The OFFICIAL JBL Owners Thread - Page 509 - AVS Forum
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post #15241 of 15490 Old 06-26-2014, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudslide View Post
This notion seems to get passed around a lot. I wonder how many people that report same actually did an A/B listening test in a controlled environment to come to this decision. Well...I did, and there is virtually NO advantage to either model. In fact, they sound incredibly alike. YMMV.
No A-B comparison, but I had S312 and replaced them with L890. The difference can be called subtle or even moderate, though the source material and amp power have a great deal to do with it. Suffice it to say that when pushed hard the S312 sounded pretty distorted, but the L890 did not. Again that was with high quality source material and abundant power. The S312 had an edge in the low end, but the L890 was cleaner and more detailed in all areas. I certainly would never say that the L890 offered "no advantage".
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post #15242 of 15490 Old 06-26-2014, 07:44 AM
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Wink

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Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post
Well there's something wrong with your ears then. I had a full set of E-series and a pair of S38.
The Es were sold to help pay for the Ls and I held on to the S38 for a while, but ended up selling them since I couldn't use them anywhere practical.
I have a dedicated theater room with proper acoustical treatments for accurate sound.
I hear a distinct difference between the S38, the E50 and the LC2 / L820. Better clarity, better imaging, smoother frequency response for the Ls.
It's not like night and day difference, but it's not so subtle either.
Thanks for your take on this issue. Did you do a controlled A/B test with instant, level matched speakers? Curious minds want to know.

MARGARITAS,
they're not just for breakfast anymore.
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post #15243 of 15490 Old 06-26-2014, 08:03 AM
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Wink

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Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post
No A-B comparison, but I had S312 and replaced them with L890. The difference can be called subtle or even moderate, though the source material and amp power have a great deal to do with it. Suffice it to say that when pushed hard the S312 sounded pretty distorted, but the L890 did not. Again that was with high quality source material and abundant power. The S312 had an edge in the low end, but the L890 was cleaner and more detailed in all areas. I certainly would never say that the L890 offered "no advantage".
Hey old friend. It's good to hear from you.

I know that you had both in your system. I'm not doubting you (nor any of you who disagree with me) at all. It's just that acoustic science has taught us that auditory memory is pretty awful. Unless a comparison was done nearly instantly, then biases, expectations, and just plain bad memory tend to color opinions.

In my experience, a couple of us blind A/B tested the S312s/L890s, level matched and with instant switching. We agreed that while we did note minor acoustic differences, as I said, the differences were quite subtle. And we also agreed that we would not (nor anyone) state "oh yeah, this one is better than that one."

Note we did not test for power handling. So the S312s may well break up before the L890s. We didn't push the speakers beyond 'loud'. I think we measured the output at 85 dB via an SPL meter.

But then, as Smarty-pants has suggested, perhaps there's something wrong with my ears.

MARGARITAS,
they're not just for breakfast anymore.

Last edited by Mudslide; 06-26-2014 at 08:09 AM.
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post #15244 of 15490 Old 06-26-2014, 11:17 AM
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^ I guess "subtle" difference may mean something different to different people.
The difference I heard, like I said was very noticeable to me, as if there was a sheer veil lifted from the sound
when played through the L series compared to the E and S.
It was enough of a difference that there was no confusion as to what I was hearing, and certainly no need for any type of double blind test and what not,
and bias is for weak minded people. I'm certainly capable of hearing the difference without letting something like that get in the way.
Anyway, I would say the difference could be classified as subtle, but not so subtle that (to my ears) I can't hear the distinct difference without doing a blind Pepsi Challenge.
I will say this much, that the difference was stronger between the E50 vs L820 compared to the S38 vs L820. Not by much but a little.

~Dave

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post #15245 of 15490 Old 06-26-2014, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post
^ I guess "subtle" difference may mean something different to different people.
The difference I heard, like I said was very noticeable to me, as if there was a sheer veil lifted from the sound
when played through the L series compared to the E and S.
It was enough of a difference that there was no confusion as to what I was hearing, and certainly no need for any type of double blind test and what not,
and bias is for weak minded people. I'm certainly capable of hearing the difference without letting something like that get in the way.
Anyway, I would say the difference could be classified as subtle, but not so subtle that (to my ears) I can't hear the distinct difference without doing a blind Pepsi Challenge.
I will say this much, that the difference was stronger between the E50 vs L820 compared to the S38 vs L820. Not by much but a little.
My original response above...and really all my responses in the past on this subject are answers to new audio fans...not to old timers like you or me or the 'cat. Yes, I'm sure you can tell the difference without an A/B. (I couldn't tell any advantage when it comes to these particular speakers we're mentioning, nor could my cohorts in the A/B.) But how many people do you think who read about JBL speakers have more than a passing familiarity with them? I'm guessing not many. And to them, the differences between these models would be nil or unimportant.

