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Speakers > Energy Owners Thread
Rebellion's Avatar Rebellion 10:02 PM 08-12-2007
Hey guys, I'm considering to pick up Energy RC-70's with RC-LCR and two RC-10's for surrounds with a Energy S12.3. Anyway, it will be a 5.1 System. On a side note, I have a Yamaha RX-V2700 Receiver and is capable of bi amping at the expense of the rear surrounds for a 7.1 system. So Until I can afford a Good dedicated 2 Channel Amp. Would Bi-Amping the front speakers with my receiver help give it a more full sound? Just to let you guys know, the Yamaha is a 140W X 7. Or am I completely misunderstanding the concept of bi-amping?

Any help in clarification would be much appreciated.

WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 02:05 AM 08-13-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by kojo39 View Post

this is what I have speaker wise
- one pair of rc 70s for the fronts
- two pairs of RC 10s for surround and surround back
- one rc-lcr for the centre
- one 12 inch Velodyne Subwoofer (DSP-12B)

excellent speaker-set.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kojo39 View Post

I'm looking at either the onkyo 805,875 the denon 3808 or the yamaha RX-V3800.

I would get the RX-V3800, you'll be very happy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kojo39 View Post

In terms of hooking everything up, should I bi-wire everything? I can't do bi-amping because it would be too much money and I am not sure if its good enough to wire directly to the bottom set of jacks on the speaker. how do you guys have your stuff wired?

I would just connect all speakers in a conventional manner. Read the Energy RC-Series manual on proper speaker connections/set-up.

This system configuration will work very well in general (ie. 2-channel and multi-channel music, DVD-Movies, digital-cable broadcast's, gaming, etc.,...). If you want more refined 2-channel music capability I would add a separate 2-channel amp (200W to 300W per/chan).
WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 02:11 AM 08-13-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebellion View Post

Hey guys, I'm considering to pick up Energy RC-70's with RC-LCR and two RC-10's for surrounds with a Energy S12.3. It will be a 5.1 System. I have a Yamaha RX-V2700 Receiver.

This system configuration will work very well in general (ie. 2-channel and multi-channel music, DVD-Movies, digital-cable broadcast's, gaming, etc.,...).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebellion View Post

Would Bi-Amping the front speakers with my receiver help give it a more full sound?

You can try it and see what you think. I've experimented with it in the past (with an RX-V1600), thought it made some difference. However a separate amp is the way to go (200W to 300W per/chan).
Alex solomon's Avatar Alex solomon 07:09 AM 08-13-2007
I have the Onkyo 805, a Rotel 100 x 5 multichannel amp and the RC-30. Let me tell you before you shell out your money...I heard no difference, I mean none!!, using the Onkyo 805 by itself vs. running the fronts with the Rotel amp. Another AVser who I met up with yesterday, sold off his statement D1/amp combo after he got his 805. I will take the time read the 805 thread.
kojo39's Avatar kojo39 09:09 AM 08-13-2007
Thanks westcoast I was leaning more towards that amp, I generally find people love the sound of yamaha. I'll take your advice in wiring everything up, the manual says wire everything to the bottom set of speaker jacks. just one last question provided I wire my system like that and do the proper break in period of 100 hours; will the speakers sound good at loud volumes? I know I should be fine for the centre and the rears because their recommened rms power is 140, 150 watts. but my rc 70 is around 250 watts and all the recievers in my price range including the yamaha are only putting out 140. will that 110 watt difference make a difference in terms of performance? I listen to my stuff loud and I don't want these speakers cutting out or even blowing for that matter. if this important to know I'll never listen to anything in stereo sound, and music for that matter.
Joseph Clark's Avatar Joseph Clark 10:19 AM 08-13-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex solomon View Post

I have the Onkyo 805, a Rotel 100 x 5 multichannel amp and the RC-30. Let me tell you before you shell out your money...I heard no difference, I mean none!!, using the Onkyo 805 by itself vs. running the fronts with the Rotel amp. Another AVser who I met up with yesterday, sold off his statement D1/amp combo after he got his 805. I will take the time read the 805 thread.

