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post #2701 of 5820 Old 07-24-2010, 09:50 PM
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I hope someone can help me with this question.

I purchased a NAD C-326BEE Stereo Integrated Amplifier and the following system Components:

- Oppo Digital BDP-83 Blu-ray Player
- PSB - Image T6 Tower Speakers
- Audioquest - Diamondback Interconnect cables

I was told that the NAD amp was really good for the price, but out of curiosity, I replaced the NAD amp with my Marantz SR-4023 Stereo Receiver just to listen to the difference. I was blown away with the much improved Sound. It sounded much more cleaner and detailed than the NAD Amp. They are both at the same price point, but I was told how good the NAD amp was so this threw me since the Marantz is a Receiver.

Now I am curious if I should replace the NAD amp with the Marantz PM8003 Integrated Amp. Do you think I would hear an even more improved sound difference with my PSB Speakers?

Russell
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post #2702 of 5820 Old 07-25-2010, 10:41 PM
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I just purchased the PSB T65 tower speakers brand new off line, im anxious to get them since where i live i cant auditin speakers and nobody carries PSB so i took a gamble.

Hopefully i fall in love, i was gonna get the t55 but i spent a little more and went with the t65. What would be a good receiver for this to power these i want somehting for home theater as well about 5.1 and im guessing later on i can add a external amp to it?
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post #2703 of 5820 Old 07-26-2010, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graydodge14 View Post

I just purchased the PSB T65 tower speakers brand new off line, im anxious to get them since where i live i cant auditin speakers and nobody carries PSB so i took a gamble.

Hopefully i fall in love, i was gonna get the t55 but i spent a little more and went with the t65. What would be a good receiver for this to power these i want somehting for home theater as well about 5.1 and im guessing later on i can add a external amp to it?

What's your budget? How big is the room you are putting them in?
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post #2704 of 5820 Old 07-26-2010, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graydodge14 View Post

What would be a good receiver to power PSB T65 tower speakers? I want something for home theater as well about 5.1. I am guessing later on i can add a external amp to it?

My congratulations on the speakers! I am pretty sure you will enjoy them. As far as your question goes, here is my "ten cents"

1. As it is mentioned above, the budget is important. There is a wide range of amplifiers/ receivers that can satisfy your requirements. It can be fairly budgetary or top of the line model. Thus in your particular case the choice will greatly depend on the money you are willing to spend.

2. If you would like to have an opportunity to add external power amplifier later, you should look for the models with analog pre-outputs, as the simplest solution.

3. I would also be somewhat concerned with their 6 Ohm (4 Ohm minimum) impedance. A potent amplifier that is rated for 6 Ohm (may be capable of 4 Ohm load is advisable).

You may take a look at Onkyo TX-NR 807 as a decent reasonably priced option. Onkyo just released 808 model, thus it is easy to find good pricing on previous models.

I personally have PSB Image T6 towers, which are newer version of T65. I drive them with Onkyo TX-NR1007, which is a mid-top level receiver from Onkyo. I like it. If you have money to spend, 1007 model is a good option. Also you can take a look at similar receivers from Denon and Marantz.
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post #2705 of 5820 Old 07-26-2010, 03:36 PM
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My budget is about 800, i can go higher if need be but that will just require more saving but if i can get better results with more money then i will save.

I do want a receiver that i can hook up external amps to my speakers. Not so much for my house but i may use these for music outside also as a nice 2.1 channel stereo type so amps would only make it easier to make it louder without mazing everything out.

Ive been looking at ONKYO, i was advised to be wary about Denon receivers because there not as good as they used to be or something. So since im new to this i just need some brands to check out or something. So thanks guys .
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post #2706 of 5820 Old 07-26-2010, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graydodge14 View Post

My budget is about 800, i can go higher if need be but that will just require more saving but if i can get better results with more money then i will save.

Ive been looking at ONKYO, i was advised to be wary about Denon receivers because there not as good as they used to be or something. So since im new to this i just need some brands to check out or something. So thanks guys .

You may look up Onkyo 1007 topick at this forum. There seems to be good deals are available, especialy with Bing cash back, well within your budget. Here is a direct link to one of the posts.
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post #2707 of 5820 Old 07-26-2010, 07:54 PM
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Not sure if it was already mentioned, but a review of the Image T6 has been posted on SoundStage! this month along with measurements taken at the NRC.

http://www.soundstage.com/equipment/psb_image_t6.htm
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post #2708 of 5820 Old 07-27-2010, 05:18 AM
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Originally Posted by RicHSAD View Post

Not sure if it was already mentioned, but a review of the Image T6 has been posted on SoundStage! this month along with measurements taken at the NRC.

http://www.soundstage.com/equipment/psb_image_t6.htm

They got great reviews as well
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post #2709 of 5820 Old 07-27-2010, 09:10 AM
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Does anybody have Emotica XPA-5 with their PSB speakers? I would like to know their experience w/XPA-5 and how much difference it made in HT.

