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post #5401 of 18940 Old 10-23-2009, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

I went by my HT specialist's shop today to pick up the speaker wire to be run thru the walls and low and behold he had OMC10/quad instead of OMC10/2 waiting for me. he said "oops" but said maybe i should keep same in order to bi-wire my system.

he is charging me $6/foot for this wire instead of $3/foot for the standard wire, but this is an expensive system I am putting together so there will be (at least) a few hundred dollars worth of haggling at the very end, meaning the extra $300 he is charging me now will be credited at some point.

i have already read one FAQ that says "dont bother biwiring" found here:

http://http://www.naim-audio.com/com....html#biwiring

but i have also heard that B&W recommends biwiring with their speakers. (i guess they were intended to be wired this way whereas the above Naims were not?)

i have to admit that i intend to have my subwoofer doing the lion's share of lower frequency work, so i'm not sure separate wires for the higher frequency and lower frequency output will make much difference.

any advice? thanks in advance.

CMM.

I bi-wire my 804s's and HTM3S (my CMW DS8 surrounds cannot be bi-wired) strictly for aesthetics. I don't really feel that it does much difference sonically, especially with all 4 wires in the same sheathing. I've heard there may some difference if you bi-wire with two separate wires where one is using spades from the amp and the other is using banana plugs at the amp.

Here are what mine look like. I plan on upgrading the speaker wire after the first of the year. They are currently DIY cables -- 12/4 Monoprice cabling and cableorganizer.com TechFlex and HST in black with Radio Shack Banana Plugs.

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post #5402 of 18940 Old 10-24-2009, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammie View Post

I bi-wire my 804s's and HTM3S (my CMW DS8 surrounds cannot be bi-wired) strictly for aesthetics. I don't really feel that it does much difference sonically, especially with all 4 wires in the same sheathing. I've heard there may some difference if you bi-wire with two separate wires where one is using spades from the amp and the other is using banana plugs at the amp.

Here are what mine look like. I plan on upgrading the speaker wire after the first of the year. They are currently DIY cables -- 12/4 Monoprice cabling and cableorganizer.com TechFlex and HST in black with Radio Shack Banana Plugs.


Those are very nice looking cables for DIY. I'd really just stick with what you got. I'm thinking about trying to bi-amp my 804S's with my XPA-5 just for the fun of it. You never know until you try.
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post #5403 of 18940 Old 10-25-2009, 02:57 PM
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just ordered three CT7.3's yesterday to replace my 604s3's and LCR600, then gotta figure out what I want to do for surrounds. Gonna re-frame and sheetrock the theater room so probly go in ceiling with CCM 818
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post #5404 of 18940 Old 10-26-2009, 08:28 AM
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Hi guys, is it a good time now to invest in a pair of 802D? I read somewhere that the current 800's series will have new speakers in 2010? Correct? Just don't want to plonk down my cash and 5 months later a new 802D is in the market....

BTW, do you guys know if the Pioneer Susano can drive the 802D in bi-amp mode sufficiently.
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post #5405 of 18940 Old 10-26-2009, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rtankm View Post

Hi guys, is it a good time now to invest in a pair of 802D? I read somewhere that the current 800's series will have new speakers in 2010? Correct? Just don't want to plonk down my cash and 5 months later a new 802D is in the market....

BTW, do you guys know if the Pioneer Susano can drive the 802D in bi-amp mode sufficiently.

It's a crap shoot to be honest. My dealer said that he has been told a revamped 800 series will be coming at the end of 2010. He has not been told what the changed are. The only thing he speculates was an 804D and an 805D speaker to replace the 804S and 805S. He feels the 803S, 804S and 805S will be retired.

SO, in regards to your 802D question. Not sure. I might wait until after the first of the year to see what other chatter is happening on the current line.
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post #5406 of 18940 Old 10-26-2009, 11:01 AM
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Hi guys,

I am thinkinig of having a custom cabinet created to hide the HTM3S and i needed some advice. I would like to "hide" said speaker rather than having it sitting on top of the "ready made" cabinet that i have. I also want to bring my Pio 141 as close to the ground as possible. if i hide the Centre speaker in the cabinet, i can bring it down to 30 inches, or even less.

to get basic idea of what the cabinet i am thinking of making looks like -- my colors are different, as are the dimensions -- i will try to paste a photo here:



The cabinets below the slab will be 25 inches high. the two outer sections will be 22 inches wide and the one ones in the middle will have a combined width of 40 inches. (this is where the HTM3 will go). The center doors will open towards the sides and i will put a few fans in each cabinet just to keep all the components nice and cool.

