B&W Owner's Thread - Page 849 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #25441 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 06:07 PM
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Phantom centers create more problems than they solve IMO.
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post #25442 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 06:42 PM
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So I accidentally dented my new tweeter on my CM10 S2's during installation. The aluminum dome popped back up immediately but there's some kind of slight ripple/imprint area where the dent was. Will this affect the tweeter sound at all? I'm debating to send it all back to B&W and ask for another tweeter.
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post #25443 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Solarium View Post
So I accidentally dented my new tweeter on my CM10 S2's during installation. The aluminum dome popped back up immediately but there's some kind of slight ripple/imprint area where the dent was. Will this affect the tweeter sound at all? I'm debating to send it all back to B&W and ask for another tweeter.
It most likely will not affect sound. However, your resale value will take a hit as you'll have to disclose that you've dented one of the tweeters. Man up and pay for a replacement. B&W owes you nothing.
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post #25444 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 07:12 PM
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Phantom centers create more problems than they solve IMO.

How so?
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post #25445 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 07:23 PM
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Not if you have a TV. Center of the screen must be eye level, center of the midrange driver in the center channel must be ear level. See the problem? Now if one has projection, that's a different story.
Never heard of tilting the axis of the speaker? Works for me with 3 floorstanders that are just short of the bottom edge of the screen.

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post #25446 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 08:42 PM
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Not if you have a TV. Center of the screen must be eye level, center of the midrange driver in the center channel must be ear level. See the problem? Now if one has projection, that's a different story.
Never heard of tilting the axis of the speaker? Works for me with 3 floorstanders that are just short of the bottom edge of the screen.
Right? There are always give and takes in the Home Theater world.
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post #25447 of 25470 Old 10-16-2017, 09:23 PM
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How so?


From what I hear, the phantom center is not so great when listening from the left or right. Also you have no option of running the center a little hot if you want louder dialogue


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post #25448 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 04:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Harry Critchley View Post
I don't enjoy really bright sounding speakers too,
i did listen to the kef r500 and it was quite sharp at times, some people are saying the same about the new b&w 700 series aswell , I had considered upgrading my cm9s2 for the 703s but i don't think there would be a huge difference?
I
I'm listening to the 703 S2s as I type, smooth as butter. I just replaced CM8 S2. Huge difference. Much more open sound. More 3 dimensional midrange. Everything has been upgraded in the right direction.
I thought there was a big difference between the cm8s and cm9s but i'm not convinced that there will be a big difference between the cm9s and 703s
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post #25449 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 05:51 AM
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I thought there was a big difference between the cm8s and cm9s but i'm not convinced that there will be a big difference between the cm9s and 703s
This difference between say cm9v2 and 703s2 is huge. The 703 sound stage is much better and the clarity is much better on the 703. The cm series sounds like you're listening in a tunnel compared to the 700 s2 series. The 703 and 702s2 has some of the best mid bass I've heard in a while. We are talking about midrange sounds you feel in your chest. Much bigger (IMO) than cm8 to cm9. I also feel the 702 is worth the $900 over the 703. The tweeter up top and the extra mid bass driver is nice.

Hey guys for phantom center, I was only suggesting testing it since he has 802d3's and wanted to know how his nautilus 800 center fit in. If the timbre was better phantom then he knows the nautilus center won't do.

The phantom center works great for a permanent install if you are mainly worried about yourself, centered, in front of the screen otherwise you'd want a real center
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post #25450 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Harry Critchley View Post
I thought there was a big difference between the cm8s and cm9s but i'm not convinced that there will be a big difference between the cm9s and 703s
This difference between say cm9v2 and 703s2 is huge. The 703 sound stage is much better and the clarity is much better on the 703. The cm series sounds like you're listening in a tunnel compared to the 700 s2 series. The 703 and 702s2 has some of the best mid bass I've heard in a while. We are talking about midrange sounds you feel in your chest. Much bigger (IMO) than cm8 to cm9. I also feel the 702 is worth the $900 over the 703. The tweeter up top and the extra mid bass driver is nice.

Hey guys for phantom center, I was only suggesting testing it since he has 802d3's and wanted to know how his nautilus 800 center fit in. If the timbre was better phantom then he knows the nautilus center won't do.

The phantom center works great for a permanent install if you are mainly worried about yourself, centered, in front of the screen otherwise you'd want a real center
how long is the breaking in period for for the new 703s
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post #25451 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 10:50 AM
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From what I hear, the phantom center is not so great when listening from the left or right. Also you have no option of running the center a little hot if you want louder dialogue


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Exactly. Move your head even a little bit and you'll find yourself in a different movie.

