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post #361 of 1051 Old 09-02-2008, 12:55 PM
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It has been three months and we are at 300+ hours now. These speakers are opening up (bloom) even more.

They have gone well beyond the typical focus of high, mid and low. We are now hearing the performances on the discs as they are recorded; good or bad. Complex passages are clearly laid out as in the recording venue with no obvious loss in instrument voices. Layering now is easily discernible and realistic. Images of performers and soloist now almost "feel" full body length. This is the strangest sensation. It must be old live-concert experiences being revived by some subtle audible cues. My mind can almost "see" them. Soundstage now defies descriptive terms like large or small, it is about whatever venue ambience information is on the disc. What it has is what we get. A day in the park? Opera house? I ended up popping in CD after CD listening to them as though it is the first time. The sensitivity of the drivers are simply fantastic; fast and yet faithful in reproduction.

There was a live-recording piece with complex interactions of instruments and vocals and with an orchestral viola section providing a rhythmic support in the background. The violas were not just audible or identifiable, they were there with full body string sweetness; even in the background! That midrange is just sweet.

The downside is they are merciless with poorly recorded discs. I will be replacing quite a few CD's or resurrect our old vinyl collection from storage to save money.

We are now looking forward to the 400+ and then the 500+ marks!

Cheers!
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post #362 of 1051 Old 09-02-2008, 04:43 PM
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Got my new boombox yesterday. Do you think it will improve upon the CS 3.7's low-end....?

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post #363 of 1051 Old 09-02-2008, 05:11 PM
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CHA!

That is one massive SS4, you are going to rock the mountains and cause an avalanche!

HHHHooooooyyyyyaaahh! I love it!

Please tell us how it all works out, that is one monster set-up!
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post #364 of 1051 Old 09-03-2008, 04:42 AM
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First one I've ever heard of in someone's house.

What are the specs for that beast ??!!!
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post #365 of 1051 Old 09-03-2008, 05:30 AM
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113db at 20Hz, 120db at 30Hz. Flat to 10Hz.
However, high SPL's are not the most important to me. If so, I could have bought a couple of SVS's and save lots of money.

I don't know how it performs yet, have to convert both the sub and Integrator to 230 volts first.
But of-course, I expect it to be insanely capable..
I'll get back..
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post #366 of 1051 Old 09-03-2008, 11:10 AM
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Cha,

Is that a SCS4 in front of your TV? If it is, can you please share your impression of its capability?

On the 230V work for the SS4, are you dedicating a circuit to the sub? In the US, for 1000W of power consumption, we will be putting in a dedicated 15A (120V) circuit to ensure smooth performance.

I just want to say that the SS4 is bigger than the Wilson Audio MAXX!!!

Cheers!
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post #367 of 1051 Old 09-05-2008, 12:05 AM
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CHA,

Not sure why you didn't get the person you bought it from (I presume this was bought on a US resident on Audiogon) to ship the items to Thiel to get the voltage converted?

I did actually ask Thiel about this as I was considering purchasing them. Thiel said the power conversion change out for the sub was relatively easy and could be performed by my Thiel dealer but they said the integrator would have to be done by Thiel themselves....

Good luck and hope you don't scare your neighbors!!

)
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post #368 of 1051 Old 09-05-2008, 05:17 AM
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Cal,

Yes, that's a SCS4. I was thinking of getting the MCS1 instead due to it's dual woofers and bigger powerhandling. But then I read this thread about blown tweeters and deceided to go for a SCS4 instead. I don't regret it.
I often play at loud levels and the SCS4 can handle the spl's with no protests.
Have previously mostly used phantom mode, no center at all since I've always felt they don't blend in. Not with this one. Same tweeter as CS3.7 likely helps in this regard.

I have a dedicated 20A circuit for my system. Guess we'll se if the fuses pop with the SS4 in full action..

Mark,

Yes, of-course I could have made the conversion at Thiel. Thiel quoted $500 for the job plus the extra freight..maybe another $400-$500..??
I deceided to save the money for something fun instead..

Thanks for the cheers guys..
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post #369 of 1051 Old 09-13-2008, 11:42 AM
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My L-C-R setup is a pair of 2.3s and a single PCS. I'm thinking of picking up some of the original SCS for the surrounds. Can I expect reasonable timbre matching? They would all be vintage 1990s models, but its beginning to feel a bit heterogeneous.

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post #370 of 1051 Old 09-13-2008, 11:50 AM
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Hi, if you all have 20 minutes, give this very well done Ken Barnes YouTube audiophile short a look and share a really good laugh with your spouse .

It is called "The Audiophile Club of Athens", a bunch of audiophiles who went a bit overboard. It is very well done and hilarious especially when their families hear for the first time how much their sound systems cost. I think some of us may be able to appreciate what these guys are "suffering" .

