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post #49741 of 49760 Old 07-23-2016, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by etc6849 View Post
No clutter allowed in the main common area so I put it in there versus the closet. Had no idea how much a bed would help the acoustics versus the great room with lots of hard surfaces. I'm sure 50% of what I'm hearing is the room and the other 50% comes from ditching my Onkyo AVR.

You can definitely here the difference versus an AVR. More punch, dynamics and clarity; these XPR amps from Emotiva have an excellent slew rate and damping factor. I would think you'd need a nice preamp like the HA-1 to take advantage of the high slew rate (versus an AVR's preout).

Drop by sometime because this setup and for sure the other one will amaze you if you're into audio.
i wish i could see and hear your setup, it looks amazing bro. somehow it makes me wonder if ur not dissapointed and bored having nothing to fiddle with on your stereo, as everything seems to be 100% archievement.

Klipsch fronts 2xRF-82-II 150W 33Hz-24KHz , center RC-64-II 200W 59Hz-24KHz , sides 2xRS-62-II 150W 50Hz-24KHz , rears 2xRB-81-II 150W 44Hz-24KHz , heights 2x Salora T25i
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post #49742 of 49760 Old 07-24-2016, 12:10 PM
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rp440 vs rc3
looking to upgrade. wonder if this speaker is better than my rc3?
im limited to space the 440 fits into

Reciever - Denon 7200wa
Front - Klipsch rp3 b
Center - Klipsch rc3 II
Sides - klipsch ref iv rs52
Rear - klipsch rb 61 II
Sub - deftech supercube 1
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post #49743 of 49760 Old 07-25-2016, 03:40 PM
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RC-64 II owners: I have a pair of RF-3s and my RC-64 II doesn't seem to be as loud as they are, even after my Onkyo TX-SR606's Audyssey calibration brought the center and towers to -10db. Seems like I need to increase the center to -5db or -7db to really bring it to a loud enough level. When I play the center by itself, it also doesn't seem to have the same clarity or range that the tweeters on my RF-3s have. I'm guessing I messed something up. What do you recommend me trying?
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post #49744 of 49760 Old 07-25-2016, 05:06 PM
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rp440 vs rc3
looking to upgrade. wonder if this speaker is better than my rc3?
im limited to space the 440 fits into
The prevailing advice here is to generally try to voice match to your L and R speakers, which means the RC3 would be a "better" idea for you.

I cannot compare the RP-440C to the RC-3 from personal experience, but I can say without reservation that I'm very very happy with my RP-440C.
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Family Room: Marantz NR1606; Klipsch 2 RP-150M (L/R), 1 RP-440C (C);Sony BDP-S390; Samsung UN46ES6100
Media Room: Marantz SR5010; Klipsch 2 RP-250F (L/R), 1 RP-450C (C), 2 R-112SW (SW); Sony Playstation 4; Samsung UN65JU6500
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post #49745 of 49760 Old 07-25-2016, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Scars View Post
The prevailing advice here is to generally try to voice match to your L and R speakers, which means the RC3 would be a "better" idea for you.

I cannot compare the RP-440C to the RC-3 from personal experience, but I can say without reservation that I'm very very happy with my RP-440C.
All my speakers are from a similar line and the same heritage. Some.have smaller drivers than others. I'm looking to upgrade my front r and l. But I have been reading up on the center and was thinking of doing that first.
I am not rich enough to get all at once

Reciever - Denon 7200wa
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Sides - klipsch ref iv rs52
Rear - klipsch rb 61 II
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post #49746 of 49760 Old 07-25-2016, 07:06 PM
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Even after Audyssey XT32 runs, I always throw in the spears and munsil version 2 disc and check audio tones with the SPL meter I have. The blu-ray has 30dbfs tones for the speakers and 40 for the subs, so you check em all out and adjust what you need to to get them close to 75db, so they are all level matched.

