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post #9451 of 18905 Old 09-29-2011, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by miamioutlaw04 View Post

So your agreeing there is not much difference between the two?



Yes, and no

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post #9452 of 18905 Old 09-29-2011, 01:34 PM
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I have a 14'x11' HT room and would like to know if CM5's or CM1's on stands would be sufficient for a room this size? I will be running a powered sub too.
which CM center would you recommend with the CM5's or CM1's?

Also, would I want to use the same speakers for the rear surrounds in a 5.1 system?

thanks for the help!
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post #9453 of 18905 Old 09-29-2011, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by the.dude View Post

Thanks for your feedback. I've decided that if I purchase the B&W 600 series, I will buy an extra pair of 685s and use one as a center. I will either use the extra for a 6.1 system or try to sell it.

The 685 won't have the same aesthetic appeal as a horizontal CC, but I would rather have better sound quality.

Thanks to everyone who commented on my post.

Like most people say the HTM61 designed is little different due to size of the woofer on both left and right. The other problem with B&W 600 Series is that the front cover that have a lot of plastics on it does not help with the sound quality. You should try to hear the speakers with the cover off to see any differents to it.

I agree that an additional B&W 685 does make sense to aligned with the rest of the 685 for Front Left/Right. Most people where space or budget not an issue will have 5 identical speakers for Front Left/Right, Centre and Rear Left/Right. This is to ensure the surround sound is cohesion.

I have a pair of B&W 685 and B&W HTM61 which sounds good than my old Jamo Center Speakers when I still got my Jamo Set.

It also depending on the Amp and positioning of the speakers. In the Home Entertainment Setup there is so much to consider to make the sound right while to get good Stereo Sound, you need to more careful on selecting dedicated stereo equipment to have the same front Left/Right speakers sound good.

That is really base on my own experience of my own setup and going to a lot of Hi-Fi Store look at their setup and experience different brand/model of speakers.
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post #9454 of 18905 Old 09-29-2011, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by skidawgz View Post

I need the speaker to be able to handle hip-hop as well as classic rock, and many things in between. Bass is very important as I do not want to have to run a subwoofer to enjoy music. So, sorry for the long intro... I am considering 683s, CM8s or CM9s. I know that I have to go listen myself, and I have but I would like more input. How far apart do you think these models perform?

Just curious, why are you against using a sub? To get really good bass with hip-hop, etc., a separate sub is going to help you a lot. They're not just for home theaters...

That said, if you don't want to get one, then I'd cross the CM8 off the list as it has a smaller driver and won't extend as deep as the other two.
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post #9455 of 18905 Old 09-29-2011, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metsuke View Post

Just curious, why are you against using a sub? To get really good bass with hip-hop, etc., a separate sub is going to help you a lot. They're not just for home theaters...

That said, if you don't want to get one, then I'd cross the CM8 off the list as it has a smaller driver and won't extend as deep as the other two.

Hey, thanks for taking the time to read through my post.
I do not want to "have to" to enjoy the music. So I would like the speakers to have satisfying bass without the use of a sub. Currently I have an old crappy JBL sub, and I plan to add a 12" or 15" sub from an ID company when I can get around to affording it. Some sort of musical sub, but one piece at a time.

Will a subwoofer play in "Pure Direct" on AVRs?

AVR: Marantz 7008 Phono: Pro-Ject Debut III Speakers: BW CMC2 + 2xCM9 + Energy 2xCB-10 (rear)
TV: Panasonic 65ZT60
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post #9456 of 18905 Old 09-29-2011, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle454 View Post

I have a 14'x11' HT room and would like to know if CM5's or CM1's on stands would be sufficient for a room this size? I will be running a powered sub too.
which CM center would you recommend with the CM5's or CM1's?

Also, would I want to use the same speakers for the rear surrounds in a 5.1 system?

thanks for the help!

With the fronts crossed over around 80hz to a powered sub, yes CM5s will do very nicely. CM1s would be iffy IMO.

B&W would pair the CMC with CM5s, but I personally would go to the CMC2 because the CMC is still a D'Appolito array and doesn't have great off-axis response. In fact my own front setup is CM5 + CMC2 and it works great.

For surrounds, no need to have the same exact model, so CMC1 would be OK, especially for HT. Some serious surround music listeners would recommend you go with the 5s again, though - CM1s are said to be a bit thin on the low end.
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post #9457 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 12:19 AM
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is it true the new B&W speakers are "made in China" now?
I don't believe it, but it was a statement I read on the internet recently...
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post #9458 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 01:56 AM
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Originally Posted by kyle454 View Post

is it true the new B&W speakers are "made in China" now?
I don't believe it, but it was a statement I read on the internet recently...

