS to a Pioneer 6020, me likey very much! My old Pioneer HPM60 from 1980 are now on their way out which brings me to this thread.

I have just purchased, have not yet recieved, a set of new Veritas 2.2i and the center 2.0ci. Will i like these? More than likely I will be with these for the next decade, that's when they will be paid off! Not sure what I'm going to do about surrounds yet, not a major concern at this time. Please tell me I wasn't to impulsive.

After a little reading I hear that bi-amping is the way to go. After reading the maunal I see that if i do that I will lose my Zone 2 on my AVR. I was hoping to use that zone for outdoor speakers. Will it make that much of a difference without bi-amping? I guess I could always use the old Denon as a dedicated outdoor amp.

Welcome back from the real world, midlifer. You deserve a break.

The Veritas talk has been very light around here. Those owners are going to have to step up to address your questions with some authority. I know the Veritas speakers need more power than the other Energy lines, but I can tell you that my Denon 3808 is in love with my Energy RCs. They make beautiful music together every day. If the passion people around here have for Energy is any indicator, you're going to be very happy with your purchase.

You may want to be ready with information on your listening environment - type and size of room, etc - and your listening preferences. That'll help with advice on placement, bi-amping and such.

Joe Clark

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post #7613 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 07:24 PM
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I have no doubt you will be delighted by the Veritas!! I wish I could afford them for myself! The Veritas are incredibly well reviewed and you will probably be blown away by their transparency and smooth sound. Did you get them at Audio Advisor? Because that is a really killer deal for an authorized setup with full warranty...

The 3808CI has ample power and (as we just discussed not a couple of days ago) "receiver bi-amping" is not REAL bi-amping and is unlikely to provide anything more than the slightest of benefits.

I suggest you don't even worry about bi-amping and, if you decide later on you want additional power as an investment in the system, just add a powerful external amp and use the pre-outs of the 3808CI. For a true upgrade a powerful external amp will beat the pants off of receiver bi-amping every time. But cross that bridge when you get to it no need to worry about problems that don't exist yet.

FYI -- you can also run zone 2 and 3 using a separate external amplifier via the zone2/3 pre-outs, so even if you have 7.1 in the main zone that doesn't cost you zone 2/3 function. It only means you need to grab a simple 2-channel amp for the other zones, or you can repurpose the old Denon just for amplification / volume control duties.

So Kpt Krunch and other Veritas owners, time for you to jump in and welcome our new friend

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post #7614 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
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Just curious, are you using the port plugs for the RC-10s on the desktop?

I recently got a pair for my pc after liking the first pair so much in my bedroom setup. They are only 2-3" out from the wall, so I'm using the port plugs. The integrated amp I'm using (TCA Gizmo) has a built in 100Hz crossver, so I'm assuming the RC-10's can handle this no problem with the port plugged.

From the pic, it looks like you may have some more clearance behind them, so the plugs may not be necessary in your case.
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post #7615 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post

So Kpt Krunch and other Veritas owners, time for you to jump in and welcome our new friend

LOL - yes it is. Congrats midlifer, some very very nice speakers you got yourself there!!!!

I'm running mine right now with an h/k PA2000 amp (100 watts / channel but has been measured as high as 180 watts) and it sounds really nice. I also use them from time to time with my 60 watt / channel tube amp. The Veritas really lets the sweet tube sound through

They do like power as they are not as sensitive as some of the other Energy speakers. However, that being said, it doesn't matter what speaker brand you put here, if it's a good speaker, it will always sound better with more power. The trick is how it sounds when it doesn't get a lot of power, and the Veritas sounds great no matter what you feed it.

So, keep that in mind, I don't think you'll need to "bi-amp" this speaker to make it sing. You'll get a little more power to it but if you need that second zone for another application (sounds like you do) you'd get far more benefit from that then would from using the second zone to "bi-amp" the Veritas.

Taken from the Veritas Manual - this is their recommendation for "Bi-Amping " btw:

"This connection system involves the use of two separate
amplifiers to power one set of speakers. The idea is to
have one stereo amplifier connected to one speaker, and
another identical amplifier powering the second speaker.
This is often referred to as Vertical Bi-amplification. It is
the only method ENERGY® recommends."