XT32 is usually pretty good, but not perfect.
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post #49747 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cndctrdj View Post
All my speakers are from a similar line and the same heritage. Some.have smaller drivers than others. I'm looking to upgrade my front r and l. But I have been reading up on the center and was thinking of doing that first.
I am not rich enough to get all at once
Understood!

Are your size limitations vertical or horizontal?
If vertical, I really think you'd be very happy with the RP-440C.
If horizontal, are you able to audition the RP-250C and the RP-440C in your home and return the one you don't like?

Family Room: Marantz NR1606; Klipsch 2 RP-150M (L/R), 1 RP-440C (C);Sony BDP-S390; Samsung UN46ES6100
Media Room: Marantz SR5010; Klipsch 2 RP-250F (L/R), 1 RP-450C (C), 2 R-112SW (SW); Sony Playstation 4; Samsung UN65JU6500
Home Office: Klipsch ProMedia 2.1; Creative Sound Blaster Z -- Work Office: Oppo PM-3; Schiit Magni 2, Modi 2 Uber
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post #49748 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by XeeN View Post
RC-64 II owners: I have a pair of RF-3s and my RC-64 II doesn't seem to be as loud as they are, even after my Onkyo TX-SR606's Audyssey calibration brought the center and towers to -10db. Seems like I need to increase the center to -5db or -7db to really bring it to a loud enough level. When I play the center by itself, it also doesn't seem to have the same clarity or range that the tweeters on my RF-3s have. I'm guessing I messed something up. What do you recommend me trying?
Something isn't right--Is the jumper connecting the terminals in place on the back?
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post #49749 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cndctrdj View Post
All my speakers are from a similar line and the same heritage. Some.have smaller drivers than others. I'm looking to upgrade my front r and l. But I have been reading up on the center and was thinking of doing that first.
I am not rich enough to get all at once
Check your local used market for upper end reference (RF-7/RC-7/RB-75) or Heritage if you can accommodate larger speakers...Honestly, what you have seems comparable to what you are considering, imo.
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post #49750 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 12:42 PM
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Something isn't right--Is the jumper connecting the terminals in place on the back?
I triple checked those, including loosening and tightening the knobs. I also tried plugging the banana plugs into the top and bottom pair of poles to see if the speaker sounded different.

It might be that my expectations were off, and my ears suck? If Audyssey set the center at -10db, and it's 99db/m, and the RF-3s are 97 or 98db/m, then it thinks they're as loud as each other. The test tones out of Audyssey sounded like they were at a similar level.

Maybe my ears suck? What else do you suggest?
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post #49751 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XeeN View Post
RC-64 II owners: I have a pair of RF-3s and my RC-64 II doesn't seem to be as loud as they are, even after my Onkyo TX-SR606's Audyssey calibration brought the center and towers to -10db. Seems like I need to increase the center to -5db or -7db to really bring it to a loud enough level. When I play the center by itself, it also doesn't seem to have the same clarity or range that the tweeters on my RF-3s have. I'm guessing I messed something up. What do you recommend me trying?
The towers are gonna sound louder because well they are towers. The 3's also have 8"drivers compared to 6.5" drivers in the 64. Buy yourself a SPL meter and find out exactly what the db's are with the test tones. That is the only way to know for sure what your actual levels are. Hope this helps.
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post #49752 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by cchunter View Post
The towers are gonna sound louder because well they are towers. The 3's also have 8"drivers compared to 6.5" drivers in the 64. Buy yourself a SPL meter and find out exactly what the db's are with the test tones. That is the only way to know for sure what your actual levels are. Hope this helps.
+1
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Panasonic: PT-AE3000 Front Projector
Elite: 115" Fixed Frame CinemaScope (2.35:1)
Onkyo: TX-NR636 (5.2.2)
Klipsch: RF-7 II's, RC-64 II, RS-62 II, RB-61 II MICCA: M-8C (Atmos) x 6
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post #49753 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 01:35 PM
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@XeeN it might be that the XT32 sets the level to -10dB because it try to compensate with the EQ on the RC-64II .. do you have it inside a cabinet or on top of one and not on the edge of the cabinet ? that might cause the problem you having. also the highs of the RF-3 are more metallic sounding then the highs of the 64II, so they seem louder. but this could be my personal opinion.
for the rest i agree with @cchunter
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Klipsch fronts 2xRF-82-II 150W 33Hz-24KHz , center RC-64-II 200W 59Hz-24KHz , sides 2xRS-62-II 150W 50Hz-24KHz , rears 2xRB-81-II 150W 44Hz-24KHz , heights 2x Salora T25i
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post #49754 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by XeeN View Post
I triple checked those, including loosening and tightening the knobs. I also tried plugging the banana plugs into the top and bottom pair of poles to see if the speaker sounded different.

