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post #3601 of 3613 Old 09-05-2014, 07:09 PM
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mkrzych: Well not sure if your going to like my results of listening today, another customer was looking at the Rubicon 2 along with me today and it was very ironic what the outcome was. We had a private listen room rigged up with very good room treatments and some decent Cary Audio gear and some high end cables, not sure on the brand as I couldn't make out the name on them. We had the Ikon 1 MKII and the Mentor 2 and Rubicon 2 and the source was a decent Parasound CD Player, and after about an hour of listening to specific tracks, the 3 people that were listening liked the Ikon 1 MK II over all because of the value we did not see why anyone would want to spend more when your getting about 95-98% of the sound quality out of the Ikon MK2 verses the Mentor 2 or Rubicon 2. I would say the Rubicon and the Ikon sounded very similar which was a bit shocking because the Rubicon doesn't have the extra ribbon tweeter. Now just for kicks after about an hour of listening we brought in another brand that sounded better yet. Since this is a Dali Thread, I will keep it as such and the other person that was listening to them, turned to me and told me not to sell them since I happen to own them as well. I personally came away a tad confused as I was expecting to be blown away by the other 2 speakers in comparison. Well, I ended up getting the Ikon 2 MKII since I wanted a tad bigger monitor and a bit more bass. They had these on loner to another person but I have heard them before and I liked them over the Ikon 1 but at the time thought these would do.

The Rubicon had a tad more clarity and a bit more soundstage, the Mentor 2's sounded excellent on some music but not so good on live music (Tad bright) the Ikon 1 we felt had the best balance of the bunch and the other now famous monitor bested them all. (Well at least to the 3 of us demoing them). In any regard all these speakers would be a fine catch for anyones listening room. Regardless all of these 4 speakers happen to scored a 5 out of 5 stars on WhatHiFi reviews which doesn't surprise me. I came away spending less, which is rare, but too my ears today the Ikon had me from the beginning out of the 3 and never lost the nicely blended balance on the different types of music we played. My opinion and 2 other people today.

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post #3602 of 3613 Old 09-06-2014, 01:41 AM
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mkrzych: Well not sure if your going to like my results of listening today, another customer was looking at the Rubicon 2 along with me today and it was very ironic what the outcome was. We had a private listen room rigged up with very good room treatments and some decent Cary Audio gear and some high end cables, not sure on the brand as I couldn't make out the name on them. We had the Ikon 1 MKII and the Mentor 2 and Rubicon 2 and the source was a decent Parasound CD Player, and after about an hour of listening to specific tracks, the 3 people that were listening liked the Ikon 1 MK II over all because of the value we did not see why anyone would want to spend more when your getting about 95-98% of the sound quality out of the Ikon MK2 verses the Mentor 2 or Rubicon 2. I would say the Rubicon and the Ikon sounded very similar which was a bit shocking because the Rubicon doesn't have the extra ribbon tweeter. Now just for kicks after about an hour of listening we brought in another brand that sounded better yet. Since this is a Dali Thread, I will keep it as such and the other person that was listening to them, turned to me and told me not to sell them since I happen to own them as well. I personally came away a tad confused as I was expecting to be blown away by the other 2 speakers in comparison. Well, I ended up getting the Ikon 2 MKII since I wanted a tad bigger monitor and a bit more bass. They had these on loner to another person but I have heard them before and I liked them over the Ikon 1 but at the time thought these would do.

The Rubicon had a tad more clarity and a bit more soundstage, the Mentor 2's sounded excellent on some music but not so good on live music (Tad bright) the Ikon 1 we felt had the best balance of the bunch and the other now famous monitor bested them all. (Well at least to the 3 of us demoing them). In any regard all these speakers would be a fine catch for anyones listening room. Regardless all of these 4 speakers happen to scored a 5 out of 5 stars on WhatHiFi reviews which doesn't surprise me. I came away spending less, which is rare, but too my ears today the Ikon had me from the beginning out of the 3 and never lost the nicely blended balance on the different types of music we played. My opinion and 2 other people today.
Garman: Thanks a lot for your feedback. Well, Mentor 2's are expensive in comparison to Ikon's, so it won't probably justify their cost vs. improvements - they are little bit bigger overall and than the bass goes down to 37Hz - what is enough to cover all the strings on double bass (the last one emitting wave around 40Hz).

I can't say so far, that Mentor 2's are bad speakers - I think they're excellent, but overpriced (I got mine with good discount) and their sound, like usually speaker's sound depends also on the character of electronics.

I am surprised too, that Rubicon did not impressed you so much, since they're placed by Dali as Mentor successor, but with much higher price. Have you found Mentor's despite the price bad speakers btw in your opinion?

