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wse's Avatar wse
10:04 AM Liked: 376
post #5761 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 7,050
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Focal are great speakers, the only problem is that in the US the distributor marks up the price by 50 points from the manufacturer, then the dealer marks up the price by 50 points as well, bottom line it's a total rip- off!

I don't get it why Focal cant establish themselves in the US directly, obey they would sell a lt more speakers than they do now!

The distributor (http://www.audioplusservices.com/) basically makes money by just being a middle man with no added value! At the end the customer is the one left holding the bag and over paying for the goods!

B&W is very smart they eliminated the middle man! That is why I will never buy a speaker where there is a distributor, I don't want to feed the middle man.

For example FOCAL DÔME PACK 5.1 WHITE in the US $2599 in France $1699 Euro exchange rate $1US = 0.80 euro
Ryan T.'s Avatar Ryan T.
10:30 AM Liked: 10
post #5762 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Focal are great speakers, the only problem is that in the US the distributor marks up the price by 50 points from the manufacturer, then the dealer marks up the price by 50 points as well, bottom line it's a total rip- off!

I don't get it why Focal cant establish themselves in the US directly, obey they would sell a lt more speakers than they do now!

The distributor (http://www.audioplusservices.com/) basically makes money by just being a middle man with no added value! At the end the customer is the one left holding the bag and over paying for the goods!

B&W is very smart they eliminated the middle man! That is why I will never buy a speaker where there is a distributor, I don't want to feed the middle man.

For example FOCAL DÔME PACK 5.1 WHITE in the US $2599 in France $1699 Euro exchange rate $1US = 0.80 euro

Unfortunately you're always going to be held captive by exchange rates for everything made overseas. This is the case with the EU, UK or Japan. You should see what some US goods cost over there - we actually have it easy!

I think $2600 vs $2200 (approx.) isn't so bad when you consider the distributor definitely has to pay duty to import these goods.

I think ideally Focal wouldn't use a distributor network, but I just don't think they do the volume to handle everything themselves; remember, B&W is a much much bigger manufacturer than Focal - hell, they even sell speakers in Best Buy and headphones in the Apple store now! They're much closer to a mass market company than a boutique, and I'd say Focal is decidedly closer to boutique.
Franin's Avatar Franin
10:39 AM Liked: 304
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05-21-2013 | Posts: 17,620
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Focal are great speakers, the only problem is that in the US the distributor marks up the price by 50 points from the manufacturer, then the dealer marks up the price by 50 points as well, bottom line it's a total rip- off!

It' happens over here on Australia and that's also with B&W and everything else. Everything is a rip off over here in this country.
SuperPoser's Avatar SuperPoser
11:56 AM Liked: 16
post #5764 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan T. View Post

Honestly for movies I'd probably just go with whichever you can get a better deal on / like the looks of better. I think you'll be very please either way.
For music, I believe the Focal's have a significant edge, although I'll admit it has been a while since I've listened to the 9s. But then again, I obviously enjoy Focal's sound; I know some folks prefer Paradigms less revealing musicality.

I was actually thinking the same exact thing, but likewise, it has been a while since I auditioned any Paradigms...
wse's Avatar wse
12:06 PM Liked: 376
post #5765 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 7,050
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View PostIt' happens over here on Australia and that's also with B&W and everything else. Everything is a rip off over here in this country.

That's a bummer mate! Are there any good Australian products in HiFi?  I would just buy locally :)


Tank_PD's Avatar Tank_PD
10:48 PM Liked: 52
post #5766 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Focal are great speakers, the only problem is that in the US the distributor marks up the price by 50 points from the manufacturer, then the dealer marks up the price by 50 points as well, bottom line it's a total rip- off!

I don't get it why Focal cant establish themselves in the US directly, obey they would sell a lt more speakers than they do now!

The distributor (http://www.audioplusservices.com/) basically makes money by just being a middle man with no added value! At the end the customer is the one left holding the bag and over paying for the goods!

B&W is very smart they eliminated the middle man! That is why I will never buy a speaker where there is a distributor, I don't want to feed the middle man.

