Originally Posted by don480
OH MY I feel partially responsible for the heated debate...I know its all in fun. Looking closer at the Harbeth cabinet work it actually looks nice. But it doesn't seem to have the complex inner workings of say the Magicos, PMC, and so on... But I am surprised how expensive the Dynaudio speakers are when they use Soft Dome Tweeter, MDF cabinet (which is pretty common), and polypropylene cone. Nothing special but I guess its how they implement it all together that makes for such a sound people love (at least from what I have read). Crazy how expensive it is for what your truly getting but in the end I guess what matters most is in the end result..."Sound"
Well Don; that was my point exactly. Harbeths, don't
have the "advanced" materials, or "complex" inner-workings...of say Magico, or Wilson; or even, as you mention...the Line-Transmission design of PMC. But then again...neither do Dyns, IMO. That's not a put-down; in fact, if anything...it's a defense...of both Harbeth and
Don't rag Harbeth...and then hold Dynaudio up, as some kind of beacon of innovation; they're not...lol. But neither has to be...to sound
good; or be considered "well-built".
Originally Posted by Dynero
I think the wood grain, colour and chamfering(??) are quite nice but all those screws in the front face....!! shame because it has a sort of nice retro-ish charm going.
See...to each his own; but I kind of "like" the screws. It reminds me...at least something
on this speaker, was still done by hand
For the record...more than any
other speaker, I have ever heard about; Harbeth STRONGLY discourages, listening with the grills removed. I usually discount such claims, as audiophile hooey; that they were "voiced", to be used with the grills on...but they actually do
sound better, grills-on IMO.
To discourage people from removing them...they are form fitted (how about that, Harbeth haters? You think plastic grills, and plastic pegs/peg-holes...is high-crafted art?
); a metal frame, groove-fitted...tightly
I might add...into the baffle of the cabinet. Maybe the screws...are also meant, to force you to keep the grills on...lol.
Originally Posted by Borderdog
1), a good silk soft dome tweeter costs more to build than ribbons.
I don't mean to be contrarian, at every turn; but I can't concur with this. I mean, maybe soft-domes don't cost any more
than ribbons; but I can't say (m)any of them, really cost very much to begin with. I've been researching drivers, of late. PMC for example, works with SEAS to develop their tweeters. I don't have a problem with this. In fact, I was just having this discussion...with someone the other day.
It's fine, the few companies...that develop drivers in-house (both Dyn and Harbeth do, BTW; though to be fair...I think Harbeth sources its tweeter). To me, it's a sound business strategy. To para-phrase: let's let the experts, do what they're experts at. Why should we build a factory, and tool-up; when they've been doing it...and doing it well...for years? Now...does that mean PMC, pulls SEAS off the shelf, or hits up Madisound for 10,000 of them? Of course not; they work with them, spec it out, etc. But when it comes to knocking them out...PMC lets SEAS, do the heavy lifting. Again...I have zero problem with that; and I don't think one is necessarily "better" than the other (and it's probably what 99% of speaker manufactures do, BTW).
But...by all accounts; the tweeter, that pretty closely resembles what PMC puts...in many of its high-dollar speakers...is the SEAS Prestige 27TFFC. Cost, to any Tom, Dick, or CD...with an internet connection? $47! I don't like "revealing" some of this information, because a) it's nice to have a "secret" (show me an audiophile, that doesn't like to be "in the know"...lol) and b) I don't want to shatter the "illusion" for anyone else. But I've seen $5,000 speakers...with $200 worth of off-the-shelf drivers in them. You think the "box", is worth the other $4800?
Look...you guys know, I'm not one of those all-hi-end audio-is-snake-oil objectivists; but I'm not a please-sheer-me-like-the-sheep-I-am, audio-fool either. I'm a middle-of-the-roader, if ever there was one. I like
knowing the truth; but then I accept the fact, that even if I am "over-paying"...it's the way things works. If I start thinking about mark-ups, at the car dealership...department store, grocery
store; it would be a tough place, to live and consume...lol.
But that's why it rubs me the wrong way, when fans of one brand...will single out another; and call it "over-priced". Like their brand, is a hero to the hobbyist; and is priced "justly". It's ALL "over-priced"...lol.
Originally Posted by jaxwired
For the record, my PMCs look like sh*t but they sound fking awesome.
For the record; not ALL PMCs, look like sh*t...lol. Tom happens to have, the studio
version...of PMCs ~$24,000 IB2i. By foregoing the "fancy" wood cabinet; he paid pennies on the dollar...but still gets, $24k "worth" of sound.
(and they still
, don't look like sh*t, IMO)
Originally Posted by Dynero
Whoa, tough room, are those Excite or Focus surrounds?
VERY tough room, indeed.