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post #271 of 1026 Old 07-01-2013, 08:06 AM
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The X4000 is excellent. I most likely would have been perfectly happy with that running just the wide speakers.

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Beautiful speakers guys! Why is everyone so obsessed with Looper? That was one of the worst movies I've ever seen! I want those 2 hours of my life back!

We liked it - I've watched it 3 times now. Maybe it's a love it or hate it type of movie like Cloud Atlas ( which we also love - I've watched that 3 time so far too ) ! smile.gif

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post #272 of 1026 Old 07-02-2013, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Holiday121 View Post

Man I wish I had room for wides. Both of your guys pics look good. I see they are slightly pointed to center of listening area

For me, having a slight toe-in helps with imaging. But, you have to make sure not to toe-in too much or you lose you soundstage.
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post #273 of 1026 Old 07-03-2013, 12:39 PM
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My front L / R are slightly toe'd in. So far I love the sound stage of these speakers .

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post #274 of 1026 Old 07-03-2013, 07:06 PM
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Below is my setup in brief. I have way too many components

ML Theos piano black fronts
ML Stage X black ash center
ML Motion 4 side and rears(4 of them)
ML Descent I dark cherry left and right subs(2 of them)

McIntosh Mx121 pre + Mc207 power (7×200watts)

Oppo Bdp105 sacd/cd player(xlr analog)
Pro-ject RPM 9.2 Evo turntable
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post #275 of 1026 Old 07-03-2013, 08:51 PM
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My motion 10s are overkill for my sides and rears
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post #276 of 1026 Old 07-04-2013, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uderman View Post

Below is my setup in brief. I have way too many components

ML Theos piano black fronts
ML Stage X black ash center
ML Motion 4 side and rears(4 of them)
ML Descent I dark cherry left and right subs(2 of them)

McIntosh Mx121 pre + Mc207 power (7×200watts)

Oppo Bdp105 sacd/cd player(xlr analog)
Pro-ject RPM 9.2 Evo turntable

Pics? I have the Theos in piano black also and love them.

Samsung 85" 4K, Dolby Atmos 7.1.4 with MartinLogan Theos, Stage, Motion 15, EM-R, Seaton Submersive F2, 5Denon AVR-X5200W, PS4 = SubSolar, Xbox1 = SubSolar0
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post #277 of 1026 Old 07-05-2013, 10:16 AM
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I have way too many components

no such thing biggrin.gif
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post #278 of 1026 Old 07-08-2013, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

My front L / R are slightly toe'd in. So far I love the sound stage of these speakers .

All my ML's are finally in! Running Motion 40's and Motion 30 for L/C/R, and Motion 15's for surrounds. I just ordered some Sanus stands for the surrounds as well, when I get those in I'll post some pics for you guys.

Craig, amazing setup man!

You are right, the soundstage is just freaking huuuuge. Even with just my 40's on listening to 2ch music w/ no EQ, the soundstage is well outside the speakers, with excellent imaging within. I watched the opening sequence of Skyfall last night, first time I'd had everything hooked up together. It absolutely blows my old JBL setup away, which was no "easy" task. These ribbon tweeters are a force to be reckoned with, amazing all around performer for both music and HT.
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post #279 of 1026 Old 07-08-2013, 03:55 PM
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All my ML's are finally in! Running Motion 40's and Motion 30 for L/C/R, and Motion 15's for surrounds. I just ordered some Sanus stands for the surrounds as well, when I get those in I'll post some pics for you guys.

Craig, amazing setup man!

You are right, the soundstage is just freaking huuuuge. Even with just my 40's on listening to 2ch music w/ no EQ, the soundstage is well outside the speakers, with excellent imaging within. I watched the opening sequence of Skyfall last night, first time I'd had everything hooked up together. It absolutely blows my old JBL setup away, which was no "easy" task. These ribbon tweeters are a force to be reckoned with, amazing all around performer for both music and HT.

Congratulations on the new setup. Try Blade Runner, Apocolypse Now and Master and Commander with your new speakers! smile.gif

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post #280 of 1026 Old 07-08-2013, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

Congratulations on the new setup. Try Blade Runner, Apocolypse Now and Master and Commander with your new speakers! smile.gif

Haha, got them all on Blu. Truly classics. The Flight of the Valkyries scene is insane.

You are right, these speakers are truly underrated. For all the hype Goldenear got last year for their ribbon tweeter, you don't see much fuss about the ML Motions. I have to say the ML's fit and finish far, far surpass the GE Tritons and these aren't baking in subwoofers to go in less than ideal room locations, and that don't perform at the level of a real 12" sub. You get all the greatness of the ribbon tweeter in the ML's, in a far prettier package, and for less money to boot.
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post #281 of 1026 Old 07-09-2013, 09:09 AM
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You are right, these speakers are truly underrated. For all the hype Goldenear got last year for their ribbon tweeter, you don't see much fuss about the ML Motions. I have to say the ML's fit and finish far, far surpass the GE Tritons and these aren't baking in subwoofers to go in less than ideal room locations, and that don't perform at the level of a real 12" sub. You get all the greatness of the ribbon tweeter in the ML's, in a far prettier package, and for less money to boot.