It might be that my expectations were off, and my ears suck? If Audyssey set the center at -10db, and it's 99db/m, and the RF-3s are 97 or 98db/m, then it thinks they're as loud as each other. The test tones out of Audyssey sounded like they were at a similar level.

Maybe my ears suck? What else do you suggest?
I had a similar issue with my RP450C for some reason it didn't sound loud at all compared to my RP280Fs. I checked the cables to make sure they were all plugged in properly messed with my receiver thinking I had the center channel too low but nothing was fixing the issue. I decided the last thing I could try before doing an RMA was to swap out the speaker cable for a new one and once I did it worked perfectly. I would try a new cable and see if that helps.
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post #49755 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by cchunter View Post
The towers are gonna sound louder because well they are towers. The 3's also have 8"drivers compared to 6.5" drivers in the 64. Buy yourself a SPL meter and find out exactly what the db's are with the test tones. That is the only way to know for sure what your actual levels are. Hope this helps.
I dunno...I completely agree about an SPL meter, but if level-matched the RF-3s shouldn't sound louder than the RC-64II. I realized the latter also uses tapered-array technology but it does have four 6.5" drivers compared to the dual 8s on the RF-3s and a larger cd driver for the horn...

Fwiw, I'm wondering if it's a setting or if something is wrong with the speaker. Again--The SPL meter or app would be great to help trouble-shoot to see what the MLP volume is from each speaker. {EDIT: I tried the RC-7 between two RF-3s and it was obvious that the RC-7 was cleaner. }
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post #49756 of 49760 Old Yesterday, 02:32 PM
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good point about the speaker cable. i had that once and it was fixed by just cutting a bit of it and re-attach the cable. this is caused by corrosion on the cable ends. but it does not explain the xt32 setting it to -10db trim as xt32 compensates with the trim and eq. i think @Zen Traveler is more right, it just a matter of different sound that creates the idea that it sound less where it actually might sound less distorted and thus less loud.
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Klipsch fronts 2xRF-82-II 150W 33Hz-24KHz , center RC-64-II 200W 59Hz-24KHz , sides 2xRS-62-II 150W 50Hz-24KHz , rears 2xRB-81-II 150W 44Hz-24KHz , heights 2x Salora T25i
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post #49757 of 49760 Old Today, 06:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scars View Post
Understood!

Are your size limitations vertical or horizontal?
If vertical, I really think you'd be very happy with the RP-440C.
If horizontal, are you able to audition the RP-250C and the RP-440C in your home and return the one you don't like?
horizontal limitations...
not a lot of high end stores around here anymore.
id probably end up buying them from crutchfield.com and sending one back
the 250 is actually worse than the rc3 as far as specs go from what i can tell.

Reciever - Denon 7200wa
Front - Klipsch rp3 b
Center - Klipsch rc3 II
Sides - klipsch ref iv rs52
Rear - klipsch rb 61 II
Sub - deftech supercube 1
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post #49758 of 49760 Old Today, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Zen Traveler View Post
I dunno...I completely agree about an SPL meter, but if level-matched the RF-3s shouldn't sound louder than the RC-64II. I realized the latter also uses tapered-array technology but it does have four 6.5" drivers compared to the dual 8s on the RF-3s and a larger cd driver for the horn...