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they're not just for breakfast anymore.
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post #15246 of 15490 Old 06-27-2014, 09:47 AM
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How come nobody has bought a pair of 4319 or 4429 yet? I'm wanting to know how they measure up.


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post #15247 of 15490 Old 06-27-2014, 08:29 PM
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You're looking in the wrong forum.

What I can afford, when I can afford it...
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post #15248 of 15490 Old 06-29-2014, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post
^ I will say this much, that the difference was stronger between the E50 vs L820 compared to the S38 vs L820. Not by much but a little.
Saw your posts concerning the switch from the E-series to Studio L speakers, the transition I'd like to make as well. Pretty good to hear of the improvement to sound you spoke of.

I see in your signature that you have 9 JBL speakers, 3 being the LC2....may I ask how you have those arranged?
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post #15249 of 15490 Old 06-29-2014, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by JosephTonyStark View Post
Saw your posts concerning the switch from the E-series to Studio L speakers, the transition I'd like to make as well. Pretty good to hear of the improvement to sound you spoke of.

I see in your signature that you have 9 JBL speakers, 3 being the LC2....may I ask how you have those arranged?
I have 3 LC2s across the front for the front L/C/R channels, then I use L820s for all of my surrounds.
I have 2 rows of seating in my theater room, so I chose to use 2 sets of surround speaker there, one set for each row.
Then in the rear, 1 set for the surround back speakers.

~Dave

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post #15250 of 15490 Old 06-29-2014, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post
I have 3 LC2s across the front for the front L/C/R channels, then I use L820s for all of my surrounds.
I have 2 rows of seating in my theater room, so I chose to use 2 sets of surround speaker there, one set for each row.
Then in the rear, 1 set for the surround back speakers.
Got to imagine that's got to sound pretty....fulfilling. Appreciate the response.
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post #15251 of 15490 Old 06-29-2014, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JosephTonyStark View Post
Got to imagine that's got to sound pretty....fulfilling. Appreciate the response.
Indeed it does

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post #15252 of 15490 Old 07-01-2014, 11:01 AM
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Folks on the right coast who are in the market should be aware of this eBay deal: (no affiliation) $450

http://www.ebay.com/itm/281374830302...84.m1423.l2649

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post #15253 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 01:56 AM
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Happy 4th of July to all the JBL owners
After spending the last few weeks getting the Studio 590's dialed in all I can say is wow. I cant believe how seamlessly all the drivers blend together. The soundstage they create is incredible. These horns are not the least bit harsh. They produce very detailed highs and have excellent imaging. The bass response is rich, articulate and powerful. Everything just sounds effortless coming out of them.

Oh and IMHO The L890's are considerably better than the S312's. Especially with the tweeters, it's not even close. Even the mid range is much clearer on the L890's. Things get closer as you get lower between the two. However S312's lack the mid-bass punch of the L890's.
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post #15254 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 02:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOM85 View Post
Happy 4th of July to all the JBL owners
After spending the last few weeks getting the Studio 590's dialed in all I can say is wow. I cant believe how seamlessly all the drivers blend together. The soundstage they create is incredible. These horns are not the least bit harsh. They produce very detailed highs and have excellent imaging. The bass response is rich, articulate and powerful. Everything just sounds effortless coming out of them.

Oh and IMHO The L890's are considerably better than the S312's. Especially with the tweeters, it's not even close. Even the mid range is much clearer on the L890's. Things get closer as you get lower between the two. However S312's lack the mid-bass punch of the L890's.
Happy 4th to you. Glad to hear the 590's are working out for you.
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post #15255 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 09:41 AM
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My JBL SB 300 sound bar and sub woofer arrived on the porch yesterday. Trying to get it up and running with my Samsung UN55F smart TV. I am using RCA cables because it's Independence Day and I don't want to go to the big box store for opticals.

The bar will not work with the Samsung. I set the TV speaker setting to "external speakers" and nada.

Tried it on a cheap TCL flat screen, same results.

Tried it with a Bose Wave Radio, works perfect.

What am I overlooking?

Hope y'all are outside grilling and having a cold one today with your family and/or Bud's!

