Revel Owners Thread - Page 268 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #8011 of 8022 Old 02-08-2016, 10:32 AM
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At a reasonable level, reflections are good for imaging and spaciousness.
ultima2's dispersion and consistent frequency off access maintains the performance of the speaker.

My room is not symmetrical, has high ceilings, books cases and other dispersing characteristics.
Even so, without the two area rugs it is too hot/reflective.

- Rich
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post #8012 of 8022 Old 02-08-2016, 06:56 PM
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It's true that Revel / Harman speakers tend to have very even dispersion, so treating the first reflection point is not quite as important as it is with most other speakers. Kevin Voecks recommends treating the first reflection point, Dr. Toole not so much (this came up at Harman Academy). As mentioned, leaving it untreated can give you more of a sense of spaciousness, under certain conditions (this was Dr. Toole's preference). It's NOT black and white, though, so please don't take this as a recommendation.

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post #8013 of 8022 Old 02-08-2016, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Schuermann View Post
It's true that Revel / Harman speakers tend to have very even dispersion, so treating the first reflection point is not quite as important as it is with most other speakers. Kevin Voecks recommends treating the first reflection point, Dr. Toole not so much (this came up at Harman Academy). As mentioned, leaving it untreated can give you more of a sense of spaciousness, under certain conditions (this was Dr. Toole's preference). It's NOT black and white, though, so please don't take this as a recommendation.
One factor to consider is application. Stereo systems might benefit from the spaciousness but multichannel systems might not.
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post #8014 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 01:37 AM
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It's true that Revel / Harman speakers tend to have very even dispersion, so treating the first reflection point is not quite as important as it is with most other speakers. .

In this case, why build speakers who minimize the difraction ?
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post #8015 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 05:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Schuermann View Post
It's true that Revel / Harman speakers tend to have very even dispersion, so treating the first reflection point is not quite as important as it is with most other speakers. Kevin Voecks recommends treating the first reflection point, Dr. Toole not so much (this came up at Harman Academy). As mentioned, leaving it untreated can give you more of a sense of spaciousness, under certain conditions (this was Dr. Toole's preference). It's NOT black and white, though, so please don't take this as a recommendation.
I suppose since one of my Salon 2s is 1 feet from sidewall (wood paneling), as opposed to other which is 16 feet away, treatment would be very beneficial. Will see in couple of days when I make measurements with and without some treatments.
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post #8016 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by dinococus View Post
In this case, why build speakers who minimize the difraction ?
I'm not a speaker engineer, so bear with what might be an incomplete or somewhat inaccurate response

Diffraction, as I understand it, is the effect of sound waves moving "around" an object. Minimizing diffraction in the speaker design is what allows broad and even dispersion (the goal). The speaker cabinet itself is not interfering with the propagation of sound waves. As you move further and further away from the front of the speaker, evenness of response (and power output) falls. The goal of a Revel design is to make sure that the falloff is both minimal and consistent with the on-axis response in terms of frequency response.

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post #8017 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donktard View Post
I suppose since one of my Salon 2s is 1 feet from sidewall (wood paneling), as opposed to other which is 16 feet away, treatment would be very beneficial. Will see in couple of days when I make measurements with and without some treatments.

That sound like a good candidate for treating the close to the wall.


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post #8018 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by donktard View Post
I suppose since one of my Salon 2s is 1 feet from sidewall (wood paneling), as opposed to other which is 16 feet away, treatment would be very beneficial. Will see in couple of days when I make measurements with and without some treatments.
The main issue you are going to have is evenness of bass response. The Salon2 near the sidewall is going to have considerably reinforced lower mids and bass compared to the speaker away from the wall.

But yes, the speaker near the sidewall is going to have far more in the way of "first reflection point" issues compared to the speaker out so far into the room. Make sure you use broadband, thick sound absorbers (4" thick or greater). Absorbing only high frequencies with thin absorption panels essentially just "turns down the treble" on the speaker. Since you are already getting a mid and bass boost from the sidewall speaker, that would only exacerbate the problem of the mis-match in bass / mid frequency boost. To compensate for that, I would make sure that the "Low Frequency Compensation" switch on the back of your Salon2s is set to "Boundary" for the speaker near the wall and "Normal" for the speaker away from the wall. That should go a long way toward making sure the speakers match in frequency response (if you haven't done this already).

Hope that helps!

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post #8019 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 01:54 PM
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I've been getting numerous inquiries about the Revel Ultima Rhythm2 sub after my post about it being discontinued last month. Yes, they are on closeout but there are still half a dozen or so left in mahogany at the Revel warehouse. Last I checked there was one B-stock unit in black available as well. The Rhythm2 is / was in the same Ultima line as the Salon2s. Stereophile wrote about the combo a couple of years ago:

http://www.stereophile.com/content/r...8rfUTr7ALrs.97

The mahogany units are all new in a box, but once they are gone, they are gone. Feel free to PM me with any questions.

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Last edited by John Schuermann; Yesterday at 01:58 PM.
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post #8020 of 8022 Old Yesterday, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Schuermann View Post
The main issue you are going to have is evenness of bass response. The Salon2 near the sidewall is going to have considerably reinforced lower mids and bass compared to the speaker away from the wall.

But yes, the speaker near the sidewall is going to have far more in the way of "first reflection point" issues compared to the speaker out so far into the room. Make sure you use broadband, thick sound absorbers (4" thick or greater). Absorbing only high frequencies with thin absorption panels essentially just "turns down the treble" on the speaker. Since you are already getting a mid and bass boost from the sidewall speaker, that would only exacerbate the problem of the mis-match in bass / mid frequency boost. To compensate for that, I would make sure that the "Low Frequency Compensation" switch on the back of your Salon2s is set to "Boundary" for the speaker near the wall and "Normal" for the speaker away from the wall. That should go a long way toward making sure the speakers match in frequency response (if you haven't done this already).

Hope that helps!
Yes, I am quite aware of bass issues and I have set LF Compensation on speaker thats closer to sidewall to boundary. My biggest concern is a mess between 70 and 600 Hz and thats what I wanna try to fix with treatments. Also, after 600 up to 10khz from what i recall from measurements I have a consistent downward slope with 10 db difference between those two points, so i also fear that adding absorbers will further kill the highs but I will know for sure next week when I get materials for room treatments and do some testing.
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post #8021 of 8022 Old Today, 03:35 PM
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This question is mainly to satisfy my curiosity and vent my frustration...

I recently had two B12 subs quit working. They are housed behind an acoustical transparent screen on a stage so they're hard to access. It happened last December assuming they quit at the same time. I tested them in November and at least one of them worked. I bought both 10/2008.

Pyramid fixed the amps for $750.00. They said they did not know why they quit working but it wasn't because of a power surge. I thought that might have been the problem even though I have them on a surge protector. They've never been played very hard.

I'm disappointed. Over the seven years that they worked I went through through two projector bulbs. So I'd estimate they've been played around 5,000 hours. Am I holding Revel to too high a standard if I believe the amps should have lasted longer?
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post #8022 of 8022 Old Today, 05:42 PM
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SS amps should have a service life exceeding 10 years at least IMO. However the fact that they quit working at the same time sends a bit of a red flag. Such coincidences rarely are coincidence, if that makes any sense.
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