PSB Speakers Owners thread - Page 191 - AVS Forum
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post #5701 of 5726 Old 09-02-2014, 06:02 PM
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are you still there wondering about having problems with the volume having to SET too loud to wake up your speakers

Volumes at 75-80 on my X4000 sounds good and felt home theater like. Below that is just fine. I guess I am beginning to appreciate the sound to some level. I will be buying the woofer in the next week or so hence reducing the load of the towers and making them small in my setup. Hopefully that will change things a lot. Will wait and see how that would sound


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1 idea I want you to check on because you have a nice setup so far is you probably have ran the Odyssey set up for the speakers sometimes when that runs it will automatically put the front speakers to small size sounding go into the settings and set the front towers to large speakers I think that might make the difference I have to do it on my Yamaha receiver every time I use auto setup and puts my fronts to small which I don't want so go in but it sounds fuller and a bit louder when they are set to large give that a try let me know.also always having a subwoofer is a great idea it takes up the slack in the soundstage I have one also in my theater.and that was a great thing I did for the system...
Remember set everything to Large.

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post #5702 of 5726 Old 09-02-2014, 06:25 PM
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Sorry, bad advice. If a sub is present in the configuration, then setting the speakers to Small is the correct answer. The sub is much better at handling the low frequencies than the mains. If there is no sub, then Audyssey will not set the speakers to Small. However, adding a sub would significantly improve the overall audio quality.

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post #5703 of 5726 Old 09-02-2014, 07:52 PM
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to reply back to you about being bad adviceI don't agree with you one bit the only thing I do agree with you about is when Odyssey is running if there's a sub involved it will set the other speakers too small but when you're looking for a certain sound the suggestion I was giving him was that I set mine too large then I added the presence of a sub and they gave me even more full of sound that is a suggestion I think is worthy
Andas he said at this time he does not have a subwoofer so make sure the speakers are set to large let me know.

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post #5704 of 5726 Old 09-02-2014, 11:57 PM
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Hey guys!

So I'm trying to decide on the speakers for my first (budget) audiophile system. After auditioning, I've narrowed it down to the PSB Imagine X2T and the Paradigm Monitor 11s. I figured the PSB owners thread would be a good place to ask this question, as I've heard so little about the X2Ts and it's a bit daunting for an audiophile newbie.

To give some context on my setup: it's going to be a living room setup for a college house of 6 guys. As such, it's going to be playing just about every genre of music, and for that reason I've been leaning towards a neutral sound signature (I tend to like that anyway). Also, as our living room is a little awkwardly laid out, it's important that the speakers still sound similar at angles. (I noticed that the Monitor 11s have a superior frequency response at 30 degrees to the X2Ts; am I correct in assuming that this means the Monitor 11s will perform better at an angled listening position?)

I thought it would be easy to compare the two after auditioning, but I'm having far more trouble than I thought. To my untrained ears, they both sound great. The only note that I could make was that the Monitor 11s seemed to have slightly more fatiguing (and airy) vocals, though I have no clue if this had something to do with the amp setup, room size, or volume. I'm going in again to audition them back-to-back on Thursday, but it's just so tricky comparing speakers when they're at different stores and you can't listen to them them side by side.

So, for that reason, I'd greatly appreciate general opinions about these speakers and speaker brands. How do they compare? How have your experiences been with the brand/specific speakers? I'd also really appreciate any tips on "remembering" the two unique sounds that I hear from the speakers and comparing them. Are there certain things I should be looking for?

I'm really excited to begin my audiophile journey, and I'd be so grateful if you guys could help steer me towards the best decision!

Thanks so much.
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post #5705 of 5726 Old 09-03-2014, 08:17 AM
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Very nice choices on the speakers I can see your dilemma on this the X2D is a more neutral sounding speakers were the monitors 11 are a little more bright on highs for me but depends on the surroundings is it ceramic tile concrete rugs what type of when you go to audition them bring a favorite CD and a favorite DVD movie Blu ray that way you know the sounds that are familiar to you and if it sounds better to you on certain sceneswhat type of equipment do you have and are you also don't you add a sub or two to the setup.
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post #5706 of 5726 Old 09-03-2014, 06:10 PM
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I received my T2's last week am very pleased for the most part. I am picking up a little bit of distortion or buzzing in some of the vocals in music and dialogue. Has anyone experienced this with these speakers? For now I'm chalking this up to needing more break in time.
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post #5707 of 5726 Old 09-03-2014, 06:50 PM
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Modern speakers need no break in time. I specifically called PSB when I purchased my Synchrony One's asking about break-in time, and they assured me none was required.

