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jostenmeat's Avatar jostenmeat 09:54 AM 10-20-2007
Though I know nothing of speaker finishes or Revel speakers, you might consider automotive "swirl remover" products. People use it on fine musical instruments, even those finished with the ultra-delicate "french polish". (Something that "auto polish" would ruin). In any case, make sure whatever you use is ok!

syswei's Avatar syswei 10:04 AM 10-20-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinkledorf View Post

A little off topic but, I was hoping that some of the Studio/Salon owners would chime in. I own a pair of the Studios and was wondering if there's a polish that you can use on the speakers that would remove swirls.

I suggest calling Revel tech support. If they don't have a specific suggestion, they can at least find out for you what type of finish it is (for instance, polyester) so you can find a compatible product.
syswei's Avatar syswei 10:59 AM 10-20-2007
Found a picture of Alywn's setup that he posted here:
http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1192109585.jpg

Nice setup, Alywn!
howaboutthat41's Avatar howaboutthat41 12:38 PM 10-20-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by syswei View Post

Found a picture of Alywn's setup that he posted here:
http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1192109585.jpg

Nice setup, Alywn!


Wow -- that system must push a lot of sound in that room!
Rinkledorf's Avatar Rinkledorf 01:30 PM 10-20-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by syswei View Post

I suggest calling Revel tech support. If they don't have a specific suggestion, they can at least find out for you what type of finish it is (for instance, polyester) so you can find a compatible product.

Thanks for the suggestions guys. First off, the swirls are super fine. I don't think a camera would pick it up. And whatever I use (even Revel recommended) I'll try it on area not seen. Maybe behind a side panel. Sometimes the panels need to be removed so that the inside of the grill can be vacuumed.
Need4spdnb's Avatar Need4spdnb 06:23 PM 10-23-2007
Those of you with a Performa setup, what amplifier are you using to drive them? I am looking at a F52, C52, and S30 setup. I have a Lexicon NT512 right now but I don't think it will be enough power. Any recommendations?
ssteel01's Avatar ssteel01 11:39 AM 10-24-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4spdnb View Post

Those of you with a Performa setup, what amplifier are you using to drive them? I am looking at a F52, C52, and S30 setup. I have a Lexicon NT512 right now but I don't think it will be enough power. Any recommendations?

The Lexicon is what, 100-125 WPC? How big of a room is it, is it open to adjoining rooms, etc.?


Scott
Need4spdnb's Avatar Need4spdnb 12:59 PM 10-24-2007
Scott,
The lexicon is 125 x 5. My paradigm signatures used up the juice in this amp and made it go into protection mode. They are more efficient than the F52's are, so I definetly need a new amp.

Room is 19x17 with a 15ft vaulted ceiling. It opens into a kitchen which is probably 25x15 ft.

I was looking at something 200w per channel. Lots of good ones in that category, just don't want anything that is bright (ie Anthem amps).
ssteel01's Avatar ssteel01 01:24 PM 10-24-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4spdnb View Post

Scott,
The lexicon is 125 x 5. My paradigm signatures used up the juice in this amp and made it go into protection mode. They are more efficient than the F52's are, so I definetly need a new amp.

Room is 19x17 with a 15ft vaulted ceiling. It opens into a kitchen which is probably 25x15 ft.

I was looking at something 200w per channel. Lots of good ones in that category, just don't want anything that is bright (ie Anthem amps).

Yeah...that's a pretty substantial room. I probably should have asked your price range, but, just to throw out a couple 200WPC amps that I have some sort of direct experience with and wouldn't consider bright (across a pretty wide price range):

Sunfire (I liked the old Cinema Grand, but don't really have any experience with the new models)

B&K Ref 200

If you like the old Lex/Bryston and price is no object maybe consider a combo of a Bryston 4B and 6B. That would make for a pretty sick setup...

Sherbourn (this is what I use to drive F32's. Definitely the "budget" amp of this crowd)


Scott
marklnj's Avatar marklnj 01:31 PM 10-24-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4spdnb View Post

Those of you with a Performa setup, what amplifier are you using to drive them? I am looking at a F52, C52, and S30 setup. I have a Lexicon NT512 right now but I don't think it will be enough power. Any recommendations?

What is your budget?

I have the Performa F32/C32/M22 system. I am using a Cinepro 6.4 (aka Verastarr 6.4SE), 6 channels/400 wpc bridgable to 3 channels/800wpc, which I got for much less than half of msrp. The amp is simply dynamite--dynamic, detailed and musical.
RMK!'s Avatar RMK! 05:39 PM 10-24-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4spdnb View Post

Those of you with a Performa setup, what amplifier are you using to drive them? I am looking at a F52, C52, and S30 setup. I have a Lexicon NT512 right now but I don't think it will be enough power. Any recommendations?