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-10...logPromoArea.2

ENJOY!
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post #371 of 1051 Old 09-13-2008, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

My L-C-R setup is a pair of 2.3s and a single PCS. I'm thinking of picking up some of the original SCS for the surrounds. Can I expect reasonable timbre matching? They would all be vintage 1990s models, but its beginning to feel a bit heterogeneous.

Nathan, sorry, no knowledge of the older SCS. Just got the SCS4 to try as a center channel and it matches very well with the 2.4's and the 3.7's. The frequency and voice matching are seamless after 20+ hours break-in. The first 2 hours were not so good, sounded boxy and congested. I will guess that the SCS3's should match well with the 2.3's and PCS.

The SCS4 is amazingly open, very nice midrange for its size, and disappears on better center channel recording. Its top end is not as open or airy as the 3.7's or the 2.4's but as a center channel, it is wonderful. We set our receiver to treat it as a "Large" center so its gets everything.

Will share our impression of the SCS4 when it hits the 100-hour mark.
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post #372 of 1051 Old 09-13-2008, 12:30 PM
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Thanks for the impression of the SCS4. Actually, I'm not considering the SCS3 but really the original SCS (no number). I was considering the Powerpoints but even the discontinued version goal for 2.5x what the SCS will cost me, and budget is a consideration at this point.

(Critical two channel listening is via Proceed amplification and the two 2.3s. I don't want to compromise on surround sound much BUT certainly don't require full range speakers.)

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post #373 of 1051 Old 09-14-2008, 03:06 AM
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Nathan,

I have 4 x SCS2s for my surrounds and I've ended up eq'ing them to get a better match to my 2.4s and MCS1.

I think you may struggle with the original SCS.
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post #374 of 1051 Old 09-14-2008, 10:26 AM
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Thanks for the feedback. That was my fear. How heavily and via what means did you EQ them? I have an Audyssey pro setup via my SSP, so I have flexible frequency and time domain manipulations available.

But if it is a significant mismatch I might as well just get some Paradigm speakers or something, under the theory that via EQ they can be timbre-matched with the mains, and that my critical listening is two channel, and surround is usually for movies.

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post #375 of 1051 Old 09-15-2008, 02:56 AM
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Nathan,

Nothing fancy, just a pair of Behringer 31 band digital eq's.

The SCS2s needed significant boosting in the mid bass and mid treble. I was actually shocked at the amount of treble boost required. I have a feeling that they were voiced to work well in very bright rooms. Now that I have them in a properly treated room, I felt they sounded very dark and laid back.

The eq'ing did the trick, but I know many would not want to go that route.
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post #376 of 1051 Old 09-15-2008, 06:16 PM
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Well, I use Audyssey for surround sound movies, which is a "room eq and time domain adjustment" but it ALSO has the effect of eq-ing out imperfections in speaker response (within reason). But for surround music I prefer to not use Audyssey all the time, so reasonable timbre matching is ideal.

For the price of a pair of powerpoints (the logical choice) I could pick up a pair of used 2.3s that match my front stereo pair.... so maybe that's something to consider "down the road".

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post #377 of 1051 Old 09-18-2008, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
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If you are looking for a deal there are some interesting listings over on Audiogon

Mike Miles

ICR [ Sales Consulting and Small Part-Time AV shop, very small...  ]

Process Integration, Inc. [ contract sales consultant ]

Eastern Shore of Maryland

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post #378 of 1051 Old 09-18-2008, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmiles View Post

If you are looking for a deal there are some interesting listings over on Audiogon

My whole A/V setup is a testament to Audiogon, but which ones were you thinking of on there, now? I'm dubious about the SCS. I may hold out for some .5 to show up, since a pair of those is about the price of pair of SCS, but probably better.

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post #379 of 1051 Old 09-21-2008, 10:38 AM
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Speak of the d****.

Craigslist to the rescue this time: A pair of the .5 came up for $500.

They have gray grill cloth so if I keep them I'll have to make an investment in some black grill cloth from Parts Express (doesn't make me happy: I hate modding stuff) but so far I am impressed with the sound.

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post #380 of 1051 Old 09-26-2008, 10:39 AM
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I've really enjoyed reading this thread. Have owned thiels since the 80's, when I got a pair of 03a's, which I owned for over 15 years. I got a pair of 2.2's, then replaced them with 2.3's, which I have today, along with scs rears, and an mcs1 I just purchased to replace an scs3, which made a fine center channel. I love the mcs1. My experience with thiel support has been fantastic. They replaced a driver for free even though I wasn't the 1st buyer and the speaker is way out of warranty. The only time they charge me is when my cats dent a driver..As for tweeter problems with the mcs1, I would join a previous poster and say its the setup on the processor...my experience with thiel is, its always somewhere in front end! This is the best center I've ever experienced. Now all I need is an S1 and I am a danger to the neighborhood...

