Revel Owners Thread - Page 232 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6931 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 10:39 AM
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What is that you say Sonny! biggrin.gif

It's even ok for B&w owners to visit us smile.gif
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post #6932 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 11:40 AM
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Add me to the Revel owners club!smile.gif

I ordered the F-208's & C-208. They should be here in about a week. They will be replacing Definitive Tech BP 2000TL & CS-8080HD. I have no idea how they will mesh but I'm going to move the BP's to the back and use those monsters as surrounds, at least temporarily. My pre amp is a Marantz AV 8801 powered by an Emoitiva XPR-5, as I couldn't afford Parasound at the time redface.gif .

I have a question about the break in period. How many hours would you suggest and what would be a good way to break in all three speakers evenly? I have DirecTv and was thinking about just leaving on an HD 5.1 channel like HBO or Showtime at low db but then most of the volume and all of the dialog would come from the center speaker and I'm not sure if the two F-208's would get broken in sufficiently.

What do you guys think?
Thanks in advance.
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post #6933 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 12:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steady teddy View Post

Add me to the Revel owners club!smile.gif

I ordered the F-208's & C-208. They should be here in about a week. They will be replacing Definitive Tech BP 2000TL & CS-8080HD. I have no idea how they will mesh but I'm going to move the BP's to the back and use those monsters as surrounds, at least temporarily. My pre amp is a Marantz AV 8801 powered by an Emoitiva XPR-5, as I couldn't afford Parasound at the time redface.gif .

I have a question about the break in period. How many hours would you suggest and what would be a good way to break in all three speakers evenly? I have DirecTv and was thinking about just leaving on an HD 5.1 channel like HBO or Showtime at low db but then most of the volume and all of the dialog would come from the center speaker and I'm not sure if the two F-208's would get broken in sufficiently.

What do you guys think?
Thanks in advance.

Congrats! You'll love them.

Break in is a myth and does not exist (audibly, anyway). Fire them up when you get them and enjoy!
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post #6934 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 12:41 PM
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Break in isn't completely a myth. It depends on the drivers too. Just connect them to a powerful amp and play them LOUD for about 30 minutes before you do any critical listening. Low volume won't do much. If you if your paranoid try low volume then gradually turn it up.
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post #6935 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steady teddy View Post

Add me to the Revel owners club!smile.gif

I ordered the F-208's & C-208. They should be here in about a week. They will be replacing Definitive Tech BP 2000TL & CS-8080HD. I have no idea how they will mesh but I'm going to move the BP's to the back and use those monsters as surrounds, at least temporarily. My pre amp is a Marantz AV 8801 powered by an Emoitiva XPR-5, as I couldn't afford Parasound at the time redface.gif .

I have a question about the break in period. How many hours would you suggest and what would be a good way to break in all three speakers evenly? I have DirecTv and was thinking about just leaving on an HD 5.1 channel like HBO or Showtime at low db but then most of the volume and all of the dialog would come from the center speaker and I'm not sure if the two F-208's would get broken in sufficiently.

What do you guys think?
Thanks in advance.
Congrats!

The DT BP will make great surrounds. I don't think surrounds are that important in general. But if you ever feel the upgrade itch in the future, you can always add Revel bookshelf for surrounds. No hurry, though. Enjoy.

Breaki-in period is 50 years. biggrin.gif

Just listen to sensible volume at all times. Take care of your hearing and your speakers. You can't go wrong. wink.gif

I would never crank up to crazy volume just for the sake of "breaking-in" anything. biggrin.gif

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post #6936 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 02:57 PM
 
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Snagged a pair of like new F206's yesterday.

Gotta say, 1st impression is pretty good bang for the buck speaker.
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post #6937 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 03:28 PM
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Snagged a pair of like new F206's yesterday.

Gotta say, 1st impression is pretty good bang for the buck speaker.
Congrats and welcome to the club. Huge value there!