A buzzing sound is more likely due to electronics, than to something with the speakers. I would try a process of elimination to see if you can identify the source of the noise.

Interesting read: Burn in Q&A

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post #5708 of 5726 Old 09-04-2014, 11:04 AM
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Very nice choices on the speakers I can see your dilemma on this the X2D is a more neutral sounding speakers were the monitors 11 are a little more bright on highs for me but depends on the surroundings is it ceramic tile concrete rugs what type of when you go to audition them bring a favorite CD and a favorite DVD movie Blu ray that way you know the sounds that are familiar to you and if it sounds better to you on certain sceneswhat type of equipment do you have and are you also don't you add a sub or two to the setup.
Thanks for the input! The walls in the living room are currently pretty bare, and are made of concrete. Would this make the sound brighter or warmer?

EDIT: Also, I have two more questions that I've been wondering about.

The PSB X2T cites its 30 degrees off-axis frequency response as 45 Hz - 10,000 Hz, while the Paradigm Monitor 11s supposedly have a FR off-axis of 42 Hz - 18,000 Hz. Does this mean that the Monitor 11s will sound better at greater listening angles?

Lastly, do you guys think that the PSB X2T has sufficient bass without need of a subwoofer?

Thanks again guys.

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post #5709 of 5726 Old 09-05-2014, 04:31 AM
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bare walls make for brighter sound as well as poor imaging....sound treatments to a room are THE biggest and most cost effective upgrade you can make you want to try to dampen reflections as much as possible

Panasonic 65VT30 | Panasonic AE8000 HD PJ | Denon x4000 | Emotiva XPA-5 | PSB imagine B's | PSB image c5 | PSB B4's | DUAL PSA XS30 | OPPO 103 | minidsp

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post #5710 of 5726 Old 09-05-2014, 09:18 AM
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My latest PSB purchase for my secondary system. Very nice sounding speakers




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My latest PSB purchase for my secondary system. Very nice sounding speakers




Very nice speakers you got congratulations on your purchase.
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post #5712 of 5726 Old 09-06-2014, 08:22 AM
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Very nice speakers you got congratulations on your purchase.
Thanks Mark.

My secondary system has now been completed from a speaker purchase POV. It started with a trade of a Blackberry Torch for a pair of original PSB Alphas to be used as my left/right mains. I already had a sub, a PSB Subsonic 5 which was replaced by a Rythmik LV-12R in my main system. This put me on the road to complete the center and surround speakers.

I picked up PSB 100c center channel in July for $75 and a pair of B Tech stands for $20 to support the Alphas. I picked up a pair of Alpha Mites and another pair of stands for $140. I now have two complete systems.

What's cool is the 2nd system is built on left overs and used components found on Kijijji, a site selling used everything .







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post #5713 of 5726 Old 09-07-2014, 05:54 PM
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Very nice speakers you got congratulations on your purchase.
Thanks Mark.

My secondary system has now been completed from a speaker purchase POV. It started with a trade of a Blackberry Torch for a pair of original PSB Alphas to be used as my left/right mains. I already had a sub, a PSB Subsonic 5 which was replaced by a Rythmik LV-12R in my main system. This put me on the road to complete the center and surround speakers.

I picked up PSB 100c center channel in July for $75 and a pair of B Tech stands for $20 to support the Alphas. I picked up a pair of Alpha Mites and another pair of stands for $140. I now have two complete systems.

What's cool is the 2nd system is built on left overs and used components found on Kijijji, a site selling used everything .







wow you did great excellent deal you got on your speakers so you're all set have you hooked up yet and how does it sound
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post #5714 of 5726 Old 09-08-2014, 04:34 PM
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Hey guys,
Are any of you using Outlaw amps for your PSB Imagine or Synchrony setups? I know that many believe that amps tend to be neutral in their impact upon sound quality, as I have as a matter of common sense, but I'm debating between going with a new Class D NAD M27 and a used, almost new Class A/B Outlaw 7700 I have a lead on from the classifieds. Other than convenience features, do any of you have a sense of reliability (meaning: lack of hum issues) from the Outlaw line vs. a Class D amp, by point of comparison in terms of the response of the T2s in particular? The Outlaws are highly regarded by some, but curious what the thoughts are with the line we know and love here in practice.