The bottom of the HTM3 will be 10 inches off the ground and roughly 23 inches high. it will be sitting on pull out drawer.

The problem i am having is that there is a glass coffee table in front of this media cabinet that goes 17 inches high from the floor. I am afraid that if i put the HTM3S inside the cabinet, all the sound will reflect off the coffee table and the accustics will be all messed up.

here's a pic of the coffee table -- in case it matters:



Also, because there is a wooden slab above the cabinets, the bottom my plasma would be roughly 7 inches above the top of the tweeter -- which some people consider "pushing it" in terms of distance. my HT specialist says he wants the HTM3 as close as possible to the plasma.

my original idea, which i not longer want to go for, would have a fairly low media cabinet that only measures 19 inches high that the HTM3 would sit on top of. I would have to mount my Plasma 33 inches off the ground, which frankly i conisder a little bit high. The top of the tweeter would however be just below the bottom of the Plasma.

what do you guys think? should i just stick with my ready made (but boring) media cabinet with the speaker on top of it, or should i go for the custom made piece and make it to my specs? btw i can make it pretty much any way i want. i have also seen pics of people's setup where the center speaker is tilted up towards the listening position, but i am not sure how this is best accomoplished.

finally, in terms of using a pull out drawer, would moving the center speaker 2-3 inches out have a big effect on the soundstage, or would u say its neglegable? (what about moving it out 10 inches?)

most of the time the center cabinet doors will be in the open position, but occasionally i would like it closed when listening to 2 channel sources.

CMM
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post #5407 of 18940 Old 10-26-2009, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

Hi guys,

I am thinkinig of having a custom cabinet created to hide the HTM3S and i needed some advice. I would like to "hide" said speaker rather than having it sitting on top of the "ready made" cabinet that i have. I also want to bring my Pio 141 as close to the ground as possible. if i hide the Centre speaker in the cabinet, i can bring it down to 30 inches, or even less.

to get basic idea of what the cabinet i am thinking of making looks like -- my colors are different, as are the dimensions -- i will try to paste a photo here:



The cabinets below the slab will be 25 inches high. the two outer sections will be 22 inches wide and the one ones in the middle will have a combined width of 40 inches. (this is where the HTM3 will go). The center doors will open towards the sides and i will put a few fans in each cabinet just to keep all the components nice and cool.

The bottom of the HTM3 will be 10 inches off the ground and roughly 23 inches high. it will be sitting on pull out drawer.

The problem i am having is that there is a glass coffee table in front of this media cabinet that goes 17 inches high from the floor. I am afraid that if i put the HTM3S inside the cabinet, all the sound will reflect off the coffee table and the accustics will be all messed up.

here's a pic of the coffee table -- in case it matters:



Also, because there is a wooden slab above the cabinets, the bottom my plasma would be roughly 7 inches above the top of the tweeter -- which some people consider "pushing it" in terms of distance. my HT specialist says he wants the HTM3 as close as possible to the plasma.

my original idea, which i not longer want to go for, would have a fairly low media cabinet that only measures 19 inches high that the HTM3 would sit on top of. I would have to mount my Plasma 33 inches off the ground, which frankly i conisder a little bit high. The top of the tweeter would however be just below the bottom of the Plasma.

what do you guys think? should i just stick with my ready made (but boring) media cabinet with the speaker on top of it, or should i go for the custom made piece and make it to my specs? btw i can make it pretty much any way i want. i have also seen pics of people's setup where the center speaker is tilted up towards the listening position, but i am not sure how this is best accomoplished.

finally, in terms of using a pull out drawer, would moving the center speaker 2-3 inches out have a big effect on the soundstage, or would u say its neglegable? (what about moving it out 10 inches?)

most of the time the center cabinet doors will be in the open position, but occasionally i would like it closed when listening to 2 channel sources.