Ya, I like my subwoofer seperate please. Nothing is going to come close to an SVS cylinder sub anyway ( especially a PC 13 Ultra, eh? ). smile.gif

Don't forget A V Science sells Martin Logan speakers now, just FYI.

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post #282 of 1026 Old 07-10-2013, 06:19 PM
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Is there a forum sponsor that someone could recommend for purchasing a pair of Electromotion ESL?
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post #283 of 1026 Old 07-11-2013, 05:51 AM
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See post above yours...

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #284 of 1026 Old 07-11-2013, 05:57 AM
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haha, how about that, thanks.
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post #285 of 1026 Old 07-12-2013, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simp1yamazn View Post

thought I'd pop into this thread ... my pup helping me set-up my speakers/getting freaked out ... a pair of Montis in dark cherry and motif x in dark cherry.

Everything looks great, especially the pup!


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post #286 of 1026 Old 07-18-2013, 07:44 AM
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Everything looks great, especially the pup!

Thanks!

Has anyone tried using pro-amps to power they ML's? Specifically ML electrostats? From what I can see from spec sheets, the pro-amps are actually much more adept at handling the low impedance that the panels show in the higher frequencies.
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post #287 of 1026 Old 07-18-2013, 08:26 AM
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Specifically, I was looking atthe behringer EP4000. 550 watts per channel into 8 ohms, 950 into 4, and 1250 into 2. You could also do a pair and bridged into 8 ohms is 1750 and 4 ohm 2400. I've seen it said that behringer is a little over zealous in their specs, but even so it would be a lot of power for very little $$ and better low impedance than any AVR by far.
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post #288 of 1026 Old 07-18-2013, 10:42 AM
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Should work OK. I would not bridge it since ML's dip so low in impedance at HF; bridging effectively halves (reduces) the load the amp sees, turning the <2 ohm dip into a <1 ohm load for the amp.

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #289 of 1026 Old 07-19-2013, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post

Should work OK. I would not bridge it since ML's dip so low in impedance at HF; bridging effectively halves (reduces) the load the amp sees, turning the <2 ohm dip into a <1 ohm load for the amp.

Ah, makes sense. Has anyone tried a pro amp in their setup with good or bad results?
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post #290 of 1026 Old 07-19-2013, 10:47 AM
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Numerous threads in the Amps forum from numerous folk who use pro amps in their systems, not sure how many on ML's.

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #291 of 1026 Old 07-20-2013, 07:38 PM
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Yea, nothing I've found so far seems to address the unique needs of an electrostatic panel and pro amps. But, it does seem like pro amps, if you are willing to modify fans for quiet operation, have much better low impedance handling.
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post #292 of 1026 Old 07-23-2013, 10:32 PM
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I think I'm still breaking in my Martin Logan speakers. That said, watched the awesome Jet Li movie HERO tonite with the sound levelscranked up there a bit - great soundtrack! Sounded so good with these speakers and my 4520 / 11.1 speaker setup. Highly recommended for Asian martial arts movie lovers !! A kick a$$ sound track !!

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post #293 of 1026 Old 07-25-2013, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

I think I'm still breaking in my Martin Logan speakers. That said, watched the awesome Jet Li movie HERO tonite with the sound levelscranked up there a bit - great soundtrack! Sounded so good with these speakers and my 4520 / 11.1 speaker setup. Highly recommended for Asian martial arts movie lovers !! A kick a$$ sound track !!

You're killing me talking about your 11.1!! I STILL haven't gotten my ML sub yet. 5 months on order and counting...

However, while I've been waiting I've been listening to my entire 2 channel music collection again. Everything sounds great on my Montis. Only problem is that it has given me a new obsession: re-rip all my CDs to get my entire music library in lossless compression formats!!
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post #294 of 1026 Old 07-25-2013, 09:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simp1yamazn View Post

Specifically, I was looking atthe behringer EP4000. 550 watts per channel into 8 ohms, 950 into 4, and 1250 into 2. You could also do a pair and bridged into 8 ohms is 1750 and 4 ohm 2400. I've seen it said that behringer is a little over zealous in their specs, but even so it would be a lot of power for very little $$ and better low impedance than any AVR by far.

The EP4000 is 450 watts per channel at 8 ohms. (drops to 288 watts at 20,000hz)
650 watts per channel at 4 ohms. (drops to 450 watts at 20,000hz)
Average of around 830 watts per channel at 2 ohm.
Around 1,250 watts bridged 8 ohm.
Around 1,950 watts bridged 4 ohm.

Fan mod it and it works well for an HT amp.

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post #295 of 1026 Old 07-25-2013, 09:50 PM
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My wife has always hated my JBL front and center speakers. She thinks they sound okay, but look "big and ugly."

I could never argue much, since they are, in fact, big and ugly. I bought em in college. Nuff said.

So what takes their place? Our new Martin Logan's arrive next week!

Wife is so psyched about how the new ML's are going to look, and I'm even more psyched about how they're going to sound.

Lots of work to do, of course, but when it's done, I'll post some performance details.

