Definitive Technology ProCinema Series 600/800/1000 (or 60/80/100) Thread - Page 245 - AVS Forum
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post #7321 of 7347 Old 10-17-2014, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkumarsb View Post
I have a dumb question. I have a ProCinema 800 and its connected using bare wire, I would like to use banana plugs. Can someone recommend which type is best (I saw Pin Screw Type, Open Screw Type and Closed Screw Type.)

Also can someone recommend which company banana plugs are the best. Any suggestions and guidance is really appreciated.

Thanks
Mohan
Why banana plugs over bare-wire connection???

Last edited by UGAd13; 10-18-2014 at 07:31 AM.
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post #7322 of 7347 Old 10-23-2014, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by discone View Post
YW!

With your room size the 1000's for L/R with a 2000 for the Center then you can use the 800's or 600's for surround duty. If you can spend the few more dollars to match the surround channels and get 4 of the Pro 1000's the match timbre match is better. Yes the surrounds do not pull as heavy load as the front stage so you can use a smaller speaker, but some movie's do make good use of the surrounds so it is nice to have a speaker that will match the rest of the system. These are just my thoughts as others may be able to offer their take based on their experience. I've set up this system and have found it to work well for movies.
Thanks for the feed back again
I'm contemplating on subwoofers now
I'm looking at the martin logan dynamo 700/500 or the supercube4000/2000
what do u think about martin logan subwoofers?
would the supercube4000 be overkill with a pro cinema 1000 setup?
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post #7323 of 7347 Old 10-24-2014, 02:59 AM
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Originally Posted by dudeitsok112 View Post
Thanks for the feed back again
I'm contemplating on subwoofers now
I'm looking at the martin logan dynamo 700/500 or the supercube4000/2000
what do u think about martin logan subwoofers?
would the supercube4000 be overkill with a pro cinema 1000 setup?
dudeitsok112,

You'll get more value for money from the Internet Direct (ID) companies that make subs rather than speaker manufacturers who make subs on the side. You might want to do some research on the following companies.
  • Rythmik
  • Outlaw Audio
  • SVS
  • PSA
  • HSU
  • Reaction Audio

Each ID companies make good subs. Consider getting a pair to deal with the room modes and smooth out the bass frequencies at the Main Listening Position (MLP).
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post #7324 of 7347 Old 10-24-2014, 07:52 AM
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I went to Best Buy yesterday and they are running a deal that combines the Definitive pro600 speakers and the denon X2100 for 1000.00. Is that a good deal or not? The room size is a small bedroom. Thanks.
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post #7325 of 7347 Old 10-24-2014, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dudeitsok112 View Post
Thanks for the feed back again
I'm contemplating on subwoofers now
I'm looking at the martin logan dynamo 700/500 or the supercube4000/2000
what do u think about martin logan subwoofers?
would the supercube4000 be overkill with a pro cinema 1000 setup?
No sorry I have not listened to Martin Logan. I see it only goes down to 29Hz where as the Supercube 4000 goes a little lower. As I mentioned before and as stated in the above post you would be better served by getting an ID ( Internet Direct ) sub. If you have a price your willing to pay like $500 and look at SVS PB-1000, or Outlaw Audio LFM-1 Plus Subwoofer. You will get better sound and feeling for the money spent. All in all though it is what serves you the best. If a small footprint is what your after then the ones you mentioned may work for you. I'd lean more toward the 4000 in my opinion.

To much sub is never enough.. It is better to spend a little more on a sub vs. rest of the system so you have a little headroom to spare and you will be gald you did. Good Luck!
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post #7326 of 7347 Old 10-24-2014, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by delta246 View Post
I went to Best Buy yesterday and they are running a deal that combines the Definitive pro600 speakers and the denon X2100 for 1000.00. Is that a good deal or not? The room size is a small bedroom. Thanks.
The Denon's price on Amazon is $700 and the 6 piece Pro600 set is $700 for a total of $1400. You save $400 so not to bad and it would work for a small bedroom.

