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post #9361 of 19922 Old 08-26-2011, 09:02 AM
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Anybody here own the DB1 subwoofer? How are you finding it? What did it replace, and how does it compare?

Frank Harvey Hi-Fi, UK
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post #9362 of 19922 Old 08-26-2011, 05:31 PM
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Thought I would put this up one here, being that these are highly sought after. I have no direct involvement wit the buyer. http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....-finish-surrou


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post #9363 of 19922 Old 08-27-2011, 01:18 AM
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Hi all,
I have the B&W 685's and I want to match them up to a good Sub.
What do you think about the B&W ASW600?

Further recommendations are welcome.
I don't really want to spend over six hundred on like a ASW61STB.
I would like to stay in the $400.00 or less neighborhood.

Thanks,
Bud B
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post #9364 of 19922 Old 08-27-2011, 05:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud B View Post

Hi all,
I have the B&W 685's and I want to match them up to a good Sub.
What do you think about the B&W ASW600?

Further recommendations are welcome.
I don't really want to spend over six hundred on like a ASW61STB.
I would like to stay in the $400.00 or less neighborhood.

Thanks,
Bud B

I haven't heard the B&W subs, but a lot of people feel they are way overpriced for the output they produce. There is no reason not to consider other brands of sub. I use M&K subs with both of my systems (KEF Q7 in one case, B&W 704s in the other)--the main speakers are quite different from each other, but the sub integrates just fine with each system.

AT&T U-Verse Northeast Ohio

Denon x4000, Samsung LED TV, B&W 704 mains, two M&K subwoofers, Oppo 103, etc.
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post #9365 of 19922 Old 08-27-2011, 11:11 AM
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Actually, the B&W subs are great for music but they are a bit on the pricey side. I own an ASW610 and am pleased with it. Then again, my listening habits are 90% music/10% movies. I also have an ASW608 paired with B&W 685s in a small bedroom setup for music. They go very well together. If you want the extension required (or often desired) for home theatre you might want to consider another brand. HSU offers some quality subs in your price range including the STF-1 and STF-2.

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post #9366 of 19922 Old 08-27-2011, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbarach View Post

I haven't heard the B&W subs, but a lot of people feel they are way overpriced for the output they produce. There is no reason not to consider other brands of sub. I use M&K subs with both of my systems (KEF Q7 in one case, B&W 704s in the other)--the main speakers are quite different from each other, but the sub integrates just fine with each system.

I would look at the brand spanking new Emotiva subs. They have a pretty great feature set for the price. You get 600 Watt digital amp and advanced EQ control on the new 12 inch. They have a 30 day return policy and there is currently nothing else out there at that price with digital EQ. I am intrigued enough to consider for my office.
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post #9367 of 19922 Old 08-27-2011, 12:30 PM
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Hi all,
Thanks for the responses.
I did hear the B&W AW610's at BB (with Avatar playing) and it did sound good but at $650.00, it was a lot than I wanted to spend!
My listening habits lean towards Cable with HBO etc.. BluRays, with some HTPC Streaming thrown in.
I do watch Palladia which I love and Blu-Ray Concerts!
So a real mix of audio.

I have a Pioneer VSX 1020 driving my B&W 685's.
I am open to suggestions on any Subs and I have been searching the Sub Threads as well.
I have seen a lot about the HSU Subs not so much about the Emotiva but I will check them out, thanks for that.

The B&W ASW 600 and 300 used are closer to my price range and do get good reviews.
I saw this You Tube Video about a B&W ASW 300 THX Sub test...Wild!
Link here..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9NdUJPA3lM

I am really just looking for something that will complement my 685's and add a quality bottom end.

Thanks again and keep em coming..I'm in Research stage and then next weekend I am going to try and hear as many as I can locally.
Then I will drop the hammer and choose.

Have a Great Weekend and if your by Irene...Stay Safe!