I have a pair of T45's in my set up. I might upgrade my speakers next year.
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post #2710 of 5820 Old 07-29-2010, 12:07 PM
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So in addition to picking up my new B6's a couple weeks ago, it looks like now I may be able to get the rest of my channels a lot sooner than expected! I'm pretty sure I'll grab the C5 for my center, but I can't decide between the B4's or the B5's for my surrounds... Is there any reason to go with the B5 for the surrounds? My concern with going with the bigger model is the size. These will be wall-mounted on the rear wall and out to the sides a bit, in as close to standard 5.1 surround positioning as possible. Due to the size of the room though, my couch is going to be almost right up against that back wall (I might be able to get it out about 6 inches, but that's probably it).

I'm also thinking about the Alpha LR1's for height channels above my B6's. Any thoughts on those speakers for that use, in this set-up?

Also, I know this gets asked all the time, but any recommendations on a sub to go with the new Images? I was originally thinking the 5i, or maybe the 6i, but I've heard that the 5i doesn't offer that much in terms of lower extension. On the other hand, I've read that the 5i is very musical, whereas something like the SVS PB-10 goes lower, but is less musical. This will be a dual-purpose set-up, so I'd like to get nice low extension for movies, but a nice blend with the B6's for music.

Thanks!

Doug
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post #2711 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 03:19 AM
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hi guy,

Need your advice on my below PSB speaker crossover setting which tested using Audyssey on my denon 1909 and need your guys to advice what is the best setting i should used for when i playing movie and music.

Audyssey setting
PSB Image B25 (Front) - 40Hz - channel setting +1.5db (L) +1.0db(R)
PSB Alpha C1 (Center) - 60Hz - Channel setting +3.0db
PSB Alpha B1 (Surround Side) - 60hz - Channel setting +0.5db(L) +1.0db(R)

Thanks
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post #2712 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug S79 View Post

So in addition to picking up my new B6's a couple weeks ago, it looks like now I may be able to get the rest of my channels a lot sooner than expected! I'm pretty sure I'll grab the C5 for my center, but I can't decide between the B4's or the B5's for my surrounds... Is there any reason to go with the B5 for the surrounds? My concern with going with the bigger model is the size. These will be wall-mounted on the rear wall and out to the sides a bit, in as close to standard 5.1 surround positioning as possible. Due to the size of the room though, my couch is going to be almost right up against that back wall (I might be able to get it out about 6 inches, but that's probably it).

I'm also thinking about the Alpha LR1's for height channels above my B6's. Any thoughts on those speakers for that use, in this set-up?

Also, I know this gets asked all the time, but any recommendations on a sub to go with the new Images? I was originally thinking the 5i, or maybe the 6i, but I've heard that the 5i doesn't offer that much in terms of lower extension. On the other hand, I've read that the 5i is very musical, whereas something like the SVS PB-10 goes lower, but is less musical. This will be a dual-purpose set-up, so I'd like to get nice low extension for movies, but a nice blend with the B6's for music.

Thanks!

Doug

Doug,
Congrats on getting your Image setup!

I have Alpha LR1's for surround duty in my 5.1 setup. I love them - they're the perfect size and great quality, and complement my Image front soundstage well. My only issue with them is that they don't extend down to 80z, where I'd prefer to cross them with my sub. I cross them at 100hz when I really should cross them at about 120hz given their performance. LR1's should be great for height channels.

The B4's hit 80z and I'd suggest those over the B5's for surrounds since the B4's should be more than capable. I'd consider the B5's only if you're into lots of multichannel SACD or DVD-Audio which, arguably, require better quality surrounds.

As for subs, as much as I love PSB I don't even consider PSB subs. My dream right now is for the Rhythmik F12SE (Rythmik has a great rep for "musical" subs), but there are plenty of quality ID brands offering better bang for the buck.

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post #2713 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squall12 View Post

Need your advice on my below PSB speaker crossover setting which tested using Audyssey on my denon 1909 and need your guys to advice what is the best setting i should used for when i playing movie and music.