I have a F52,C52 and F32 5.1 system and I'm using a 4 year old, cool running Sunfire Sig. 400/5. This amp can drive the Revels much louder than I need/want.
Zoubs's Avatar Zoubs 08:32 PM 10-24-2007
Quote:


I have a F52,C52 and F32 5.1 system and I'm using a 4 year old, cool running Sunfire Sig. 400/5. This amp can drive the Revels much louder than I need/want

I have been temporarily using the same amp to drive my ultimas (salons, voice, embrace)

Very surprising the capabilities of this amp. The amp pushes the salons at full levels effortlessly, no matter how demanding the sound track.
Need4spdnb's Avatar Need4spdnb 08:54 PM 10-24-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by marklnj View Post

What is your budget?

I have the Performa F32/C32/M22 system. I am using a Cinepro 6.4 (aka Verastarr 6.4SE), 6 channels/400 wpc bridgable to 3 channels/800wpc, which I got for much less than half of msrp. The amp is simply dynamite--dynamic, detailed and musical.

I would say under 5k new or used. I am not opposed to Audiogon. I was thinking along the lines of a Theta Dreadnaught II, Krell HTS, etc. I can get a good deal on an Anthem P5, I would have to see what that would sound like because I have an Anthem D2 pre right now and it is slightly bright. I know their amps are also semi bright. Maybe the Parasound Halo A51. Any other thoughts?
marklnj's Avatar marklnj 08:16 AM 10-25-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4spdnb View Post

I would say under 5k new or used. I am not opposed to Audiogon. I was thinking along the lines of a Theta Dreadnaught II, Krell HTS, etc. I can get a good deal on an Anthem P5, I would have to see what that would sound like because I have an Anthem D2 pre right now and it is slightly bright. I know their amps are also semi bright. Maybe the Parasound Halo A51. Any other thoughts?

You can't go wrong with any of the amps you mentioned and I see that they have some really good deals on A-gon. I'd also consider the Halco MC50 for its detail and neutrality, I like the Theta warmth, similar to my 6.4... but I chose the Cinepro b/c of the power reserves and the extra channel.

The Verastarr is definitely not bright, it probably leans to the darker side of neutral, if at all, in my system.
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 03:04 PM 10-25-2007
Both the Salons and my Ayre amps MX-R are now fully run in,and they are sounding wonderful.I have just listened to a new sacd recording with the above listed artists playing Mozart concertone for two violins and orchestra in Eflat,K,364 And it was just as if I was at the concert hall listening to the music being played to me live,absolutley superb.These speakers must rank amongst the worlds best.The thing that strikes me is the power that this combo of amps/speakers can give without being a strain on the listener,many times in the past with other speakers,I have reduced the volume because it hurt my ears,but with these I can turn the music up to its full soundstage image and have no problems.I would just add a comment regarding the Ayre amps,they give sound that is both delicate and yet precise their musicality is breath taking,and their power astonishing.
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 03:08 PM 10-25-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by syswei View Post

Found a picture of Alywn's setup that he posted here:
http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1192109585.jpg

Nice setup, Alywn!

Thank you for showing my system,and your kind remarks
alwyn
Rinkledorf's Avatar Rinkledorf 04:13 PM 10-25-2007
Alwyn, I had a question about your Ayre's. Are they the ones that are milled out of a solid piece of aluminum? If so, I heard a pair of these about 3 mo. ago. Beautiful sounding amps, and for their smallish size over 50 lbs apeice. Fantastic setup BTW.
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 04:41 PM 10-25-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinkledorf View Post

Alwyn, I had a question about your Ayre's. Are they the ones that are milled out of a solid piece of aluminum? If so, I heard a pair of these about 3 mo. ago. Beautiful sounding amps, and for their smallish size over 50 lbs apeice. Fantastic setup BTW.

Yes they are the ones that you heard MX-R.
syswei's Avatar syswei 05:43 PM 10-25-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by alwynwilliams View Post

Both the Salons and my Ayre amps MX-R are now fully run in,and they are sounding wonderful.I have just listened to a new sacd recording with the above listed artists playing Mozart concertone for two violins and orchestra in Eflat,K,364 And it was just as if I was at the concert hall listening to the music being played to me live,absolutley superb.These speakers must rank amongst the worlds best.The thing that strikes me is the power that this combo of amps/speakers can give without being a strain on the listener,many times in the past with other speakers,I have reduced the volume because it hurt my ears,but with these I can turn the music up to its full soundstage image and have no problems.I would just add a comment regarding the Ayre amps,they give sound that is both delicate and yet precise their musicality is breath taking,and their power astonishing.