CMM

I guess I'll start of with why you want to hide the speaker?

I really wouldn't recommend putting a center speaker, let alone the HTM3S in a cabinet. I would be afraid that it would sound boomy and possibly echoey.

I currently have my plasma about 43" odff the ground. I sit about 8-9 feet away from the TV and have not had any issues with it being too high. Additionally, Having the 804's as my fronts, All tweeters are at the same height. My TV is about 2-3 inches above the center speaker.

The front of my center speaker is is about 18 inches in front of the TV.

Not sure if it helps but I thought I would say my two cents.

BTW, You can look at a picture of my setup below in my sig.
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post #5408 of 18940 Old 10-26-2009, 09:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rtankm View Post

Hi guys, is it a good time now to invest in a pair of 802D? I read somewhere that the current 800's series will have new speakers in 2010? Correct? Just don't want to plonk down my cash and 5 months later a new 802D is in the market....

BTW, do you guys know if the Pioneer Susano can drive the 802D in bi-amp mode sufficiently.

Rumours are just that...rumours. Like anything, the 800 series will get changed one day, but who knows when (other than B&W themselves!), and if they do, the prices will likely go up. I recently bought a set of 800Ds....I could have waited to see if there are changes, but that is a never ending story.

I think if you like the current 802Ds and plan to keep them for a long time, I don't think it matters. Life is short.
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post #5409 of 18940 Old 10-26-2009, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

Hi guys,

I am thinkinig of having a custom cabinet created to hide the HTM3S and i needed some advice. I would like to "hide" said speaker rather than having it sitting on top of the "ready made" cabinet that i have. I also want to bring my Pio 141 as close to the ground as possible. if i hide the Centre speaker in the cabinet, i can bring it down to 30 inches, or even less.

to get basic idea of what the cabinet i am thinking of making looks like -- my colors are different, as are the dimensions -- i will try to paste a photo here:



The cabinets below the slab will be 25 inches high. the two outer sections will be 22 inches wide and the one ones in the middle will have a combined width of 40 inches. (this is where the HTM3 will go). The center doors will open towards the sides and i will put a few fans in each cabinet just to keep all the components nice and cool.

The bottom of the HTM3 will be 10 inches off the ground and roughly 23 inches high. it will be sitting on pull out drawer.

The problem i am having is that there is a glass coffee table in front of this media cabinet that goes 17 inches high from the floor. I am afraid that if i put the HTM3S inside the cabinet, all the sound will reflect off the coffee table and the accustics will be all messed up.

here's a pic of the coffee table -- in case it matters:



Also, because there is a wooden slab above the cabinets, the bottom my plasma would be roughly 7 inches above the top of the tweeter -- which some people consider "pushing it" in terms of distance. my HT specialist says he wants the HTM3 as close as possible to the plasma.

my original idea, which i not longer want to go for, would have a fairly low media cabinet that only measures 19 inches high that the HTM3 would sit on top of. I would have to mount my Plasma 33 inches off the ground, which frankly i conisder a little bit high. The top of the tweeter would however be just below the bottom of the Plasma.

what do you guys think? should i just stick with my ready made (but boring) media cabinet with the speaker on top of it, or should i go for the custom made piece and make it to my specs? btw i can make it pretty much any way i want. i have also seen pics of people's setup where the center speaker is tilted up towards the listening position, but i am not sure how this is best accomoplished.

finally, in terms of using a pull out drawer, would moving the center speaker 2-3 inches out have a big effect on the soundstage, or would u say its neglegable? (what about moving it out 10 inches?)

most of the time the center cabinet doors will be in the open position, but occasionally i would like it closed when listening to 2 channel sources.

CMM

What other front speakers are you running? I am thinking the center will be a lot lower than them, in particular the tweeters, it would be tough to get a consistent sound out of your front three speakers if your HTM3S is that much lower....It is always a compromise between aesthetics and sound quality...
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post #5410 of 18940 Old 10-27-2009, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by KahunaCanuck View Post

What other front speakers are you running? I am thinking the center will be a lot lower than them, in particular the tweeters, it would be tough to get a consistent sound out of your front three speakers if your HTM3S is that much lower....It is always a compromise between aesthetics and sound quality...