That receiver is 7.1 so is Best Buy giving you 2 extra 600 speakers for the rear surrounds?
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post #7327 of 7347 Old 10-24-2014, 01:39 PM
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The speakers from Best Buy comes with the center, two front, two rear and sub for a 5.1 speaker system. Still hesitant to pull the trigger because the Denon does not have the MHL connection which I don't understand why they did not include that this year in the In-Command models, at least for the 1100 and 2100 models.
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post #7328 of 7347 Old 10-26-2014, 09:09 PM
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Originally Posted by discone View Post
No sorry I have not listened to Martin Logan. I see it only goes down to 29Hz where as the Supercube 4000 goes a little lower. As I mentioned before and as stated in the above post you would be better served by getting an ID ( Internet Direct ) sub. If you have a price your willing to pay like $500 and look at SVS PB-1000, or Outlaw Audio LFM-1 Plus Subwoofer. You will get better sound and feeling for the money spent. All in all though it is what serves you the best. If a small footprint is what your after then the ones you mentioned may work for you. I'd lean more toward the 4000 in my opinion.

To much sub is never enough.. It is better to spend a little more on a sub vs. rest of the system so you have a little headroom to spare and you will be gald you did. Good Luck!
thanks for the response again
the only reason why I'm interested in definitive subs or martin logan cause i get a really good discount on them particular brands


thank you
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post #7329 of 7347 Old 10-26-2014, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by steveting99 View Post
dudeitsok112,

You'll get more value for money from the Internet Direct (ID) companies that make subs rather than speaker manufacturers who make subs on the side. You might want to do some research on the following companies.
  • Rythmik
  • Outlaw Audio
  • SVS
  • PSA
  • HSU
  • Reaction Audio

Each ID companies make good subs. Consider getting a pair to deal with the room modes and smooth out the bass frequencies at the Main Listening Position (MLP).
thanks for the response
ya the only reason why I'm looking in the definitive subs and martin logan is because i get a really good deal on them particular brands I'm looking into the supercube4000/pro cinema 1000 on wall with pro mount 90
I'm wanna hang my tv on the wall how would i measure how far I'm putting the pro monitor 1000's on the sides of the tv?
would i put the center channel above or below the tv?


thank you
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post #7330 of 7347 Old 10-26-2014, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dudeitsok112 View Post
thanks for the response
ya the only reason why I'm looking in the definitive subs and martin logan is because i get a really good deal on them particular brands I'm looking into the supercube4000/pro cinema 1000 on wall with pro mount 90
I'm wanna hang my tv on the wall how would i measure how far I'm putting the pro monitor 1000's on the sides of the tv?
would i put the center channel above or below the tv?


thank you
Have a look at post number 7310 which shows that angles you should be aiming for in a 5.1 setup: Definitive Technology ProCinema Series 600/800/1000 (or 60/80/100) Thread

Also the side view of where the speakers are and where you sit are shown in post number 7312 here: Definitive Technology ProCinema Series 600/800/1000 (or 60/80/100) Thread

I've heard suggestions that the front left and front right speakers 'only' need to be about 6' apart for a good stereo separation. Think of an equilateral triangle between the fronts and where you sit at the Main Listening Position (MLP).

For the center channel, you can do place it either on top of the screen or below, be sure to point the tweeter to your head. If you mount the center below the screen, care should be taken for any surface below the center speaker as it will introduce reflections.

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Last edited by steveting99; 10-26-2014 at 10:08 PM. Reason: additional text added for clarity
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post #7331 of 7347 Old 10-28-2014, 11:54 AM
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Just thought I would chine in on the Pro Monitor 1000s and 800s as I've been using them in a dedicated theater room since April. I needed speakers that could wall mount below my 9 foot projection screen as my wall is only 10' wide.

I'm using the 1000s for my fronts and the 800s for surround (7.1 system) with a Denon X3000 receiver which has been pro Audyssey cal'd by Chad B. My sub is a Hsu 15" VTF. My room is not very large (just a little bigger than 10' x 12' with 8' ceilings) and these speakers sound excellent. Obviously, they are not very large, but they give an impressive, immersive sound with Blu-ray movies which is all my set-up in this room is used for right now. They've got surprisingly good punch (and I am coming from Inifinity Betas which had 8" woofers) and decent warmth. I like them better than the Betas. On any rate, highly recommended. Of course, if you have a very large room, then they might not be quite as well suited and you may need something bigger, not sure.