Bud B
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post #9368 of 19922 Old 08-27-2011, 02:32 PM
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Hi SeattleHTGuy,
Update:
I checked out the Emotiva Subs.
They look nice with good features.
You are talking about the new X-Ref 12 Sub but it's too pricey....
Plus, I do not need all of the Digital processing of the X-Ref because my Pioneer will be setting all of the crossover points and LFE.

The Ultra Sub 12 looks more to what I need and still has a lot of adjustments.
Link here..http://emotiva.com/ultra_sub12.shtm

I'll investigate this further but it looks good on paper, just depends on how it sounds.

Thanks,

Bud B
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post #9369 of 19922 Old 08-28-2011, 11:56 AM
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The Emotiva 12 sub would be a good choice. It appears that the Emotiva 10 has reliability issues. I'm not sure about the 12. You might also consider offerings from Outlaw. The LFM-1 compact (10") is $399. Outlaw products are well reviewed here on the forums.

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post #9370 of 19922 Old 08-28-2011, 12:31 PM
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Hi postrokfan,

Thanks for the response.
I checked the Outlaw out but it is a "Down Firing" Sub and I live on the second floor of an Apartment Bldg.
I may want to stick with front loaded Subs.

Bud B
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post #9371 of 19922 Old 08-28-2011, 03:00 PM
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There's an easy fix for that. Just use a Sub dude. They're inexpensive and can be found at Amazon and other online retailers. But, I did miss that detail in your post indicating that the sub needs to be front-firing.

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post #9372 of 19922 Old 08-28-2011, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by postrokfan View Post

The Emotiva 12 sub would be a good choice. It appears that the Emotiva 10 has reliability issues. I'm not sure about the 12. You might also consider offerings from Outlaw. The LFM-1 compact (10") is $399. Outlaw products are well reviewed here on the forums.

IMHO you really can't go cheaper than the lowest subs from the online only manufacturers. The new Emos are feature packed for the price. The Ultra 12 is well reviewed. It is a big mistake to cheap out on a sub. I don't know many subs under $400 even worth buying. You will get high distortion , backstops tapping out, really cheap cabinetsetc ... So for the guy looking for a sub, my advice is just don't get anything until you can spring for an adequate sub. The b&ws are quite good but not at all good value. The ultra 10 is discontinued and did have some issues.
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post #9373 of 19922 Old 08-28-2011, 10:29 PM
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I have a hsu vtf2 mk3 that I sm very happy with. It took a little to get setup correctly(placement & my processor settings) but it was worth it.
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post #9374 of 19922 Old 08-28-2011, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjangus View Post

Need some help figuring out if this setup will play well together:

I'm planning to get a pair of PM1s and use them as the mains for HT/Music system in a NY apartment, so won't really be putting them to the test. I'll match them with an HTM4 for the center (Q: is this the best match?) and probably just go with M1s for the rears (Q: are these sufficient as rears in a small room?). I've got a Velodyne HGS-10 that should give me plenty of bass with the space I have. I'm powering just with a Denon 3312CI (don't need tons of power - would prefer to go with Rotel but really need the functionality built into the Denon AVR) - Q: will i get good sound from the PM1s with this amp or should I look at other options? Trying to stay around 1000 on the amp.

I appreciate any thoughts or suggestions. Many thanks,

Mike

Also, please let me know if this question is better suited to a different forum. Thanks again, Mike
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post #9375 of 19922 Old 08-29-2011, 06:32 PM
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Hi all,

OK, probably a dumb question but here goes.
I just recently purchased a pair of the B&W 685's.
I initially hard wired them by inserting the wire into the hole and tightening down the outer sleeve.

I assumed that they could also be connected with Banana plugs and since I was out of them, I ordered some from Monoprice.
So they came in today and I removed the first speaker wires and screwed on my new Bananas, (can you feel it coming..LOL) I went to insert the banana into the hole and it went nowhere.
So I unscrewed the outer sleeve and saw just a a red piece of plastic.
I then thought, Oh it's an insert, remove it and my Banana plug will go in.
Well the red plastic did not want to pop out with me fingernail, so rather than damage anything, I consulted the OP Manual but I saw nothing about Banana connectors.
I took off the bananas and put the wires back into the 685 like I had them before.