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post #6938 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 03:29 PM
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Man, it's getting crowded in the Revel Club House smile.gif

 

It ain't ignorance causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so

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post #6939 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Breaki-in period is 50 years. biggrin.gif

Just listen to sensible volume at all times. Take care of your hearing and your speakers. You can't go wrong. wink.gif

I would never crank up to crazy volume just for the sake of "breaking-in" anything. biggrin.gif

Or more biggrin.gif. Yes you will change speakers before you change your ears wink.gif. Max volume for me for "Break-in" is 90 db and I stay out of the room wink.gif I like to protect my ears now too many night clubs when I was younger and did not know any better mad.gif
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post #6940 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Milt99 View Post

Man, it's getting crowded in the Revel Club House smile.gif

Is that a bad thing? West of California does that mean Hawaii ?
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post #6941 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 05:55 PM
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That will not sound bad at all. If it did, the vast majority of recordings would not be less than DR10 tongue.gif

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Thank you, thank you this is not the case!

J River 19 has an option to run DR and EU R128 analysis on music files.
Perhaps, it is just my collection but the older recording (1987-1991) are more likely to exceed DR10 and more recent CD's.

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post #6942 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by steady teddy View Post

Add me to the Revel owners club!smile.gif

I ordered the F-208's & C-208. They should be here in about a week. They will be replacing Definitive Tech BP 2000TL & CS-8080HD. I have no idea how they will mesh but I'm going to move the BP's to the back and use those monsters as surrounds, at least temporarily. My pre amp is a Marantz AV 8801 powered by an Emoitiva XPR-5, as I couldn't afford Parasound at the time redface.gif .

I have a question about the break in period. How many hours would you suggest and what would be a good way to break in all three speakers evenly? I have DirecTv and was thinking about just leaving on an HD 5.1 channel like HBO or Showtime at low db but then most of the volume and all of the dialog would come from the center speaker and I'm not sure if the two F-208's would get broken in sufficiently.

What do you guys think?
Thanks in advance.

Congratulations. They are great speakers.

Many think break-in is a myth. When I replaced a Tweeter on the Salon, Revel tech support told me it at about 8 hours at normal and not excessive volume. So if you go with that play them for a day tongue.gif

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post #6943 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 06:31 PM
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I auditioned Studio2s new out of the box and they definitely broke in for the first four hours, primarily in the bass. No question for me.

Main Kef: Reference 205/2 & 202/2c, Surrounds: Kef XQ40, Velodyne Optimum 12, Integra DHC 80.3, Ayre K-5xeMP, Oppo BDP-103, Bryston 4Bsst2, Parasound Halo A31. Second B&W: 685 (3), CCM618, Def Tech Powerfield 1500, Onkyo TX-NR1008, Zone 2 Klipsch AW650.
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post #6944 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 06:50 PM
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Thanks for everyone's input. Can't wait till the new speakers arrive! It's gonna seem like a long wait.
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post #6945 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 07:12 PM
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Modern AVRs, at least the ones I hear are not harsh when clipping. They may compress if unable to deliver the required power.
That will not sound bad at all. If it did, the vast majority of recordings would not be less than DR10 tongue.gif

For me, HT is not that demanding, it is 2 channel music that heats my amp.

No need to ever change if you are happy. I expect Most folks don't stress their systems.

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That 's true only neurotics like us stress about our systems biggrin.gif
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post #6946 of 7805 Old 04-27-2014, 07:13 PM
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Thanks for everyone's input. Can't wait till the new speakers arrive! It's gonna seem like a long wait.

Very nice! The speakers will sound great out of the box but at around 4-6 hour mark of listening at pretty loud levels, the F208s, bloomed..it sounded a little more open and I felt this was the "break in".