Alwyn,

What are the dimensions of your room, and how far do you sit from the speakers? Sounds like you are listening at live-concert volumes?

Glad you are enjoying your system!

If I get Ultima2s, it is likely to be the Studio2, partly because of cost, partly because of efficiency (3dB better), and partly because the drivers are a match for the Voice2 (I am still concerned that the Voice2 is relatively overpriced, though).
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 03:31 AM 10-26-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by syswei View Post

Alwyn,

What are the dimensions of your room, and how far do you sit from the speakers? Sounds like you are listening at live-concert volumes?

Glad you are enjoying your system!

If I get Ultima2s, it is likely to be the Studio2, partly because of cost, partly because of efficiency (3dB better), and partly because the drivers are a match for the Voice2 (I am still concerned that the Voice2 is relatively overpriced, though).

The room is 20ft x12ft.I sit eight feet away from the speakers and they are spaced six feet between them,each speaker has two feet space from both rear and side walls.I use an out of phase recording to get max stereo effect from them,towing in inch by inch untill I get an all arround the room sound,this results in very precise stereo.
TrebleVsBass's Avatar TrebleVsBass 05:06 PM 10-29-2007
Hello everyone,

1)How good is the f32 over the m22? Would you notice the difference with a subwoofer?
2)is it better to get a f32 and get a cheaper subwoofer(~$500)? or use m22 with more expensive subwoofer(~$1500)? assuming both combinations cost the same.
3) Can you guys recommend me a subwoofer to go with m22s? (budget around $1500) How does the revel b15a stack up against the subwoofers talked about frequently on the forums? (like svs 13 ultra, epik tower, hsu vtf3 etc..)

The living room is 19*12 but open to kitchen and dining area on half of one of the long sides. Kitchen and dining area together would add more or less the same area to the living room. The speakers face the other long side with one speaker's back facing the wall and the other one's back facing the high kitchen counter wall. , so the listening distance to the speakers is around 9 feet along the shorter sides.

Thank you.
rich wu's Avatar rich wu 11:08 PM 10-29-2007
alwyn,

I am considering replacing my Revel Studio with either the Salon 2 or Studio2. I would prefer the Salon but I am concerned that my room (25 x 16 ) may be too small for the Salon. How is the bass response in your room?

Also, how well does the old Voice match with the Salon2? I have the Voice and two pairs of Embraces in my system.

Thanks,
Rich
hifisponge's Avatar hifisponge 12:40 AM 10-30-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrebleVsBass View Post

Hello everyone,

1)How good is the f32 over the m22? Would you notice the difference with a subwoofer?
2)is it better to get a f32 and get a cheaper subwoofer(~$500)? or use m22 with more expensive subwoofer(~$1500)? assuming both combinations cost the same.
3) Can you guys recommend me a subwoofer to go with m22s? (budget around $1500) How does the revel b15a stack up against the subwoofers talked about frequently on the forums? (like svs 13 ultra, epik tower, hsu vtf3 etc..)

The living room is 19*12 but open to kitchen and dining area on half of one of the long sides. Kitchen and dining area together would add more or less the same area to the living room. The speakers face the other long side with one speaker's back facing the wall and the other one's back facing the high kitchen counter wall. , so the listening distance to the speakers is around 9 feet along the shorter sides.

Thank you.

You will only really benefit from the F32 + sub over the M22 + sub if a)you really like to crank action flicks to reference levels; b)play music at live rock concert levels; c)if you have a relatively large room; or d)you want the option to listen to music in stereo with out a sub at times. It all comes down to this: the extra bass drivers and larger cabinet of the F32 results in two primary advantages over a bookshelf--more extended bass and the ability to play louder.

I run floorstanding speakers with a sub because I want the high-output capability for movies, and I find that even with music, the added drivers in the floorstander provide an effortless quality at medium to high volumes.

With that said, you really don't want to pair a cheap sub with a speaker the caliber of the F32. Cheap subs tend to be boomy and/or peaky and have high distortion levels which will muddy up the sound of the F32's.

Oh, and the Revel sub is great, though as with many high-end speakers you are paying for the nicer cabinet quality of the sub and you could probably get similar performance from a more value oriented brand like SVS and HSU. They just won't look as nice or match your main speakers, if that is important to you.
ssteel01's Avatar ssteel01 07:44 AM 10-30-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifisponge View Post

With that said, you really don't want to pair a cheap sub with a speaker the caliber of the F32. Cheap subs tend to be boomy and/or peaky and have high distortion levels which will muddy up the sound of the F32's.