So my question...these speakers can only be hardwired and Bananas cannot be used?
My other speakers can be hardwired or use Bananas.

Thanks,

Bud B
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post #9376 of 19922 Old 08-29-2011, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud B View Post

Hi all,

OK, probably a dumb question but here goes.
I just recently purchased a pair of the B&W 685's.
I initially hard wired them by inserting the wire into the hole and tightening down the outer sleeve.

I assumed that they could also be connected with Banana plugs and since I was out of them, I ordered some from Monoprice.
So they came in today and I removed the first speaker wires and screwed on my new Bananas, (can you feel it coming..LOL) I went to insert the banana into the hole and it went nowhere.
So I unscrewed the outer sleeve and saw just a a red piece of plastic.
I then thought, Oh it's an insert, remove it and my Banana plug will go in.
Well the red plastic did not want to pop out with me fingernail, so rather than damage anything, I consulted the OP Manual but I saw nothing about Banana connectors.
I took off the bananas and put the wires back into the 685 like I had them before.

So my question...these speakers can only be hardwired and Bananas cannot be used?
My other speakers can be hardwired or use Bananas.

Thanks,

Bud B

Use a sharp nail or awl to pull the plastic and red inserts out. They do that so that people in Europe don't accidently try to put an electrical connection in them, It's a safety thing. I had the same for my 703s. Usually it's in the owner's manual in fine print somewhere.

Phil Tomaskovic
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post #9377 of 19922 Old 08-29-2011, 08:26 PM
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Hi Phil,

Thanks for that!
I just added the Bananas to my Speaker wire and removed all of the plastic inserts!
I'm good to go!
I thought it was something like that but I just did not want to go after it with a metal tool until I knew for sure!
I looked in the Manual and the website but did not see anything mentioned about doing that..

Thanks again,

Bud B
PS. The 685's even Sound Better! LOL!
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post #9378 of 19922 Old 08-29-2011, 09:40 PM
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B&W owners I need some guidance...

Here is my current start on Hometheater/2.1 Music room.

Fronts: 2x 805S
Centre: HTM4
Rears: In ceiling the top end Jamo, Dipole 10" in ceiling (WAF on these, regretably.)
Sub: EPIK Empire (Sealed, 2x15" Drivers, 600 watts.)

Reciever: Denon AVR 2809/989
HPTC: FLAC files and 1080P TV/Movies via XBMC
Digital Cable
EPSON 8350

My problems:

-I have a boxy 17"x22" room with one open half of a side, with VERY hard surfaces and signifcant echo.
-an amp section that I feel deos not do my front sound stage justice. I feel at mid to higher levels -I am losing out on control, and sound quality or 'life' - I think.

In short: I am losing out on clean, clear well controled sound quality - the thing we are all chasing here on many of these fourms. My room, power section and lower end DAC are likely prevenitng me from a decent result.

I need your advise on how to best impove my set up with my next round of funding - which is MAX $1000-$1500.

I am considering the following:

1)Power amp. I need 200x5 of clean, clear power to my B&W 800 series. Use my Denon as a pre amp.
If you choose this one, what should I go for?
Athem?
NAD?
Emotiva? (was my insital gut for price/performance)
Splurge for Rotel? (does not fit in $1500)

2)Room treatment - (prime accoustics London 12?) open to suggestions here. Do i need to place them perfectly? I have a nice, well decorated (ie. art etc) basement room. Can i place them all over to dampen the general sound then let room correct take over (for HTPC) (-I go Pure Direct for Music).

and/or (2+3 may be aforadbale in the same volley)

3) DAC for my HTPC digital flac files to come to life. rDAC?

a very distant consideration...