I'm interested in the Onkyo 875 (2 HDMI outputs, 4 in), but I've had a couple of Denon receivers whose sound I've loved (3801, 3805). Because of space concerns, I have 3 RC-LCR's (and 4 RC-R's). I know the Onkyo will handle my power needs, but I'm curious about the sound compared to the Denon's. Interesting to hear about your experience with the 805. Does anyone know where I might hear, say, a Denon 4308 and an Onkyo 875 together?
WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 12:27 PM 08-13-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by kojo39 View Post

I'll take your advice in wiring everything up, the manual says wire everything to the bottom set of speaker jacks.

that's fine, just make sure the shorting bars are installed (they should be already out-of-the-box).

Quote:
Originally Posted by kojo39 View Post

will the speakers sound good at loud volumes? all the recievers in my price range including the yamaha are only putting out 140

yeah, for home theater operation these speakers should be just fine with the RX-V3800, you should be able to safely turn volume up to moderate, or high levels, with good clean response (depending on your room size as well). However, as I mentioned, a separate amp for your RC-70 front's will work nicer, more efficiently. Will provide that extra head-room, yielding better dynamic range (and articulation) at lower level's.
batpig's Avatar batpig 01:16 PM 08-13-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by eecubed View Post

The e series were sold in the early 90's and predated the popularity of the Internet. That's why you don't see too many reference on them. They were replaced by the e:XL series which were replaced by the C series. The 4.1e were around $700-800 back then.

I don't know how the 4.1e compares to the C-2. They have really decent frequency response (around 35-20000Hz) though.

Thank you for the response.

Anybody else have any thoughts on the old e-series speakers? I see 2.1e and 4.1e for sale used every now and then. I'm curious what folks who used to own these think of the audio quality.

Also, question on the Pro series, another model that has limited online coverage. I see a pro 2.5 for sale online. When did the Pro series exist and how do they stack up?

Thanks in advance!
ripg0810's Avatar ripg0810 10:05 PM 08-14-2007
I need to get a center and was considering the RC-LCR or the Veritas center. Will the Veritas center be a good match for the RC-30's? I can get both for about the same price. Thanks.
WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 11:24 PM 08-14-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by ripg0810 View Post

I need to get a center and was considering the RC-LCR or the Veritas center. Will the Veritas center be a good match for the RC-30's? I can get both for about the same price.

I would get the RC-LCR it's a very well designed and performing piece. It is exactly matched to RC-Series line. Moreover, it is a true 3-way design.
ripg0810's Avatar ripg0810 11:30 PM 08-14-2007
Thank you westcoastd. I can find the LCR in black on the net for about half msrp but only in black. This may be okay since it will sit on the tv(my 30's are the rosenut)
ripg0810's Avatar ripg0810 11:44 PM 08-14-2007
WestCoastD, can you recommend an amplifier for my set-up. 30's front, LCr center and 10's rear.
WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 01:55 AM 08-15-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by ripg0810 View Post

WestCoastD, can you recommend an amplifier for my set-up. 30's front, LCr center and 10's rear.

what are you using as a processor? a receiver? or a separate processor?

I prefer to use a solid-state multi-channel amp (ie. 5 to 7 channel, 150W per/chan minimum), for example- Rotel RMB-1095, NAD M25, Adcom GFA-7705 or GFA-7707, Outlaw 7500 or 7700, Parasound A-51, Emotiva MPS-1, Sunfire TGA-5200 or TGA-7200, etc.,...
CFP's Avatar CFP 08:50 AM 08-15-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwtoxman View Post

Parasound Halo gear is very good. I'm not big on integrated amps for music. The best sound I have gotten so far from my veritas mains is from a tube preamp with a SS amp. I haven't tried a tube amp yet, and probably won't for a long time. I use a SimAudio W-5 amp.

I am part of an audiophile group that hosts members monthly in personal systems. I have heard a lot of gear now, and some very nice and very expensive systems. It has been interesting to see that system synergy is very important.

It is also very interesting being able to do this. Each system on its own obviously tends to sound quite good, but the experience of carefully listening to multiple systems with different gear (with the same music for comparison) has really opened my eyes (ears ) up to the differences in sound quality.

FWIW I recently heard a very expensive system with Bel Canto e.One Reference 1000 Mono's. It was an all digital SS system using a very expensive Wadia cdp with volume control so no preamp. I did not find the overall sound to my preferences as well as many others. It was typical of my system when I was all SS gear. It played music well, but it was too analytical, straying to harshness and sibilance. If the cd was reference quality it was very nice, but if not (and most CD's aren't) it revealed the deficiencies in the recording very notably, resulting in the descriptions above. And the system seemed to be a little cold to me, not overly emotive with flesh to the music. I liken it to sounding like a recording, while a great system can make it sound live.

