The *OFFICIAL* Vienna Acoustics Owners Thread - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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Speakers > The *OFFICIAL* Vienna Acoustics Owners Thread
rinthiran's Avatar rinthiran 07:24 PM 01-22-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Carr View Post

Mozart is better, but if you desire the sound of a floorstanding Vienna and have limited space the Schonberg is rather compelling. Just my opinion, any others?

Dave, I agree with your assessment. I own the Beethoven Baby Grands and have listenend extensively to the Bach Grand and Haydn Grand (BUT never the Mozart, go figure) and did audition the Schonbergs and Webern in a HT and audio setup in Magnolia Audio. I like the Schonbergs for HT use and perhaps rock/modern, but with detailed material (classical, vocals), the Grand series had more synergy and detail with a bigger soundstage in 2-channel audio.

The Schonbergs and Webern would be fantastic in a near-wall/on-wall application. My wife rejected the Schonberg series just based on looks alone. She even mentioned that comparing the Webern and the Waltz Grand, the Webern was more dynamic and a better pair for HT use, but just could not see it in our living room. Style over audio I guess. Either way, they are both pretty good.

Ese's Avatar Ese 06:26 PM 01-26-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigred7078 View Post

For about the same money anyone have any ideas of how the Sonus Faber Domus Concerto compare to the Mozart Grands?

Hands down I agree with T-3G. I also auditioned the Sonus Faber line before purchasing my Mozart Grands. For my ears and taste, there was no comparison. I respected the opinions of those that were Sonus fans but it was a short audition for me re: the Sonus line. Bought the Mozart Grands and I have never looked back.

Ese
Ese's Avatar Ese 06:38 PM 01-26-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by lpollis View Post

Sorry if this has been asked before but I have decided to buy a set of the Mozart Grands and a Theater Grand for the center. Is Best Buy the only distributor in the US? Is there another that has a better price?
Thanks,
Lp

Again, I agree with T-3G. Go for the Maestro. I purchased the Maestro to complement my Mozarts as mains. I believe, they are the same speakers, or from a construction standpoint, are a better fit for the Mozarts. Dave Carr you can chime in here whether I am on or off base on this.

Ese
kanedale's Avatar kanedale 09:28 PM 01-26-2009
In trying to complete my home theater with the impossible to find Rosewood Oratorio, I ran into a 7.1 system for sale.
  1. Quantity 4 - BCG's
  2. A pair of Hayden Grands
  3. Maestro Grand Center

I am torn if the Mahlers are really that much better of a speaker than the Beethoven Concert Grands. My room is not huge, but I love my Mahlers.

Should I consider selling the Mahlers and moving to the above system? Note: I'd sell 2 of the BCG's as I only have room for a 5.1 not a 7.1 system. My Mahlers are rosewood and the above is Cherry, so I'm sure the fiance won't let me do a mix and match system

Cheers,

Dale
KMC45's Avatar KMC45 02:02 PM 01-27-2009
I gave those speakers to my nephew awhile back and they were in perfect condition. You just missed the best deal of your audio life as he sold them this morning.

Keeping the four BCG with the MGC would have made a very nice HT system, and you could have used the Haydens for a little two channel system, all for the price of a pair of new BCG. I've owned Mahlers and I liked them a lot, kind of regret selling them, but they sometimes make it hard to build a HT system around them.
Stellar's Avatar Stellar 01:11 AM 01-28-2009
Hi guys, im thinking in buying the Waltz Grand speakers for my surrounds.

Do you prefer them mounted in the vertical or horizontal?

If possible , could someone post pics of these speakers?

Many thanks
KMC45's Avatar KMC45 04:36 PM 01-28-2009
The guy that just bought that speaker package from my nephew is flipping them on AG, nothing wrong with that. Telling people you have owned them for the last 13 months is not the truth, so buyer beware for anyone here.
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:14 AM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ese View Post

Again, I agree with T-3G. Go for the Maestro. I purchased the Maestro to complement my Mozarts as mains. I believe, they are the same speakers, or from a construction standpoint, are a better fit for the Mozarts. Dave Carr you can chime in here whether I am on or off base on this.

Ese

Mozart is the split point for Maestro. For smaller, less elaborate systems the Theatro is a great value. Maestro is a better match sonically, so if you're capable this is the route I would choose.

Vienna Acoustics are available from a number of dealers across the country. I would contact the Sumiko main office for the location of another dealer nearest you. The number is 510-843-4500.
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:29 AM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stellar View Post

Hi guys, im thinking in buying the Waltz Grand speakers for my surrounds.

Do you prefer them mounted in the vertical or horizontal?

If possible , could someone post pics of these speakers?