4) A new receiver (what my local HT guy was trying to sell me -$2300 ARcam)
to create a 'new base' for my rack. (Very relucnta as my Dneon is 1.5 years old and has preouts, 1.3 HDMI and Auduessy XT D-vol etc.).

Please advise on what you would do if you were me. Thanks in advance for any all efforts in providing feedback are appreciated.

William
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post #9379 of 19922 Old 08-30-2011, 03:15 PM
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Hello, I just purchased a Rotel 1520 integrated amp, I am setting it up to my iMac and have ALAC files for music (still searching for a DAC under $500). My system will be in the living room of an apartment (about 12x13). Which speakers do you recommend, B&W CM1 vs CM5, I have listened to both at a local shop but cannot decide if $500 extra is worth it. Thank you.
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post #9380 of 19922 Old 08-30-2011, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m1982 View Post

Hello, I just purchased a Rotel 1520 integrated amp, I am setting it up to my iMac and have ALAC files for music (still searching for a DAC under $500). My system will be in the living room of an apartment (about 12x13). Which speakers do you recommend, B&W CM1 vs CM5, I have listened to both at a local shop but cannot decide if $500 extra is worth it. Thank you.

You need to give us a ballpark amount that you are willing to spend. Does that amount include a budget for a sub? Are your listening habits strictly music or will you be using it also for movies? Thanks.

B&W 804D2, B&W HTM4 center, LSiFX surrounds, HSU sub, Onkyo TX-NR3010, Parasound Halo A31, NAD t975
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post #9381 of 19922 Old 08-31-2011, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkstar3 View Post
B&W owners I need some guidance...

Here is my current start on Hometheater/2.1 Music room.

Fronts: 2x 805S
Centre: HTM4
Rears: In ceiling the top end Jamo, Dipole 10" in ceiling (WAF on these, regretably.)
Sub: EPIK Empire (Sealed, 2x15" Drivers, 600 watts.)

Reciever: Denon AVR 2809/989
HPTC: FLAC files and 1080P TV/Movies via XBMC
Digital Cable
EPSON 8350

My problems:

-I have a boxy 17"x22" room with one open half of a side, with VERY hard surfaces and signifcant echo.
-an amp section that I feel deos not do my front sound stage justice. I feel at mid to higher levels -I am losing out on control, and sound quality or 'life' - I think.

In short: I am losing out on clean, clear well controled sound quality - the thing we are all chasing here on many of these fourms. My room, power section and lower end DAC are likely prevenitng me from a decent result.

I need your advise on how to best impove my set up with my next round of funding - which is MAX $1000-$1500.

I am considering the following:

1)Power amp. I need 200x5 of clean, clear power to my B&W 800 series. Use my Denon as a pre amp.
If you choose this one, what should I go for?
Athem?
NAD?
Emotiva? (was my insital gut for price/performance)
Splurge for Rotel? (does not fit in $1500)

2)Room treatment - (prime accoustics London 12?) open to suggestions here. Do i need to place them perfectly? I have a nice, well decorated (ie. art etc) basement room. Can i place them all over to dampen the general sound then let room correct take over (for HTPC) (-I go Pure Direct for Music).

and/or (2+3 may be aforadbale in the same volley)

3) DAC for my HTPC digital flac files to come to life. rDAC?

a very distant consideration...

4) A new receiver (what my local HT guy was trying to sell me -$2300 ARcam)
to create a 'new base' for my rack. (Very relucnta as my Dneon is 1.5 years old and has preouts, 1.3 HDMI and Auduessy XT D-vol etc.).

Please advise on what you would do if you were me. Thanks in advance for any all efforts in providing feedback are appreciated.

William
Anyone? Any comments?
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post #9382 of 19922 Old 08-31-2011, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkstar3 View Post
Anyone? Any comments?
I would deal with room treatments first, because any other changes that you subsquently make will be more effective if the room echo isn't getting in the way.