For example FOCAL DÔME PACK 5.1 WHITE in the US $2599 in France $1699 Euro exchange rate $1US = 0.80 euro

I have always considered Focal a step above Paradigm. Am I mistaken, or is the price difference between the Electra vs. Signature series largely the distributor network? Paradigm would seem to have an advantage being based in Canada. I'd be curious to know what the at cost value of the various models are. But good luck getting that, can't even get a price list on the internet. The prices are a secret til you commit to buy it seems....
Franin's Avatar Franin
10:58 PM Liked: 304
post #5767 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 17,620
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

That's a bummer mate! Are there any good Australian products in HiFi?  I would just buy locally smile.gif

I've tried Aarron speakers which were quite good but comparing them to my focals I prefer the focals. I was actually thinking of upgrading to 1038be but because I'm mainly using my speakers for movies now I won't waste any money on upgrading.
Franin's Avatar Franin
11:02 PM Liked: 304
post #5768 of 6614
05-21-2013 | Posts: 17,620
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tank_PD View Post

I have always considered Focal a step above Paradigm. Am I mistaken, or is the price difference between the Electra vs. Signature series largely the distributor network? Paradigm would seem to have an advantage being based in Canada. I'd be curious to know what the at cost value of the various models are. But good luck getting that, can't even get a price list on the internet. The prices are a secret til you commit to buy it seems....

Paradigm are great speakers, but like Focal they cost a fortune over here
hao_888's Avatar hao_888
08:50 AM Liked: 10
post #5769 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 5
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Hi Focal Owners..

I need some input about purchasing Scala Utopia in display for about 2 years but still in good condition. After I checked Focal website, Scala Utopia already discontinued and replace with Scala Utopia V2. The V2 have a new redesigned 11" W woofer with same MSRP. I couldn't find further information about this product on google due these loudspeaker are very new. The dealer offers me for $14000. Is it worth to buy this display Scala Utopia or wait for the Scala V2?

BTW, my current stereo setup is Focal Chorus 826V, Musical Fidelity M1CDT, Musical Fidelity M1DAC, Musical Fidelity M6PRE and Vincent SP-993.
SuperPoser's Avatar SuperPoser
09:45 AM Liked: 16
post #5770 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 112
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Scala Utopia is a huge step up from the 826! I am not familiar with your electronics, but you may want to audition them to ensure your electronics are not holding the speakers back.
What did they quote to you for the new V2?
My personal rule of thumb for anything (not just speakers): A discontinued model should be 10% or more discounted, and being it was used (or a display model) should be 25% or more off... Using my rule of thumb, I would want these to be at least 35% less than the cost of the new ones.
Goodluck!
hao_888's Avatar hao_888
10:28 AM Liked: 10
post #5771 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperPoser View Post

Scala Utopia is a huge step up from the 826! I am not familiar with your electronics, but you may want to audition them to ensure your electronics are not holding the speakers back.
What did they quote to you for the new V2?
My personal rule of thumb for anything (not just speakers): A discontinued model should be 10% or more discounted, and being it was used (or a display model) should be 25% or more off... Using my rule of thumb, I would want these to be at least 35% less than the cost of the new ones.
Goodluck!

Hi SuperPoser,
Sorry about my electronics, I forgot to mention the brand, edited. Yes, the best way is to audition the Scala with my current electronics but I think that would be not easy because the dealer location is too far away from me.
Yes, I agree with your personal rule of thumb. The MSRP of Scala Utopia is $30000, right? May I know how much discount the local dealer in your country give you for the Utopia line for the new one? Just want to compare the price in my country. I live in Indonesia.
Rod#S's Avatar Rod#S
10:54 AM Liked: 29
post #5772 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 1,767
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I'm not a Focal owner but if they are in like new condition with not a mark on them and you will get full manufacturer's warranty, at $14k this sounds like an exceptional deal to me if they list for $30k new where you live.
SuperPoser's Avatar SuperPoser
12:17 PM Liked: 16
post #5773 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 112
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$30,000 new (MSRP), or $14,000 for the display set... that is more than 50% off!!! You may want to ask the same place how much they charge for a the new V2 to see if it is close to MSRP. (I would think their sales price would be a little less.)
If you have the money and that's what you want, like Rod#S said it sounds like a great deal!
(I don't know the price of them here in the states...)
Tank_PD's Avatar Tank_PD
01:03 PM Liked: 52
post #5774 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperPoser View Post

$30,000 new (MSRP), or $14,000 for the display set... that is more than 50% off!!! You may want to ask the same place how much they charge for a the new V2 to see if it is close to MSRP. (I would think their sales price would be a little less.)
If you have the money and that's what you want, like Rod#S said it sounds like a great deal!
(I don't know the price of them here in the states...)