Fwiw, I'm wondering if it's a setting or if something is wrong with the speaker. Again--The SPL meter or app would be great to help trouble-shoot to see what the MLP volume is from each speaker. {EDIT: I tried the RC-7 between two RF-3s and it was obvious that the RC-7 was cleaner. }
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Stice View Post
I had a similar issue with my RP450C for some reason it didn't sound loud at all compared to my RP280Fs. I checked the cables to make sure they were all plugged in properly messed with my receiver thinking I had the center channel too low but nothing was fixing the issue. I decided the last thing I could try before doing an RMA was to swap out the speaker cable for a new one and once I did it worked perfectly. I would try a new cable and see if that helps.
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Originally Posted by DaJoJo View Post
@XeeN it might be that the XT32 sets the level to -10dB because it try to compensate with the EQ on the RC-64II .. do you have it inside a cabinet or on top of one and not on the edge of the cabinet ? that might cause the problem you having. also the highs of the RF-3 are more metallic sounding then the highs of the 64II, so they seem louder. but this could be my personal opinion.
for the rest i agree with @cchunter
Quote:
Originally Posted by cchunter View Post
The towers are gonna sound louder because well they are towers. The 3's also have 8"drivers compared to 6.5" drivers in the 64. Buy yourself a SPL meter and find out exactly what the db's are with the test tones. That is the only way to know for sure what your actual levels are. Hope this helps.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaJoJo View Post
good point about the speaker cable. i had that once and it was fixed by just cutting a bit of it and re-attach the cable. this is caused by corrosion on the cable ends. but it does not explain the xt32 setting it to -10db trim as xt32 compensates with the trim and eq. i think @Zen Traveler is more right, it just a matter of different sound that creates the idea that it sound less where it actually might sound less distorted and thus less loud.
Thanks for the input. Looks like my expectations, ears, and perception are off.

SPL tests: I used an app on my Nexus 6P for this, placing it about 1m in front of the tower (on the floor) and the center (on the floor). I played 250Hz - 80Hz tone sweeps and white noise test audio files. The db levels fluctuated around the same points for the tower and the center for all these tests.

Power test: I hooked up my NAD 2600A to the RC-64 II unbridged (2chx150w) and bridged (1chx 500w) to see if I could tell a difference. Besides some differences in general sound (highs particularly, since the NAD 2600A seems to soften them out a bit) it was a fun test because to my sucky ears, I felt like the results were pretty close to what my AVR was able to push through the speaker. I tried some music tracks with wide sustained freq ranges to make the 6.5in woofers move in case my AVR was running out of steam, but I couldn't tell any major lack in sound through AVR vs the NAD (but if I can get an AVR with pre-outs I'm eager to get the NAD in-line).

Cabinet placement: the RC-64II is in a cabinet with a board above and below it. For my tests, I made sure I brought the speaker out so that the front was protruding from the cabinet a half inch or so (the front being the actual front wood, not just the grill).

Cable: I have not tried replacing the cable yet, but the above tests seem to tell me that there isn't a problem with the speaker or tech, but rather my own inexperience and ears are more at fault here. I will still try replacing the cable for kicks.

Lastly, I hooked everything back up to my AVR and played Interstellar scenes where vocals were lost before I had a center at all. I used to use addons in mpc-hc to boost the center track by 5db - 8db when I only had the two RF-3 towers to try to keep the center audio from being drowned out.

Now, however, with the towers at -10db, if I brought the RC-64 II up to -3db, not only were the vocals super clear/not lost at all, but I heard details I hadn't caught since seeing the film in IMAX theaters. The rocket launch scene and black hole scene were my main two tests scenes.

So it still seems like, for my room, furniture, listening distance, ears, etc., the center is something I can adjust per movie, and I can probably count on bringing it from -10db adjusted (where Audyssey put it, like the two RF-3 towers) to -7, -5, or -3db depending on how much other sound is coming from a movie, and know nothing is wrong with the speaker, but it's just how things will be for my system/ears for now.