As an example, I used to own Carver Amazing loudspeakers, which are dipoles. The imaging became MUCH better when I dampened down the walls behind them with two large corkboards, the kind you pin messages to with thumbtacks. Bought them at an office supply store. I can't think of a single thing I could have done for such little money that made that much of an improvement. Now, anything you can do to put room treatments at the point of first reflection and to dampen down reflections from the floor in front of the speakers should make quite a difference. And it wouldn't be that expensive.

BTW now I have B&W 704s for my mains, and there is someone who I hope remains quite happy with the Carvers that I sold on ebay.

AT&T U-Verse Northeast Ohio

Denon x4000, Samsung LED TV, B&W 704 mains, two M&K subwoofers, Oppo 103, etc.
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post #9383 of 19922 Old 08-31-2011, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbarach

I would deal with room treatments first, because any other changes that you subsquently make will be more effective if the room echo isn't getting in the way.

As an example, I used to own Carver Amazing loudspeakers, which are dipoles. The imaging became MUCH better when I dampened down the walls behind them with two large corkboards, the kind you pin messages to with thumbtacks. Bought them at an office supply store. I can't think of a single thing I could have done for such little money that made that much of an improvement. Now, anything you can do to put room treatments at the point of first reflection and to dampen down reflections from the floor in front of the speakers should make quite a difference. And it wouldn't be that expensive.

BTW now I have B&W 704s for my mains, and there is someone who I hope remains quite happy with the Carvers that I sold on ebay.
I'd also go with better room treatment but I'd add an Emotiva XPA-3 for your fronts. I still have and use the original N805s. The little buggers really need lots of power to make them sing. As you have noticed with your Denon AVR, the 805S can be held back without lots of power; especially in a fairly medium big and difficult room. When I bought my XPA-1s and hooked them up to the N805s, I was quite surprised how the room really opened up for even moderate volume listening.

I have found the 805s really need a touch more power than most people feed them. In some ways and partly due to them being less efficient than the bigger 800 speakers, they need more power than my 803S's to really sound their best. you could go for another brand than Emotiva but if you skimp too much you won't see much of a boost in music and movies at higher volume. The Denon amps are pretty decent until pressed. You could look for a good used amp somewhere. I think Rotel Amps are over emphasized here only because they are sold in tandem with many B&Ws. There is no secret sauce to a Rotel/B&W combo.

I would not ditch your Denon AVR yet and wait for XT32 to be available in lower cost AVR's. I would also not yet get an external DAC. These are coming down in price as well and I'd just wait a bit. Just my opinion. Frankly, of all suppliers, ASUS may have a decent DAC coming soon. From my first look at it, it looks quite nice. Too early to tell but I always like competition.
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post #9384 of 19922 Old 09-01-2011, 08:09 AM
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Researching the B&W MT-25 set. Any comments or feedback on the MT-25? Also, anyone know if you can buy this set online (no dealer in my area) and how much they cost? Trying to figure out if this set is going out of my budget.

Also, any recommendations for a receiver for the set?
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post #9385 of 19922 Old 09-02-2011, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

I'd also go with better room treatment but I'd add an Emotiva XPA-3 for your fronts. I still have and use the original N805s. The little buggers really need lots of power to make them sing. As you have noticed with your Denon AVR, the 805S can be held back without lots of power; especially in a fairly medium big and difficult room. When I bought my XPA-1s and hooked them up to the N805s, I was quite surprised how the room really opened up for even moderate volume listening.

I have found the 805s really need a touch more power than most people feed them. In some ways and partly due to them being less efficient than the bigger 800 speakers, they need more power than my 803S's to really sound their best. you could go for another brand than Emotiva but if you skimp too much you won't see much of a boost in music and movies at higher volume. The Denon amps are pretty decent until pressed. You could look for a good used amp somewhere. I think Rotel Amps are over emphasized here only because they are sold in tandem with many B&Ws. There is no secret sauce to a Rotel/B&W combo.