What do you mean new version 2? Are there new Scala Utopia's coming out?
SuperPoser's Avatar SuperPoser
01:59 PM Liked: 16
post #5775 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 112
Joined: Oct 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tank_PD View Post

What do you mean new version 2? Are there new Scala Utopia's coming out?

See hao_888's post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by hao_888 View Post

Hi Focal Owners..

I need some input about purchasing Scala Utopia in display for about 2 years but still in good condition. After I checked Focal website, Scala Utopia already discontinued and replace with Scala Utopia V2. The V2 have a new redesigned 11" W woofer with same MSRP. I couldn't find further information about this product on google due these loudspeaker are very new. The dealer offers me for $14000. Is it worth to buy this display Scala Utopia or wait for the Scala V2?

BTW, my current stereo setup is Focal Chorus 826V, Musical Fidelity M1CDT, Musical Fidelity M1DAC, Musical Fidelity M6PRE and Vincent SP-993.

Tank_PD's Avatar Tank_PD
02:36 PM Liked: 52
post #5776 of 6614
05-22-2013 | Posts: 815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperPoser View Post

See hao_888's post:

Thanks, I was so excited I failed at reading comprehension. I apologize.
hao_888's Avatar hao_888
10:06 AM Liked: 10
post #5777 of 6614
05-23-2013 | Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod#S View Post

I'm not a Focal owner but if they are in like new condition with not a mark on them and you will get full manufacturer's warranty, at $14k this sounds like an exceptional deal to me if they list for $30k new where you live.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperPoser View Post

$30,000 new (MSRP), or $14,000 for the display set... that is more than 50% off!!! You may want to ask the same place how much they charge for a the new V2 to see if it is close to MSRP. (I would think their sales price would be a little less.)
If you have the money and that's what you want, like Rod#S said it sounds like a great deal!
(I don't know the price of them here in the states...)

You're right Rod, forget to ask about the warranty. Thanks for remind me that.

Actually I was interesting with the Electra 1028BE, but the dealer offers me the Scala with a great deal. As I know, the Utopia lines get 30-35% off from pricelist here. So I need to know in other country, what is the best discount for the Utopia lines. Anyone who know, inform me here please smile.gif
sid369's Avatar sid369
01:04 PM Liked: 11
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05-23-2013 | Posts: 648
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How are focal for HT, I mean the 700 series, is their center channel good in that series? or is the 700 series mores suited for movies?
ronrags's Avatar ronrags
05:04 PM Liked: 10
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05-23-2013 | Posts: 150
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Sid369,

I use to own the 700 series and thought they were very good for home theater. My fronts were the 726v, 705v for the rears and the cc700. I think it's important to have equal timbre all around and the 700cc blended very well with the 726v with both movies and 5 channel audio. I eventually upgraded to the electra series but always thought the 700 series was a great bargain. At the time I compared the 700 series to other brands like Paradigm but always thought Focal speakers offered the most consistent and well balanced sound. Highly recommended.

BTW- what electronics are you using?
hao_888's Avatar hao_888
08:54 PM Liked: 10
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05-23-2013 | Posts: 5
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There are new Focal Chorus 700 lines, with new tweeter TNV2 with slightly a bit change in look, more classic looks than previous Chorus 700V. For movies, Chorus series performs very well in its class. Worth every penny..

Ronrags,
Very nice upgrade, btw! Did you replace all your 700 series with Electra? How much did you spend for Electra?
Ryan T.'s Avatar Ryan T.
08:22 AM Liked: 10
post #5781 of 6614
05-24-2013 | Posts: 122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hao_888 View Post

There are new Focal Chorus 700 lines, with new tweeter TNV2 with slightly a bit change in look, more classic looks than previous Chorus 700V. For movies, Chorus series performs very well in its class. Worth every penny..