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post #7332 of 7347 Old 10-31-2014, 10:43 AM
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I've got a question about the passive radiators and room boundaries, the benefits of timbre matching and comparing DT speakers. Up front I have a PC 1000 mounted above my TV and 2 PM1000s. It just occurred to me that I could probably wall mount a PM1000 as a center (vertically) above the TV where the PC1000 is. However, I don't believe I would be able to angle it down towards the MLP (as the PC1000 currently is) and the radiator on top would be wedged basically against the ceiling. I'm assuming the combination of directionality and whatever issues the proximity of 2 room boundaries would cause more problems than perfect timbre matching across the front 3 speakers would solve, and I'd be better off staying where I am, or just grading to the PC2000 as planned. Any input is appreciated. (I'm drilling into plaster covered masonry on this wall, so I've been putting off upgrading to the PC2000, since it will require drilling at least one set of new holes for the wider mounting required of the larger center.) Thanks.
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post #7333 of 7347 Old 10-31-2014, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by DonnyKerabatsos View Post
I've got a question about the passive radiators and room boundaries, the benefits of timbre matching and comparing DT speakers. Up front I have a PC 1000 mounted above my TV and 2 PM1000s. It just occurred to me that I could probably wall mount a PM1000 as a center (vertically) above the TV where the PC1000 is. However, I don't believe I would be able to angle it down towards the MLP (as the PC1000 currently is) and the radiator on top would be wedged basically against the ceiling. I'm assuming the combination of directionality and whatever issues the proximity of 2 room boundaries would cause more problems than perfect timbre matching across the front 3 speakers would solve, and I'd be better off staying where I am, or just grading to the PC2000 as planned. Any input is appreciated. (I'm drilling into plaster covered masonry on this wall, so I've been putting off upgrading to the PC2000, since it will require drilling at least one set of new holes for the wider mounting required of the larger center.) Thanks.
You will be happier with the PC 2000 as it is matched for the PM 1000's. I have the PC 2000 with the 1000's as my front stage and am very happy with them.
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post #7334 of 7347 Old 10-31-2014, 03:48 PM
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Thanks for your reply, Alexander.

I was poking around Def Tech's website looking for more info on this topic and, in the "ask a question" portion of the ProCenter 2000's page (http://www.definitivetech.com/products/procenter-2000), it claims that the BP8040ST, BP6B, and SR-8080BP are all timbre matched to the PC2000. Is this possible, or does this stretch the concept of timbre matching? The woofer types appear to all be different than the PC2000, and the BP8040ST and SR-8080BP have smaller woofers than those in the PC2000. Not to mention the fact that they are all bipolar rather than direct radiating design. Is merely being the same manufacturer and same tweeter (are they?) enough to declare them timber matching? If so, why do people claim the PM1000 and PC1000 aren't perfectly timber matched? I feel slightly confused after reading this on the manufacturer's website.

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post #7335 of 7347 Old 10-31-2014, 04:51 PM
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Originally Posted by DonnyKerabatsos View Post
Thanks for your reply, Alexander.

I was poking around Def Tech's website looking for more info on this topic and, in the "ask a question" portion of the ProCenter 2000's page (http://www.definitivetech.com/products/procenter-2000), it claims that the BP8040ST, BP6B, and SR-8080BP are all timbre matched to the PC2000. Is this possible, or does this stretch the concept of timbre matching? The woofer types appear to all be different than the PC2000, and the BP8040ST and SR-8080BP have smaller woofers than those in the PC2000. Not to mention the fact that they are all bipolar rather than direct radiating design. Is merely being the same manufacturer and same tweeter (are they?) enough to declare them timber matching? If so, why do people claim the PM1000 and PC1000 aren't perfectly timber matched? I feel slightly confused after reading this on the manufacturer's website.
The PM 1000 and the PC 1000 are not matched....the PC 1000 goes with the PM 800's and it caused a lot of confusion with consumers. This thread, which I have read in its entirety, helped steer me to what I have now. I do not know enough about the speakers you mentioned so I don't want to give you the wrong answer. Chet at Def Tech will answer your question. His email is CPelkowski@definitivetech.com

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post #7336 of 7347 Old 11-11-2014, 08:49 AM
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Got the Bluray for "Edge of tomorrow - Live, die and repeat" during the weekend. It had excellent sound effects - Procinemas sounded awesome. I watched the movie with sound at the reference level I am using Promonitor 800s for rear (I guess a mistake as I thought that rears won't get used a lot - but after watching such movies, I see a lot of usage. Could have gone for 1000s for rears as well). However, 800s are doing fine.