...

I have heard this opinion from many sources and it always bothered me for some reason. I am sure that if we attached instruments to the 805 speaker outputs at normal volumes, we would be surprised at how little power is needed to make them go loud (their sensitivity is 88db/W/m, which means that they will give you 88dB with 1 Watt at one meter distance). With more distance you will need to add volume but I am sure that most of the time they coast at only a few watts. Obviously any competent amp can supply those few watts. OTOH I have heared that 805s sound better with dedicated separates, so there must be more at play than just sheer power.

I would speculate that more powerful dedicated power amplifiers have higher dumping factor, higher current capability and the ability to really drive the speakers AT ANY POWER that gives you better results over receivers. That means that it is not the power that you need but the driving ability. The fact that amps that can really drive somewhat difficult loads with gusto ALSO have a lot of power is a side effect, not the requirement. If somebody made a power amp with tons of current and high damping factor that only produced 60Wpc, I bet you it would drive 805s just fine in most real world situations (and much better than 100Wpc receivers).

Unfortunately moderate power amps with tons of current and high dumping factor are hard to find, so we usually have power and driving ability coming in tandem, resulting in frequent claims that 800 series requires 'tons of power to really come alive'. It is probably more correct to say that they require 'lots of current and control to come alive'. If you focus on current, you will be better off than chasing watts per channel by themselves. But of course, EMOTIVA amps have tons of current, hense the preference over receiver amps that normally have one pair of transistors per channel and limited power supplies.
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post #9386 of 19922 Old 09-02-2011, 05:35 PM
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So I was just curious about my volume for the speakers. So I don't know if did anything wrong prior to setting up the receiver settings but, I have to turn the volume on the receiver to -29dB which is more than half volume to get a loud volume. I know that some of my mp3s and youtube video have different volumes, so when playing through my speakers some might be loud at -35dB and some might not be as loud at that level. So I sampled a Flac music file and, the volume is loud at -29dB, but I was hoping that it should be glass shattering. I also turned the audio on the control panel, and the TMT5, youtube, PDVD10 at 100% volume so everything is controlled through the receiver. But anyways, I was just wondering if you had to turn your volume that high (-29dB) just to get a decent sound for watching movies and music. I also fiddled with the settings of the receiver, and changed the dB of the front and center to +2dB. Would increasing them over +5dB clip the receiver? When I did YPAO, it definitely did not change the front or center to the + spectrum of the volume.


I have a B&W CM1(one pair), and a B&W CMC 2. My receiver is a Yamaha RX-V667.
Thanks.
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post #9387 of 19922 Old 09-03-2011, 11:29 PM
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hello,

can you guys tell me where to buy 683 and htm61 all black color. should i get it at bestbuy? thanks
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post #9388 of 19922 Old 09-04-2011, 03:24 PM
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hello,

can you guys tell me where to buy 683 and htm61 all black color. should i get it at bestbuy? thanks
I think that you will pay essentially the same price anywhere for B&W speakers. Maybe you can find a small discount but I don't think the retailers have much leeway in setting B&W prices.

B&W 804D2, B&W HTM4 center, LSiFX surrounds, HSU sub, Onkyo TX-NR3010, Parasound Halo A31, NAD t975
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post #9389 of 19922 Old 09-04-2011, 03:39 PM
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I think that you will pay essentially the same price anywhere for B&W speakers. I don't think the retailers have much leeway in setting the prices.
Many retailers will sell for 10-20% off MSRP (but not BestBuy).

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post #9390 of 19922 Old 09-04-2011, 06:45 PM
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I think that you will pay essentially the same price anywhere for B&W speakers. I don't think the retailers have much leeway in setting the prices.

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Many retailers will sell for 10-20% off MSRP (but not BestBuy).

You have to walk in and ask what they can do as responses will vary. I recommend going in late at night during the weekday as it will increase the likelihood of a discount.
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