Don't forget, the 86 decibel rating is 86 decibel using ONE watt of power, it would be two watts at 89db's, 4 for 92db's, 8 for 95, 16 for 98, ... 64 watts for 104 db's and 128 watts for 107 db's.

Somehow midifier, I don't think you'll be listening to them in the 100db range (though I could be wrong ). I'm sure your Denon will be able to power your Veritas just fine using just the dedicated channels

"it's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it"
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post #7616 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Kpt_Krunch View Post

LOL - yes it is. Congrats midlifer, some very very nice speakers you got yourself there!!!!

I'm running mine right now with an h/k PA2000 amp (100 watts / channel but has been measured as high as 180 watts) and it sounds really nice. I also use them from time to time with my 60 watt / channel tube amp. The Veritas really lets the sweet tube sound through

They do like power as they are not as sensitive as some of the other Energy speakers. However, that being said, it doesn't matter what speaker brand you put here, if it's a good speaker, it will always sound better with more power. The trick is how it sounds when it doesn't get a lot of power, and the Veritas sounds great no matter what you feed it.

So, keep that in mind, I don't think you'll need to "bi-amp" this speaker to make it sing. You'll get a little more power to it but if you need that second zone for another application (sounds like you do) you'd get far more benefit from that then would from using the second zone to "bi-amp" the Veritas.

Taken from the Veritas Manual - this is their recommendation for "Bi-Amping " btw:

"This connection system involves the use of two separate
amplifiers to power one set of speakers. The idea is to
have one stereo amplifier connected to one speaker, and
another identical amplifier powering the second speaker.
This is often referred to as Vertical Bi-amplification. It is
the only method ENERGY® recommends."


Don't forget, the 86 decibel rating is 86 decibel using ONE watt of power, it would be two watts at 89db's, 4 for 92db's, 8 for 95, 16 for 98, ... 64 watts for 104 db's and 128 watts for 107 db's.

Somehow midifier, I don't think you'll be listening to them in the 100db range (though I could be wrong ). I'm sure your Denon will be able to power your Veritas just fine using just the dedicated channels

Yeah but thats just a very general rule. If he turns the volume up to make them sing, he may encounter clipping. With any speaker with such low sensitivity, i would go separates. That Denon will THANK him for not putting it into such stress.
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post #7617 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by MameXP View Post

Yeah but thats just a very general rule. If he turns the volume up to make them sing, he may encounter clipping. With any speaker with such low sensitivity, i would go separates. That Denon will THANK him for not putting it into such stress.

Yes, of course you run the risk of clipping if you turn it up too loud. And in a cheaper receiver I'd agree 100%, but the 3808 is a pretty robust receiver rated at 130 watts/ channel all channels driven which isn't bad at all. Like I said, I drive mine with a 100 watt/channel amp (the H/K which is also high current and very underrated) and I've never had a problem driving the Veritas with it (nor my RC-70's but the 70's are more sensitive). And I've had it well over 100 db's (mostly movies - music as loud as I go is around 93 or 94 decibels - albeit at my listening position which is more like 15 feet away as opposed to 3 feet as the measurements are done - so from 3 feet we're probably running over 100db's as well) and no clipping.

As long as the amp can supply the power required by the speakers, there should be no problem. and 107 db's, even at 3 feet, is pretty loud.

But if you're going to run your speakers that loud all the time and for long periods, I'd definitely agree there and get a separate amp. And maybe midilifer might need it with his teenagers

"it's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it"
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post #7618 of 52337 Old 03-10-2009, 10:27 PM
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This Post is dedicated to all of the fine individuals, that have spend time, effort and sole, to this forum.

This is for

SoundoMind
Jdssootheie
And special appreciation for all that this Man has done… batpig, thankyou!
And all of the others that should receive praise too, but have not been listed.

3 months ago, I decided it was time to upgrade from a 2.0 Stereo system to HT to match my 46” LCD 1080P Sony bought 16 months ago.