I am a newbie with all this sort of thing, so thanks for all of your input. If you have anything else you suggest, please share. I love experimenting with settings so I'm ready to try more out.
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post #49759 of 49760 Old Today, 01:54 PM
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you know i had the same sort of strange things with my old sony center speaker and i bought the rc-62II. this improved the soundquality a lot but it did not make the center feel like it was in the middle there, just somewhere far behind the mains. i was looking for a good new avr and i came up with the a3040. since it was not yet in stores i had to wait and tried several things to make the center in the center again. even crazy things like swapping the wire - and + and putting it on its side and upside down. (yes i know.. ridiculous). then finally the a3040 came and i hooked it up and first thing i noticed was the clear center speaker sound, like it came back to life. the center highs where so dull and liveless, this all went away in the second i turned on the avr and started a movie. can't describe how happy i was.. 7.1 and finally a good center sound.. i didn't even put back the + and - in the right way lol.
So after a little while getting used to it, there was this little difference in highs and i thought, mmm i forget to swap the wires. now i know what this weird letters message on the avr is .. out of phase. then after i put on a dolby movie the center was too loud and it took me some digging in white papers and other resources to find out that dolby adds a little dB to the center voices. later then i have sold my rc-62II to a friend and got the rc-64II for myself.. what a difference.. hooked on between a pair of rf-62II, the rc-64II was massive overkill, so i took the thing home anxious about it too much for my rf-82II. turned out it did very well and i'm still very happy with my setup. there is none in the whole neighbourhood that even comes close to the soundquality and the loudness of this klipsch speakers. the avr can easely handle all the 9 speakers with xo on 60hz and my sub is bored to dead, waiting for some 0dB volume to actually move a bit. at +5dB volume there is a rare occasion that the avr shuts down due to overcurrent with a high input source like psyradio progressive internetradio. this is so unbearable loud that you don't want to listen to it for more then 5 minutes, so i don't mind it shuts down then. i need a extra amp for the 2 rear heights just for the amp channels, the wattage is not really important to me, just a 10Watt rms will give loudness enough with these klipsch speakers for me. i guess thats also why you hardly notice a difference in sound, you have to put it on really eardeafening volumes to hear the difference between a little wattage or a 300+ wattage. in the beginning you be wanting to change all eq and settings everytime but in the end you just put it on what sound averagely good to you personally. i even have 2 amp presets for speaker/eq setting , but i never bothered to make use of them.. in my new house i might try everything on 'Large' and sub xo to 120h, it'll be the last thing i try. you'll get used to the fact that not one movie has the same sound or soundpositioning. atmos does far better concerning this and the improvement is undeniably noticable. the cables i had expensive monitor audio, monster cable, MIT and now a cheap ass german 4mm2 speakerwire, can't say i hear a difference.. i tried a mainspower filter and corrector, this seem to work a little, sounds a little more crips and clearer. the 1300€ for it didn't sound good for my wallet though.. i decided to get this one day when im out of ideas to buy for my setup anyways enjoy ur stay here and ask whatever you want to know, there a lot of knowledgable people here and they are happy to help you out.

Klipsch fronts 2xRF-82-II 150W 33Hz-24KHz , center RC-64-II 200W 59Hz-24KHz , sides 2xRS-62-II 150W 50Hz-24KHz , rears 2xRB-81-II 150W 44Hz-24KHz , heights 2x Salora T25i
Yamaha RX-A3040, SVS PB13-Ultra 1000W 14-200hz
4 mm el cheapo wire / Samsung UE-ES8000S TV+evo 2014 / Optoma DH-1015 Sony PS3
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post #49760 of 49760 Old Today, 05:44 PM
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I feel like my rc62ii is louder than my rf62ii's. I have to go check through the wires and everything.
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