Ronrags,
Very nice upgrade, btw! Did you replace all your 700 series with Electra? How much did you spend for Electra?

For a room that doesn't need the extra volume capability, my old Focal Chorus 700 series performs 90% as admirably on movies as my new Electra Be 5.1 setup. That's amazing to me but speaks volumes about the quality of Focal's entry level stuff.

Musically it's a different story, but they're great in that respect too - just not quite 90% of a system that literally costs 10-15x as much.
sid369's Avatar sid369
08:50 AM Liked: 11
post #5782 of 6614
05-24-2013 | Posts: 648
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrags View Post

Sid369,

I use to own the 700 series and thought they were very good for home theater. My fronts were the 726v, 705v for the rears and the cc700. I think it's important to have equal timbre all around and the 700cc blended very well with the 726v with both movies and 5 channel audio. I eventually upgraded to the electra series but always thought the 700 series was a great bargain. At the time I compared the 700 series to other brands like Paradigm but always thought Focal speakers offered the most consistent and well balanced sound. Highly recommended.

BTW- what electronics are you using?

I spoke to a dealer who carries both paradigm and focal and he said that for HT Paradigm is better because their center is much better than focals, but fro 2 channel music focal is great.
SuperPoser's Avatar SuperPoser
11:00 AM Liked: 16
post #5783 of 6614
05-24-2013 | Posts: 112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sid369 View Post

I spoke to a dealer who carries both paradigm and focal and he said that for HT Paradigm is better because their center is much better than focals, but fro 2 channel music focal is great.

I upgraded from a Chorus S center to a Profile Center and it was an amazing upgrade for movies!
I have not auditioned any Paradigm centers so can't comment on the dealer's statement, but for the Chorus S line, the center channel was the biggest problem. The Chorus V series Center have an elevated tweeter which is supposed to be an improvement over the Chorus S series Center.
http://www.paradigm.com/products/products-by-category/center
Being as all the Paradigms are 3-ways, I could see why the dealer says this.
Are you able to audition both systems to see which you prefer?
kzhtoo's Avatar kzhtoo
03:48 PM Liked: 17
post #5784 of 6614
05-24-2013 | Posts: 274
Joined: Apr 2012
Anyone knows why Scala V2? It seems Scala is the only Utopia getting a refresh.
ronrags's Avatar ronrags
05:52 PM Liked: 10
post #5785 of 6614
05-24-2013 | Posts: 150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hao_888 View Post

There are new Focal Chorus 700 lines, with new tweeter TNV2 with slightly a bit change in look, more classic looks than previous Chorus 700V. For movies, Chorus series performs very well in its class. Worth every penny..

Ronrags,
Very nice upgrade, btw! Did you replace all your 700 series with Electra? How much did you spend for Electra?


I did replace the entire 700 series with the electra series. As I stated, I believe it's important to have balance and synergy between all 5 speakers. I bought all the speakers on audiogon between 40 to 50% off msrp. But if you hvae budget constraints, the 700 series is the way to go.

Concerning your dealer's choice of the Paradigm's center channel being better than the 700 series center, I cannot say. But again I stress the point of having speakers match especially in the front. The Paradigms always seemed a bit bass heavy to me and not as smooth as the focals. It also depends on your electronics. When I moved up to the electra series, I also upgraded to Classe equipment.


BTW- I recently sold my entire HT set-up except the Focal 1027be and went back to 2 channel since I spend more time these days listening to music. Even though the Classe equipment sounded great for HT, it doesn't sound as good as a dedicated 2 channel set-up.
hao_888's Avatar hao_888
08:00 AM Liked: 10
post #5786 of 6614
05-27-2013 | Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan T. View Post

For a room that doesn't need the extra volume capability, my old Focal Chorus 700 series performs 90% as admirably on movies as my new Electra Be 5.1 setup. That's amazing to me but speaks volumes about the quality of Focal's entry level stuff.