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post #3603 of 3613 Old 09-06-2014, 10:33 AM
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mkrzych: I use to work at a high end dealer many years ago, and I use to do comparison testing of speakers using the same equipment/cables etc.. when things were slow, that was years ago before I got married. It's now just a fun hobby for me and at times I can get carried away with buying too much stuff... LOL

Now as I stated all of these speakers were great, all of them get great reviews out of the 4 speakers 3 where Dali and one was a KEF. All get 5 star ratings as they should because they all at times sound like a full range floor stander which is pretty amazing. To me out of the Dali the Ikon 1 MK II and Ikon 2 sounded the most balanced on all types of music. I did a listening session before when it was just the Ikon 1 and 2 and didn't have enough cash at the time so I bought the Ikon 1s, which I been very happy with over the last couple of months. During the hour plus listening we didn't have the Ikon 2 present as it was out as a loaner. I thought I was going to walk out of the store with the Rubicon's 2 or Mentor 2, but that didn't happen. The Mentor 2 sounded great on some music and slightly bright on live music and the Ikon 1 and Rubicon sounded very similar to the point that I couldn't justify the price difference, all the speakers were very good at their perspective price points and I can see why you like the Mentor.

Now that I have my speakers coming next week, I need to work on a music server or device so I can access my music better as I have a ton of CDs and want to be able to access them in high quality format for playback, I have a Mac Mini which I am thinking of using, but I am open to suggestions to anyone here. I hear Brystons new piece and Sony/Marantz have new units, but I was thinking of using Pure Music and my Mac Mini.
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post #3604 of 3613 Old 09-06-2014, 11:25 AM
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mkrzych: I use to work at a high end dealer many years ago, and I use to do comparison testing of speakers using the same equipment/cables etc.. when things were slow, that was years ago before I got married. It's now just a fun hobby for me and at times I can get carried away with buying too much stuff... LOL

Now as I stated all of these speakers were great, all of them get great reviews out of the 4 speakers 3 where Dali and one was a KEF. All get 5 star ratings as they should because they all at times sound like a full range floor stander which is pretty amazing. To me out of the Dali the Ikon 1 MK II and Ikon 2 sounded the most balanced on all types of music. I did a listening session before when it was just the Ikon 1 and 2 and didn't have enough cash at the time so I bought the Ikon 1s, which I been very happy with over the last couple of months. During the hour plus listening we didn't have the Ikon 2 present as it was out as a loaner. I thought I was going to walk out of the store with the Rubicon's 2 or Mentor 2, but that didn't happen. The Mentor 2 sounded great on some music and slightly bright on live music and the Ikon 1 and Rubicon sounded very similar to the point that I couldn't justify the price difference, all the speakers were very good at their perspective price points and I can see why you like the Mentor.

Now that I have my speakers coming next week, I need to work on a music server or device so I can access my music better as I have a ton of CDs and want to be able to access them in high quality format for playback, I have a Mac Mini which I am thinking of using, but I am open to suggestions to anyone here. I hear Brystons new piece and Sony/Marantz have new units, but I was thinking of using Pure Music and my Mac Mini.
Good luck, I highly recommend you to try Audirvana Plus on Mac OSX - major breaking upgrade is coming in a few days with version 2.0. Happy listening.

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post #3605 of 3613 Old 09-06-2014, 12:36 PM
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Good luck, I highly recommend you to try Audirvana Plus on Mac OSX - major breaking upgrade is coming in a few days with version 2.0. Happy listening.
Thanks all the dealers are trying to talk me into Digital devices that don't use a computer, saying the OS gets in the way. Go figure if they were selling computers I am sure they would say things differently!
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post #3606 of 3613 Old 09-07-2014, 07:18 AM
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Thanks all the dealers are trying to talk me into Digital devices that don't use a computer, saying the OS gets in the way. Go figure if they were selling computers I am sure they would say things differently!
Good to read your experiences Garman! How do you consider the KEF LS50 to Mentor 2/ Ikon / Rubicon 2?
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post #3607 of 3613 Old 09-07-2014, 01:43 PM
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Good to read your experiences Garman! How do you consider the KEF LS50 to Mentor 2/ Ikon / Rubicon 2?
Well, I don't want to step on anyones toes in this thread as I love Dali speakers and I will have the Ikon 2, hopefully this week. But out of the 3 Dali speakers we listened to and then the KEF, we were pleasantly surprised the LS50 sounded to our ears the best out of the bunch, but to be fair the Dali seemed to do better on all types of equipment where the LS50 sounded the best when you paired them with better electronics. Using a Rega 50wpc the Dali's sounded great and the KEF was so so, this is similar to the situation with Magnepan they just do better and can sound fantastic with the right type of electronics. This is almost why I sold the KEF's, I was using them with a decent Marantz 8005 Int. Amp in my office and thought they were ok, but when I paired them with my Musical Fidelity KW-500 Int. Amp I was blown away, my Ikon 2 seem to sound good with both systems. Regardless, you can't go wrong with any of these speakers, and it nice to hear great monitors for under 3K!

