SURROUND SPEAKERS - Bipole, Dipole, Quadpole, Omnipole... WHICH ONE? - Page 25 - AVS Forum
View Poll Results: There are many surround speakers out there now, but the ones below would have to get my highest reco
Mirage OMD5 (or any other Mirage Omnipole) 23 22.33%
JBL P520WS / Infinity ES-250 / Infinity Classia C255ES (Dual-monopole for 4 channels from 2 speakers, but also Bipole & Dipole switchable) 4 3.88%
Axiom QS8 or QS4 (Unique Quadpole design) 28 27.18%
Paradigm ADP (Many models available with this design, where the tweeters run Dipole, but the woofers are Bipole) 18 17.48%
Monitor Audio BXFX or RXFX (Single woofer, but the tweeters can switch to either Dipole or Bipole) 13 12.62%
Monitor Audio GXFX (6 drivers, including a ribbon. (Monopole / Dipole switchable) 11 10.68%
KEF 26/2DS (Dipole only, alas... but with two 6.5 inch side woofers and a front-firing 8 inch!!! ) 6 5.83%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 103. You may not vote on this poll

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post #721 of 737 Old 08-08-2014, 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
Some people prefer diffused or spread sound. Depends on the room too.

If the sofa was right up against the back wall, no way I'd use monopoles, even if they're the coaxial type which generally have a wider dispersion and central sound point source.

I have heard M&K tripoles, forget the model maybe K and S series. Like the S series but too expensive for me.
It's not about preference per se with Dolby Atmos or any other object based format, it's how the content is recorded and also delivered to theaters and to the home. Monopoles work best, dipoles "confuse" and "blur" the 3D imaging set up by the Atmos rendering processor. The only speakers that could be a bit more diffuse are the ceiling surrounds, but they still call for something more akin to bipoles or monopoles with at least a 90 degree by 90 degree dispersion pattern.

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post #722 of 737 Old 08-08-2014, 02:30 PM
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Not trying to start an long hypothetical discussion but until Atmos is in the wild I am not convinced that dipoles or bipoles may not have a place depending on the room and set-up. I have a sofa near wall and plan to use my bipoles with Atmos when I get a new receiver.
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post #723 of 737 Old 08-08-2014, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
Not trying to start an long hypothetical discussion but until Atmos is in the wild I am not convinced that dipoles or bipoles may not have a place depending on the room and set-up. I have a sofa near wall and plan to use my bipoles with Atmos when I get a new receiver.
I think bipoles may be more acceptable than dipoles, especially for ceiling surrounds. Dipoles create an artificial diffusion due to the two sets of drivers being wired out of phase, creating a null between the two sets of drivers. From what I'm reading and hearing about Atmos and DTS MDA (aka DTS-UHD), that is not what you want to have happen.

Any diffusion or reverb is in the mix itself, but you also want a more directionalized effect as well, especially since dialog is now often panned into the surrounds aggressively. That also calls for strict timbre matching of all the speakers in a system.

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post #724 of 737 Old 08-08-2014, 03:59 PM
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That also calls for strict timbre matching of all the speakers in a system.
Not possible.

Krell Evolution 900e x 7

Bose Jewel speakers.

 

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post #725 of 737 Old 08-08-2014, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
Not possible.
Sure it is, especially if you're building anew or expanding a system with more speakers (there are always caveats due to the age of the speakers or the manufacturer's product line being too limited, etc.). It will hopefully get easier to do so as companies embrace object based surround, which is starting a paradigm shift in the industry. Things, they are a-changin'.

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post #726 of 737 Old 08-08-2014, 04:50 PM
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No it isn't. For many reasons I've already given. I have no desire to change speakers to new ones. And they don't make matching surround speakers.

Krell Evolution 900e x 7

Bose Jewel speakers.

 

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post #727 of 737 Old 08-09-2014, 06:38 AM
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@Dan Hitchman

hey thanks for youre advise. i already sold my dipole/bipole speakers, to replace it with center speaker RC LCR for my surrounds and also get timbre match with my fronts. question, i know the RC LCR is a center channel, if im placing them for my surrounds, which is better position do i need to place them horizontal or vertical? thanks.

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post #728 of 737 Old 08-09-2014, 09:05 AM
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@Dan Hitchman

hey thanks for youre advise. i already sold my dipole/bipole speakers, to replace it with center speaker RC LCR for my surrounds and also get timbre match with my fronts. question, i know the RC LCR is a center channel, if im placing them for my surrounds, which is better position do i need to place them horizontal or vertical? thanks.
Fantastic!