804s will be the Front L/R and SCMS for the rears. I guess i should only put it in a cabinet if i can tilt it upwards towards the listening position.

in the end it may just be easier to get my low cabinet and simply place the speaker on top of it. I will run into trouble eventually as i want to upgrade to 802s in the front and HTM1 for the center (the 804s would be moved to the rear).

in the custom cabinet i was going to have custom built, the shelf that raises the HTM3 to the middlle of the cabinet would be removable so that i could place the HTM1 in the cabinet (where that monster would take up the entire space -- and then some!). I would simply move the pull out drawer to the bottom of the cabinet and place the HTM1 in there.

most pictures of an HTM1 that i have seen in a non dedicated home theater room, the HTM1 is sitting on the floor or is raised an inch or two from the floor. i know this isn't optimal, but i'd like to strike a ballance between aesthetics and sound quality.

can anyone who has their 800 series center speaker inside a cabinet comment on weather or not it sounds "boomy" ?

thanks in advance for taking the time to reply.

CMM.
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post #5411 of 18940 Old 10-27-2009, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammie View Post


BTW, You can look at a picture of my setup below in my sig.

Your setup looks fantastic. how tall is that cabinet? how do u keep all your components cool?

When i finally upgrade to 802Ds, i will need a second amp which wont really fit into my ready made 19 inches high cabinet. i was thinking of getting something nicer that could "grow" along with my system.

the ready made cabinet is a lot more affordable than the custom one -- not that i would be comfortable throwing it away when i upgraded -- so it wouldn't be the end of the world if it was relegated to a bedroom or something.

CMM
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post #5412 of 18940 Old 10-27-2009, 09:46 AM
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Anyone know the Canadian MSRP for B&W 600 series?
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post #5413 of 18940 Old 10-27-2009, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

Your setup looks fantastic. how tall is that cabinet? how do u keep all your components cool?

When i finally upgrade to 802Ds, i will need a second amp which wont really fit into my ready made 19 inches high cabinet. i was thinking of getting something nicer that could "grow" along with my system.

the ready made cabinet is a lot more affordable than the custom one -- not that i would be comfortable throwing it away when i upgraded -- so it wouldn't be the end of the world if it was relegated to a bedroom or something.

CMM

Thanks for the compliment.

My cabinet is about 29" high. It is made by BDI and is designed to keep electronics cool.
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post #5414 of 18940 Old 10-28-2009, 06:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

can anyone who has their 800 series center speaker inside a cabinet comment on weather or not it sounds "boomy" ?

thanks in advance for taking the time to reply.

CMM.

Definitely not boomy in my situation. The HTM3S isn't even ported to begin with so I can notice the 804S is slightly bassier than the HTM3S. Unless that has to do with actual placement in the room, or both the placement and the ported vs non-ported enclosure. My makeshift stand/cabinet (that I made out of an old aquarium stand ) that my HTM3S currently resides in is also fully open in the back and has some breathing room around the top and sides and I also made sure that the drivers stick out and protrude from the front and also tilted up towards your ears:









I still think I need to put some type of dampening material inside the walls of cubby the HTM3S resides in - maybe not, but it wont hurt to try since I have some left over carpet from re-carpeting the room I could cut and put in there. I would like to have the center at the same height as the mains eventually when I move the system into the main living room that's three times the size as the current room, but I think when that happens I want to go with 804S's all the way around...rears, fronts, and even the center. But for now I try to make the best of what I have to work with - keep it tilted up, drivers protruding out the front, and a little breathing room around the speaker from the cabinet.