Musically it's a different story, but they're great in that respect too - just not quite 90% of a system that literally costs 10-15x as much.

Focal Chorus in term of playing loud, they do pretty well especially for movies. I like my current Chorus setup, but want to experience with the higher level stuff biggrin.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrags View Post

I did replace the entire 700 series with the electra series. As I stated, I believe it's important to have balance and synergy between all 5 speakers. I bought all the speakers on audiogon between 40 to 50% off msrp. But if you hvae budget constraints, the 700 series is the way to go.

Concerning your dealer's choice of the Paradigm's center channel being better than the 700 series center, I cannot say. But again I stress the point of having speakers match especially in the front. The Paradigms always seemed a bit bass heavy to me and not as smooth as the focals. It also depends on your electronics. When I moved up to the electra series, I also upgraded to Classe equipment.


BTW- I recently sold my entire HT set-up except the Focal 1027be and went back to 2 channel since I spend more time these days listening to music. Even though the Classe equipment sounded great for HT, it doesn't sound as good as a dedicated 2 channel set-up.

So you have 2 channel setup, Focal 1027BE with Classe electronics right now. no more HT for movies. Still thinking which one should I get, Scala Utopia or Eelectra 1028BE. If I take Electra, still have some bucks for upgrading the electronics lol.
kzhtoo's Avatar kzhtoo
05:18 PM Liked: 17
post #5787 of 6614
05-27-2013 | Posts: 274
Joined: Apr 2012
At Utopia/ Electra level, do not underestimate the quality of electronics you need (esp. if you're talking about 2-ch). If getting Utopia limits the budget, IMO getting Electra to channel some budget for quality electronics will be my preferable way.
avman09's Avatar avman09
05:22 PM Liked: 18
post #5788 of 6614
06-04-2013 | Posts: 496
Joined: Jan 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tank_PD View Post

I have always considered Focal a step above Paradigm. Am I mistaken, or is the price difference between the Electra vs. Signature series largely the distributor network? Paradigm would seem to have an advantage being based in Canada. I'd be curious to know what the at cost value of the various models are. But good luck getting that, can't even get a price list on the internet. The prices are a secret til you commit to buy it seems....

I have not compare the 1028 side by side with the S8 but I did spend a lot of time listening to my favorite pieces on discs and usbs. My conclusion is that the 1028 sounds better overall, especially with violin, mass strings and brass. The S8 is much bigger, has more and larger woofers but I didn't even find them better in bass. In fact, if I were to go with Paradigm I think the Studios are much better deals because the S8 didn't sound that great to me. The S8 also costs more, so to me it is a no brainer, but this is a subjective matter. Many people will prefer the S8 or 804 diamond.
avman09's Avatar avman09
05:25 PM Liked: 18
post #5789 of 6614
06-04-2013 | Posts: 496
Joined: Jan 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by kzhtoo View Post

At Utopia/ Electra level, do not underestimate the quality of electronics you need (esp. if you're talking about 2-ch). If getting Utopia limits the budget, IMO getting Electra to channel some budget for quality electronics will be my preferable way.

I find the source media matters most, used to think preamp/amps are critical but no longer feel this way, and I know I am no audiophile.
wse's Avatar wse
05:40 PM Liked: 376
post #5790 of 6614
06-04-2013 | Posts: 7,050
Joined: Mar 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by ronrags View Post

I did replace the entire 700 series with the electra series. As I stated, I believe it's important to have balance and synergy between all 5 speakers. I bought all the speakers on audiogon between 40 to 50% off msrp. But if you hvae budget constraints, the 700 series is the way to go.

Concerning your dealer's choice of the Paradigm's center channel being better than the 700 series center, I cannot say. But again I stress the point of having speakers match especially in the front. The Paradigms always seemed a bit bass heavy to me and not as smooth as the focals. It also depends on your electronics. When I moved up to the electra series, I also upgraded to Classe equipment. BTW- I recently sold my entire HT set-up except the Focal 1027be and went back to 2 channel since I spend more time these days listening to music. Even though the Classe equipment sounded great for HT, it doesn't sound as good as a dedicated 2 channel set-up.

The Classe CP-800 sound really good
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