The Outlaw 7700 I would get is about LT 40% of the cost of the new NAD (the M27 is almost $4K), and I'd use it to power my 7.1 Imagine-based configuration (see my sig for details), so unless there's strong feelings/issues I should know about with the Imagine towers and Outlaw, I'd lean toward the cheaper solution for our room. I'm going to a separate amp in preparation for moving to a pre/pro for Atmos, hence I'm looking at seven-channel amp solutions with plenty of headroom. Both the 7700 and the M27 would easily fit the bill there, giving me about 200 W/Channel @ 8 ohms, with the primary difference being the M27 being Class D and size: 90+ lbs. for the 7700 vs. around 31 for the M27.


I'm also going to CEDIA - I don't see any PSB/NAD representation at the booths AFAIK.

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Denon 4311 with XT32 and Audyssey Pro

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PSB Imagine T2, Center, and Surrounds (as of 5/2014); HSU ULS-15 subs (2)

 

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post #5715 of 5726 Old 09-09-2014, 09:45 AM
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wow you did great excellent deal you got on your speakers so you're all set have you hooked up yet and how does it sound
I've had the center channel (100c), the left/right mains (Alphas) and the subsonic 5 already running and it sounds very nice. I haven't had the chance to get the surrounds engaged yet,, in the process of modifieing stands to support them. Unfortunately for me, the room is set up correct from a positional perspective but as a 2nd system, it will do. The sub is behind the entertainment center.
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post #5716 of 5726 Old 09-09-2014, 09:48 AM
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Hey guys,
Are any of you using Outlaw amps for your PSB Imagine or Synchrony setups? I know that many believe that amps tend to be neutral in their impact upon sound quality, as I have as a matter of common sense, but I'm debating between going with a new Class D NAD M27 and a used, almost new Class A/B Outlaw 7700 I have a lead on from the classifieds. Other than convenience features, do any of you have a sense of reliability (meaning: lack of hum issues) from the Outlaw line vs. a Class D amp, by point of comparison in terms of the response of the T2s in particular? The Outlaws are highly regarded by some, but curious what the thoughts are with the line we know and love here in practice.


The Outlaw 7700 I would get is about LT 40% of the cost of the new NAD (the M27 is almost $4K), and I'd use it to power my 7.1 Imagine-based configuration (see my sig for details), so unless there's strong feelings/issues I should know about with the Imagine towers and Outlaw, I'd lean toward the cheaper solution for our room. I'm going to a separate amp in preparation for moving to a pre/pro for Atmos, hence I'm looking at seven-channel amp solutions with plenty of headroom. Both the 7700 and the M27 would easily fit the bill there, giving me about 200 W/Channel @ 8 ohms, with the primary difference being the M27 being Class D and size: 90+ lbs. for the 7700 vs. around 31 for the M27.


I'm also going to CEDIA - I don't see any PSB/NAD representation at the booths AFAIK.
I would go with the Outlaw for cost alone. NAD used to have a bad reliability problem but I don't know if this is still the case.
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post #5717 of 5726 Old 09-09-2014, 10:01 AM
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he Outlaws are highly regarded by some, but curious what the thoughts are with the line we know and love here in practice.

Definitely the 7-channel ATI AT6005, Stuart.

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post #5718 of 5726 Old 09-09-2014, 10:40 AM
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Definitely the 7-channel ATI AT6005, Stuart.

116 lbs, dual line cords, and ideally used with dual 20 amp circuits. 300 watts @ 8 ohms, and 450 watts @ 4; just the thing you'd want to use with those PSB Imagine T2s, if I feel the need to crank up Master and Commander in our condo living room. Also $7995. :eek


At least the baby (who incidentally turned 1 today, so he's been promoted to toddler) won't be able to knock it over .


http://ati-amp.com/AT6000.php

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Denon 4311 with XT32 and Audyssey Pro

Oppo 93 and 103

Panasonic VT50

Sherwood R-972 with its version of the Trinnov Optimizer

MiniDSP 10x10 HD

PSB Imagine T2, Center, and Surrounds (as of 5/2014); HSU ULS-15 subs (2)

 

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post #5719 of 5726 Old 09-09-2014, 03:26 PM
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Definitely the 7-channel ATI AT6005, Stuart.