I have found a good tube preamp can alleviate the above issues, as well as increase the soundstage and improve imaging. Most people in our group use tube preamps in their systems. Some of those even switched from SS to tube pre's after listening to tube preamps in our group .

I'm not saying the Bel Canto's are bad or anything like that, but my experience demontrated to me (yet again) that many systems with all solid state (SS) gear are not optimal. And I wouldn't doubt that Class D gear can magnify the SS sound. This is going to be very speaker dependent, but many speakers will fall under this generalization. Certainly the Energy speakers do. For me the jury is still out on Class D amplification for audiophile music systems. I'll wait for the technology to improve.

Although in the minority, my friend who owns the bel canto system loves it, so obviously there is personal preference.
His System -
Hales Design Group - Concept Five Speakers
Wadia 581 CD Player
Bel Canto e.One Reference 1000 Mono Blocks
Transparent Music Link Balanced
X-Symphony Pure Silver Hybrid
Cardas Golden Power Cords


The veritas are very highly regarded by most people. If your looking for more info Soundstage has a good review on the 2.4i's. Consider them like the 2.2i but with better bass response. I also wrote a more detailed review of the sound of the veritas on audioreview.com. It is under the veritas 2.4i's.

Why do you want an integrated? I recommend separate preamp and amplifier. I have found that a preamp makes a huge difference to the sound of a system, more so than amplifier changes (at least in my system). I have found a preamp is very useful to tweak the sound of a system, a change can make a good system better, or the opposite.

kw..........


Curious, how do your Veritas stack up to the other speakers in your audiophile group? Any specific comparisons you'd like to share?
swestbom's Avatar swestbom 09:15 AM 08-15-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFP View Post

Curious, how do your Veritas stack up to the other speakers in your audiophile group? Any specific comparisons you'd like to share?

I have Veritas speakers as well (2.3s). Stay away from the 2.4i unless you are going to put a lot of space around it. They interact too much with a room in the lower frequencies because of the plethora of ports. I love my 2.3s for anything over 50 Hertz, they lose accuracy and output quickly below this, so do the 2.4s.

Also, CDs generally suck in the higher end period, they always have, mostly because of too high recording levels and the lack of dithering on early ones but the medium always sucked for anything with large dynamic swings (listen to a Mahler or Stravinsky symphony and it hurts your ears on CDs).

Tube preamps are a good way to smooth out CDs but you are using them for their sound effects, not their accuracy. Get a good SACD player and you will hear an obvious difference, no tubes needed with SACDs using DSD mastering. The sad things is there are not nearly enough good SACDs out there, plenty of Mahler and Stravinsky though. If you like classical music these will blow you away.
ed_robyn's Avatar ed_robyn 04:34 PM 08-19-2007
Does anyonw know where I can get the wall mounting brackets for the Take 2.2 speakers?
briankmonkey's Avatar briankmonkey 09:40 AM 08-29-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex solomon View Post

I have the Onkyo 805, a Rotel 100 x 5 multichannel amp and the RC-30. Let me tell you before you shell out your money...I heard no difference, I mean none!!, using the Onkyo 805 by itself vs. running the fronts with the Rotel amp. Another AVser who I met up with yesterday, sold off his statement D1/amp combo after he got his 805. I will take the time read the 805 thread.

Thanks for the input Alex, I'm now considering the 805 for my RC-30's and RC-10's as AVScience has a great price.

Anybody else have experience with the 805? Just curious how happy people are with it on Energy speakers and if their are any con's to know about as well. Will be used for blu-ray movies as well as music (very important).
crimsona's Avatar crimsona 03:00 PM 08-31-2007
Future Shop has 25% off all speakers (Energy being the biggest name they have) for the upcoming long weekend. Maybe decent for someone looking to pick something up. 25% off all receivers too.
Luap's Avatar Luap 08:58 PM 08-31-2007
Energy are selling for way less in the US than in Canada (some models are below the Canadian dealer cost). This should not be the case with a Canadian made product. Has anyone heard what is happening with Energy now that they are owned by Klipsch? Will the Veritas line still be made? Will older models still be supported with parts? Many of these Canadian companies have supported their products with parts for 15+ years. Is this the end for Energy in Canada?
crimsona's Avatar crimsona 09:22 PM 08-31-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luap View Post

Energy are selling for way less in the US than in Canada (some models are below the Canadian dealer cost). This should not be the case with a Canadian made product. Has anyone heard what is happening with Energy now that they are owned by Klipsch? Will the Veritas line still be made? Will older models still be supported with parts? Many of these Canadian companies have supported their products with parts for 15+ years. Is this the end for Energy in Canada?