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post #3608 of 3613 Old 09-07-2014, 10:48 PM
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Dali bookshelves for 2 channel audio

Pardon me if this question on the two Dali models has already been asked on a long thread.
I have a Sonos Connect amp that does an honest 55wpc into 8 ohms and 100wpc into 4. It doesn't like speakers that go much below 4 for long, protection circuitry tends to kick in and it shuts down. Within the above limits it is as good a 2 channel amp as any. Music listening levels at 4 metres away are moderate to moderately loud - certainly never head banging ones. And I prefer decent controlled bass to bass that goes deep but challenges the room to be heard well. I also have a Sonos Sub that can take over bass duties with a crossover options from 50hz to 110 hz.
I am looking for modestly priced speakers for, for music, with the speakers to be placed on a long shelf that is about 60 cms deep to the wall behind.
I am looking at three options - the new B&W 685, Dali Zensor 3 and Dali ikon 1 mk 2.
Music tastes run to jazz and close miked acoustic vocals, world music and so on - mostly if not all, acoustic music. Indian classical too, which is similar to jazz in what speakers need to do for it to sound good.
Given the above, between the two Dali options which one would most suit?
And if there are any views on the B&W model, I would be happy to ask - which of the three options would be best suited?
Thanks in advance for any advice.
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post #3609 of 3613 Old 09-08-2014, 10:22 PM
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Kumar: As you know the Dali line I think is all 6 ohm, it's a toss up between the Ikon 1 MK2 and the Zensor 3 both very decent speakers and reasonably priced. The Sensitivity rating is a tad better on the Zensor so that might help when it comes to using the Sonos Connect. Both the Zensor 3 and Ikon 1 MK2 get top ratings in sound quality from many reviewers, but let you ears be the judge! I don't know much info on the B&W 685, but they make great speakers as well.
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post #3610 of 3613 Old 09-09-2014, 06:31 PM
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Thanks - in India the Zensor 3 is about half the price of the other two, so I am leaning towards that if it auditions well.
I know about the 6 ohm thing - what I haven't been able to find out is how much below 6 ohms it goes for frequencies above 80-90 hz. As long as it stays above 4 ohms, it should do fine from the Sonos Amp perspective, given the slightly higher sensitivity as well.
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post #3611 of 3613 Old 09-09-2014, 11:14 PM
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Well, I don't want to step on anyones toes in this thread as I love Dali speakers and I will have the Ikon 2, hopefully this week. But out of the 3 Dali speakers we listened to and then the KEF, we were pleasantly surprised the LS50 sounded to our ears the best out of the bunch, but to be fair the Dali seemed to do better on all types of equipment where the LS50 sounded the best when you paired them with better electronics. Using a Rega 50wpc the Dali's sounded great and the KEF was so so, this is similar to the situation with Magnepan they just do better and can sound fantastic with the right type of electronics. This is almost why I sold the KEF's, I was using them with a decent Marantz 8005 Int. Amp in my office and thought they were ok, but when I paired them with my Musical Fidelity KW-500 Int. Amp I was blown away, my Ikon 2 seem to sound good with both systems. Regardless, you can't go wrong with any of these speakers, and it nice to hear great monitors for under 3K!

Thank you for sharing this. It is good to compare other brands with DALI, this thread is very suitable for this.
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post #3612 of 3613 Old 09-10-2014, 03:59 AM
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The other option I have is to use a currently idle Sonos Connect unit that has volume controls but no amp with something like the Adam F5 units, a first foray into active speakers.
Unfortunately I will not be able to audition them side by side in the same room - I can't find a store that has both the Dali Zensors and the Adams. Or any other pro monitor for that matter - they seem to exist in a different universe from hifi speakers.
Given well recorded recorded tracks into both, what differences should I expect in the nature of the sound?
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post #3613 of 3613 Old Yesterday, 08:25 AM
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I was wondering about people's opinions of pairing Epicon front with either Mentor surround or Rubicon surround setup.

By surround I mean SR left, SR right and the back channels, which can be either one channel or two channels (3 or 4 speakers in total).

Of course Epicon 2's would be ideal, but I cannot pull a surround setup with the Dali Epicon 2 stands (they are a mismatch with my furniture) and also it is out of my price range at the moment (two pairs of Epicon 2s is quite expensive... at least for limited ht/surround use). So I know it won't ideal.

Helicon series is out of the question because of the available color options.

I am also unable to use Rubicon LCR's because I can't use wall mount for rear channels.

This leaves me with Mentor 1, 2, 5 or LCR and Rubicon 2 or 5. Or maybe there is another choice that I've been unable to come up yet. For music I will be using 2-channel stereo mostly so this would be for home theater only kind of solution.

I would think the Rubicon series are closer to Epicon sound vice and by timbre matching. Rubicons are quite pricy for me at the moment... could be a waste of money... as I am not getting the Epicons yet and this could be a future upgrade. I would think that Lektor and Ikon mk2 series are out of the question, or maybe they are enough for surround channels / movies - even though I really doubt it at the moment. Or maybe Ikon would be a better match than Mentor.

I would be very interested in your experiences of mixing up Dali different series speakers for surrounds and extra channels (front height or front wide for example).

The results might be similar in mixing Helicon with Mentor series as it could be with Epicon with Rubicon series. Room correction via amplifier could help at least somewhat.

Last edited by tsal; Yesterday at 08:53 AM.
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