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post #331 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 08:21 AM
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Given the little amount of information you provided, it's really hard to say. Can you be more specific? What model were the Polks? What was the room like compared to your room? What kind of music was played? Did you take something of your own to listen to? Are you sure those bastiges didn't have a sub hooked up and playing in the background? (I've seen this done at two local CC stores.) Did they have the "loudness" contour turned on? (seen this) Was the bass boosted in some way, like +12dB in the speaker set up menu for multichannel sound buried in the software? (seen this at CC, BB, and others) Were they using a specially engineered CD or DVD that was deliberately curved to emphasize high and low frequencies? These shops all do this s#!t you know.

I see I can buy a pair of Balboa 30s for $240. So the cheapest pair of Polk floorstanders I see at CC is the Monitor50 at $380 a pair. Is that what you heard?

If so, the Polks are 37% more, or equal to 158% of the Balboa's price. That's not a small increment at this price point. It becomes apples and oranges. You could spend an extra $100 on some JBLs and get a similar scenario: they sound better.

Anyway, this is all speculation until you can identify the Polk model.

What I can afford, when I can afford it...
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post #332 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 12:33 PM
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my objection to the wall mounts is that i dont want to put holes in my walls and dont trust the weight of these on drywall
ya i meant the L820 sorry, and not all that big? to big for most speaker stands that i've looked at
would like them to be at least 36" high
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post #333 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 01:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4DHD View Post

I assume you mean the L820, which aren't all that big @ 12 x 15.5 x 5.
What is your objection to using the wall mounts? If the wall mounts are similar to the PT800 wall mounts they work very well.


I guess maybe 1 drawback of buying from ebay is althought he box camed sealed, and it came with the manual and rubber feet and everythign for my L820's, it didnt come with the brackets. It even came with the template. But my LC2 came with everything including the brackets. Ims ure if later on the road i decide to wall mount my L820's i could buy the brackets form JBL.
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post #334 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn2166 View Post

my objection to the wall mounts is that i dont want to put holes in my walls and dont trust the weight of these on drywall
ya i meant the L820 sorry, and not all that big? to big for most speaker stands that i've looked at
would like them to be at least 36" high

Good drywall anchors can support 30-40 lbs with no problem. and if one of the screws for the bracket you can get into a stud, then way more weight can be held.
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post #335 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 01:51 PM
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There's a lot of talk about the E-series speakers in this thread. I have E30s and an EC35 that I really like. I had a dedicated media room in our old house and these speakers blended in with the black front wall perfectly. (Rears and surrounds were SP6c in-ceiling speakers that stayed with the house.)

In our new house, I'm stuck. I don't have a place to put any of the three. They are all sitting on the floor. I don't want to sell them and regret giving them up in exchange for a soundbar type of L/C/R 3-in-1.

Speaker stands aren't going to work due to kids. I had the E30s mounted to the wall for a brief time with Omni Mount 20.0s and they worked well, but the E30 is a big speaker and looks a bit funny as a wall mount. The EC35 is a monster, and won't sit on top of our new DLP.

Talk me out of selling these, please. Convince me that I won't be happy with something like the Mirage Uni-Theater. Recommend a wife-friendly way of using these speakers.

TIA.

My Media Room Construction thread. Work began 2/15/05, finished 7.1 install 6/2005. Sold house 7/2007.
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post #336 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toeside View Post

I had a dedicated media room in our old house

My dream some day is to accomplish what you did with your dedicated media room. Congratulations on that project and I hope it brought you increased resale value. I know absolutely nothing about construction so I envy what you and others like you are able to accomplish. Someday. . . I guess I need to start my dedicated home theater education so I'm prepared. I need a good intro book to supplement the AVS Forum and the many websites out there.

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I had the E30s mounted to the wall for a brief time with Omni Mount 20.0s and they worked well

How did you mount the E30s to the Omnimount 20.0? Did you mount the mounting plate onto the BACK of the speaker? If so, I'm glad to know the back panel is strong enough to support the speaker weight. Can you share some details (i.e., what length screws you used, how far you drilled into the back cabinet, etc.)?

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The EC35 is a monster, and won't sit on top of our new DLP.