T
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post #15256 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 10:15 AM
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Think I may have discovered why. The RCA's on the TV are inputs.

Yep, that was it.

Not impressed with the sound though.

Last edited by tomthbomb; 07-04-2014 at 11:43 AM.
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post #15257 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 12:35 PM
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[quote=tomthbomb;25488434

Hope y'all are outside grilling and having a cold one today with your family and/or Bud's!

T[/QUOTE]

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomthbomb View Post
Think I may have discovered why. The RCA's on the TV are inputs.

Yep, that was it.

Not impressed with the sound though.
Any relation between these events? ;-)

Happy Fourth!

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post #15258 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOM85 View Post
Happy 4th of July to all the JBL owners
After spending the last few weeks getting the Studio 590's dialed in all I can say is wow. I cant believe how seamlessly all the drivers blend together. The soundstage they create is incredible. These horns are not the least bit harsh. They produce very detailed highs and have excellent imaging. The bass response is rich, articulate and powerful. Everything just sounds effortless coming out of them.

Oh and IMHO The L890's are considerably better than the S312's. Especially with the tweeters, it's not even close. Even the mid range is much clearer on the L890's. Things get closer as you get lower between the two. However S312's lack the mid-bass punch of the L890's.
I did the same today listening to my Studio 590s on new Legends SACDs. Great sound from awesome speakers.
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post #15259 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 07:06 PM
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Hello guys! I need little help here!

What receiver is the best for JBL Studio series??

I have 580 front, 530 back and 2 DIY subwoofers coming soon.

Budget $500.

Thanks in advance!!
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post #15260 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDST View Post
Hello guys! I need little help here!

What receiver is the best for JBL Studio series??

I have 580 front, 530 back and 2 DIY subwoofers coming soon.

Budget $500.

Thanks in advance!!
^Happy hunting.
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-rec...ps-processors/

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JVC DLA-RS40-U... Oppo BDP-105D... Toshiba HD-XA2... Uverse VIP-2250... Roku Streaming Stick... Emotiva XPA-3... Onkyo TX-SR805
JBL LC2 (x3) ... JBL L820 (x6) ... SVS PB10-ISD (x2) ... SVS 20-39-PCI
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post #15261 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDST View Post
Hello guys! I need little help here!

What receiver is the best for JBL Studio series??

I have 580 front, 530 back and 2 DIY subwoofers coming soon.

Budget $500.

Thanks in advance!!
http://www.accessories4less.com/make...ceivers/1.html
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post #15262 of 15490 Old 07-04-2014, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDST View Post
Hello guys! I need little help here!

What receiver is the best for JBL Studio series??

I have 580 front, 530 back and 2 DIY subwoofers coming soon.

Budget $500.

Thanks in advance!!

I'm running a couple of 580's, a 520, two 530's and one Rythmik E15 Subwoofer with a Denon X1000 and have been very happy with this setup. Got a refurbished from Accessories For Less, looked and worked like a brand new one.

http://www.accessories4less.com/make...airplay/1.html
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post #15263 of 15490 Old 07-05-2014, 12:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOM85 View Post
Happy 4th of July to all the JBL owners
After spending the last few weeks getting the Studio 590's dialed in all I can say is wow. I cant believe how seamlessly all the drivers blend together. The soundstage they create is incredible. These horns are not the least bit harsh. They produce very detailed highs and have excellent imaging. The bass response is rich, articulate and powerful. Everything just sounds effortless coming out of them.

Oh and IMHO The L890's are considerably better than the S312's. Especially with the tweeters, it's not even close. Even the mid range is much clearer on the L890's. Things get closer as you get lower between the two. However S312's lack the mid-bass punch of the L890's.
How would you compare the Studio 590 to the L890?
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post #15264 of 15490 Old 07-06-2014, 01:28 PM
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How would you compare the Studio 590 to the L890?
More "contrast" than "compare" because they have little in common other than the JBL name.

The long-running L890 is a superior direct radiator tower in the low-mid price category. It may be the last JBL consumer four-way direct radiator speaker, as the platform moves toward horns. There are still pro models that have all direct radiators. (Harman's Revel brand is taking over direct radiator production in consumer models.)

The 590 is a NEXT-generation horn tower with a ton of newer technologies that have trickled down from JBL's higher end products. It's still a low-mid price entry based on price, but it boxes way above its weight class.

Of course, it all comes down to personal preference and circumstances, such as your room, your family, and your ears, but if I had a decent room to place either model in, I'd take the 590 at full price over the L890 with a $500 rebate. When it comes to clarity, depth and width of soundstage, impact, and balance, the 590 flips all my switches.
rokbyter and 89grand like this.

