The BEST speakers under $10,000 - Page 11 - AVS Forum
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post #301 of 330 Old 11-13-2007, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by win200 View Post

Also, I'd be curious to see how anyone thinks the Dalis compare to these other speakers. I know they're sort of towards the bottom of the price range, and I was thinking maybe they'd simply be outclassed by some of the other options.

I do not want to comment because I might be a bit biased since I am a Dali Helicon owner.
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post #302 of 330 Old 11-13-2007, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rydenfan View Post

If you have any interest in Internet Direct companies I would highly suggest you consider the Salk HT3's. People absolutly rave about these speakers, and you can have them custom built in any wood you like.

http://www.salksound.com/ht3.shtml

Ugh, I wish you hadn't told me that... I looked at those speakers and I think I'm in love. Those are the most gorgeous things I've ever seen. I'm really a sucker for craftsmanship and wood-working and I'd kill to have a pair of those in my house...

Oh, and I'm sure they sound good too.

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post #303 of 330 Old 11-13-2007, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by win200 View Post

Thanks for the caution. Could you give me an example of a similarly-priced speaker that improves on those deficiencies? Thanks!

Among B&M speakers, I recommend Revel. For ID, the Salks certainly get wonderful press.
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post #304 of 330 Old 11-13-2007, 05:27 PM
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Win,

You are going to get a bunch of fan favorites on here. It's a journey to find the speaker that fits you just right. Take your time, bring your own material, take notes and listen to as many as you can. Speakers are like women. There is always one or two or maybe three that just make you quiver inside. In the end if you decide to make a commitment to just one, you pay the price of admission and enjoy them. The nice thing about speakers is you don't lose half your assets if you decide to change to another.

"Man plans, God laughs"
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post #305 of 330 Old 11-13-2007, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

Ugh, I wish you hadn't told me that... I looked at those speakers and I think I'm in love. Those are the most gorgeous things I've ever seen. I'm really a sucker for craftsmanship and wood-working and I'd kill to have a pair of those in my house...

Oh, and I'm sure they sound good too.

They sound amazing! Over at audiocircle there is a whole thread for Salk owners. They are within your budget, and are possibly some of the most beautiful cabinets I have ever seen. And if you can think about it Jim will build it, he is a very cool guy. The HT3's have a great midrange and highs because of their ribbon tweeter yet there is so much bass that a lot of owners run them in a 2 channel rig with no sub.

I was between the HT2's and the Helicon 400's as my final two speaker choices. Had I been able to afford the HT3's that is what I would have gone with. I went with the Dali because it was a close call and Jim is on about a 90 day build time right now. I bet you can find someone who will allow to listen to theirs, it would be worth your time!
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post #306 of 330 Old 11-13-2007, 06:06 PM
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It's good to know, though, that the Dalis were in contention with the Salks. I completely agree with Mozvz that finding a speaker is a subjective journey. For some reason, I listen to a certain speaker and it's like a lightbulb comes on in my head. I had that reaction to the Helicon 400s. Conversely, however, I heard a pair of Aerial Acoustic Model 20Ts run off of Levinson gear, and while they were technically very good, I just didn't have much emotional reaction to them; they left me uninspired. I think there's an emotional component to listening to music that's sort of beyond quantification.

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post #307 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by rydenfan View Post

I do not want to comment because I might be a bit biased since I am a Dali Helicon owner.

If I can ask, what preamp/amp do you use with them? A guy offered me a pair of 800s at a price that's really tough to pass up. I have a Krell pre/pro and a Rotel amp and I'm a little concerned about that gear matching up well with the speakers.

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post #308 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 01:38 PM
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December issue of TAS features PSB Synchrony reviews. Final paragraph says it all in relation to this thread. Short quote:

"The Synchrony Two is the best PSB speaker I've reviewed. How Good? Even if you've allotted up to ten grand on a pair of speakers, you'd be making a serious mistake if you didn't audition this exceptional product."
-----Neil Gader

Also consider the Synchrony Ones and PSB Platinums depending on style.

Strongly second the Thiel 3.6s, 3.7s...and virtually any Vandersteen in the price range...along with Revel.



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post #309 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkeBar View Post

December issue of TAS features PSB Synchrony reviews. Final paragraph says it all in relation to this thread. Short quote:

"The Synchrony Two is the best PSB speaker I've reviewed. How Good? Even if you've allotted up to ten grand on a pair of speakers, you'd be making a serious mistake if you didn't audition this exceptional product."
-----Neil Gader

Also consider the Synchrony Ones and PSB Platinums depending on style.