Many thanks

Either position will sound wonderful. The vertical position, toed-in, will offer the best soundstaging. But, with most situations, you will have to be mindful of aesthetics (also know as the Wife Acceptance Factor), so either will do. They are certainly better than tin-can in-ceiling speakers!
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:35 AM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by kanedale View Post

In trying to complete my home theater with the impossible to find Rosewood Oratorio, I ran into a 7.1 system for sale.
  1. Quantity 4 - BCG's
  2. A pair of Hayden Grands
  3. Maestro Grand Center

I am torn if the Mahlers are really that much better of a speaker than the Beethoven Concert Grands. My room is not huge, but I love my Mahlers.

Should I consider selling the Mahlers and moving to the above system? Note: I'd sell 2 of the BCG's as I only have room for a 5.1 not a 7.1 system. My Mahlers are rosewood and the above is Cherry, so I'm sure the fiance won't let me do a mix and match system

Cheers,

Dale

You need to check out The Kiss. Keep your eyes on this forum for news on a nationwide tour of this product. Check out pictures I posted earlier.
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:43 AM 01-29-2009
Introducing the Poetry by Vienna Acoustics:
LL
LL
LL
LL
Stellar's Avatar Stellar 06:27 AM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Carr View Post

Either position will sound wonderful. The vertical position, toed-in, will offer the best soundstaging. But, with most situations, you will have to be mindful of aesthetics (also know as the Wife Acceptance Factor), so either will do. They are certainly better than tin-can in-ceiling speakers!

Hehe thanks for your input, the wifey acceptance factor is pretty much important.
rinthiran's Avatar rinthiran 10:25 AM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Carr View Post

Either position will sound wonderful. The vertical position, toed-in, will offer the best soundstaging. But, with most situations, you will have to be mindful of aesthetics (also know as the Wife Acceptance Factor), so either will do. They are certainly better than tin-can in-ceiling speakers!

Hi Dave - I'm in the same boat; just purchased the Waltz Grand as surround speakers to be mounted on-wall on the rear walls, about 5-ft high, 12-ft apart, and 1-ft from the side walls. in a 5.1 setup (with Beethoven Baby Grands and Maestro center). What would you recommend, either toed-in or flat-flush? I'm going to experiment a bit, but I can't do it in the HT setup as it will be installed prior to the rest of the equipment being in place; so no testing once its installed.

Thanks - Ravi
Stellar's Avatar Stellar 02:26 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by rinthiran View Post

What would you recommend, either toed-in or flat-flush?

Thanks - Ravi

I think he will reply that toe-in will sound better, it's what the theory says, but flush it looks way better, it's a compromise but i think a small one because it is surround sound, it's more diffuse. But i'm in the same boat as you, im just speculating.
Please report your findings , i'm going to buy to the same purpose, and i dont have the possibility to listen to them priorly.

Cheers
Ese's Avatar Ese 03:10 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stellar View Post

Hi guys, im thinking in buying the Waltz Grand speakers for my surrounds.

Do you prefer them mounted in the vertical or horizontal?

If possible , could someone post pics of these speakers?

Many thanks

Stellar:

Vertical.

Ese
T-3G's Avatar T-3G 04:41 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by rinthiran View Post

Hi Dave - I'm in the same boat; just purchased the Waltz Grand as surround speakers to be mounted on-wall on the rear walls, about 5-ft high, 12-ft apart, and 1-ft from the side walls. in a 5.1 setup (with Beethoven Baby Grands and Maestro center). What would you recommend, either toed-in or flat-flush? I'm going to experiment a bit, but I can't do it in the HT setup as it will be installed prior to the rest of the equipment being in place; so no testing once its installed.

Thanks - Ravi

That depends on where you sit, your taste, and your room acoustics. But what do you mean "no testing once installed?" I thought the mounts for Waltz Grand are adjustable even installed, unless I'm missing something.
T-3G's Avatar T-3G 04:46 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Carr View Post

Introducing the Poetry by Vienna Acoustics:

Yummy. Is that a $10K puppy? The Klimt/REL 5.1ch SACD setup will cost around $45K. Anything between the Grand line and the Klimt line being planned? I'm sure Vienna didn't anticipate the economy to go so bad when they were dreaming up the Klimt line
Clem272's Avatar Clem272 06:40 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by lquam View Post

I've been through a large number of amplifies with my Mozarts (old model, not the Grand), both tube and solid state.

Tubes are tough. The wacky impedance curves on the Mozarts play havoc with many tube amps and forget about trying to power them with a SET--it's push-pull or the highway. Honestly, an amp I still regret not pairing them with was the Music Reference RM200. It provided perhaps the most beautiful sound from my Mozarts and delivered balanced frequency response and plenty of power, including nice, deep, taut bass.

