Would I benefit from going to higher quality speaker wire? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 01:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I currently run the Sony 4es and Paradigm Studio 100's in front and studio 60's in the rear.

I was thinking of going to something better than the home depot cable. It is starting to turn green.

I was thinking of going with bettercables or kimber. Something in the 200 per pair range.
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post #2 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 01:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sincere View Post

It is starting to turn green.


money wasted on cheapo

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post #3 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 01:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cpu8088 View Post

money wasted on cheapo


I figured so.
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post #4 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 02:58 AM
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Stay with something inexpensive or moderately priced, just get higher quality this time. BlueJeansCable is a good choice.

-Max
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post #5 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 04:37 AM
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If the green color, a surface phenomenon, upsets you, then go with a speaker wire whose dielectric (the stuff that covers the actual wires) is not PVC.

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post #6 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 08:41 AM
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Don't waste your money on even moderately expensive speaker wire. Check out this site which seems to have all the information you would ever need to know about speaker wire: http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm While I am not an audio engineer, I know a number of audio professionals and top engineers and the site's advice matches what they have told me.

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post #7 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:02 AM
 
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If you'll note, Mr. Russell advises against green speaker wire
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post #8 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:02 AM
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Take a look at the copper pipes in your house - they're green (inside and out), does your water taste any different than the day they were new, bright, shiny copper?

Take a look at the electrical wires in your house - they're green too and still conduct electricity just as well as the day they were new, bright, shiny copper.

Your green speaker wire will also continue to conduct electricity just as well as when they were new, bright, shiny copper. All speaker wire does is conduct an electrical signal from your receiver/amp to your speakers.
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post #9 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:07 AM
 
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There is more to the equation than simply "conducting electricity". Corrosion of the wire can and will affect sound. If it remains simply on the surface, it probably isn't a huge deal. If the wire starts corroding badly around the contact points, sound will be affected, as the electrical properties of the copper will change.
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post #10 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:09 AM
 
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FWIW, I use Audioquest GBC without any issues. It isn't ultra cheap, but at $80 for an 8ft pair finished with Audioquest nanners, it is well within your budget, and they look pretty good to boot.
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post #11 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:11 AM
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Stefano,

You're right concerning corrosion. If the wires are green from oxidation that's one thing. If they're corroded, however, they need to be changed.
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post #12 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:17 AM
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You gotta get those Valhalla power cables.

They are fast, Speed: 91% Speed of light.
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post #13 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 09:28 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sincere View Post

I was thinking of going with bettercables or kimber. Something in the 200 per pair range.

You don't need to spend nearly that much. Kimber 4PR is only $2.00/ft, and sounds noticeably better than both generic and Monster XP (I know because I have A/B'd it with both.)
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post #14 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 10:22 AM
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If your wires are corroding that badly, you might want to give some thought as to what you're breathing.

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post #15 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 10:28 AM
 
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Think about rust and tell me about the corrosive properties of oxygen.
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post #16 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 10:40 AM
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Copper doesn't rust like other metals; hence its use in water pipes, roofing, decorative outdoor garden ornaments, weather vanes, electrical wires, etc. Oxidation will turn it green, but shouldn't corrode it.
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post #17 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 10:41 AM
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Just be sure to get the proper gauge in correspondence with the length of run. And yes, corrosion will certainly effect the sound. Those AudioQuest cables that were recommend are perfect and not too pricey. I have AudioQuest Quad type 4 cables along with Blue Jeans Canare 4s11 speaker wire. There is no sound quality difference between the two (there shouldn't be unless the wire is flawed, damaged or intentionally designed to change the sound - IOW flawed). Of course, the AudioQuest stuff is much nicer looking...

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post #18 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 10:51 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhoganjr View Post

Copper doesn't rust like other metals; hence its use in water pipes, roofing, decorative outdoor garden ornaments, weather vanes, electrical wires, etc. Oxidation will turn it green, but shouldn't corrode it.