Whether it's a myth or not won't matter in the long run. You will enjoy them out of the gate smile.gif.
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post #6947 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 08:00 AM
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Thanks Rich ..........the L/R speakers are driven by the ML No 432 and the Voice and current surrounds (Boston 300ls- soon the be Gems )are driven by the No 433....they do a good job with the Revels

PS - pse post a pic with the grills in place ......might try to find a pair

Here is a picture of a the a Studio 1 with grill



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post #6948 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 08:09 AM
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Thanks , Rich -pic appreciated.....looks rather nice !
Will see whether I can lay my hands on a pair perhaps via my dealer can still find a pair lying at Revel .
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post #6949 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 08:37 AM
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Or more biggrin.gif. Yes you will change speakers before you change your ears wink.gif. Max volume for me for "Break-in" is 90 db and I stay out of the room wink.gif I like to protect my ears now too many night clubs when I was younger and did not know any better mad.gif

If it's too loud for my ears, then it's too loud for my loudspeakers. wink.gif

Treat our things right, and they will treat us right. wink.gif

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post #6950 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 08:39 AM
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Is that a bad thing? West of California does that mean Hawaii ?

He's a fish in the ocean. biggrin.gif

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post #6951 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

If it's too loud for my ears, then it's too loud for my loudspeakers. wink.gif Treat our things right, and they will treat us right. wink.gif

Philosophies, yes I treat my speakers right with plenty of good music and movies fed by good current biggrin.gif
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post #6952 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 11:41 AM
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He's a fish in the ocean. biggrin.gif
Close but still a mammal, Orca.

 

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post #6953 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 04:12 PM
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Thanks , Rich -pic appreciated.....looks rather nice !
Will see whether I can lay my hands on a pair perhaps via my dealer can still find a pair lying at Revel .
If you are interested in a pair if Salon 1s one of my dealers got a pair in on trade. I think they are asking $5,500 or so. PM me and I can send you details if you are interested.

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post #6954 of 7805 Old 04-28-2014, 11:06 PM
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Thanks Rich -the Studios , Voice and Gems are fine for me at this point in time ...This is where I will stay for the present .
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post #6955 of 7805 Old 04-29-2014, 06:53 AM
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Well guys, Audioholics just debunked the theory that all amps sound the same.

Not. biggrin.gif

Speaking of debunking, there is a myth that real life music presents a more difficult load and stress to the amp than in the lab where pure test tones are feeding the amps. They argue that just because the amp measures well into 4 ohms or 2 ohms does not mean they can handle real life music the same way. This is wrong. The reason is because in the lab, the pure test tones at keep at a constant impedance. So a constant continuous 2 ohms impedance is a heck of a lot more stressful to the amp than in real life music where the impedance varies from 2 ohms to 20 ohms.

For AVRs, the RMS continuous 4 ohms testing is a lot more stressful to the AVR than real music playing on speakers that vary impedance from 4 ohms - 20 ohms.

So we have debunked 2 audio myths:

1. Amp clipping does not damage speakers. Speakers are damaged due to thermal and mechanical causes secondary to excessive power, not due to any clipping.
2. Amp testing in the lab is a lot more strenuous and stressful to the amp than playing any real life music.

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post #6956 of 7805 Old 04-29-2014, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Not. biggrin.gif

Speaking of debunking, there is a myth that real life music presents a more difficult load and stress to the amp than in the lab where pure test tones are feeding the amps. They argue that just because the amp measures well into 4 ohms or 2 ohms does not mean they can handle real life music the same way. This is wrong. The reason is because in the lab, the pure test tones at keep at a constant impedance. So a constant continuous 2 ohms impedance is a heck of a lot more stressful to the amp than in real life music where the impedance varies from 2 ohms to 20 ohms.

For AVRs, the RMS continuous 4 ohms testing is a lot more stressful to the AVR than real music playing on speakers that vary impedance from 4 ohms - 20 ohms.

So we have debunked 2 audio myths:

1. Amp clipping does not damage speakers. Speakers are damaged due to thermal and mechanical causes secondary to excessive power, not due to any clipping.
2. Amp testing in the lab is a lot more strenuous and stressful to the amp than playing any real life music.