I'd second that, but with a qualifier. If you're only using the sub for HT and NOT music, I think you can get away with a cheaper sub w/ the F32's. I defintely prefer to run them full range for music, but they go low enough that a sub is not needed for the stuff I generally listen to. If you're going with the M22's, I'd consider a higher quality/more musical sub than the big box du jour of the sub forum.

Just my 2c.

Scott
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 12:37 PM 10-30-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by rich wu View Post

alwyn,

I am considering replacing my Revel Studio with either the Salon 2 or Studio2. I would prefer the Salon but I am concerned that my room (25 x 16 ) may be too small for the Salon. How is the bass response in your room?

Also, how well does the old Voice match with the Salon2? I have the Voice and two pairs of Embraces in my system.

Thanks,
Rich

iN MY OPINION,YOU WILL NOT HAVE ANY PROBLEMS USING THE SALON2 IN YOUR ROOM,THE BASS IS STRONG BUT WELL CONTROLED,I USED A REVEL Q400 WITH MY PREVIOUS F52 BUT WITH THE SALONS THE SUB IS REDUNDENT.
AS FOR THE VOICE1 IT BLENDS IN WITH THE SALON2 NO PROBLEM,I WOULD ADD,THAT I NEVER USE SURROUND SOUND FOR MUSIC,ONLY THE TWO FRONT SPEAKERS,SO MY CENTRE SPEAKER IS ONLY EVER USED FOR A/V AND WITH THAT I FIND IT FIRST CLASS.
alwyn
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 12:59 PM 10-31-2007
Has anyone seen a revue of the new Salon 2 yet,I would have thought that after five months of the Salon being available in the US that at least one Mag. would have revued them
hifisponge's Avatar hifisponge 03:47 PM 10-31-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by alwynwilliams View Post

Has anyone seen a revue of the new Salon 2 yet,I would have thought that after five months of the Salon being available in the US that at least one Mag. would have revued them

This is the only Ultima2 review I have seen so far--it's for the Studio2 model.

http://ultimateavmag.com/speakersystems/1007rev/
alwynwilliams's Avatar alwynwilliams 04:32 AM 11-01-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifisponge View Post

This is the only Ultima2 review I have seen so far--it's for the Studio2 model.

http://ultimateavmag.com/speakersystems/1007rev/

Thanks for that,the revue amazes me in suggesting that the speaker should be used with a sub operating below 80hz for two channel music,does this guy know what he is talking about,to me the speaker should be allowed its full range for music.I realize that he is using the Studio and that my experience is with the Salon,but even so I can see no justifercation in stifling the natural range of such a qaulity speaker when listening to music,with any sub.
Kal Rubinson's Avatar Kal Rubinson 11:14 AM 11-01-2007
I don't know about 80Hz but, frankly, 2 speaker stereo is subject to the complication that the best site for wide-range imaging is rarely the best site for bass accuracy and linearity, even with the best of full-range speakers. (It can be but compromise is usually involved.)

Adding the sub permits greater optimization.
hifisponge's Avatar hifisponge 11:45 AM 11-01-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

I don't know about 80Hz but, frankly, 2 speaker stereo is subject to the complication that the best site for wide-range imaging is rarely the best site for bass accuracy and linearity, even with the best of full-range speakers. (It can be but compromise is usually involved.)

Adding the sub permits greater optimization.

I completely agree, and if you have a sub like the Velodyne DD (or the SMS-1 connected to any quality sub), the issues with proper integration between sub and mains pretty much goes away.

Speaking of, I own a Velodyne DD15, and I recently changed to new tower L/R speakers (coming from stand-mounts). When I first set them up, I ran the L/R's full range, they sounded nice and tight in the upper-bass, but a little boomy down low. When I switched in the sub, I noticed that the punch that was present in the L/R's playing full-range was now missing. So I hooked up the mic to the DD15 and ran the frequency sweep. Based on the readout of the FR, it was clear that there was cancelation happening in the cross-over region. I flipped the polarity on the sub and checked the FR readout again. The large dip at the crossover point had diminished but not completely. So next I inverted the phase and what do ya know . . . there was now a perfect blend between the mains and the sub. To get rid of the "boom" at the bottom, I notched out an 8dB peak at 30Hz caused by the room using the parametric EQ built into the sub. The end result: all of the punch and clarity of running the L/R's full-range, added LF extension and none of the room boom.
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