Mine were. I read a while back that 800 series are still made in England though.
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post #9459 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 02:55 AM
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As I mentioned earlier I am pretty much set on buying either the CM8 or CM9 and hook them up to my Rotel RSX-1550. I'm not sure which one would be the best choice considering my apartment.

The size of the room they will be placed in is about 14'x19' and the listening area within this room will be about 10'x12'. The main focus of these speakers is music listening, ranging from jazz to rock. I have a wooden floor, with a 5'x7' carpet in the listening area.

I am afraid the CM9's will offer too much punch in my apartment (they will be placed near the wall that separates me from my neighbours). And will the Rotel RSX-1550 be able to unlock these speakers' potential?

Any thoughts?
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post #9460 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 11:59 AM
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What really surprised me is how good these old cdm2se sound as rear channels and how they match well with my 803s and htm1. The driver on them looks just like the one on the other speakers. I am not sure about the tweeter.
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post #9461 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 03:07 PM
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can someone tell me if a set of CM2's are clearly hands down better than the 685's for Front Left & Right?

thanks in advance!
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post #9462 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metsuke View Post

With the fronts crossed over around 80hz to a powered sub, yes CM5s will do very nicely. CM1s would be iffy IMO.

B&W would pair the CMC with CM5s, but I personally would go to the CMC2 because the CMC is still a D'Appolito array and doesn't have great off-axis response. In fact my own front setup is CM5 + CMC2 and it works great.

For surrounds, no need to have the same exact model, so CMC1 would be OK, especially for HT. Some serious surround music listeners would recommend you go with the 5s again, though - CM1s are said to be a bit thin on the low end.

Metsuke, do you have any issues with your CMC2 having the same (or close) tonal quality as the CM5's? I have recently purchased the CM5's and CMC2 and I am struggling to get the center to have the same dynamic range as the CM5's? I am using a Yamaha RX-A 3000 to drive the CM's. In HT mode, I cannot seem to get a good sound quality. I have not tried a blue ray yet, just been testing off of cable tv. The CM5's sound great in stereo. But HT has me scratching my head.

Any thoughts?
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post #9463 of 18905 Old 09-30-2011, 10:27 PM
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have a denon 4311 and B&W diamond HTM4 center with QED biwire cables (2 plugs to 4 plugs).

so I plugged in the red and black plugs to the back of the denon but I am not sure about the other end with 4 plugs. How do I know what plug goes into the top black vs the bottom black of the speaker and the same for the top red vs the bottom red? or does it matter?

thanks
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post #9464 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 03:52 AM
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Originally Posted by macmd View Post

have a denon 4311 and B&W diamond HTM4 center with QED biwire cables (2 plugs to 4 plugs).

so I plugged in the red and black plugs to the back of the denon but I am not sure about the other end with 4 plugs. How do I know what plug goes into the top black vs the bottom black of the speaker and the same for the top red vs the bottom red? or does it matter?

thanks

If it's 2 plugs to 4 plugs then it doesn't matter.
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post #9465 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 05:41 AM
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Will 685's work for my mains in my great room 14'x25'x9' being pushed with my Yamaha V663? Or do you think i should step up to the 684 for not much more money? Mosty tv/movies and some music, probably 80/20. I currently have 303 for L/R and LCR3 for center w/ older 10" Velodyne sub. House is being built currently so i have not heard my 303's in this house yet, obviously.

Suggestions for around $6-800 budget??
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post #9466 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bowen8688 View Post

Metsuke, do you have any issues with your CMC2 having the same (or close) tonal quality as the CM5's? I have recently purchased the CM5's and CMC2 and I am struggling to get the center to have the same dynamic range as the CM5's? I am using a Yamaha RX-A 3000 to drive the CM's. In HT mode, I cannot seem to get a good sound quality. I have not tried a blue ray yet, just been testing off of cable tv. The CM5's sound great in stereo. But HT has me scratching my head.

Any thoughts?

I also have CM5 fronts and a CMC2 center. I am really happy with the combo for HT. I ran with a phantom center for a few months before adding the CMC2 and I can understand where you are coming from as it really alters things quite a bit.

The CMC2 is a big speaker relative to the CM5s. I notice it especially in the mid-bass. The CMC2 really "hits you in the chest" during action sequences in a way the CM5s just aren't capable of. Part of what you are hearing may just be the process of your ears/mind adjusting to the added dynamics and power of your overall system.

To adjust the overall balance to your liking I have a few suggestions:

1) Experiment with speaker placement if your room allows. Speaker placement - even a few inches - can really have a large effect. Try adjusting distance of the CM5s as well as toe-in to see if you can dial in the balance that sounds right to you. If you have your center in an AV cabinet it may help to put it on a stand, or angle the front up slightly.