116 lbs, dual line cords, and ideally used with dual 20 amp circuits. 300 watts @ 8 ohms, and 450 watts @ 4; just the thing you'd want to use with those PSB Imagine T2s, if I feel the need to crank up Master and Commander in our condo living room. Also $7995. :eek


At least the baby (who incidentally turned 1 today, so he's been promoted to toddler) won't be able to knock it over .


http://ati-amp.com/AT6000.php
I've also been thinking about buying a external amp for my system been trying to find out more about them and also need a new audio video receiver with the pre outs to use the amplifier I've been watching videos on Emotiva website they seem really nice so is outlaw amps I think there more expensive than Emotiva which one do you like I don't mind about paying more for quality and the one thing I can't find out about is how or why is there a humming problems with amplifiers...:sunglasses:
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post #5720 of 5726 Old 09-11-2014, 08:19 PM
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Hey guys, it's the PSB X2T vs. Paradigm Monitor 11 guy again, this time with some actually answerable questions if I could borrow another moment of your time! So I just went and auditioned both of the speakers, and I'm glad that I'm able to actually comprehend a notable difference between the two. Like I expected, the Paradigms had a brighter tone, to the point where some songs just barely began to sound sibilant. The PSBs had a slightly more laid back midrange which prevented a lot of that sibilance, and to my great surprise, had significantly stronger bass.

There were some very significant variations in the auditioning rooms, though, and I'd be super grateful if you guys could help me understand how these differences may have affected the sound.

The most major difference was the size; the Paradigm auditioning room was a quite large (300+ sq foot) room, whereas the PSB room was probably a little over a third of the size. Also, the large Paradigm room had pretty much all bare walls, and was pretty sparse other than more speakers in the corners, while the PSB room was very actively covered in carpets, rugs, and "sound dampener" walls in the corners (like those in lecture halls?).

The amps used were also quite different; the Paradigms were on some model number Pioneer 7.2 150W receiver, and the PSBs were on the NAD 356BEE that I'm going to be using.

There are a couple reasons for my suspicions that the room differences are making my comparison a little less accurate. The most surprising thing about my auditions was that the PSBs had a MUCH more powerful bass response than the Paradigms, which confuses me greatly since the PSB has 1 whole less subwoofer than the Paradigms. The more that I've thought about this, the more I feel like the room and amp played a big part in making the PSBs way bassier than the Paradigms. Am I right that a smaller and more sound-treated room will have a warmer, bassier sound? And a bare room would push towards a brighter sound? And, most importantly, would the PSBs likely sound less almost overbearingly bassy if I were to put them in a 300 sq foot room (like the room they're going in in my house)?
I also have a slight suspicion that the NAD amp is bassier than the Pioneer receiver, but I don't have a clue what the sound signature of Pioneer amps is like. If anyone happens to know, that'd help me out a lot. Googling hasn't yielded me much.

Unfortunately, the small size of the PSB room didn't give me a chance to test out the X2T's off-axis frequency response, which was one of my biggest concerns given its unfavorable data: Paradigm claims an off-axis by 30 degrees FR of +-2 DB 42 Hz - 18 KHz, while the PSBs supposedly have a poor-looking off-axis FR of +- 1 1/2 DB 45 Hz - 10 KHz. From these numbers is it just safe for me to assume that the PSBs will sound worse off-axis than the Paradigms?


I'm at the point where I understand the general tone of each speaker, but I really need to figure out what is and what isn't a valid assessment of the speaker, and I really need to understand how that sound is going to change when it comes into my large, bare walls living room. It'd be awesome if I could tone down the brightness of the Paradigms with the NAD amp, but I don't know if that's how it actually works. I'd love the X2T sound but only if the bass was toned down a bit from how I heard it in that small room.

If you guys could help me with even one of these questions it would make this really stressful decision a lot easier for me.

TL;DR: big room bare walls brighter sound? Small room sound-treated walls very bassy and warm sound? Pioneer receiver sound signature? Off-axis frequency response?