My latest addiction since getting the HTM3S is expanding 2-channel audio into surround with DSP - the Yamaha 7-channel enhancer is one of the first DSP programs I've been happy with using over normally just using a pure direct or straight stereo mode. In fact, the little surround music that I have that's been remastered from older originally stereo released CDs doesn't even come close to the sound quality of Yamaha's DSP which sounds far closer to proper surround. I only have one music surround DVD that actually sounds like proper surround - the Eagles Hole In The World 5.1 DVD. The rest I have sounds fake and phony and sometimes looses detail over their older stereo CD counterparts. But I've been hooked on using the Yamaha DSP to expand CD audio to surround and it does a great job, much better than some remastered to surround DVDs from originally released on CD. My only complaint is that it adds a little of what sounds like modulation distortion on some bass notes, but not all the time. If I could figure out a way to get rid of that, it would be perfect. And the detail and realism of the vocals is so good on the better sounding recordings it's like, is this real, or coming from a speaker? It's a somewhat surreal experience. hehe. I can't wait to turn the living room into a dedicated sound/theater room...
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post #5415 of 18940 Old 10-28-2009, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

Hi guys,

I am thinkinig of having a custom cabinet created to hide the HTM3S and i needed some advice. I would like to "hide" said speaker rather than having it sitting on top of the "ready made" cabinet that i have. I also want to bring my Pio 141 as close to the ground as possible. if i hide the Centre speaker in the cabinet, i can bring it down to 30 inches, or even less.

to get basic idea of what the cabinet i am thinking of making looks like -- my colors are different, as are the dimensions -- i will try to paste a photo here:



The cabinets below the slab will be 25 inches high. the two outer sections will be 22 inches wide and the one ones in the middle will have a combined width of 40 inches. (this is where the HTM3 will go). The center doors will open towards the sides and i will put a few fans in each cabinet just to keep all the components nice and cool.

The bottom of the HTM3 will be 10 inches off the ground and roughly 23 inches high. it will be sitting on pull out drawer.

The problem i am having is that there is a glass coffee table in front of this media cabinet that goes 17 inches high from the floor. I am afraid that if i put the HTM3S inside the cabinet, all the sound will reflect off the coffee table and the accustics will be all messed up.

here's a pic of the coffee table -- in case it matters:



Also, because there is a wooden slab above the cabinets, the bottom my plasma would be roughly 7 inches above the top of the tweeter -- which some people consider "pushing it" in terms of distance. my HT specialist says he wants the HTM3 as close as possible to the plasma.

my original idea, which i not longer want to go for, would have a fairly low media cabinet that only measures 19 inches high that the HTM3 would sit on top of. I would have to mount my Plasma 33 inches off the ground, which frankly i conisder a little bit high. The top of the tweeter would however be just below the bottom of the Plasma.

what do you guys think? should i just stick with my ready made (but boring) media cabinet with the speaker on top of it, or should i go for the custom made piece and make it to my specs? btw i can make it pretty much any way i want. i have also seen pics of people's setup where the center speaker is tilted up towards the listening position, but i am not sure how this is best accomoplished.

finally, in terms of using a pull out drawer, would moving the center speaker 2-3 inches out have a big effect on the soundstage, or would u say its neglegable? (what about moving it out 10 inches?)

most of the time the center cabinet doors will be in the open position, but occasionally i would like it closed when listening to 2 channel sources.

CMM

If your goal is to hide the speaker then I would choose a speaker that deserves to heard and not seen. The B&W Nautilus series is both art and science and should not be hidden. You would be charged with high treason to hide these speakers. They are a show piece! Please pick another speaker for that application.
Please remember you asked the question so we are trying to help you avoid the blunder!

SticknStones
"I was not born a wise man but I am learning the trade" roo
B&W 802's, Emotiva - XMC-1, (2) XPA-2's bi-wired, XPA-3, ERC-1, XDA-2, (2) Ultra-12 subs, & DSPeaker - antimode 8033c
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post #5416 of 18940 Old 10-28-2009, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sticknstones View Post

If your goal is to hide the speaker then I would choose a speaker that deserves to heard and not seen. The B&W Nautilus series is both art and science and should not be hidden. You would be charged with high treason to hide these speakers. They are a show piece! Please pick another speaker for that application.
Please remember you asked the question so we are trying to help you avoid the blunder!