It won't rust per say and copper is highly resistant to corrosion, but it can corrode around the contacts. That wasn't really the point so much as Chu thinking that the air we breathe not having any properties that would cause corrosion in materials.
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post #19 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 10:58 AM
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If the green bothers you, replace them. Make sure to wire using a heavy enough gauge for the length of run you need. Save the extra money you'd spend on fancy cables for acoustic treatments or a new component.
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post #20 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefano-M View Post

If you'll note, Mr. Russell advises against green speaker wire

Not quite. What he says is that "Although the wire may not corrode any further, it doesn't inspire confidence, particularly if the insulation comes close to the connecting terminals." He does not state that surface oxidation of copper wire will make any impact on the sound you hear. Nor should it.

As to buying wire because it is "only" $2 or $5 per foot, that is still silly unless the look of the wires behind your speakers is important enough to you to justify the extra cost you are paying. You can get decent, cheap, speaker wire at places other than Home Depot for 40 cents or less per foot that will not later turn green.

And while I have heard any number of people claim that they heard a difference in differently priced wires based upon A/B testing, I have never heard anyone reputable claim that there is a measurable difference in wires of the same gauge, regardless of cost. I have in fact heard many reputable people say that there is no such measurable difference. I'll trust measurements, over what someone thinks they heard, any day.

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post #21 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 11:37 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tnilsson View Post

Not quite. What he says is that "Although the wire may not corrode any further, it doesn't inspire confidence, particularly if the insulation comes close to the connecting terminals." He does not state that surface oxidation of copper wire will make any impact on the sound you hear. Nor should it.

What is "not quite" about that? Things like "it doesn't inspire confidence" sounds pretty darned negative to me. Surface oxidation won't affect the sound (nor did I claim it will), but it is indicative of other potential problems, which could affect sound.
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post #22 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 11:42 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tnilsson View Post

And while I have heard any number of people claim that they heard a difference in differently priced wires based upon A/B testing, I have never heard anyone reputable claim that there is a measurable difference in wires of the same gauge, regardless of cost. I have in fact heard many reputable people say that there is no such measurable difference. I'll trust measurements, over what someone thinks they heard, any day.

Ohh and yes, there CAN be measurable differences between wires of the same gauge. Look at the Audioholics DIY cable roundup and look at the CAT 5 group, and see how wrapping the cables together differently alone can affect RLC. Resistance alone yeah, it shouldn't vary too much. Inductance and capacitance, thats another story.
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post #23 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 11:51 AM
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i still cannot find a green nordost valhalla cable

but there are imitations of those nordost valhalla from china selling at a fraction of genuine price. if cable is cable perhaps you should consider buying some

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post #24 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 12:10 PM
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A little oxidation has nothing to do with sound quality whatsoever,the copper oxidizes because of the humidity in the air and not because of electrical conduction,even if you use 200 dollar wire it will still oxidize no matter what,what I do is I take a little flux and solder
and I tin the edges so they won't corrode or change color.
And I am using 12 gauge speaker wire and my ends never change color because I bothered to take a little time to treat the ends so they won't corrode.
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post #25 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 12:10 PM
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I take it you've seen the Van deHull knockoffs too Valhalla. What's next from China? Unauthorized Harley Davidson stuff?!

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post #26 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 12:12 PM
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Quote:


Ohh and yes, there CAN be measurable differences between wires of the same gauge. Look at the Audioholics DIY cable roundup and look at the CAT 5 group, and see how wrapping the cables together differently alone can affect RLC. Resistance alone yeah, it shouldn't vary too much. Inductance and capacitance, thats another story.

Certainly. Now what's the drop at say 1 kHz and 10 kHz for something like 3 meters?

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post #27 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 12:17 PM
 
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Probably not a whole lot, although in the Audioholics cable roundup part I, that stealth ribbon crap might have been of shoddy enough quality to make an audible difference.
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post #28 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 12:36 PM
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Yeah, I saw that. But just think. You can do the same thing with zip cord. Just rip it apart.

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post #29 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai View Post

I take it you've seen the Van deHull knockoffs too Valhalla. What's next from China? Unauthorized Harley Davidson stuff?!

LMAO!

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post #30 of 110 Old 12-19-2006, 01:13 PM
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Oh, that's a problem over there. Well not for China, but for HD. They'll be damned if they pay royalties!

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