"Talk is cheap, until you hire a lawyer"
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post #381 of 1051 Old 09-26-2008, 11:19 AM
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How do those SCS rears match the 2.3s you use up front? Pretty seamless? I've been contemplating something similar. I actually have ended up with a PCS center, 2.3'ss for the LR, and .5's for the surrounds.... but will eventually add rear speakers, and need something that can be mounted on a wall.... and are okay for nearfield placement... and are affordable.... and the SCS might be fit all those criteria.

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post #382 of 1051 Old 09-27-2008, 02:39 AM
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Nathan,

What do you use your system for ?

The reason I ask is that upon further reflection I realised that my dissatisfaction with the SCS2 surrounds only came about when I got some surround music discs with quite aggressive mixes.

I was quite happy with them for some years prior to this with just movies and 2 channel music through PLIIx.
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post #383 of 1051 Old 09-27-2008, 05:34 AM
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That SS4 is huge! I have Thiel CS1.6's and a SCS2 for center and the sound blends seamlessly. I'm very happy. The original SCS is not as bright or open when compared to the later models.
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post #384 of 1051 Old 09-27-2008, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter M View Post

Nathan,

What do you use your system for ?

Since what I'm looking into are the rear surrounds, which are not used with surround music, I guess you could say these speakers will be 100% for movies. I've got pretty decent surround matching in place, since the [side] "surround" speakers are .5's and those are what are used for surround music. I'd hope to not introduce problems for movies with the rear surrounds.

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Originally Posted by cawgijoe View Post

That SS4 is huge! I have Thiel CS1.6's and a SCS2 for center and the sound blends seamlessly. I'm very happy. The original SCS is not as bright or open when compared to the later models.

Urgh. This is what I was afraid of with the SCS.

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post #385 of 1051 Old 09-27-2008, 12:02 PM
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Nathan_h: I too have the same LCR setup as you do - CS 2.3's and PCS for center. I also have a second HT system with three PCS as LCR. Both systems are anchored by B&K equipment. I too find the Thiels to be a big improvement to the Monitor Audio speakers I had previously. I have moved all those Monitor Audio speakers to rear surround duty and find them to integrate very well. I guess what I am saying is the rear surrounds in an HT system may not be as critical as most HT magazine writers want us to believe. IMO, using my Monitor Audio speakers is just fine for movies. When I listen to music, I basically listen through the two main speakers anyway. Listening to 2 channel music with the PCS and a subwoofer or the 2.3's is everything I want and need at this point. With the economy going the way it has, I have not bought anything new since January. I have long-term upgradeitis and this has been a difficult time for me. I still look around and audition but I cannot bring myself to buy. It just wouldn't pass the spousal approval test anyway. But I am very satisfied with what I have.

Whalen
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post #386 of 1051 Old 09-27-2008, 08:17 PM
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I've had good luck with the scs's as rears. I had one as a center, then bought another pair for rears to replace a pair of paradigm titans, then sold the center scs & got the scs3, which was replaced by the incredible mcs1, which is in morado, by the way. Gorgeous. I don't think you can go wrong with scs's for rears; of course, I don't do dvd audio or SACD, but for HT, they're great. A pair of scs3's would be even better. I'll add my WOW! to that S4.......

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post #387 of 1051 Old 09-28-2008, 03:05 AM
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Nathan,

Interesting ... I use PLIIx and all 7 channels for everything.
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post #388 of 1051 Old 10-10-2008, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjblaw View Post

I've had good luck with the scs's as rears. I had one as a center, then bought another pair for rears to replace a pair of paradigm titans, then sold the center scs & got the scs3, which was replaced by the incredible mcs1, which is in morado, by the way. Gorgeous. I don't think you can go wrong with scs's for rears; of course, I don't do dvd audio or SACD, but for HT, they're great. A pair of scs3's would be even better. I'll add my WOW! to that S4.......

I agree. For rear speakers in a HT envronment, they should work very well.

I currently have a mint SCS2 for center paired with 1.6's for mains and really love the sound.....maybe someday I'll pick up an SCS4 to replace the SCS2........but for now I'm having a good time!

I use an Atlantic Tech 12" 250w THX sub and rears are Mirage Omnipolar speakers which work great as surrounds.
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post #389 of 1051 Old 10-17-2008, 03:48 AM
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Great review of a truely amazing speaker, a modern classic.......from NOV 2008 issue of TAS:-

http://www.thielaudio.com/THIEL_Site.../TAS_nov08.pdf

Home Theater mag will review in their DEC issue and Stereophile review out in the near future....

Cheers
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post #390 of 1051 Old 10-17-2008, 07:14 AM
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I'm glad you think that they are so amazing. Would you like to buy a 6-month old pair from someone that is not so impressed?
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