You could always go with the Custom Series in-walls. I'm running the CMW DS8's as my surrounds and they are just awesome!
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post #5417 of 18940 Old 10-28-2009, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galve2000 View Post

804s will be the Front L/R and SCMS for the rears. I guess i should only put it in a cabinet if i can tilt it upwards towards the listening position.

in the end it may just be easier to get my low cabinet and simply place the speaker on top of it. I will run into trouble eventually as i want to upgrade to 802s in the front and HTM1 for the center (the 804s would be moved to the rear).

in the custom cabinet i was going to have custom built, the shelf that raises the HTM3 to the middlle of the cabinet would be removable so that i could place the HTM1 in the cabinet (where that monster would take up the entire space -- and then some!). I would simply move the pull out drawer to the bottom of the cabinet and place the HTM1 in there.

most pictures of an HTM1 that i have seen in a non dedicated home theater room, the HTM1 is sitting on the floor or is raised an inch or two from the floor. i know this isn't optimal, but i'd like to strike a ballance between aesthetics and sound quality.

can anyone who has their 800 series center speaker inside a cabinet comment on weather or not it sounds "boomy" ?

thanks in advance for taking the time to reply.

CMM.

This may be a little off topic but I saw that you said you intend to purchse the 802 in the future. Have you considered going to a wide setup? I have done that using my old sides, which are now up front and the sound stage is amazing. I found that the rears and sides were rarely getting used in my old 7.1 setup. I would hate to see those 804s go to waste if you move them to your rears.

For more information wide setup, check out the audyssey website. This format has made an incredible difference the sound in my setup.
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post #5418 of 18940 Old 10-28-2009, 09:45 AM
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Is it a good idea to match 683 with CM center 2? heard that the HTM61 is kind of weak and without the FST. I wish I can get the CM9 too but it is way beyond my budget.
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Originally Posted by ishoong View Post

Is it a good idea to match 683 with CM center 2? heard that the HTM61 is kind of weak and without the FST. I wish I can get the CM9 too but it is way beyond my budget.

This is apparently the million dollar question. And one I'd *really* like to know the answer to so I can stop torturing myself with "research" and pull the trigger and get on with my life.

And, yes, I've auditioned what I could, but my dealer doesn't have a CMC-2 to listen to.

Edit: My dealer has an upgrade policy and I'm planning to keep the option open to upgrade from 683 -> CM9, though unless I have money burning a hole in my pocket sometime in the next year I may just keep the 683s. I haven't heard the CM9s (yet) but did like the clarity of the CM7s. But because of room dynamics I need a bit more low end from my mains and all in all I like the sound of the 683s and CM7s about equally.
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post #5420 of 18940 Old 10-29-2009, 02:21 PM
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Howdy Folks...

Just picked up three CWM 650 in-wall's today but just recently found what appears to be a very good deal on some closeout Energy Veritas v2.2hm in-walls. Anyone have experience with the CWM 650's or are more informed about specs that could lend some guidance.

Chris
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post #5421 of 18940 Old 10-29-2009, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdo400 View Post

This is apparently the million dollar question. And one I'd *really* like to know the answer to so I can stop torturing myself with "research" and pull the trigger and get on with my life.

And, yes, I've auditioned what I could, but my dealer doesn't have a CMC-2 to listen to.

Edit: My dealer has an upgrade policy and I'm planning to keep the option open to upgrade from 683 -> CM9, though unless I have money burning a hole in my pocket sometime in the next year I may just keep the 683s. I haven't heard the CM9s (yet) but did like the clarity of the CM7s. But because of room dynamics I need a bit more low end from my mains and all in all I like the sound of the 683s and CM7s about equally.

Then what center do you have now? NE1 with CMC-2? also where are the 600 series & CM series make? UK or China?
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post #5422 of 18940 Old 10-30-2009, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdepaola View Post

Howdy Folks...

Just picked up three CWM 650 in-wall's today but just recently found what appears to be a very good deal on some closeout Energy Veritas v2.2hm in-walls. Anyone have experience with the CWM 650's or are more informed about specs that could lend some guidance.

I've got the CMW 650s in my bedroom setup, and really like them. I don't have much to offer in regards to specs, or comparison to the Energy speakers. The 650s do not come with a backing box, so I used some accoustic cotton batting that I stuff into the wall around all sides of the speaker to dampen and insulate from the room next door, and it improved the sound quite a bit.

Brad
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post #5423 of 18940 Old 10-30-2009, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ishoong View Post

Then what center do you have now? NE1 with CMC-2? also where are the 600 series & CM series make? UK or China?