But thanks right now to Craig Peer, and the entire group at AVS.

There are lots of options out there, but it makes such a difference to work with good guys that know their stuff inside and out.


Every once in a while, quite inexplicably, things actually go according to plan.
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post #296 of 1026 Old 07-26-2013, 06:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mogrub View Post

My wife has always hated my JBL front and center speakers. She thinks they sound okay, but look "big and ugly."

I could never argue much, since they are, in fact, big and ugly. I bought em in college. Nuff said.

So what takes their place? Our new Martin Logan's arrive next week!

Wife is so psyched about how the new ML's are going to look, and I'm even more psyched about how they're going to sound.

Lots of work to do, of course, but when it's done, I'll post some performance details.

But thanks right now to Craig Peer, and the entire group at AVS.

There are lots of options out there, but it makes such a difference to work with good guys that know their stuff inside and out.

Congratulations!!! Now if only I knew which Logans you're getting i'd be even more excited for you biggrin.gif
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post #297 of 1026 Old 07-26-2013, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

The EP4000 is 450 watts per channel at 8 ohms. (drops to 288 watts at 20,000hz)
650 watts per channel at 4 ohms. (drops to 450 watts at 20,000hz)
Average of around 830 watts per channel at 2 ohm.
Around 1,250 watts bridged 8 ohm.
Around 1,950 watts bridged 4 ohm.

Fan mod it and it works well for an HT amp.

So definitely overzealous, which was to be expected. Even so, a whole lot more power than any AVR and a lot less money than anything from even the more value oriented amps (emotiva, parasound, outlaw, etc). I'm thinking i'll pick one up in the new few months after I get my subwoofer situation straightened out. Thanks for the real-world info!
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post #298 of 1026 Old 07-26-2013, 08:03 AM
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Congratulations!!! Now if only I knew which Logans you're getting i'd be even more excited for you biggrin.gif

Theos will sit FR and FL, and a Stage-X at CC in between. It's gonna be a several orders of magnitude upgrade for us.

We've grossly underspent on the audio side of our HTS from day one. I didn't mean to do it that way. It's just that the pace of technology change on the video side has been mind blowing. We've all got a closet full of useless cables to prove it. (OTA, cable, satellite. RCA connectors, S-Video, RGB, DVI, HDMI 1.0 through 1.4. Shielded. Unshielded. Magnets. Now stuff is wireless. Wow.)

Meanwhile, your old speakers keep humming along, using about the same connections, and sounding okay, and never really demanding replacement. In fact, their long and steady service helped make all those video upgrades possible. God bless 'em.

Then one day, you realize that since speakers can have such longevity, it's probably the last place you ought to go on the cheap. And since your wife hates how they look, what are you waiting for? So the light bulb goes off, and now all I'm waiting for is delivery.

Well delivery is one thing I'm waiting on. The other is significantly less exciting. That's the running of new speaker wire up into the attic, and down to where the speakers will sit. Due to the completely demented lay-out of the HVAC equipment in the attic, I've got to literally crawl on my stomach under stuff, then monkey climb over more stuff, and then repel here and there, and then somehow coax the cables up and down the wall spaces.

It's going to be a complete belly-scratching, head-bumping, knee-twisting nightmare. And once you make it bruised and bloody all the way into the work zone, you usually realize you've forgotten the flashlight or some other &^%$ thing, and you have to do the whole Houdini thing in reverse back out of the attic to grab something, and then repel back in. (Then you realize you should have gone to the bathroom while you were free, but you're not up to another steeplechase, so you just mutter a string of obscenities, and wipe the sweat off, and get back to work.)

You've all been there more than once, so you know what I'm talking about. It'll be hours of sweat and headaches, but worth every minute of it. Starting is the hardest part though ...

biggrin.gif


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post #299 of 1026 Old 07-26-2013, 08:15 AM
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Sweet! those theos are awesome speakers. I spent months contemplating basing my system on Theos or Montis for mains.
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We've all got a closet full of useless cables to prove it. (OTA, cable, satellite. RCA connectors, S-Video, RGB, DVI, HDMI 1.0 through 1.4. Shielded. Unshielded. Magnets. Now stuff is wireless. Wow.)

Me too. My wife insisted that I consolidate and reduce the number of cables. Now I only have 3 completely full boxes left tongue.gif



As for the headache of getting everything installed, at least you know what you having coming to you! So many people start on these projects thinking it will be a leisurely evening one day after-work and just end up getting completely overwhelmed and frustrated.
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post #300 of 1026 Old 07-26-2013, 01:26 PM
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Well delivery is one thing I'm waiting on. The other is significantly less exciting. That's the running of new speaker wire up into the attic, and down to where the speakers will sit.

OK, I feel your pain on this one. Having gone up in the attic TWICE now to run new 12 gauge wire when it was blazing hot ( being shot with a 12 gauge load of rock salt wouldn't have been any worse ), just get all your wire cut and marked and pulled. Now it's just a " fond " memory of sweating and knowing how a Gino's Pizza Roll feels.....! eek.gif And I shouldn't have to pull wire again ever ( God help me if someone convinces me I need more than 11 speakers ! ). smile.gif

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