Are you sure about this? I admit I'm not up-to-date on DLP profiles (I just have a CRT HDTV) but I know several people have had luck with the Omnimount CCH1 (Movie Mate Television Shelf) on their DLPs. I use the shelf on my Sony CRT and it works perfectly. It has a lip on the front to support downward tilting and is very stable. It is low-profile and supports up to 30lbs. The rear legs extend pretty far and offer pivoting feet with adhesive to ensure it can fit a very steep top panel. Check it out.

Regarding the E30s (though this is NOT the opimum idea of course) if you had media cabinets on either side of your TV, since the E30s are front-ported, they could go in the cabinets. Not ideal, but I admit before I got the E90CHs I did this for a while and it was fine given the limitations. Hi-rez audio still sounded wonderful. At least the E30s aren't real-ported.

Best and thanks,
Josh

End LOUDNESS in Music; Fight for High-Resolution Surround Sound: Buy DVD-A/SACD!

Find me at: Last.fm and SA-CD.net
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post #337 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonerCaniac View Post

My dream some day is to accomplish what you did with your dedicated media room. Congratulations on that project and I hope it brought you increased resale value. I know absolutely nothing about construction so I envy what you and others like you are able to accomplish. Someday. . . I guess I need to start my dedicated home theater education so I'm prepared. I need a good intro book to supplement the AVS Forum and the many websites out there.

Thanks. We really enjoyed the room. I hope the new owners do, too. I never got any feedback from them on it, but they did buy the RP CRT from us to keep in the room.

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Originally Posted by SoonerCaniac View Post


How did you mount the E30s to the Omnimount 20.0? Did you mount the mounting plate onto the BACK of the speaker? If so, I'm glad to know the back panel is strong enough to support the speaker weight. Can you share some details (i.e., what length screws you used, how far you drilled into the back cabinet, etc.)?

I don't remember the name of the drywall anchor I used, but I have some left, so I'll take a look. The speaker side of the mount was screwed directly to the back of the cabinet. I called JBL for their recommendation and they said to use the Omnimount 20.0. The guy told me to attach the mounting plate directly over where the label is and use the supplied screws and I'd be OK. They hung on the wall well, but as I mentioned, they are BIG for wall mounted speakers. They looked funny to me that way. I will say that it's definitely a 2 person job to get the speaker (and the 20.0 ball mount) into the bracket and positioned while the mount is tightened.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonerCaniac View Post

Are you sure about this? I admit I'm not up-to-date on DLP profiles (I just have a CRT HDTV) but I know several people have had luck with the Omnimount CCH1 (Movie Mate Television Shelf) on their DLPs. I use the shelf on my Sony CRT and it works perfectly. It has a lip on the front to support downward tilting and is very stable. It is low-profile and supports up to 30lbs. The rear legs extend pretty far and offer pivoting feet with adhesive to ensure it can fit a very steep top panel. Check it out.


I did look at the CCH1 and almost bought one last night. I wasn't sure how sturdy it would be. I guess it'd be OK.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonerCaniac View Post



Regarding the E30s, though this is NOT the opimum idea of course, but if you had media cabinets on either side of your TV, since the E30s are front-ported, they could go in the cabinets. Not the best, but I admit before I got the E90CHs I did this for a while and it was fine given the limitations. Hi-rez audio still sounded wonderful.

Best and thanks,
Josh

We bought a 52" Kingston TV stand from Crate & Barrel and it does have matching side cabinets for $399 each. We are waiting on some loveseats to be delivered and I'm afraid we won't have room for 2 of the media towers. That was the original plan until my wife saw a different $800 peice of furniture at C&B that she wanted instead.


Like I said...I feel stuck. I have speakers that I like but no where to put them. I can buy the $32 CCH1 tonight and give it a try, but that doesn't help with the E30s. I suggested that we just buy stands. She didn't like that suggestion.



If only someone would release invisible speakers.

My Media Room Construction thread. Work began 2/15/05, finished 7.1 install 6/2005. Sold house 7/2007.
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post #338 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 03:10 PM
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Sounds like "someone" doesn't like how the big black boxes look in the room, not that you don't have enough room for them.
What's behind the wall? Could you cut out the wall to accomadate inserting a box into the wall (would hang out the other side like 8"). The speakers would then look like flat panel speakers.
What color are the walls?... white? You could paint the outside of the cabinets white, and redo the speaker grills in white also. Don't forget to paint the grills white before puting on the new cloth.