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post #25452 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 11:49 AM
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AVR CM8 S2's

Hi, I just purchased a pair of CM8 S2's and am now searching for an A/V receiver. I want to build a home theater system but will listen to music as well.

I can get a good deal on a Marantz sr6011. It is rated at 110watts at 8 ohms with 2 channels. My question is this enough to get decent sound from the CM8's?

Eventually I will get a dedicated amp for them.

Many thanks in advance.
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post #25453 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 12:40 PM
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This difference between say cm9v2 and 703s2 is huge. The 703 sound stage is much better and the clarity is much better on the 703. The cm series sounds like you're listening in a tunnel compared to the 700 s2 series. The 703 and 702s2 has some of the best mid bass I've heard in a while. We are talking about midrange sounds you feel in your chest. Much bigger (IMO) than cm8 to cm9. I also feel the 702 is worth the $900 over the 703. The tweeter up top and the extra mid bass driver is nice.

Hey guys for phantom center, I was only suggesting testing it since he has 802d3's and wanted to know how his nautilus 800 center fit in. If the timbre was better phantom then he knows the nautilus center won't do.

The phantom center works great for a permanent install if you are mainly worried about yourself, centered, in front of the screen otherwise you'd want a real center
I went to other stereo stores that had the 702s2's and 703s2's side by side and you can clearly hear that the 702's are the better speakers! I also listen to the 800 D3's and I also agree with that reviewer that said.. 'in many ways the 702s2's sound more like the 800 D3's'!
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post #25454 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
This difference between say cm9v2 and 703s2 is huge. The 703 sound stage is much better and the clarity is much better on the 703. The cm series sounds like you're listening in a tunnel compared to the 700 s2 series. The 703 and 702s2 has some of the best mid bass I've heard in a while. We are talking about midrange sounds you feel in your chest. Much bigger (IMO) than cm8 to cm9. I also feel the 702 is worth the $900 over the 703. The tweeter up top and the extra mid bass driver is nice.

Hey guys for phantom center, I was only suggesting testing it since he has 802d3's and wanted to know how his nautilus 800 center fit in. If the timbre was better phantom then he knows the nautilus center won't do.

The phantom center works great for a permanent install if you are mainly worried about yourself, centered, in front of the screen otherwise you'd want a real center
I went to other stereo stores that had the 702s2's and 703s2's side by side and you can clearly hear that the 702's are the better speakers! I also listen to the 800 D3's and I also agree with that reviewer that said.. 'in many ways the 702s2's sound more like the 800 D3's'!
why do you think the 702s sound better than the 703s?
Some people say the 702s are too bright and that the 703s sound more realistic
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post #25455 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 01:52 PM
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why do you think the 702s sound better than the 703s?
Some people say the 702s are too bright and that the 703s sound more realistic
I must have listen to 702s2's that were broke in good because this time they had a much bigger soundstage than the 703's and the tweeters were cleaner and better defined on the 702's too. You can hear deeper into the soundstage with the 702's with a much better defined bottom-end and everything into the music is cleaner and much better defined so you can hear everything on the recording more clearly on the 702's.
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post #25456 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 03:01 PM
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I must have listen to 702s2's that were broke in good because this time they had a much bigger soundstage than the 703's and the tweeters were cleaner and better defined on the 702's too. You can hear deeper into the soundstage with the 702's with a much better defined bottom-end and everything into the music is cleaner and much better defined so you can hear everything on the recording more clearly on the 702's.
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I went back and listened the 702s2 and 703s2 and the 703s2's wins hands down! It's hard to believe but the 703's just sounds more realistic to my ears!
So, which model wins today? What is different that now the 702's sound better, and were you able to compare to the new 703's at the same time?

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #25457 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 03:46 PM
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I went to other stereo stores that had the 702s2's and 703s2's side by side and you can clearly hear that the 702's are the better speakers! I also listen to the 800 D3's and I also agree with that reviewer that said.. 'in many ways the 702s2's sound more like the 800 D3's'!
Full disclosure: I have not yet heard the 700's, and have very little time with the 800 D3 models. However, having owned 600's, CM's, and now 802 D2's, I can say that the difference between the CM9 S2 and 802 D2 is enormous. Like, not even on the same planet enormous.