Strongly second the Thiel 3.6s, 3.7s...and virtually any Vandersteen in the price range...along with Revel.

IMHO the TAS reviews are barely worth the paper they are printed on, because there is a lack of objective measurements (unlike Stereophile). How a product is rated IMHO is going to be based primarily on how much advertising (or other compensation) has passed from a manufacturer to a publication (or its reviewers).

Even Stereophile I look to mostly for the objective measurements, not the reviewer's writeup...which I usually don't even read.

Not saying the Synchrony isn't a great speaker. It might well be, I haven't heard it myself.
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post #310 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by syswei View Post

IMHO the TAS reviews are barely worth the paper they are printed on, because there is a lack of objective measurements (unlike Stereophile). How a product is rated IMHO is going to be based primarily on how much advertising (or other compensation) has passed from a manufacturer to a publication (or its reviewers).

Even Stereophile I look to mostly for the objective measurements, not the reviewer's writeup...which I usually don't even read.

Not saying the Synchrony isn't a great speaker. It might well be, I haven't heard it myself.

I tend towards Stereophile as well, but I do read TAS. I'm not sure I'm so cynical regarding the influence of advertising.

My problem with PSB speakers is that they're the most boring, unimaginative-looking things I've ever seen. I know speakers are about producing sound, but there are so many great speakers out there that I would have a hard time settling on one that I didn't think was attractive. To me, they're a piece of furniture that's prominently featured in my house as well as a functional piece of equipment. I'm still leaning towards the Helicon 800s because I love the sound and I think they're gorgeous.

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post #311 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

If I can ask, what preamp/amp do you use with them? A guy offered me a pair of 800s at a price that's really tough to pass up. I have a Krell pre/pro and a Rotel amp and I'm a little concerned about that gear matching up well with the speakers.

I am now running them with the Cary Cinema 11 pre/pro and the Cary Cinema 5 amp.

Do not be concerned at all about your gear. I also ran them on an Emotiva MPS-1 amp which is very similar to the Rotel 1095 and they sound great! If you are happy with the price and you already know you are happy with the look and sound, it sounds like a no-brainer to me...
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post #312 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 07:15 PM
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I've always thought Def Techs are what Bose owners trade up to when they build a man cave and WAF is no longer as issue.
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post #313 of 330 Old 11-14-2007, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

I tend towards Stereophile as well, but I do read TAS. I'm not sure I'm so cynical regarding the influence of advertising.

My problem with PSB speakers is that they're the most boring, unimaginative-looking things I've ever seen. I know speakers are about producing sound, but there are so many great speakers out there that I would have a hard time settling on one that I didn't think was attractive. To me, they're a piece of furniture that's prominently featured in my house as well as a functional piece of equipment. I'm still leaning towards the Helicon 800s because I love the sound and I think they're gorgeous.

I'm not seeing at all how the Helicons are better looking in any way than the Synchronies. Not that the Synchronies are groundbreaking, but just not seeing it with the Helicons.

As for the review, yeah, the conclusion was pretty trite, so it could be valid or it could have been one of those "insert brand name/model here" reviews.

John
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post #314 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 05:21 AM
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I will agree that my personal preference is for reviews which supply hard technical data. Even with such however, reviews should always taken with a grain of salt until the individual can verify with the ear. Unlike many here though, I don't have nearly the level of suspicion regarding these matters. These are after all audiophile products in their design. That is the reason the product is being reviewed in the first place. [Edit] This in itself, of course, is certainly no guarantee of anything beyond the presumed label/status of 'audiophile'. [Edit]

The jaded expectation is that advertising dictates what sounds good to a reviewer regardless of actual listening experience. I find such conspiracy/paranoia humorous at best. The review pages rather are filled with specific examples of what the listener heard and why it was distinctive/pleasant or pedestrian/unpleasant to that particular reviewers ears and sensibilities. Source music is most always given, many times down to exact passages. Comparisons with other reference equipment is also routinely made. I don't know how much more transparent the entire operation could be short of every reader being in the listening room contemporaneously ? And in the end it is always left to the prospective buyer to verify for himself/herself.

Caveat Emptor, as always... but also informed as a buyer doesn't hurt.