I knew it was going to be an expensive upgrade, plus, I lacked the knowledge.

First, the wealth of info here (AVS Forums) has surpassed any Web site, Hands down! That is how I decided on my Sony 46 1080P LCD TV 16 months ago, and I cannot be happier!!

I started on this Audio quest 3 months ago, and have made the following venture.

Bought the Energy Classic Take 5.1 and was planning on the Yamaha 663 with the decoders for True Dolby and DTS Master Audio.

Beginning (Early Jan 2009):

1) Energy Classic Take 5.1 (Bought)
2) Yamaha 663 (not Bought)

System as of now (March 2009):

1) Fronts Energy C300’s (WW) $250
2) Center Energy C-C50 (WW) $80
3) Side Surrounds C100’s (Vans) $120
4) Back Surrounds (not bought, but looking for the C-50s for $80, any ideas???? I know about the $100 from WW).
5) Sub – ESW-8 (but I have to sell it, for I am selling the Energy Take Classic 5.1 package as new, and it is, all never used). I hope to sell it for $225, half of what I paid for from HHGREGG at $444 back in Jan.
6) AND YES, YES, YES>>>> As your guys like to say.. I pulled the “Trigger” on the Denon 1909 from 6Ave tonight, the discounted price!

I love you guys (and Girls too who post too,, sorry), for making a Decent 1st Time HT system at minimal cost! And for all the educating I needed.

This Includes MonoPrice for cables, speaker wire, and Cooler Guys for Cooling Fans, 12VDC PS, and wiring harnesses). It was a major jump in technology for me to tackle (2.0 to 7.1). But you did it! Thank you, Thank you!


Now please understand something here, I Thank you.

Buttttttttttttttt! My Bank Accounts does not like you at all (lol)!

Yet, with the C series closing out, I could not pass on this, for this is a system that I will be very happy owning for the next 10 years+.

Last, any ideas on selling the Classic Take 5? I am going to start with Craigslist, and yes Ebay is an option. But since I have never sold anything on Ebay, I think I will have a very difficult time convincing a buyer on the Classis for $225. Any ideas outside of Craigslists add Ebay?

Last……

Everyone here has is some way, contributed, to a buying decision, that I could have never done 10 years ago alone, and I thank Each and Every One of You!

You are the Best!!!

Sometimes, Less is More...
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post #7619 of 52337 Old 03-11-2009, 06:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L54 View Post

Kind of nervous because I never got to listen before purchasing (only real option for auditioning electronics is Best Buy), but based on this thread and the prices I purchased a c-c100, 2 pairs of c100, and a pair of c300s.

I now have a couple of newb questions.
1) I have some 18 gauge speaker wire, and according to the roger russell chart my span should be ok (less than 32 feet), would I notice a difference if I bought something bigger? (from monoprice of course)
2) In my current entertainment center the center speaker will be a tight fit, will that matter?
3) Any advise for some speaker mounts that would let me mount the c100's one foot from the wall facing 90 degrees away?
4) Can I use an old mini hifi sony player (sony MHC-310AV) to break in my speakers while I choose a receiver (at reasonable volumes of course)? Its current speakers are 8 ohm. Will it hurt the speakers or the system?

Thanks for helping me out.

This thread has been good, expensive but good!

3) I had to mount my speakers on the sidewall of my room instead of the front wall which required me to turn my speakers quite a bit (not 90 degrees though). I bought the omnimount mounts, but they didn't turn enough because the speaker would hit the wall. I bought a threaded rod and a coupler from Home Depot to extend the mount rod enough to turn the speaker to where I wanted it. Someone also suggested using Loctite to be safe. I believe I went about 8 inches from the wall. I don't know if you really need it to extend a whole foot. I don't know if I'd extend mine much more than I already did.
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post #7620 of 52337 Old 03-11-2009, 06:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post


I used a pa-120 sub with both setups.

I recently ordered the PA-120 but it won't be shipping for another couple of weeks. What do you think of your PA-120?
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