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post #5721 of 5726 Old 09-12-2014, 06:23 AM
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Hi everyone,

I currently have the the older 6t towers,c5,s5 and lfm1 plus ex powered by a rxa 820 receiver. Would I notice improvement by picking up a pair of t5's on clearence and replacing the 6t's? I know the t6 would probably be better, but they are sold out. My room is 12 x 15.

Thanks
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post #5722 of 5726 Old 09-12-2014, 11:10 AM
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Hey guys, it's the PSB X2T vs. Paradigm Monitor 11 guy again, this time with some actually answerable questions if I could borrow another moment of your time! So I just went and auditioned both of the speakers, and I'm glad that I'm able to actually comprehend a notable difference between the two. Like I expected, the Paradigms had a brighter tone, to the point where some songs just barely began to sound sibilant. The PSBs had a slightly more laid back midrange which prevented a lot of that sibilance, and to my great surprise, had significantly stronger bass.

There were some very significant variations in the auditioning rooms, though, and I'd be super grateful if you guys could help me understand how these differences may have affected the sound.

The most major difference was the size; the Paradigm auditioning room was a quite large (300+ sq foot) room, whereas the PSB room was probably a little over a third of the size. Also, the large Paradigm room had pretty much all bare walls, and was pretty sparse other than more speakers in the corners, while the PSB room was very actively covered in carpets, rugs, and "sound dampener" walls in the corners (like those in lecture halls?).

The amps used were also quite different; the Paradigms were on some model number Pioneer 7.2 150W receiver, and the PSBs were on the NAD 356BEE that I'm going to be using.

There are a couple reasons for my suspicions that the room differences are making my comparison a little less accurate. The most surprising thing about my auditions was that the PSBs had a MUCH more powerful bass response than the Paradigms, which confuses me greatly since the PSB has 1 whole less subwoofer than the Paradigms. The more that I've thought about this, the more I feel like the room and amp played a big part in making the PSBs way bassier than the Paradigms. Am I right that a smaller and more sound-treated room will have a warmer, bassier sound? And a bare room would push towards a brighter sound? And, most importantly, would the PSBs likely sound less almost overbearingly bassy if I were to put them in a 300 sq foot room (like the room they're going in in my house)?
I also have a slight suspicion that the NAD amp is bassier than the Pioneer receiver, but I don't have a clue what the sound signature of Pioneer amps is like. If anyone happens to know, that'd help me out a lot. Googling hasn't yielded me much.

Unfortunately, the small size of the PSB room didn't give me a chance to test out the X2T's off-axis frequency response, which was one of my biggest concerns given its unfavorable data: Paradigm claims an off-axis by 30 degrees FR of +-2 DB 42 Hz - 18 KHz, while the PSBs supposedly have a poor-looking off-axis FR of +- 1 1/2 DB 45 Hz - 10 KHz. From these numbers is it just safe for me to assume that the PSBs will sound worse off-axis than the Paradigms?


I'm at the point where I understand the general tone of each speaker, but I really need to figure out what is and what isn't a valid assessment of the speaker, and I really need to understand how that sound is going to change when it comes into my large, bare walls living room. It'd be awesome if I could tone down the brightness of the Paradigms with the NAD amp, but I don't know if that's how it actually works. I'd love the X2T sound but only if the bass was toned down a bit from how I heard it in that small room.

If you guys could help me with even one of these questions it would make this really stressful decision a lot easier for me.