The Energy RC LCR, in actuality, is designed as a vertically aligned monitor that can be used for the left, center, or right channel positions (as well as surrounds). Definitely place them vertically.

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post #729 of 737 Old 08-09-2014, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post
Fantastic!

The Energy RC LCR, in actuality, is designed as a vertically aligned monitor that can be used for the left, center, or right channel positions (as well as surrounds). Definitely place them vertically.
Gotcha! Thanks. I'm getting ready for atmos 5.1.2.
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post #730 of 737 Old 08-09-2014, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by caloyzki View Post
Gotcha! Thanks. I'm getting ready for atmos 5.1.2.
Do you have a line on any particular Atmos capable receiver?

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post #731 of 737 Old 08-09-2014, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post
Do you have a line on any particular Atmos capable receiver?
not at the moment. any receiver that you can recommend? im looking from one of the denon new avr with atmos. but its a little bit pricey. maybe wait for a couple of years to get one.

Energy RC 70 fronts
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Energy RC LCR surrounds
Rythmik LV12R and Mirage Omni 12 subwoofers
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post #732 of 737 Old 08-09-2014, 12:57 PM
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not at the moment. any receiver that you can recommend? im looking from one of the denon new avr with atmos. but its a little bit pricey. maybe wait for a couple of years to get one.
I would wait until next year's models and hopefully they will then have HDMI 2.0 with HDCP 2.2 encryption.

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post #733 of 737 Old 08-18-2014, 05:17 PM
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I'm about to get some bipoles so I will add my opinion to the discussion soon.

I don't know, is RB-41 II even a bipole? It's kind of a weird mix. With a front firing woofer and angled tweeters. It might be perfect for me and my room arrangement though.

Sony KDL-70R550A (passive 3D tv)
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post #734 of 737 Old 08-18-2014, 05:43 PM
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I'm about to get some bipoles so I will add my opinion to the discussion soon.

I don't know, is RS-41 II even a bipole? It's kind of a weird mix. With a front firing woofer and angled tweeters. It might be perfect for me and my room arrangement though.
It's still mostly a dipole. If you're thinking of doing Atmos as some point... not recommended.

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post #735 of 737 Old 08-18-2014, 07:16 PM
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It's still mostly a dipole. If you're thinking of doing Atmos as some point... not recommended.
Probably not for a long while. Now if it doesn't sound great then I'll replace it with a RB. Curious though, I thought dipoles were speakers that fired in 2 directions completely opposite of each other? I thought a bipole is what the Klipsch surrounds are. Angled outward but not completely polar opposite firing.

Plus klipsch claims they are both good at directionality and ambiance. They use some PR lingo for it. I'll find out soon enough.

Sony KDL-70R550A (passive 3D tv)
Denon x4000 (amazing sound correcting software)
Klipsch RF-62IIs (amazing horns)
Klipsch RC-62II (so clear)
Klipsch RS-41IIs (so full)
SVS PC12-NSD + Klipsch RW12d (so boom)
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post #736 of 737 Old 08-18-2014, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Teremei View Post
Probably not for a long while. Now if it doesn't sound great then I'll replace it with a RB. Curious though, I thought dipoles were speakers that fired in 2 directions completely opposite of each other? I thought a bipole is what the Klipsch surrounds are. Angled outward but not completely polar opposite firing.

Plus klipsch claims they are both good at directionality and ambiance. They use some PR lingo for it. I'll find out soon enough.
The horns of the Klipsch's are wired out of phase... a dipole speaker trait. Bipole speakers fire in two directions, but are wired in-phase like a normal speaker. Dipoles, in particular, are not recommended for Atmos and DTS-UHD because they cause phasing problems with these types of object based formats where the ambient presence is embedded in the mix already.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #737 of 737 Old 08-18-2014, 10:42 PM
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I see, well I'm still demoing my RS-41. Not sure if I like stepping down from a 5.25" woofer to a 4" one. Even if it was an entry level. I don't want to derail the thread. But so far it doesn't seem to provide much more ambience, just more clarity. But that's a biproduct of the horn. I might try the RB-51 since that's the closest match to what I had before.

Sony KDL-70R550A (passive 3D tv)
Denon x4000 (amazing sound correcting software)
Klipsch RF-62IIs (amazing horns)
Klipsch RC-62II (so clear)
Klipsch RS-41IIs (so full)
SVS PC12-NSD + Klipsch RW12d (so boom)

Last edited by Teremei; 08-18-2014 at 10:54 PM.
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