Energy is a NEW vendor for FS... and they're pretty serious. Veritas, not so sure though. I don't think any of the speakers outside of the Veritas are made in Canada though - my RC-30 and S10.3 say made in China
Luap's Avatar Luap 09:24 AM 09-01-2007
I'm at a point where I would have only bothered with the Veritas line. The flagship model (2.4i or its successor) was a serious contendor for my next set of speakers. I don't mind so much if they make them in China, if the quality and long-term support are there, but if they give up on that level of product they will not get my business. Also, I won't buy a product that has a price differential between Canada and the US that is far greater than the difference in the value of the currency.
Joseph Clark's Avatar Joseph Clark 01:49 AM 09-02-2007
I want to upgrade from my Denon 3805 to an HDMI receiver. I haven't owned a Yamaha receiver since I bought a high end Dolby Surround unit (composite only, before s-video even). I loved that receiver, but since then I've owned Pioneer and, for the last few years, Denons. This may have been covered before, but I'd like to know about the auto EQ function in the new Yamahas and how it compares to Audyssey in the Onkyos and Denons. I have 3 RC-LCRs across the front and 4 RC-Rs as surrounds. I got the Energys at American here in St. Louis, and they have Yamaha, Denon and Onkyo, so I'll have a chance to audition receivers with my speakers. I'm looking for a receiver with 4 HDMI in and, if possible, 2 out. What should I be looking at in the Yamaha line?
WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 01:49 PM 09-02-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post

What should I be looking at in the Yamaha line?

I would go with the new RX-V3800, or the new flag-ship RX-Z11.

I've heard mostly very good things about Audyssey. You should check out the receiver/processor/amp's threads and read about the new Denon's and Onkyo's. There's also alot of excitement over the newly released Integra (Onkyo) 9.8 pre-pro which has Audyssey, if you would like to go with separates.

Actually I've pre-ordered one of the new, highly-anticipated, NAD T175 pre-pro's which has Audyssey as well. I hope to get it by end of september or october. Moreover there are also a line of new NAD reciever's, with Audyssey, that are sure to be popular (ie. T785, T775, T765).
http://nadelectronics.com/news/NADs-New-AV-Components

While I think the new Denon receivers are very nice (on paper) with all the neat features, I've become a little apprehensive with their quality/customer service lately (especially at the prices they charge nowadays). I have a fairly new, top-line, universal DVD player (DVD-3930CI) which has world-class video and audio quality, it has all but failed to work after approx. 4 months of use. Customer service has been flakey. At $1500.00 I would expect a lot more.
eightninesuited's Avatar eightninesuited 06:59 PM 09-02-2007
Can someone here clarify how to set the levels of the RC-R surrounds? I'm stumped. The manuals asks to subtract the distance or something and it's getting confusing.

Let's say I want to set the RC-R, 4 feet away, to the side from the listener's ear, what should I set it to? Dipole, bipole? Min, max?
Joseph Clark's Avatar Joseph Clark 01:43 AM 09-03-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

I would go with the new RX-V3800, or the new flag-ship RX-Z11.

I've heard mostly very good things about Audyssey. You should check out the receiver/processor/amp's threads and read about the new Denon's and Onkyo's. There's also alot of excitement over the newly released Integra (Onkyo) 9.8 pre-pro which has Audyssey, if you would like to go with separates.

Actually I've pre-ordered one of the new, highly-anticipated, NAD T175 pre-pro's which has Audyssey as well. I hope to get it by end of september or october. Moreover there are also a line of new NAD reciever's, with Audyssey, that are sure to be popular (ie. T785, T775, T765).
http://nadelectronics.com/news/NADs-New-AV-Components

While I think the new Denon receivers are very nice (on paper) with all the neat features, I've become a little apprehensive with their quality/customer service lately (especially at the prices they charge nowadays). I have a fairly new, top-line, universal DVD player (DVD-3930CI) which has world-class video and audio quality, it has all but failed to work after approx. 4 months of use. Customer service has been flakey. At $1500.00 I would expect a lot more.