In solid state, it really comes down current delivery and just amp quality. The Bryston 3BST sounded like Bryston with the Mozarts--a little Mosfet fog, but clean, powerful, and musical. For several years I used a B&K AV5000 on them in an HT setup. Again, no problems and they delivered the B&K house sound. I had a Bel Canto EVO200.2 (no longer made, new ones are different tech and haven't tried them) that combined the best of tubes and SS but ultimately left me a bit flat. When I got my current Yamaha surround receiver (RXV1600) it had no problem driving them and sounded decent. However, it sounded like a receiver. So I went a different route and tried several integrated amps to use for my 2 channel audio that included home theater bypass features (where HT sources use the amps in the integrated for L/R via a unity gain input that allows the receiver to control volume and maintain channel balance and all your 2ch sources go direct to the integrated and their volume is controlled by it). I tried the NAD M3, Krell 400x, Bel Canto Evo2i, and Musical Fidelity A5. All in the 2500-3000 range. The Bel Canto sounded like and perhaps a bit better than my old Evo200.2. The NAD sounded like NAD; not for me. The Krell was very dynamic and I think complement the VA's well. In the end I got the Musical Fidelity as it didn't fight the warmth and timbre of the VAs (I love the Mozarts on stringed music) and had, hands down, the best bass. It then became obvious to me that VAs don't just want power, they really need power. 100 watt SS and tube amps were fine to a point, but what the Mozarts want is juice--250 in the case of the A5. So, I'd say, go for the watts in a quality amp. Parasound, B&K, Musical Fidelity, Classe, and Bryston are all good and offer amps in the 200 watt range that won't break the bank. I bet a Krell FPB amp would sound awesome, but that's probably way overkill for a $2500 speaker.

I've heard that VA voices their speakers in Austria with Audio Research tube monoblocks (the big ones).

I really enjoyed my time spent listening to some Mazart Grands but has anyone here ever thought about using an Emotiva RPA-2 amp, it provides 350 watts @ 4ohms for 2 channels.

http://emotiva.com/rpa2.shtm

While I am still new to the world of HiFI, I don't see how you could go wrong with this amp for these speakers.
Bigred7078's Avatar Bigred7078 07:11 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 View Post

I really enjoyed my time spent listening to some Mazart Grands but has anyone here ever thought about using an Emotiva RPA-2 amp, it provides 350 watts @ 4ohms for 2 channels.

http://emotiva.com/rpa2.shtm

While I am still new to the world of HiFI, I don't see how you could go wrong with this amp for these speakers.

It's what i use, and i couldnt be happier. Well actually i use the RPA-1, but its the same thing. Definately an awesome amp for the money.
rinthiran's Avatar rinthiran 07:18 PM 01-29-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by T-3G View Post

That depends on where you sit, your taste, and your room acoustics. But what do you mean "no testing once installed?" I thought the mounts for Waltz Grand are adjustable even installed, unless I'm missing something.

Hey, you're right! Completely adjustable by just unscrewing the back "black" screws and rotating the speaker. Nice!
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 01:36 AM 01-30-2009
Amps are subjective, although current delivery is ALWAYS important. Tube amps are fantastic devices, and offer a level of musicality that is often unparalleled by solid state. Don't limit what you look at when deciding based on what you hear about on this forum. There are many manufacturers that deserve your attention that may not be mentioned often here, both tube and solid sate (and sometimes a combination of the two).

Although no one expected the sudden and dramatic decline in the worldwide economy, Vienna has been planning this next phase of the company for many years. The revolutionary design of the coincidental driver featured in the Klimt series is the fruit of MANY years of development, starting with designs dating from the early 1990s. Thanks to sophisticated computer modeling and advancements in material sciences, we can do things that were impossible 20 years ago.

As for a bridging product line, who knows. Vienna is hard at work developing architectural product that will live up to the performance standards set forth by all of their products.

Here's a dream system for you:

(2) The Music reference L/R mains
(1) Poetry reference center
(2) The Kiss reference pedestal L/R surrounds
(5) REL Studio III sub-bass systems

Cost to own: $92k plus electronics, etc.
Lifetime of pleasure: priceless

Dare to dream...

d.
T-3G's Avatar T-3G 01:49 PM 01-30-2009
Actually, my dream system would be:

(5) The Music reference mains (L, R, C, rears)
(5) REL Studio III's
(5) McIntosh MC2102

Others, undecided.

Vienna still wouldn't sell main speakers as individuals, do they? I don't do theaters, I do multichannel SACD so the same speakers all around would be ideal. I listen to a lot of violin concertos and the soloist is often played through the center channel. I use BCG's for the main but I'd love to find a single BCG.

BTW, if I were to add an REL to my center Maestro Grand, how do I hook it up to the amp?
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:13 PM 01-31-2009
Since we are going balls to the wall, why not 5 MC2301s?