2) Experiment with the foam port plugs in the CMC2, especially if your center is in an AV cabinet or if the rear of the speaker is less than ~2' from the wall. This will cause the bass to roll off and may sound more balanced with the CM5s for you.

3) Try adjusting the volume trim in your AVR and set the volume of the center down a couple of db.
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post #9467 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Gzerro View Post

I also have CM5 fronts and a CMC2 center. I am really happy with the combo for HT. I ran with a phantom center for a few months before adding the CMC2 and I can understand where you are coming from as it really alters things quite a bit.

The CMC2 is a big speaker relative to the CM5s. I notice it especially in the mid-bass. The CMC2 really "hits you in the chest" during action sequences in a way the CM5s just aren't capable of. Part of what you are hearing may just be the process of your ears/mind adjusting to the added dynamics and power of your overall system.

To adjust the overall balance to your liking I have a few suggestions:

1) Experiment with speaker placement if your room allows. Speaker placement - even a few inches - can really have a large effect. Try adjusting distance of the CM5s as well as toe-in to see if you can dial in the balance that sounds right to you. If you have your center in an AV cabinet it may help to put it on a stand, or angle the front up slightly.

2) Experiment with the foam port plugs in the CMC2, especially if your center is in an AV cabinet or if the rear of the speaker is less than ~2' from the wall. This will cause the bass to roll off and may sound more balanced with the CM5s for you.

3) Try adjusting the volume trim in your AVR and set the volume of the center down a couple of db.

Thank you for the suggestions. I will give them a try this weekend and see what I can accomplish. More to comeā€¦
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post #9468 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msmeets View Post

As I mentioned earlier I am pretty much set on buying either the CM8 or CM9 and hook them up to my Rotel RSX-1550. I'm not sure which one would be the best choice considering my apartment.

The size of the room they will be placed in is about 14'x19' and the listening area within this room will be about 10'x12'. The main focus of these speakers is music listening, ranging from jazz to rock. I have a wooden floor, with a 5'x7' carpet in the listening area.

I am afraid the CM9's will offer too much punch in my apartment (they will be placed near the wall that separates me from my neighbours). And will the Rotel RSX-1550 be able to unlock these speakers' potential?

Any thoughts?

Bump... Isn't there anybody that can share some insight on this?
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post #9469 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveM1 View Post

Will 685's work for my mains in my great room 14'x25'x9' being pushed with my Yamaha V663? Or do you think i should step up to the 684 for not much more money? Mosty tv/movies and some music, probably 80/20. I currently have 303 for L/R and LCR3 for center w/ older 10" Velodyne sub. House is being built currently so i have not heard my 303's in this house yet, obviously.

Suggestions for around $6-800 budget??


Anyone????
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post #9470 of 18905 Old 10-01-2011, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by DaveM1 View Post

Anyone????

685 with a sub over the 684 unless you can step up to he 683. This steps you into the their three way design with their FST midrange and more articulate bass response.
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post #9471 of 18905 Old 10-02-2011, 04:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Fanaticalism View Post

685 with a sub over the 684 unless you can step up to he 683. This steps you into the their three way design with their FST midrange and more articulate bass response.


Great. I have heard the 685 and they sound awesome along with the 683. Just wasn't sure if there would be a huge difference in sound considering my room size. I may go with the 685 for now.
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post #9472 of 18905 Old 10-02-2011, 04:53 AM
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At the end of the day, when it's all said and done and whatever other cliche that applies, the CM8's and CM9's will bother your neighbors if you turn them up loud enough. You only live once; go for the 9's. I'm not sure about the Rotel because it's only rated at 75 watts and from what I've read and listening to a demo or ten, they may need a little more to make you grin.
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post #9473 of 18905 Old 10-02-2011, 08:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gzerro View Post

I also have CM5 fronts and a CMC2 center. I am really happy with the combo for HT. I ran with a phantom center for a few months before adding the CMC2 and I can understand where you are coming from as it really alters things quite a bit.

The CMC2 is a big speaker relative to the CM5s. I notice it especially in the mid-bass. The CMC2 really "hits you in the chest" during action sequences in a way the CM5s just aren't capable of. Part of what you are hearing may just be the process of your ears/mind adjusting to the added dynamics and power of your overall system.

To adjust the overall balance to your liking I have a few suggestions:

1) Experiment with speaker placement if your room allows. Speaker placement - even a few inches - can really have a large effect. Try adjusting distance of the CM5s as well as toe-in to see if you can dial in the balance that sounds right to you. If you have your center in an AV cabinet it may help to put it on a stand, or angle the front up slightly.

2) Experiment with the foam port plugs in the CMC2, especially if your center is in an AV cabinet or if the rear of the speaker is less than ~2' from the wall. This will cause the bass to roll off and may sound more balanced with the CM5s for you.