Audyssey setting
PSB Image B25 (Front) - 40Hz - channel setting +1.5db (L) +1.0db(R)
PSB Alpha C1 (Center) - 60Hz - Channel setting +3.0db
PSB Alpha B1 (Surround Side) - 60hz - Channel setting +0.5db(L) +1.0db(R)

What's the question exactly? Those setting seem reasonable, but: 1) does it sound good to you? and 2) if not, what's wrong? Also, you don't say what you are using for a sub or how that's set up, so we're missing half the picture here...
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post #2714 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpearman View Post

Doug,
Congrats on getting your Image setup!

Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpearman View Post

I have Alpha LR1's for surround duty in my 5.1 setup. I love them - they're the perfect size and great quality, and complement my Image front soundstage well. My only issue with them is that they don't extend down to 80z, where I'd prefer to cross them with my sub. I cross them at 100hz when I really should cross them at about 120hz given their performance. LR1's should be great for height channels.

Thanks for the info! I'm hoping to get the store to set up a system with the B6's and C5 in front and the LR1's as heights for me to demo when I get there. I'm going to have to do some research on some recommended PLIIz Height demo material so I can put it to the test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpearman View Post

The B4's hit 80z and I'd suggest those over the B5's for surrounds since the B4's should be more than capable. I'd consider the B5's only if you're into lots of multichannel SACD or DVD-Audio which, arguably, require better quality surrounds.

I was kind of thinking the same thing, so that definitely helps with my decision. I'm pretty sure the B4's will be all I need for my surrounds. Also, since posting my question, I've been told that the B4's have screw holes in them for wall-mounting. So if that's true, that makes the choice even easier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpearman View Post

As for subs, as much as I love PSB I don't even consider PSB subs. My dream right now is for the Rhythmik F12SE (Rythmik has a great rep for "musical" subs), but there are plenty of quality ID brands offering better bang for the buck.

Oh really? That's interesting that you wouldn't even consider a PSB sub, 'cause I've also read that PSB subs are supposed to be pretty good... Maybe it comes down to the difference between "pretty good" and "awesome." I definitely want the sub to be adding to the mix, which I think the 5i will when paired with my B6's. But what I want to avoid is something that's going to shake the whole house. I'd kind of like to limit the effect to the family room as much as possible.

Thanks for your comments!

Doug
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post #2715 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Doug S79 View Post

Oh really? That's interesting that you wouldn't even consider a PSB sub, 'cause I've also read that PSB subs are supposed to be pretty good... Maybe it comes down to the difference between "pretty good" and "awesome." I definitely want the sub to be adding to the mix, which I think the 5i will when paired with my B6's. But what I want to avoid is something that's going to shake the whole house. I'd kind of like to limit the effect to the family room as much as possible.

I have no doubt that PSB subs are good - very good even. The ID brands have really created a lot of value in the subwoofer space. I searched through several boxes from eD, SVS, HSU, Outlaw etc before settling on a sealed, servo-controlled Rhythmik option for my next sub.

If you can get a PSB sub at a good price, by all means go for it.

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post #2716 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 07:11 PM
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Well, it's been a week since I hooked up my new PSB's: Synchrony One Towers in front, along with the One Center, and a pair of Synchrony Two Towers for surround duty. Pre-amp is a Pioneer Elite SC-05, to an also new B&K Ref. 200.7 power amp. I crossed over at 50hz. to an SVS 20-39 PC+ sub. My room is about 25x15.

First off - the build quality of these speakers are terrific. I'm fussy, and found nothing to complain about. About the ONLY negative I can think of is the grill covers are cloth covered metal, and fit into grooves REALLY tight. I had to take mine off initially as some protective sheet foam stayed behind the grill covers and frame when I pulled the foam out. The quality of the veneer is really good (I got the black ash but like the cherry too) and the way the wood panels interlock with the aluminum front and back is totally seamless.

As for the sound? I wish I could say they sound incredible, fantastic, etc. - but they don't - they just sound REAL. One of the first blu-rays I watched was "Master & Commander", and the sounds of footsteps from the above decks on the ship and the creaking of the ship made me turn my head more than a few times (Not to mention those cannon shots!) Dialog is always crystal clear, I don't have to keep turning it up to hear whispers anymore. They handle power really well, instead of the sound seeming to get louder it's like you are just walking closer to the music or soundstage, if that makes sense.

I turn off all processing for stereo music and run the One Towers full range with no sub. The bass is tight and room filling. I have them about 10" from the front wall with the bottom port blocked. They make me want to listen to my entire collection of music again. I had my last speakers for almost 20 years ( Definitive Technology BP-10's) and am shocked at how clear and "unmuddy" the midrange of the PSB's are. I plan on keeping these Synchronys a long time also!