No singles, its to hard to forcast production, etc.
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:22 PM 01-31-2009
Center channel REL hookup is easy. The hot leads (red & yellow) are combined and attached to the positive output of the center channel amp output, and the black lead is attached to ground (generally the negative output on most amps). No LFE in necessary for the center woofer. Usually placement nearer to the center speaker is recommended for larger rooms, but corners still work great for small to mid-size rooms.
angal's Avatar angal 07:19 PM 01-31-2009
I apologize in advance if I'm breaking rules, however I think that my question can be answered from the users in this thread. I'm debating purchasing a pair of Haydns used. I liked the Haydn Grands, mostly because of their imaging. Has anyone owned both the Haydn and Haydn Grands that can comment on the difference in sound quality between the two. Comments on the difference between any Grand/non-Grand model could also be useful.

Anyhow, I started a thread on this earlier, but I think Vienna owners monitoring this thread may be able to answer my question.

Link to the thread I started for reference:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1115024
mbyrnes's Avatar mbyrnes 07:45 PM 01-31-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by angal View Post

I apologize in advance if I'm breaking rules, however I think that my question can be answered from the users in this thread. I'm debating purchasing a pair of Haydns used. I liked the Haydn Grands, mostly because of their imaging. Has anyone owned both the Haydn and Haydn Grands that can comment on the difference in sound quality between the two. Comments on the difference between any Grand/non-Grand model could also be useful.

Anyhow, I started a thread on this earlier, but I think Vienna owners monitoring this thread may be able to answer my question.

Link to the thread I started for reference:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1115024

Can you listen to them before you buy them? Also if you are getting them for $500 or more off from the list of the Haydn Grands it might be worth a shot if you can't listen to them. You could always sell them again to break even and get the grands if it matters that much.

I don't think you would notice a big difference without an A/B comparison. Hopefully Dave Carr can jump in and help since I am sure he would know more than anyone about the differences between the two.
Bigred7078's Avatar Bigred7078 10:41 AM 02-01-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbyrnes View Post

Can you listen to them before you buy them? Also if you are getting them for $500 or more off from the list of the Haydn Grands it might be worth a shot if you can't listen to them. You could always sell them again to break even and get the grands if it matters that much.

I don't think you would notice a big difference without an A/B comparison. Hopefully Dave Carr can jump in and help since I am sure he would know more than anyone about the differences between the two.


^ i was under the impression the newer Grand line was alot better
Dave Carr's Avatar Dave Carr 12:31 PM 02-01-2009
The Grand series vs Classic series update is all but a clean sheet redesign. Only the basic aesthetics and core design remains similar.

For Haydn specifically, and Grand series generally:

Slightly larger cabinet with thicker front and rear baffles, to support new drivers and port system

Unique front port system, located behind the tweeter, for easier room placement and quieter port operation

Improved polymer blend for mid-bass driver (X3P), for more resolved, higher band-width midrange and bass frequencies

Refined tweeter design for smoother more extended high frequencies

Linear crossover layout featuring VERY high tolerance components (including .7% tolerance hand-wound inductor coils) for more efficient transmission of amp power

Custom gold-silver alloy binding posts for greater mechanical/electrical connection to speaker cables

Overall, the new Haydn Grand is more resolved, more extended on both extremes, and smoother. A commendable upgrade from an already great design!
angal's Avatar angal 12:38 PM 02-01-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbyrnes View Post

Can you listen to them before you buy them? Also if you are getting them for $500 or more off from the list of the Haydn Grands it might be worth a shot if you can't listen to them. You could always sell them again to break even and get the grands if it matters that much.

I don't think you would notice a big difference without an A/B comparison. Hopefully Dave Carr can jump in and help since I am sure he would know more than anyone about the differences between the two.

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to listen to a pair before buying them. I'm basically waiting for a pair to show up used for a decent price. I don't have a problem with selling them if I don't like them.
T-3G's Avatar T-3G 07:25 PM 02-01-2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by angal View Post

I apologize in advance if I'm breaking rules, however I think that my question can be answered from the users in this thread. I'm debating purchasing a pair of Haydns used. I liked the Haydn Grands, mostly because of their imaging. Has anyone owned both the Haydn and Haydn Grands that can comment on the difference in sound quality between the two. Comments on the difference between any Grand/non-Grand model could also be useful.

Anyhow, I started a thread on this earlier, but I think Vienna owners monitoring this thread may be able to answer my question.

Link to the thread I started for reference:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1115024

My impressions on the Haydn Grand:
  • The tweater sounds more transparent and smoother on the Haydn Grand.
  • The woofer is less boomy and tighter on the Haydn Grand, but less volume.
  • I prefer the added flexibility of speaker placement (I like front ported design).
  • The old Haydn had better overall tonal balance; the Haydn Grand has shifted towards the highs.

Overall, I prefer the new Haydn Grands over the old one.
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