Right now I have 685 fronts with 686 surrounds along with a CMC that I had unopened and didn't set up until last night. I'm not very enthused about the CMC so far. It may need to be broken in a bit and tweaked though.

I'd like to hear about people's experiences with the CMC-2. If the CMC-2 is a big improvement over the CMC, doesn't need too much space behind it, and matches well with 683s (I'm planning on getting 683 fronts and moving the 685s or 686s to another room), then I'll keep the CMC for now and use my dealer upgrade option to go to the CMC-2 down the road. If it's not a good match, I need to return the CMC while I can. It was dumb of me to leave it in the box for 2 1/2 weeks, now I have less time to break it in, adjust placement, and give it a good listen.

At the shop the CMC sounded better to me than the HTM61/62, but I didn't spend ALL that much time listening to the centers, and placement issues could have been a factor as well. I'd love to go with a 685 for center, but that route would compromise aesthetics and/or viewing comfort too much for it to be a reasonable option.
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post #5424 of 18940 Old 11-01-2009, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ishoong View Post

Is it a good idea to match 683 with CM center 2? heard that the HTM61 is kind of weak and without the FST. I wish I can get the CM9 too but it is way beyond my budget.

The HTM61 may be kind of weak, or it may be kind of affordable. Both of those are subjective labels. What is not subjective is that the HTM61 does have the FST technology:

http://www.bowers-wilkins.com/displa...fid=2321&sc=ht
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post #5425 of 18940 Old 11-02-2009, 11:25 AM
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hello all...ive been looking everywhere for a pair and i finally found a guy who is trying to get rid of a pair and is asking for an offer....what would be a good fair price without offending him.....cherry and mint...thanks in advance for any input...
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post #5426 of 18940 Old 11-02-2009, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Sanman023 View Post

hello all...ive been looking everywhere for a pair and i finally found a guy who is trying to get rid of a pair and is asking for an offer....what would be a good fair price without offending him.....cherry and mint...thanks in advance for any input...

I think they list for about $3000 USD. $2400 USD (20% off) would probably be the best you can get at a dealer. Therefore, I would say $1800-$2000 would be a good offer, IMO.
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post #5427 of 18940 Old 11-02-2009, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Hammie View Post

I think they list for about $3000 USD. $2400 USD (20% off) would probably be the best you can get at a dealer. Therefore, I would say $1800-$2000 would be a good offer, IMO.

thanks lou...i needed that.....i was thinking $1900 paypal and shipped....
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post #5428 of 18940 Old 11-04-2009, 12:31 AM
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Hi guys, this is my first post on this forum. Actually I'm looking for help. I've had the DM602 S3 speakers since March, and I bought them due to glowing reviews within this price range. Even though the speakers look wonderful, and are very detailed, they don't seem full in my case at all. Totally lacking in bass. I have to turn the volume up really high before I'm satisfied by the bass, and by then the highs are too overwhelming.

I've tried driving them with my MArantz 5002 AVR (90 Watts per channel), and also with a Rotel RB850 (50 W per channel). Source is a SACD from Marantz, a DV7600. The speakers sound a bit better with the rotel, but still lacking. Could it be the preamp circuitry in the Marantz, filtering the signal somehow? I've tried with the speakers set to small and large, and even on the large setting they still just aren't full. I've tried various music.

I have to admit that the room is very large (7m x 10m x 2.5m), and has many hard surfaces. Even so, I have also tried the speakers in my office (3m x 4m), and they don't sound full in there either.

So now I really wonder if these speakers just aren't meant for bass reproduction? I certainly don't expect loud thumping bass, but I expect them to flesh out music acceptably at least. The funny thing is, I know they can go deep on bass. I've played some tracks with deep bass, and listened to thunder storms on them. They reproduce the deep bass, but it just seems that the low end of the frequency spectrum has much less gain. It doesn't take long before I get listening fatigue and have to turn the system off.

I would greatly appreciate any info you guys can give.

Tom
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post #5429 of 18940 Old 11-04-2009, 12:39 AM
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hey guys, anyone here running 805's in 2.0? if so, what amps are you guys using? im thinking about picking up a used mcintosh mc7100.. anyone have experience with the 7100?
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post #5430 of 18940 Old 11-04-2009, 04:51 AM
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Firstly, welcome to the forums!