Had a question about the crossover. Audyssey has set the crossover of these 800s to 90hz. But the definitive tech website says 100hz. Will using 90hz be harmful to these speakers - should I increase it to 100hz?
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post #7337 of 7347 Old 11-11-2014, 08:59 AM
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No it won't cause any harm to leave it as Audyssey set it. Should be fine but you can play around with crossover point of 100 to see if you hear a difference. What sub are you using? FWIW, my yamaha YPAO set my front 800s and ProCenter 1000 at 100hz.
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post #7338 of 7347 Old 11-11-2014, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Cla55clown View Post
No it won't cause any harm to leave it as Audyssey set it. Should be fine but you can play around with crossover point of 100 to see if you hear a difference. What sub are you using? FWIW, my yamaha YPAO set my front 800s and ProCenter 1000 at 100hz.
I am using BIC PL200 sub. Audyssey has set my fronts (Pro1000s) to 80hz which sounds right. It had set the center (Procen2000) to 90hz - I manually lowered it to 80hz and think that it sounds better.
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post #7339 of 7347 Old 11-11-2014, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by pmat123 View Post
Got the Bluray for "Edge of tomorrow - Live, die and repeat" during the weekend. It had excellent sound effects - Procinemas sounded awesome. I watched the movie with sound at the reference level I am using Promonitor 800s for rear (I guess a mistake as I thought that rears won't get used a lot - but after watching such movies, I see a lot of usage. Could have gone for 1000s for rears as well). However, 800s are doing fine.

Had a question about the crossover. Audyssey has set the crossover of these 800s to 90hz. But the definitive tech website says 100hz. Will using 90hz be harmful to these speakers - should I increase it to 100hz?
Hi pmat123,

Welcome to AVS!

The Def Tech owner's manual for the PM800 says the lowest frequency it can reproduce is 57Hz, but doesn't mention if this is the -3dB point (F3). The Def Tech numbers are somewhat exaggerated to say the least.

When Audyssey carries out the in-room measurement by sending several chirps for each speaker, the result is correction filters being applied up to the F3 value. In your case it is 90Hz = F3 point as determined by Audyssey. Manually raising the crossover point above the F3 is fine as the filters are still active and applied to all frequencies above the F3. Lowering the crossover below the F3 is bad as Audyssey wont know what to do with those signals and will most likely get bypassed or unfiltered.

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Last edited by steveting99; 11-11-2014 at 06:33 PM. Reason: welcome greeting
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post #7340 of 7347 Old 11-12-2014, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by pmat123 View Post
Got the Bluray for "Edge of tomorrow - Live, die and repeat" during the weekend. It had excellent sound effects - Procinemas sounded awesome. I watched the movie with sound at the reference level I am using Promonitor 800s for rear (I guess a mistake as I thought that rears won't get used a lot - but after watching such movies, I see a lot of usage. Could have gone for 1000s for rears as well). However, 800s are doing fine.

Had a question about the crossover. Audyssey has set the crossover of these 800s to 90hz. But the definitive tech website says 100hz. Will using 90hz be harmful to these speakers - should I increase it to 100hz?
I set mine to 100hz as my sub is a Rythmik and can handle the sub much better. 120hz would not be a bad option either.

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post #7341 of 7347 Old 11-24-2014, 04:52 PM
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Long-time lurker. First post. I appreciate any feedback that you can give... I'm very much a novice. I'm going to build a Bajawaverunner DefTech system to replace a 10 year old Onkyo HTIB. Figured it was time since I just got a new 65" Samsung LCD.