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post #339 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 03:40 PM
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Thought I'd post this specifically in the JBL thread, I figured out how to bi-wire my L880's but not quite sure how to bi-wire the LC1, I'm using a Onkyo SR-805 which is 7.1 with both 2nd and 3rd zone capabilities. Any suggestions?
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post #340 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Lyricalchaos View Post

Thought I'd post this specifically in the JBL thread, I figured out how to bi-wire my L880's but not quite sure how to bi-wire the LC1, I'm using a Onkyo SR-805 which is 7.1 with both 2nd and 3rd zone capabilities. Any suggestions?

I don't think your receiver has that option. Most only let you bi-wire R/L.

But you might want to ask again in the Onkyo section under Amps, as I am not familiar with that unit.
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post #341 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 07:10 PM
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Given the little amount of information you provided, it's really hard to say. Can you be more specific? What model were the Polks? What was the room like compared to your room? What kind of music was played? Did you take something of your own to listen to? Are you sure those bastiges didn't have a sub hooked up and playing in the background? (I've seen this done at two local CC stores.) Did they have the "loudness" contour turned on? (seen this) Was the bass boosted in some way, like +12dB in the speaker set up menu for multichannel sound buried in the software? (seen this at CC, BB, and others) Were they using a specially engineered CD or DVD that was deliberately curved to emphasize high and low frequencies? These shops all do this s#!t you know.

I see I can buy a pair of Balboa 30s for $240. So the cheapest pair of Polk floorstanders I see at CC is the Monitor50 at $380 a pair. Is that what you heard?

If so, the Polks are 37% more, or equal to 158% of the Balboa's price. That's not a small increment at this price point. It becomes apples and oranges. You could spend an extra $100 on some JBLs and get a similar scenario: they sound better.

Anyway, this is all speculation until you can identify the Polk model.

Thanks for reply. the polks were either the $179ea or the $359ea. big gap, i know. they were playing lord of the rings, two towers. i put same movie in last night and still found a huge difference. they did have a sub hooked up, but it was on the far side of the room and i was standing next to the towers. it was most definitely coming from the polks. i mentioned to him my towers didn't sound that way and then he showed me the infinitys next to the polks and they sounded even better then the polks.
i read the manual on the balboa 30s and it did say if i was lacking bass that there may be a polarity problem. what's weird is i can do a test with a cheap old maxwell calibration disc and get the polarity to be off or on no matter which way i plug the wires. I need to go buy the hd dvd video essentials tonight. i think there may be either a prob with my wiring or with my receiver. i'm sure comparing a 2 yr old yamaha to a brand new onkyo is apples and oranges. just didn't think it would be that much of a difference. it sounded like both the polks and the infinitys had built in subs compared to my balboas.
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post #342 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn2166 View Post

my objection to the wall mounts is that i dont want to put holes in my walls and dont trust the weight of these on drywall
ya i meant the L820 sorry, and not all that big? to big for most speaker stands that i've looked at
would like them to be at least 36" high

Its all personal choice as to wall mount or not.
But those L820 are only half the size of my PT800s and L212s. Both are 24" tall x 6" deep. The L212 are 16" wide and the PT800s are 13". The four surround speakers, two of each, are mounted on-wall, using the JBL provided wall brackets, which screw to the backs of the speakers.
Each bracket has two slot holes at the top, that hang on screws, screwed into the wall. One screw for each speaker is run into a wall stud, the other screw is screwed into an EZ Anchor (TM), drywall anchor.

Those anchors screw into the wall, using an electric drill motor or a screw gun w/ a phillips bit.
Then you screw a round head screw into the center of the anchor, leaving the head about a 1/4" out from the wall.
Then its just a matter of slipping the slotted holes, in the bracket, over the screw heads.
My surround speakers weight is at least twice that of the L820.

Look at this pic of one of my PT800, wall mounted.
LL
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post #343 of 15536 Old 08-17-2007, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by indian View Post

Thanks for reply. the polks were either the $179ea or the $359ea.