Well that's it for now, any questions let me know!
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post #2717 of 5820 Old 07-30-2010, 09:12 PM
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Well, it's been a week since I hooked up my new PSB's: Synchrony One Towers in front, along with the One Center, and a pair of Synchrony Two Towers for surround duty.

Good to hear that you like them. I am jealous!
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post #2718 of 5820 Old 07-31-2010, 12:18 PM
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They handle power really well, instead of the sound seeming to get louder it's like you are just walking closer to the music or soundstage, if that makes sense.

That's a pretty awesome description. I've experienced this once before in a well-treated home theater with B&W 802D's running. So nice.

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post #2719 of 5820 Old 08-01-2010, 12:58 PM
 
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And I will soon be joining the PSB family too as I've reached agreement to buy a pair of Stratus Goldi in the gloss black finish off of Craigslist. However, circumstances dictate that it will be two or three weeks before I have them. ...

I plan on driving them with a NAD Silverline S300 integrated amp, which some people believe to actually be a Gryphon Tabu Century rebadged as a NAD. Don't really know about that for sure one way or the other, but at the very least, the only other traditional integrated amp that NAD has ever made even close to being as good as or better than the S300 is the Master Series M3.

Really looking forward to them, as I recall what a great speaker for listening to hard rock/heavy metal in plain old 2 channel they were and are!

Will be receiving my Goldis on Tuesday, the 3rd, although it will be later than that before I will get the chance to set them up and play them. Can't wait!

Just curious, but what would most of you buy first, a new pair of Image T65s for $800, or a new pair of G-Design GT1s for $1000?
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post #2720 of 5820 Old 08-01-2010, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark russ View Post

Will be receiving my Goldis on Tuesday, the 3rd, although it will be later than that before I will get the chance to set them up and play them. Can't wait!

Just curious, but what would most of you buy first, a new pair of Image T65s for $800, or a new pair of G-Design GT1s for $1000?

I posted a mini-review of my experience with the GT1s here, that you may want to read.

I'm still surprised by the relative lack of GT1 owners, there was little to be found on them.

If you decide to try them, just make sure that you can return them. (That's good advice for any speaker.)

Scott

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post #2721 of 5820 Old 08-01-2010, 01:54 PM
 
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^^^ Thanks for your brutal honesty. Sure makes the case for the Images plus the $$$ savings.

That last line in your post is very "sound" advice for all.
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post #2722 of 5820 Old 08-03-2010, 07:28 PM
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I was looking into the image line for an HT setup. The only thing that concerned me was the relatively small size of the C5 center, compared to similarly priced lines from other brands (Klipsch Reference, Paradigm Monitors).

The psb speakers are the farthest away to audition, and i wanted to get a little insight before thinking about driving down to check them out.

Does anyone have any experience with the c5 for Movies? The room is about 15'x17' and is open to another room about the same size. The listening position is about 10' from the TV.
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post #2723 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 10:32 AM
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Hello, I am not too active on the forum. I purchased all new PSB Image speakers back in late May. I have a few concerns about the 6ohm rating. I'm currently driving them with an Onkyo Ht RC160(80wpc 8ohm). I am not sure this receiver is feeding enough power to my speakers. I've been thinking about upgrading to an RC180(110wpc 8ohm). Does anyone have a take on this move? I am only considering an RC180 at the moment(I get a good deal on Onkyo). Also, I've noticed my fronts(B5s) and center(C5) are rated at 125-150watts or so, but my B4(rears) are at 80watts. Will this be an issue with the RC180? Will this damage my speakers? Does anyone think I should just stay with the RC160? Any help would be great

Thank you!

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post #2724 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by mquirozz View Post

I am not sure this receiver is feeding enough power to my speakers. I've been thinking about upgrading to an RC180(110wpc 8ohm). <......> Also, I've noticed my fronts(B5s) and center(C5) are rated at 125-150watts or so, but my B4(rears) are at 80watts. Will this be an issue with the RC180? Will this damage my speakers? ........

1. I am not sure re: RC160, but I think with RC-180 you should be able to wire front speakers as Bi-Amp, to help drive more power into Frontal speakers.

2. I would not be worried about damaging the speakers, unless you really crank the volume all the way up. These receivers in case of all channels driven cannot really output the rated power any way.

3. RC180 is better, but the difference is not extreme. Thus only you can really decide if it is worth the hassle and money considering your individual case and your own satisfaction levels from the current system.
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post #2725 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by mquirozz View Post

Hello, I am not too active on the forum. I purchased all new PSB Image speakers back in late May. I have a few concerns about the 6ohm rating. I'm currently driving them with an Onkyo Ht RC160(80wpc 8ohm). I am not sure this receiver is feeding enough power to my speakers. I've been thinking about upgrading to an RC180(110wpc 8ohm). Does anyone have a take on this move? I am only considering an RC180 at the moment(I get a good deal on Onkyo). Also, I've noticed my fronts(B5s) and center(C5) are rated at 125-150watts or so, but my B4(rears) are at 80watts. Will this be an issue with the RC180? Will this damage my speakers? Does anyone think I should just stay with the RC160?