3) Try adjusting the volume trim in your AVR and set the volume of the center down a couple of db.

Nice answer. It also sounds to me like potential placement issues.

To add color: if the center is in a cabinet, pull it out right to the edge, so the front isn't recessed at all. You don't want any sound coming off and hitting the sides / top / bottom of the cabinet first thing.

Try to have the tweeter right at face level, or angled as such if it's lower.

Also, basic question: have you used the room correction in your receiver?
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post #9474 of 18905 Old 10-05-2011, 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Fanaticalism View Post

It has more to do with the proximity of the cc to the listening position. It is an odd design in that it is a MTW. The further you sit, the less of an issue it is (but an issue nonetheless).

What about 7 feet? That's how close I need to be for my Pro111FD.

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post #9475 of 18905 Old 10-05-2011, 05:52 PM
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Can any of you B&W guys give me any info on the Matrix 805 bookshelves? How do they compare to the Nautilus, "S", and Diamond lines? How would you compare them to say the 685 or 683?
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post #9476 of 18905 Old 10-05-2011, 07:29 PM
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You guys think an AVR is enough to make the CM9's/CMC2 sing and dance? Im not sure if im buying them yet. Im still listening to different speakers. But i heard them at my dealer with separates and they sounded really good. But im not sure if an AVR will bring out the same quality as separates.

I have a pioneer SC37.

Side note.

One thing i've noticed listening to different speakers (3k and up range) is that they all had the same information but sounded different. As in they each revealed every detail of the music but one was warm (CM9's) another bright (focal) and one smooth (totem forest).

One wasn't necessarily better than the other. IMO anyway.

home theater addict
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post #9477 of 18905 Old 10-05-2011, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [Irishman] View Post

What about 7 feet? That's how close I need to be for my Pro111FD.

On axis it is not a problem.
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post #9478 of 18905 Old 10-05-2011, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

You guys think an AVR is enough to make the CM9's/CMC2 sing and dance? Im not sure if im buying them yet. Im still listening to different speakers. But i heard them at my dealer with separates and they sounded really good. But im not sure if an AVR will bring out the same quality as separates.

I have a pioneer SC37.

Side note.

One thing i've noticed listening to different speakers (3k and up range) is that they all had the same information but sounded different. As in they each revealed every detail of the music but one was warm (CM9's) another bright (focal) and one smooth (totem forest).

One wasn't necessarily better than the other. IMO anyway.

I think you have answered your own question and are right about each speaker sounding different. The truth is each system is going to sound different in different environments based on many factors.

An AVR is more than capable of sounding great if properly matched with other components which include the room, cables, speakers....etc... and with proper setup....etc.

I would suggest you try to work with your dealer and get an in home demo of the speakers that you are considering. This will allow you the opportunity hear these speakers will sound in your environment.

Mid 2010 Mac Mini>B&W 805Di> Rotel RSX-1560> Harmony 890> iPad (4th gen.)
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post #9479 of 18905 Old 10-05-2011, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

Can any of you B&W guys give me any info on the Matrix 805 bookshelves? How do they compare to the Nautilus, "S", and Diamond lines? How would you compare them to say the 685 or 683?

Needless to say the 800 series is going to be a level above the 600 series with a more refined sound.

I own a pair of 805Di and did consider the 805S and the 685's. I had the chance to have an in-home demo of all three and the CT7.4 LCR. I listen to jazz and R&B with a lot of vocals and I down selected to the 805Dis and the CT7.4s because IMO they sounded the best when coupled with my Rotal RSX-1560.

I don't have any experience with the Matrix or the Nautilus 805's, but I would say, 805Dis, CT7.4LCR, 805S, 685, 683 is the order of sound quality IMO. But it will all depend on what type of music you listen to, your set-up and the room environment.

Mid 2010 Mac Mini>B&W 805Di> Rotel RSX-1560> Harmony 890> iPad (4th gen.)
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post #9480 of 18905 Old 10-07-2011, 01:15 PM
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Hello all,

i currently have a 9.2 set up with the following, I am wanting to go to 11.2.

Denon AVR-4311CI
Rotel 985 5 channel amp

B&W 603 mains and Wides
B&W DS6 dipole surrounds
B&W LCR6 SII Center
B&W 600 SII heights
MK MX125 II sub
JL Audio 10W3 sub in custom box

I also have a cc6 center channel sitting in a box.

I would really like to replace my LCR center channel. I have tried using the 603 as a center and really like it. I am also open to replacing the mains with a set of 800 series speakers. What 800 series should I look at to timber match as close as possible to the 600 series. If I go that route, is one of the 603s an option for a center and then find another LCR for the rear surrounds?

all opinions welcome

Brad T
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B W , Bowers And Wilkings 685 Speakers , carver cm-1090
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