We need model #, price means squat. We can't help you w/o proper info.
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post #344 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 06:49 PM
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Since I was working, for the past couple of days, in an area north of Reno, where there are a gross of new stores, I thought I would check out the new BB and CC.
Talk about two stores being video only, its not quite that bad, but almost.
No JBLs in either store, of any size, and if it wasn't for the Mag. HT corner in BB, neither store would have much of anything I would call a speaker. Can you spell Bose?
CC did have a couple of pair of Boston speaker systems.
I know that BB does sell JBLs online, I checked the other day. And its been quite a few years since CC sold JBLs
So that leaves Fry's as the only store, that I know of that sells JBLs. Tweeters did, but most, or at least many of them have closed up.
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post #345 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 07:21 PM
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What do you guys think about the 4 inch Venue Tour speakers for surrounds? I think the the 5 inchers are too big and that nixes the 6 inchers as well. Plus the Tours come with the wall brackets.

Mike
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post #346 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by rifleman98 View Post

What do you guys think about the 4 inch Venue Tour speakers for surrounds? I think the the 5 inchers are too big and that nixes the 6 inchers as well. Plus the Tours come with the wall brackets.

Mike

They are pretty much "the minimum" of what you need. You wiil get decent surround sound out of them, but don't expect anywhere near "full range" sound. They'll sound like really good satellite speakers. They do look good though since they mount to the wall and are low profile.

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JVC DLA-RS40-U... Oppo BDP-105D... Toshiba HD-XA2... Uverse VIP-2250... Roku Streaming Stick... Emotiva XPA-3... Onkyo TX-SR805
JBL LC2 (x3) ... JBL L820 (x6) ... SVS PB10-ISD (x2) ... SVS 20-39-PCI
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post #347 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 07:52 PM
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That's all I'm using them for.

I'm using the Venue 6 inch Stage 3 ways for the fronts, Venue Voice 5 inch 2 ways center, and Venue Sub 12 500W sub. All powered by an Onkyo 605s.

Do the bigger ones have anything other than woofer size on the Tour?

It's all going in a 17x15 room.

If that sounds OK, I'm ordering now.

Mike
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post #348 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman98 View Post

What do you guys think about the 4 inch Venue Tour speakers for surrounds? I think the the 5 inchers are too big and that nixes the 6 inchers as well. Plus the Tours come with the wall brackets.

Mike

I'm not real similar with the Venue sereis. But looking over the different models on the JBL site, I'd go with at least the Balcony for surrounds. It also has a built in keyhole mounting bracket.
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post #349 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 07:59 PM
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Nice receiver. Best bang for your buck right now.
The speakers are ok, probably what you can afford right? Too bad they don't make a
3-way center in the Venue series. That would be better.
I would NOT buy that sub though. That would be a waste of money.
You should get (talking budget-wise here) a SVS PB10-NSD. Frequently they have scratch-n-dent models on their website for something like $50 less than regular price.
Go to the subwoofers forum here and READ up on it. Ask about it. It is WAYYY better than that JBL.

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JVC DLA-RS40-U... Oppo BDP-105D... Toshiba HD-XA2... Uverse VIP-2250... Roku Streaming Stick... Emotiva XPA-3... Onkyo TX-SR805
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post #350 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 08:05 PM
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Yeah, they're what I want to spend and we actually listened to the fronts and center at the local Best Buy. Plus they look good IMO.

I didn't really see anything else in my price range that matched up.

I'll take a look at other subs.

Thanks

Mike
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post #351 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 08:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman98 View Post

Yeah, they're what I want to spend and we actually listened to the fronts and center at the local Best Buy.
Thanks

Mike

Well at least you have a BB that sells JBL's. Around here two of the three BB won't have any JBLs. Guess I'll have to check the main BB in the center of Reno.
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post #352 of 15536 Old 08-18-2007, 08:20 PM
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One last thing-

Am I looking for too much sub for my sq footage?

It is a cathedral ceiling in a ranch house. The dividing wall between the living room and the kitchen only goes 3/4 of the way up and has a 8x7 (aprox) opening and then is open to the kitchen which is probably 25% bigger with the breakfast nook than the living room.

Mike
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post #353 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman98 View Post

One last thing-

Am I looking for too much sub for my sq footage?

It is a cathedral ceiling in a ranch house. The dividing wall between the living room and the kitchen only goes 3/4 of the way up and has a 8x7 (aprox) opening and then is open to the kitchen which is probably 25% bigger with the breakfast nook than the living room.

Mike

My media room was 16x20 that vaulted to 10 feet and I have the JBL E250 (12 sub from the previous model line). It was great in that room.

Now we have a 16x19 room that vaults to 12 ft. The left side wall is really 8' long with an 8' opening. I'm using the E250 and it doesn't seem like overkill to me. That said, I'd probably be fine with a well performing 10" sub, though.