Here's my standard reply to this type of question: Have you actually noticed any problems? Amp overheating and shutting down? Distortion? If not, I really can't see why you'd change anything...
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post #2726 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 01:22 PM
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Here's my standard reply to this type of question: Have you actually noticed any problems? Amp overheating and shutting down? Distortion? If not, I really can't see why you'd change anything...

The unit does heat up a bit but I am unsure if its the load or if it just heats up a bit. I have read reviews that complain of this. The unit has never shut down randomly. I do notice distortion with certain music. My main concern is clarity and low level listening. I'm under the impression that an amp that puts out more power stresses less reducing distortion. Less distortion can help low level listening. Am I over thinking?

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post #2727 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by dima333a View Post

1. I am not sure re: RC160, but I think with RC-180 you should be able to wire front speakers as Bi-Amp, to help drive more power into Frontal speakers.

2. I would not be worried about damaging the speakers, unless you really crank the volume all the way up. These receivers in case of all channels driven cannot really output the rated power any way.

3. RC180 is better, but the difference is not extreme. Thus only you can really decide if it is worth the hassle and money considering your individual case and your own satisfaction levels from the current system.

I have considered bi-amping but I've read that if your not running the right amount of power you can damage one of the channels. So to be safe i've stayed with bi wire. Really, neither produced a difference from what I can hear.

The goal of satisfaction through the pursuit of great sound can easily turn to madness.
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post #2728 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by mquirozz View Post

The unit does heat up a bit but I am unsure if its the load or if it just heats up a bit. I have read reviews that complain of this. The unit has never shut down randomly.

The Onkyo's a pretty infamous for running hot (at least past models). If it's not shutting down I'd guess you're ok, but you do want to make sure the thing is well ventilated!

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Originally Posted by mquirozz View Post

I do notice distortion with certain music. My main concern is clarity and low level listening. I'm under the impression that an amp that puts out more power stresses less reducing distortion. Less distortion can help low level listening. Am I over thinking?

You probably are over thinking, welcome to the club....

There are lots of possible reasons for hearing distortion on some music, probably 90% of them being what's on the actual recording. If you have good headphones see if you can hear the distortion via them also before picking on your amp. Modern amps shouldn't be adding anything in the way of audible distortion for low level listening (unless they're tube amps, but that's a whole 'nother issue).

If you can't hear the distortion via good headphones then you may want to consider swapping the Onkyo out. If I was you, I'd want to borrow or have the ability to return any replacement before I committed to spending any money I didn't have to....
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post #2729 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by scientest View Post

The Onkyo's a pretty infamous for running hot (at least past models). If it's not shutting down I'd guess you're ok, but you do want to make sure the thing is well ventilated!



You probably are over thinking, welcome to the club....

There are lots of possible reasons for hearing distortion on some music, probably 90% of them being what's on the actual recording. If you have good headphones see if you can hear the distortion via them also before picking on your amp. Modern amps shouldn't be adding anything in the way of audible distortion for low level listening (unless they're tube amps, but that's a whole 'nother issue).

If you can't hear the distortion via good headphones then you may want to consider swapping the Onkyo out. If I was you, I'd want to borrow or have the ability to return any replacement before I committed to spending any money I didn't have to....

Thank you,

I do keep my receiver very ventilated(blurry pic attached)

I'll take your thoughts into consideration as I troubleshoot. I very much appreciate all your input. I'm also wrestling with acoustics(hardwood) so that may be where the battle truly is.

Thank you for the replies all.
LL

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post #2730 of 5820 Old 08-05-2010, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by mquirozz View Post

I'll take your thoughts into consideration as I troubleshoot. I very much appreciate all your input. I'm also wrestling with acoustics(hardwood) so that may be where the battle truly is.

I wouldn't spend any money on new equipment until you get your room acoustics under control. If the back of your room looks like the front, you've got 6 hard surfaces causing problems, not just your hardwood flooring.

Start with reading the Acoustical Treatments Master Thread (it's a long one). Also, there are several other Internet sites and a few books on the subject (see F Alton Everest and Floyd Toole at Amazon)

Fixing the acoustical problems will pay big dividends now and in the future. And it's not too expensive if you go the DIY route.

Cheers,

jr

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