My room:
- Approx. 3200-3300 cu ft basement. HT is in one half of that space but it is wide open.
- I will be mounting all speakers. No shelves or media cabinets. One of the fronts will be mounted in the corner... not sure if that's an issue or not.
- 75% movies, 25% music (mostly Pandora, Spotify, etc.)
- I plan to purchase PM1000 fronts, PC2000 center, PM800 surrounds, still unsure of sub.
- Receiver is Yamaha RX-A740BL.

My questions:
- Are the PM1000's necessary or can I get away with PM800's for the fronts given the space? I assumed 1000's but I'm all for saving money
- The standard subwoofer recommendation seems to be SVS PB/SB1000, HSU, Rythmik, etc. As a novice, will I hear a difference between the SVS and, say, a SuperCube 2000? Baja has the SC's super cheap. If it's THAT much of a difference, I will take the plunge. I don't mind spending the money if it's warranted. I'm just unsure if my ear would hear it. Unfortunately, I can't listen to it prior to the purchase.

Any help would be most appreciated. I'm amazed at the level of knowledge on this forum. Hopefully I can learn something and do this the right way. Thanks guys!
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post #7342 of 7347 Old 11-24-2014, 06:03 PM
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I think I posted this in the wrong Def Tech thread.

I am a total newbie here and have been strongly considering the Def Tech Pro Cinema 600/800 speakers. I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on the following options I've seen so far.

1. Best Buy has a bundle, Pro Cinema 600 with either Denon X2100W receiver or Yamaha RA-A740BL receiver for $999.
2. Pro Cinema 600 for $599 at Best Buy
3. Pro Cinema 800 for $899 at ProAudioDealer

Either of the last 2 options, I can get a Pioneer Elite VSX-44 on sale at Best Buy for $299.

My budget is about $1200.

For those with Pro Cinema 600/800 - would you recommend these speakers?
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post #7343 of 7347 Old 11-24-2014, 07:21 PM
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Took the plunge. Got the SC2000 for $140. Just too good of a price to not at least try it. If it's terrible, I'll upgrade later. PM1000 fronts, PC2000 and PM800 surrounds. Hope Baja is as reputable as everyone says he is
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post #7344 of 7347 Old 11-24-2014, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgrove12 View Post
Long-time lurker. First post. I appreciate any feedback that you can give... I'm very much a novice. I'm going to build a Bajawaverunner DefTech system to replace a 10 year old Onkyo HTIB. Figured it was time since I just got a new 65" Samsung LCD.

My room:
- Approx. 3200-3300 cu ft basement. HT is in one half of that space but it is wide open.
- I will be mounting all speakers. No shelves or media cabinets. One of the fronts will be mounted in the corner... not sure if that's an issue or not.
- 75% movies, 25% music (mostly Pandora, Spotify, etc.)
- I plan to purchase PM1000 fronts, PC2000 center, PM800 surrounds, still unsure of sub.
- Receiver is Yamaha RX-A740BL.

My questions:
- Are the PM1000's necessary or can I get away with PM800's for the fronts given the space? I assumed 1000's but I'm all for saving money
- The standard subwoofer recommendation seems to be SVS PB/SB1000, HSU, Rythmik, etc. As a novice, will I hear a difference between the SVS and, say, a SuperCube 2000? Baja has the SC's super cheap. If it's THAT much of a difference, I will take the plunge. I don't mind spending the money if it's warranted. I'm just unsure if my ear would hear it. Unfortunately, I can't listen to it prior to the purchase.

Any help would be most appreciated. I'm amazed at the level of knowledge on this forum. Hopefully I can learn something and do this the right way. Thanks guys!
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Originally Posted by dgrove12 View Post
Took the plunge. Got the SC2000 for $140. Just too good of a price to not at least try it. If it's terrible, I'll upgrade later. PM1000 fronts, PC2000 and PM800 surrounds. Hope Baja is as reputable as everyone says he is
Hi dgrove12,

Welcome to AVS!

Looks like you've got the fronts and surrounds for the 5.0 setup - congrats! The only thing missing is the 0.1 to complete the 5.1 system.