My Media Room Construction thread. Work began 2/15/05, finished 7.1 install 6/2005. Sold house 7/2007.
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post #354 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman98 View Post

One last thing-

Am I looking for too much sub for my sq footage?

It is a cathedral ceiling in a ranch house. The dividing wall between the living room and the kitchen only goes 3/4 of the way up and has a 8x7 (aprox) opening and then is open to the kitchen which is probably 25% bigger with the breakfast nook than the living room.

Mike

You LR is only 6" shorter in one direction and 5' shorter the other than my LR, which also has a vaulted ceiling and an 8'-8"x7' opening to the kitchen/dining.
My LR, with the sliding doors closed in the archway is 3150cuft. I'm running dual 800w subs, 4ohms. Those 4ohm subs aren't as efficient as 8ohm subs would be.

So size wise, that should be a good comparision.
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post #355 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toeside View Post

My media room was 16x20 that vaulted to 10 feet and I have the JBL E250 (12 sub from the previous model line). It was great in that room.

Now we have a 16x19 room that vaults to 12 ft. The left side wall is really 8' long with an 8' opening. I'm using the E250 and it doesn't seem like overkill to me. That said, I'd probably be fine with a well performing 10" sub, though.

When it comes to subs, the more air it pushes the better. Bigger diameter driver=more air. I wouldn't use anything smaller than a 12" sub. I currently use two 15", 800w subs.
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post #356 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 11:53 AM
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I found this in a speaker link of Consumer's Report. What a joke.
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Center-channel speaker. In a multichannel setup, the center-channel speaker sits on, above, or beneath the TV. Because it primarily handles dialog, its frequency range doesn’t have to be as full as that of the front pair, but its sound should be similar so that all three blend well. Most center- channel speakers are short and wide so they fit nicely atop a TV. Price: $100 to more than $500.
The center reproduces much more than dialog, which is why having 3 identical speakers is usually best.
Its always been my opinion that CR doesn't know the first thing about audio.
That entire theory of the center channel is why, in the early days of MC, at least, the weak link in most MC systems was the center speaker. It seems to have gotten better over the last few years.
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post #357 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 12:13 PM
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I used to read consumer reports thinking that with all their research and experience, that they knew what they we're talking about. Until I started buying stuff based on their recomendations. Like 6 out of 7-8 things that I've bought that they said were good ended up being junk. Not consumer electronics though, I knew better than that. But I wiil never read CR again. They're basically a scam. They give good reviews in exchange for merchandise and advertising.

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post #358 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 01:42 PM
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Any reason why I shouldn't go with Balconies over the Tours? They look like the same speaker with a different cabinet. I read what there is out there to read about them and the people who owned them were pleased.

Mike
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post #359 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

I used to read consumer reports thinking that with all their research and experience, that they knew what they we're talking about. Until I started buying stuff based on their recomendations. Like 6 out of 7-8 things that I've bought that they said were good ended up being junk. Not consumer electronics though, I knew better than that. But I wiil never read CR again. They're basically a scam. They give good reviews in exchange for merchandise and advertising.

Actually, they don't take ads, and companies can't use CR test results about their products in their ads. Which is the whole point, CR is suppose to be unbiased. But many of their testing staff don't have a clue.
I've seen ads that use test results from Consumers Digest, which is a totally different company.

With the old PL the center and surround speakers were junk. But when digital MC came in that changed the whole concept, now the center is the main speaker.
Except in many DVD-A/SACD recordings. I've got a few of both that either don't use the center at all, or only use the center for instrumental, with the singer's voice only coming from the L/R, as it would be in a stereo recording.
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post #360 of 15536 Old 08-19-2007, 01:54 PM
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I didn't mean print-ads in the mag. By having the products in the mag for testing IS advertising. Most of their tests don't include many of the best models available for that particular test. Thus elevating a crappy model to the top of the list since others aren't even on the list when they should be.

~Dave

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JVC DLA-RS40-U... Oppo BDP-105D... Toshiba HD-XA2... Uverse VIP-2250... Roku Streaming Stick... Emotiva XPA-3... Onkyo TX-SR805
JBL LC2 (x3) ... JBL L820 (x6) ... SVS PB10-ISD (x2) ... SVS 20-39-PCI
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