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post #15265 of 15490 Old 07-06-2014, 08:05 PM
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^ Well, seeing as how the real world street prices of the 590 is about $1000 vs $700 for the L890,
I would certainly hope the 590 sounds better.
I know price paid isn't always determinate of sound quality, but for JBL that usually holds true since they
seem to have a more honest approach with the marketing of their stand alone speakers.

Does anyone have any real experience comparing the Studio series directly with the Performance series?
That would be an interesting show down I think. Might come down to personal preference compared to better SQ though.

~Dave

...Theater Room Setup...
JVC DLA-RS40-U... Oppo BDP-105D... Toshiba HD-XA2... Uverse VIP-2250... Roku Streaming Stick... Emotiva XPA-3... Onkyo TX-SR805
JBL LC2 (x3) ... JBL L820 (x6) ... SVS PB10-ISD (x2) ... SVS 20-39-PCI
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post #15266 of 15490 Old 07-06-2014, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDST View Post
Hello guys! I need little help here!

What receiver is the best for JBL Studio series??

Budget $500
Real good price - the Denon X2000
http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR-X200...ds=denon+x2000

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post #15267 of 15490 Old 07-07-2014, 11:49 AM
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Also great price on the Denon X1000. Lowest I have ever seen for new.

http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR-X100...ds=denon+x1000
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post #15268 of 15490 Old 07-07-2014, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post
^ Well, seeing as how the real world street prices of the 590 is about $1000 vs $700 for the L890,
I would certainly hope the 590 sounds better.
I know price paid isn't always determinate of sound quality, but for JBL that usually holds true since they
seem to have a more honest approach with the marketing of their stand alone speakers.

Does anyone have any real experience comparing the Studio series directly with the Performance series?
That would be an interesting show down I think. Might come down to personal preference compared to better SQ though.
I carefully avoided writing that it sounds better. I try to keep the lid on that can of worms.

My personal preference would be to pay $1000 for the 590 before spending $200 for the L890 (that's your $700 street price minus my fictional $500 rebate) because I would not be happy with the L890 having heard the 590 in the same environment.

As for the comparison with the Performance Series, I got to do a side-by-side with the Studio 530 ($600 pair JBL price) and the PT800 ($1500 each JBL price when available) in my house, and that made it a lot easier for me to sell my entire Performance system as I was downsizing for a potential move. Some of it went to Colorado, some to Oregon, some to Washington, some to new York, some to New Mexico, and even a little to California. I've loved the Performance Series for a long time, and I'm still using inverted Ti drivers in my "PT250" experiment, but the reality is that even the 530 ate the PT800's HF, midrange, and midbass lunch. I can't say what the larger models would do, but the inference is clear.

Again, some folks might still prefer the sound of the Performance Series, and I can understand why.

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post #15269 of 15490 Old 07-08-2014, 02:58 AM
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I carefully avoided writing that it sounds better. I try to keep the lid on that can of worms.

My personal preference would be to pay $1000 for the 590 before spending $200 for the L890 (that's your $700 street price minus my fictional $500 rebate) because I would not be happy with the L890 having heard the 590 in the same environment.

As for the comparison with the Performance Series, I got to do a side-by-side with the Studio 530 ($600 pair JBL price) and the PT800 ($1500 each JBL price when available) in my house, and that made it a lot easier for me to sell my entire Performance system as I was downsizing for a potential move. Some of it went to Colorado, some to Oregon, some to Washington, some to new York, some to New Mexico, and even a little to California. I've loved the Performance Series for a long time, and I'm still using inverted Ti drivers in my "PT250" experiment, but the reality is that even the 530 ate the PT800's HF, midrange, and midbass lunch. I can't say what the larger models would do, but the inference is clear.

Again, some folks might still prefer the sound of the Performance Series, and I can understand why.
It seems you've developed a preference for horns.
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post #15270 of 15490 Old 07-08-2014, 07:49 AM
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Horns vs cone/dome speakers is not a new discussion. Either "value" or sound quality discussions are still pretty much an apples/oranges conversation. I think many folks would agree that the PS and Revel models have reached near the pinnacle for cone/dome type speakers. Horn technology is still evolving to some extent. I'm pretty sure I will die listening to my PS system. But if I was to dabble in horns, I think I'd go looking for some used Array 1400/1000/880/800 models before I'd fork over $1K for a 590. But then I've never seen the value in new speakers when used are available.
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