You've got a medium sized room (3,200 to 3,300 cu. ft.) and bass frequency issues are very room volume dependent. Basically the sub needs to fill the entire room so you should be looking at least a pair of subs with less than 12" drivers. The benefits of multiple subs include dealing with room modes, smoother bass response at the Main Listening Position and minimizing seat to seat variance.

The PM series of speakers will need to be crossed over at a much higher frequency than specified by Def Tech - again the advantage of multiple subs to minimize localization issues with higher crossover frequencies. The crossover frequency is determined by your receiver during the setup process.

Draw a sketch of your room, where you plan to put the TV, speakers, sub and where you'll be sitting? Where you sit is commonly referred to as the Main Listening Position (MLP). Work out the angle between the MLP and each speaker and get approximate distances.

The angles used are to check if you can meet the standard 5.1 layout arrangement as shown in post number 7310 and post number 7312.

Use the the approximate distance between the MLP and the front left/front right speaker to determine if your receiver (Yamaha RX-A740BL) has sufficient power to drive up to peak reference level of 105dB using the web app here: http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

Maranatz NR1504, Oppo BPD-93, MTV 7000D, LG LW6500, aTV, WDTV Live, Harmony 650 remote, KEF E301, MiniDSP(2x4), Rythmik F12G
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post #7345 of 7347 Old 11-24-2014, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by DJones410 View Post
I think I posted this in the wrong Def Tech thread.

I am a total newbie here and have been strongly considering the Def Tech Pro Cinema 600/800 speakers. I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on the following options I've seen so far.

1. Best Buy has a bundle, Pro Cinema 600 with either Denon X2100W receiver or Yamaha RA-A740BL receiver for $999.
2. Pro Cinema 600 for $599 at Best Buy
3. Pro Cinema 800 for $899 at ProAudioDealer

Either of the last 2 options, I can get a Pioneer Elite VSX-44 on sale at Best Buy for $299.

My budget is about $1200.

For those with Pro Cinema 600/800 - would you recommend these speakers?
Did your budget include sub(s)?

For either the Pro Cinema 600/800 options, you're going to need a sub and preferably a pair of them to deal with higher than expected crossover frequencies. The Pro Cinema 600/800 will struggle reproducing the last 2 to 2.5 octaves of the soundtrack.

Either the Denon or Pioneer receiver can drive the speakers, whether it can go to reference level depends on how far away the Main Listening Position (MLP) is from the speakers and how loud you like to listen at.

Maranatz NR1504, Oppo BPD-93, MTV 7000D, LG LW6500, aTV, WDTV Live, Harmony 650 remote, KEF E301, MiniDSP(2x4), Rythmik F12G
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post #7346 of 7347 Old 11-25-2014, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steveting99 View Post
Did your budget include sub(s)?

For either the Pro Cinema 600/800 options, you're going to need a sub and preferably a pair of them to deal with higher than expected crossover frequencies. The Pro Cinema 600/800 will struggle reproducing the last 2 to 2.5 octaves of the soundtrack.

Either the Denon or Pioneer receiver can drive the speakers, whether it can go to reference level depends on how far away the Main Listening Position (MLP) is from the speakers and how loud you like to listen at.
The bundle includes the ProCenter 600 and ProSub 600.
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post #7347 of 7347 Old 11-25-2014, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by DJones410 View Post
The bundle includes the ProCenter 600 and ProSub 600.
DJones410,

Forgot to ask you about your room dimensions. What's the side to side, front to back and floor to ceiling lengths? Where to do plan to be relative to all the speakers? This is often referred to as the Main Listening Position (MLP).

The distance between the MLP and the speakers + the speakers' sensitivity and amp power will give an idea of how loud one can go. Ideally to reference level of peak being 105dB.

The room volume will give an idea of how space the bass frequencies need to fill as well as room modes. Generally it's better to multiple subs to deal with room mode issues and smooth at the bass at the MLP.

If you can convince them to give you an extra ProSub 600 for a little more, this would be a better option. Note that the PM600 has a 3.5" driver and this will require a higher crossover frequency - all the more reason to get multiple subs.

Maranatz NR1504, Oppo BPD-93, MTV 7000D, LG LW6500, aTV, WDTV Live, Harmony 650 remote, KEF E301, MiniDSP(2x4), Rythmik F12G
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