As such, I do have a hard time believing that the 702, as good as it may be, can sound anything like B&W's $30,000 flagship. If it does, that's awesome, but the 800 D3 probably has more money just in parts than the complete 702 model at full retail. Heck, the diamond tweeters alone will set you back about 1200 bucks apiece if you need to replace one.

I know that sound quality is not always commensurate with cost, but I'm skeptical.

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post #25458 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 06:03 PM
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Full disclosure: I have not yet heard the 700's, and have very little time with the 800 D3 models. However, having owned 600's, CM's, and now 802 D2's, I can say that the difference between the CM9 S2 and 802 D2 is enormous. Like, not even on the same planet enormous.

As such, I do have a hard time believing that the 702, as good as it may be, can sound anything like B&W's $30,000 flagship. If it does, that's awesome, but the 800 D3 probably has more money just in parts than the complete 702 model at full retail. Heck, the diamond tweeters alone will set you back about 1200 bucks apiece if you need to replace one.

I know that sound quality is not always commensurate with cost, but I'm skeptical.
I know many don't like to talk about this but the law of diminishing returns starts kicking in at around $4K for speakers!

After listening to both speakers back to back I thought the 702's had many of the qualities of the 800 D3 But with.. much less bottom end . Think of the 702's as the 800 d3's made for smaller rooms!
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post #25459 of 25470 Old 10-17-2017, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by adrummingdude View Post
Full disclosure: I have not yet heard the 700's, and have very little time with the 800 D3 models. However, having owned 600's, CM's, and now 802 D2's, I can say that the difference between the CM9 S2 and 802 D2 is enormous. Like, not even on the same planet enormous.

As such, I do have a hard time believing that the 702, as good as it may be, can sound anything like B&W's $30,000 flagship. If it does, that's awesome, but the 800 D3 probably has more money just in parts than the complete 702 model at full retail. Heck, the diamond tweeters alone will set you back about 1200 bucks apiece if you need to replace one.

I know that sound quality is not always commensurate with cost, but I'm skeptical.
I know many don't like to talk about this but the law of diminishing returns starts kicking in at around $4K for speakers!

After listening to both speakers back to back I thought the 702's had many of the qualities of the 800 D3 But with.. much less bottom end . Think of the 702's as the 800 d3's made for smaller rooms!
I don't think anyone is in dought that the 800s are better than the 700 series.
The main questions was about the new 700 series and which model is best ?
And the improvement over the cm series
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post #25460 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 02:00 AM
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I know many don't like to talk about this but the law of diminishing returns starts kicking in at around $4K for speakers!

After listening to both speakers back to back I thought the 702's had many of the qualities of the 800 D3 But with.. much less bottom end . Think of the 702's as the 800 d3's made for smaller rooms!
I’d actually say diminishing returns on speakers kicks in at around $200, but that doesn’t mean a $200 speaker is going to be anything even approaching a $10,000 speaker. It will just be a better value. That’s all.

With all the hype around these 700’s, I’d like to be impressed. I remember seeing the Hope diamond in D.C. a few years back. Walking in to the smithsonian, I was sure the thing was going to be the size of a basketball...I mean, it’s the Hope diamond. Instead, I had a “really, that’s it? moment when I saw the thing. It’s about the size of a big marble.

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post #25461 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 02:44 AM
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I know many don't like to talk about this but the law of diminishing returns starts kicking in at around $4K for speakers!

After listening to both speakers back to back I thought the 702's had many of the qualities of the 800 D3 But with.. much less bottom end . Think of the 702's as the 800 d3's made for smaller rooms!
I?d actually say diminishing returns on speakers kicks in at around $200, but that doesn?t mean a $200 speaker is going to be anything even approaching a $10,000 speaker. It will just be a better value. That?s all.

With all the hype around these 700?s, I?d like to be impressed. I remember seeing the Hope diamond in D.C. a few years back. Walking in to the smithsonian, I was sure the thing was going to be the size of a basketball...I mean, it?s the Hope diamond. Instead, I had a ?really, that?s it? moment when I saw the thing. It?s about the size of a big marble.
yeah your right hifi is a bit of a rip off really ?
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post #25462 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 07:55 AM
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I'm going to wait and listen to 701s2's and 700s2's coming in the near future before buying.

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Hi all,

I recently updated my cm10 s2 and my sub asw10 s2 and bought a pair of 804 D3 and a DB1. and that besides the huge price differnce also another level of audio quality, luckily!