I suppose these are debunked so long as evidence to the contrary is ignored.

1. There are FFT measurements of amps with moderate clipping changing the tonal balance so as the shift the power distribution toward the upper frequencies.
What has been shown is that amount of energy added from the square-waves is not as likely to damage as the compression and power shift.
So, it is not that a lower power amps is more likely to damage speakers, it is that those inclined to overdrive an moderately powered amp can drive their tweeters with more power than they can handle and cause the thermal problem.
Tweeters do fail an the vast majority of users do not have separate power amps. There is no evidence that a separate power amp is required for tweeter to fail.
To believe this is a myth (presented as an absolute) is to believe that tweeter failure is a myth.

2. Not all amp testing is the same and not all AVR amplifiers are tested with the same rigor as their standalone counterparts.
Testing in a lab can be more strenuous than testing in a lab, except when it is not. For example, for speakers that dip below 4 ohms.
If heat is an issue, the duration of a 4 ohm test matters as well. A few minutes may not be indicative of a 4 ohm speaker listening for an extended period of time.

Here is a real world example. I was able to put the A51 (on an open shelf) into thermal overload driving my Revels with musical content at near reference levels (-5 or so).
The amp has been thoroughly tested into 4 ohm loads 20-20kHz and the Salons are specs are 6 ohms nominal.

Does that make them bunked tongue.gifbiggrin.gif

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post #6957 of 7805 Old 04-29-2014, 10:10 AM
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I suppose these are debunked so long as evidence to the contrary is ignored.

Tweeters do fail an the vast majority of users do not have separate power amps.

What evidence is there to support that the vast majority of cases of tweeter damages occurred when an AVR was used? The only time I've even heard of anyone complaining of blowing the speaker tweeters are from audiophiles who used external amps because they "needed" more power.

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Testing in a lab can be more strenuous than testing in a lab, except when it is not. For example, for speakers that dip below 4 ohms.
If heat is an issue, the duration of a 4 ohm test matters as well. A few minutes may not be indicative of a 4 ohm speaker listening for an extended period of time.

And I suppose the vast majority of the time, most music will require the amp to play @ an impedance of 2 ohms continuously for 10 minutes or more?

So for most speakers with a nominal impedance of 6-8 ohms (but has a minimum of 3 ohms), the vast majority of the time the amp will be working continuously at 3 ohms for longer than a few minutes - not in a few peak microseconds or seconds, but continuously for a few minutes nonstop?

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Here is a real world example. I was able to put the A51 (on an open shelf) into thermal overload driving my Revels with musical content at near reference levels (-5 or so).
The amp has been thoroughly tested into 4 ohm loads 20-20kHz and the Salons are specs are 6 ohms nominal.

Does that make them bunked tongue.gifbiggrin.gif

In all my years with amps and AVR and speakers with minimum of 2 ohms impedance, I have never ever put any amp or AVR (even 50WPC) into thermal overload with the maximum volume my ears could tolerate, which is about 95dB in 2.0 mode. Never blown a speaker either.

How many people have actually put any of their amps into "thermal overload" and shutdown that is NOT due to lack of heat dissipation?

Now if people argue that one amp sounds better to them than another amp, I can't argue with that subjective assessment.

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And so we go round and around. smile.gif
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post #6959 of 7805 Old 04-29-2014, 12:12 PM
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And so we go round and around. smile.gif

You are right. Resistance is futile. Must.....buy.......amps..... biggrin.gif

What's in your wallet? biggrin.gif

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

You are right. Resistance is futile. Must.....buy.......amps..... biggrin.gif

What's in your wallet? biggrin.gif

Bunch of receipts smile.gif

You are going against the common ideology in high-end audio that all else equal, a more powerful amp is preferred over a lesser powerful amp.

I believe these clipping theories etc. are just distractions from the main argument. Deflect if you must but you used to think Deftechs and Acurus were the be all and end all of high end. (just a hunch based on your name) biggrin.gif.
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