TL;DR: big room bare walls brighter sound? Small room sound-treated walls very bassy and warm sound? Pioneer receiver sound signature? Off-axis frequency response?
well what I would do is first which you did is too audition them with a familiar music CD and favorite Blu ray DVD now that you know somewhat what they sound like you can figure out how they're going to sound in your home.and what you need to do to make them sound better for your liking.
second I would research the speakers type,brands and see what other people are saying about them because they have the equipment the sound room and experience more than us ,like AVS my personal opinion I would go with the PSB especially after hearing what you're listening room is like.
third thing I would do is purchase them from a company that has a good return policy just in case you still can dial them in the way you want them to sound like the store should have at least a 30 day return even if you do not like the way they sound in your home.
now with the question about the receivers each one of them are going to sound different they're not the same sound chips,etc inside of them what you need to do is purchase the one that has all the options that you are looking for and that has enough power to push all the speakers because whatever receiver you buy when the Odyssey speaker setup is done hopefully it will dial in to your listening room environment where that it sounds awesome and from the sound of you talking about with Rugs, sound installation, pictures ext.you know that each listening room will sound different IF their is tile and no area rug then it will be a more bright sounding if there is rug then it won't be so bright and therefore sound will be more bass like with my home theater setup I have tile and a big area rug which helps but I still had to dial it in and add a subwoofer until I was happy which I am.
with the question about off axis I don't really know too much about all that but the advice that I've just given you ,has never steered me wrong good luck look forward to hearing from you..:sunglasses:
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post #5723 of 5726 Old 09-12-2014, 11:37 PM
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Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post
Hey guys,
Are any of you using Outlaw amps for your PSB Imagine or Synchrony setups? I know that many believe that amps tend to be neutral in their impact upon sound quality, as I have as a matter of common sense, but I'm debating between going with a new Class D NAD M27 and a used, almost new Class A/B Outlaw 7700 I have a lead on from the classifieds. Other than convenience features, do any of you have a sense of reliability (meaning: lack of hum issues) from the Outlaw line vs. a Class D amp, by point of comparison in terms of the response of the T2s in particular? The Outlaws are highly regarded by some, but curious what the thoughts are with the line we know and love here in practice.


The Outlaw 7700 I would get is about LT 40% of the cost of the new NAD (the M27 is almost $4K), and I'd use it to power my 7.1 Imagine-based configuration (see my sig for details), so unless there's strong feelings/issues I should know about with the Imagine towers and Outlaw, I'd lean toward the cheaper solution for our room. I'm going to a separate amp in preparation for moving to a pre/pro for Atmos, hence I'm looking at seven-channel amp solutions with plenty of headroom. Both the 7700 and the M27 would easily fit the bill there, giving me about 200 W/Channel @ 8 ohms, with the primary difference being the M27 being Class D and size: 90+ lbs. for the 7700 vs. around 31 for the M27.


I'm also going to CEDIA - I don't see any PSB/NAD representation at the booths AFAIK.
I'm currently running an Outlaw 7700 balanced from a Marantz AV8801 into a Imagine T2 - 7 channel setup. In my 4000+ cuft. living room I usually have volume levels between 35-65% on the AV8801, depending on the material. I can't stand much beyond 70% for very long. The 7700 seems to have power to spare beyond that, but I don't want to find out how much, TBH. It runs warm, but not as warm as the AV8801. It's dead quiet with no hum. My personal opinion on the sound of my system would be to say that it's pretty neutral while leaning just a bit toward warm, but I attribute this more to the PSB speakers than the pre/pro or amp. My dual subs are set about 2dB hot, so take that for what it's worth. I've been using this setup since February and have had no issues or niggles with the 7700. This amp is solid.

Outlaw Audio was very friendly and professional during our correspondence and the transaction was painless.

Whatever you decide, good luck with your purchase. I hope you enjoy your PSBs as much as I have mine.

Last edited by Budley007; 09-12-2014 at 11:42 PM.
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post #5724 of 5726 Old Yesterday, 02:20 AM
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Has anyone auditioned the Imagine x2T's? I want to know the differences VS my Paradigm Studio 100 v.4
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post #5725 of 5726 Old Yesterday, 05:28 PM
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I've had the Image T5s for a few weeks already and I'm amazed by their sound. The Images are very detailed and neutral with just the right amount of bass. I was worried how they would pair with the Sony in my listening room but everything is just great. I've played the T5s for over a hundred hours and they are more open and less stuffy sounding then when they were brand new. I hooked up an Emotiva UPA-500 amplifier I've been evaluating for another room setup to the Sony's pre-outs just to see how it would compare to a separate but the Sony was better sounding with more dynamics and definition throughout the frequency spectrum. Pics
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Sony 5700ES
PSB Image T5, PSB Image B5, PSB Image B4, PSB Image C4

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post #5726 of 5726 Old Yesterday, 07:31 PM
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I have PSB's all around in a 11.1 setup (see the My Setup link in my sig). I also have the 4520, and listen to a lot of music in 5.1 PLII Music mode. IMO, you will be much better off with a direct-radiating speaker, rather than the Imagine S. I have both the Imagine B's and the Imagine Mini's in my setup, and can highly recommend either.
Nice set up. I was curious if you notice much of a sound quality upgrade between the Emotiva and the 4520.
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