Thanks. I've been skimming the Denon and Onkyo threads, but it's hard to keep up. On paper, the most interesting receiver is the Onkyo 905, with a really rich feature set. I checked out the specs for the Yamaha 3800 on their site. I hope to hear it soon at American. They're getting new receivers in now. I have a friend who has the Sony 5200ES, although he's driving only his RC-R's with its amps, and using separates for the fronts. He has some high end separates, and his system (paired with a Sony Pearl) sounds amazing.

Right now, I'm leaning toward the Onkyo 905, but I think I may have to move almost all my gear into the basement. One big slam against the latest Onkyo's is heat - apparently, there's lots of it with this beast. I think I could keep it really cool in the basement, along with my computers and video server, and simplify my equipment rack dramatically. I'm still going to try to do some A/B/C comparisons in a couple of weeks.
Joseph Clark's Avatar Joseph Clark 01:49 AM 09-03-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by eightninesuited View Post

Can someone here clarify how to set the levels of the RC-R surrounds? I'm stumped. The manuals asks to subtract the distance or something and it's getting confusing.

Let's say I want to set the RC-R, 4 feet away, to the side from the listener's ear, what should I set it to? Dipole, bipole? Min, max?

I followed the suggestions from Energy and set up my RC-R's as dipoles. It depends on your room configuration and how far the speakers will be from your listening positions. My seating positions and speaker positions were almost dead on for the recommended dipole settings. Check the manual again and measure the speaker distances from the seating. I had few options of where I could set mine up, but fortunately, it worked out well. Some folks prefer bipole, but I like the dipole settings for my room. Experiment.
markicanberry's Avatar markicanberry 06:24 PM 09-03-2007
I have the Audissy Series A3+2-1 mains and matching center, XLS-12 sub and a pair of RVSS-B-1 rears. This system totaly rocks. BUT I am about to get the new Denon AVR 4308ci 7.1 and need 4 rear speakers. I may be able to steal a pair of matching RVSS-B-1's that my friend has??? I have been loojking at the Vartas V2.ORI's And think 4 of them should do the trick?
cchitanu's Avatar cchitanu 05:45 PM 09-04-2007
I plan to buy the Energy C-500 speakers but I did not found too many reviews, I did like the sound more than the Polk Ri10 set but I am not sure I am making the right decision. Any light on this will be much appreciated ...

I am also considering to buy the C-C100 central speaker which is 100$ more than the C-C50. Is there a big difference between these two ?

Thanks again !
eightninesuited's Avatar eightninesuited 07:30 PM 09-04-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by cchitanu View Post

I plan to buy the Energy C-500 speakers but I did not found too many reviews, I did like the sound more than the Polk Ri10 set but I am not sure I am making the right decision. Any light on this will be much appreciated ...

I am also considering to buy the C-C100 central speaker which is 100$ more than the C-C50. Is there a big difference between these two ?

Thanks again !

If you listen to music, get the C-500s. Great speakers. If you want primarily for HT, then the RT-10 is not a bad choice at all. It's more brighter than Energys, but really excelsl at HT.
WestCoastD's Avatar WestCoastD 09:15 PM 09-04-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by cchitanu View Post

I plan to buy the Energy C-500 speakers but I did not found too many reviews, I did like the sound more than the Polk Ri10 set but I am not sure I am making the right decision. Any light on this will be much appreciated ...

I am also considering to buy the C-C100 central speaker which is 100$ more than the C-C50. Is there a big difference between these two ?

Are you referring to the RTi10 models (and not Ri10's)?
http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/products/rti10/

These are two very different speaker brand/models (that is, comparing the Energy C-Series to Polk RTi-series).

The Energy C-Series are good performing speakers for, both, music and home theater sources, especially for the price. The C-500 floorstanders, combined with a C-C100 center, and matching rears (C-R100's, C-50's, C100's, or C200's) will provide for a very nice, dynamic, surround system. The C-500's are very impressive sounding, with excellent range, explosive bass response. And I would definitely prefer the C-C100 over the C-C50, it has more range.

However, if you can afford it, and desire a more refined sound, especially for music, I would go with the Energy RC-Series line (ie. RC-30 or RC-50 fronts, RC-LCR center, RC-10 or RC-R rear's).
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