Cheers

Arcam PreAmp: AVR550, NAD Amp: m27, 5.1.2 setup B&W LCR: 2x 804 D3 + CM centre 2 S2, Sub: DB1 Nubert Sur: 2x nuVero 50, Atmos/ Ceiling: 2x WS 14, isotek mains conditioner: EVO 3 Aquarius, Samsung 65JU7080, Microsoft Xbox One S + Surface Pro 4
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Hi all,

I recently updated my cm10 s2 and my sub asw10 s2 and bought a pair of 804 D3 and a DB1. and that besides the huge price differnce also another level of audio quality, luckily!

Cheers
nice speakers, how much did they cost you and what are you using to power then?
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post #25465 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 11:26 AM
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Hi all,

I recently updated my cm10 s2 and my sub asw10 s2 and bought a pair of 804 D3 and a DB1. and that besides the huge price differnce also another level of audio quality, luckily!

Cheers
And some say the all new 702 s2's are a whole another level of audio quality over the cm10 s2's too!

Even the 703 s2's are said to be better speakers than the old cm10 s2's!

Last edited by musicman777; Yesterday at 11:33 AM.
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nice speakers, how much did they cost you and what are you using to power then?
Well i bought the two 804 D3 and the DB1 from a guy that owned them for 1.5 Years. He decided to switch to the 803 D3 without sub. I payed for the three 8500 SFr. thats around 7400 Euros. So i think it was a very good deal.

I'm driving the speakers with a NAD m27. You can see my set up in my signature.

Cheers

Arcam PreAmp: AVR550, NAD Amp: m27, 5.1.2 setup B&W LCR: 2x 804 D3 + CM centre 2 S2, Sub: DB1 Nubert Sur: 2x nuVero 50, Atmos/ Ceiling: 2x WS 14, isotek mains conditioner: EVO 3 Aquarius, Samsung 65JU7080, Microsoft Xbox One S + Surface Pro 4
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post #25467 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Harry Critchley View Post
nice speakers, how much did they cost you and what are you using to power then?
Well i bought the two 804 D3 and the DB1 from a guy that owned them for 1.5 Years. He decided to switch to the 803 D3 without sub. I payed for the three 8500 SFr. thats around 7400 Euros. So i think it was a very good deal.

I'm driving the speakers with a NAD m27. You can see my set up in my signature.

Cheers
nice the new NAD stuff is really good , I have the NAD C388 to power my cm9s2 although im contemplating upgrading to the 703s!
Your nad is a power amp right? Bet it sounds awesome, what pre amp are you using ?
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post #25468 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RMR1der View Post
Hi all,

I recently updated my cm10 s2 and my sub asw10 s2 and bought a pair of 804 D3 and a DB1. and that besides the huge price differnce also another level of audio quality, luckily!

Cheers
And some say the all new 702 s2's are a whole another level of audio quality over the cm10 s2's too!

Even the 703 s2's are said to be better speakers than the old cm10 s2's!
really? were did you hear about the 703s being better that cm10 s2?
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nice the new NAD stuff is really good , I have the NAD C388 to power my cm9s2 although im contemplating upgrading to the 703s!
Your nad is a power amp right? Bet it sounds awesome, what pre amp are you using ?
Yes the m27 is a power amp. at the moment i'm using an Arcam avr550 receiver as pre amp. I bought the new NAD m17v2 pre amp this may... but it won't be available before mid december unfortunately. when i bought it it was said it will be on the market in europe in july...

Arcam PreAmp: AVR550, NAD Amp: m27, 5.1.2 setup B&W LCR: 2x 804 D3 + CM centre 2 S2, Sub: DB1 Nubert Sur: 2x nuVero 50, Atmos/ Ceiling: 2x WS 14, isotek mains conditioner: EVO 3 Aquarius, Samsung 65JU7080, Microsoft Xbox One S + Surface Pro 4
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post #25470 of 25470 Old Yesterday, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Harry Critchley View Post
really? were did you hear about the 703s being better that cm10 s2?
All the stereo stores I've went to listen to new 700 series said the 702 s2's and 703 s2's were better sounding speakers and I listen to the cm10 s2 right before the new 700 series came out because I was thinking about buying a pair but ended up waiting for the 700 series because I did not like the bright sound tweeters or the bottom end on the cm10 s2's! I agree with the Dealers, these all new 702's 703's are better sounding speakers than the older cm10 s2's!
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