I have owned the 602s3 in the past prior to upgrading to N805 then to 804s. I found the 602s3 to be slightly hot on the treble, and this can be fixed by two things. One, getting taller stands so that their tweeter was slightly higher than listening position. Next, treating the early reflection points.

For the bass problem, there are three major things that need to be fixed.
1.) Speaker placement. The location of the speaker in the room with regards to the walls determines your imaging and bass response. Also depending on the distance they are from the wall behind them, that distance corresponds to a 1/4 wavelength of a null frequency typically between 80hz and 200hz. The farther you have the speaker from the wall, the lower in frequency the null will be which helps to give you a better image, and more fullness in the lower guitar range.
2.) Listening position. The location of your listening chair will determine how badly the reflections in the room affect your listening experience. Sitting directly in the center of the room will be extremely detrimental to bass frequencies. Sitting against a wall will be extremely detrimental to some bass frequencies and will mess up the sound due to early reflections off of the close wall causing cancellation with the source wave. In a shoe-box dimensioned room (rectangular) a good place to start with the listening position is between 30-45% of the length dimension of the room with 38% being a typical good place to start.
3.) Room treatments. You gotta absorb/diffuse the reflections. A website like realtraps.com has a plethora of information to help you better understand absorbing and diffusing sound. example link

4.) Multiple subwoofers. By placing the speakers where the image the best (by sacrificing some bass), using multiple subwoofers will fill the bass down to the depths and enable you to place the subwoofers were bass works best in the room. Best of both worlds. This path requires care in placing the subwoofers and calibrating them to the level of the speakers appropriately. At the very least, there is a requirement for test tones and a sound-pressure level meter (like one that can be gotten from Radio Shack for 40$).

The above 4 points are only some of the major points that can fix your situation. The first 2 points are the most important, and they cost 0$. You have to spend the time to set up the listening position and speakers correctly so that you maximize your situation. For me, the next step was multiple subwoofers and careful calibration. Next is room absorption. Depending on your specific needs, room absorption would be prior to getting the multiple subwoofers or concurrent. For example, perhaps a small investment into room treatment (first reflection points) and a couple subwoofers simultaneously. To cure damaging bass problems that are inherent in almost all (if not all) normal sized rooms in a home requires significant investment into bass traps, however there are folks on this forum that are more than willing to give you more information about that. Websites like GIK acoustics and Realtraps have resources to help you better understand how trapping bass works and what problems you have in your room. They also frequently post here, (ethan from Realtraps, Glenn from GIK) giving you even further resource for helping to understand the problems in your room.


Quote:
Originally Posted by esotice View Post

Hi guys, this is my first post on this forum. Actually I'm looking for help. I've had the DM602 S3 speakers since March, and I bought them due to glowing reviews within this price range. Even though the speakers look wonderful, and are very detailed, they don't seem full in my case at all. Totally lacking in bass. I have to turn the volume up really high before I'm satisfied by the bass, and by then the highs are too overwhelming.

I've tried driving them with my MArantz 5002 AVR (90 Watts per channel), and also with a Rotel RB850 (50 W per channel). Source is a SACD from Marantz, a DV7600. The speakers sound a bit better with the rotel, but still lacking. Could it be the preamp circuitry in the Marantz, filtering the signal somehow? I've tried with the speakers set to small and large, and even on the large setting they still just aren't full. I've tried various music.

I have to admit that the room is very large (7m x 10m x 2.5m), and has many hard surfaces. Even so, I have also tried the speakers in my office (3m x 4m), and they don't sound full in there either.

So now I really wonder if these speakers just aren't meant for bass reproduction? I certainly don't expect loud thumping bass, but I expect them to flesh out music acceptably at least. The funny thing is, I know they can go deep on bass. I've played some tracks with deep bass, and listened to thunder storms on them. They reproduce the deep bass, but it just seems that the low end of the frequency spectrum has much less gain. It doesn't take long before I get listening fatigue and have to turn the system off.

I would greatly appreciate any info you guys can give.

Tom

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