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post #315 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 06:00 AM
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has anyone here listened to the Gershman Acoustics Avante Garde?
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post #316 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkeBar View Post

The review pages rather are filled with specific examples of what the listener heard and why it was distinctive/pleasant or pedestrian/unpleasant. Source music is always given, many times down to exact passages. Comparisons with other reference equipment is also routinely made. I don't know how much more transparent the entire operation could be short of every reader being in the listening room contemporaneously?

Just because examples and reasons are given does not mean that the resulting descriptions/conclusions were fundamentally honest, as opposed to being influenced to one degree or another by monetary issues or other "favors".

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkeBar View Post

And in the end it is always left to the prospective buyer to verify for himself/herself. Caveat Emptor, as always... but also informed as a buyer doesn't hurt.

Agreed.

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These are after all audiophile products in their design. That is the reason the product is being reviewed in the first place.

Yes, we can usually presume at least a moderate level of quality. But the differences that the reviewers find between products of similar design/price are to me suspect and potentially not objective. Using reviews that lack hard data to pick between speakers of similar design and price I think would be a bad idea; as you said, the final arbiter should be the buyer's ears, not some reviewer's.
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post #317 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Alimentall View Post

I'm not seeing at all how the Helicons are better looking in any way than the Synchronies. Not that the Synchronies are groundbreaking, but just not seeing it with the Helicons.

I think this falls into a category even more subjective than sound. To be fair, however, I've never seen the PSBs in person, so I'm basing that opinion off of pictures from their website. At this point, however, it's irrelevant, as I've committed to buy a pair of Helicon 800s. I figured, go with what I know I like.

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post #318 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

I think this falls into a category even more subjective than sound. To be fair, however, I've never seen the PSBs in person, so I'm basing that opinion off of pictures from their website. At this point, however, it's irrelevant, as I've committed to buy a pair of Helicon 800s. I figured, go with what I know I like.

You will be very happy! I am suprised how much low bass extension my 400's have, so I can only imagine what the 800's sound like. Are you going to be running them with a sub? Did you get the C200 Center? Did you go for the cherry or the rosenut?
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post #319 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 11:24 AM
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A ways back a poster suggested the Martin Logan Summits.

This is a great speaker. I owned one of the first pairs on the east coast!

The only knock I had was if you stood up and moved around in the room (party perhaps) you are doomed.

However when I watch a movie or listen to music I'm sitting down in the SPOT chair or lying down on the couch...

There are many great choices in this range (and some with MSRP out of the range that could be had for close to the OP's range )

Some I sell and some I don't:

Klipsch La Scalla
Focal 1037Be
Dynaudio Contour S5.4
Dynaudio Confidence C1
Dali Helicon 400/800
Dali Euphonia MS4
Thiel CS 3.7
Martin Logan Summit
Gallo Ref 3.1 (less than half the price limit - NO I DO NOT SELL THIS MODEL)
RBH T1/T2 (T2 is a T1 with a sub - NO I DO NOT SELL THIS MODEL)


PSB T8

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post #320 of 330 Old 11-15-2007, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rydenfan View Post

You will be very happy! I am suprised how much low bass extension my 400's have, so I can only imagine what the 800's sound like. Are you going to be running them with a sub? Did you get the C200 Center? Did you go for the cherry or the rosenut?

They're cherry, although I would have preferred rosenut. It's not a big deal to me, especially at the price they were offered to me at. I don't have a sub yet, although I'll pick one up at some point in the next year. I'm going to be moving in the next few months, so I'm going to wait until I know what kind of space I have before I buy any more big boxes. I'm running stereo right now, so no center. I'm going to buy two more stereo amps sometime soon and run six-channel off my Krell, and I'll pick up a center at that point. Again, it'll depend upon space. Surround sound is great, but it can be tricky to configure if you don't have a good space for it. In college, I configured some pretty bizarre surround sound setups in my dorm rooms. I'm very glad to hear about the bass extension; should lessen my yearning for a sub for movies.

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post #321 of 330 Old 01-05-2008, 12:53 AM
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Have anyone listen to the RBH T2 ?
How would it compare to the speakers listed above like Dali Euphonia MS4, Thiel CS 3.7, Dynaudio Contour S5.4, Focal 1037Be ?

I currently just have the Thiel 3.6, and have been thinking of upgrading. I am looking for any opinion on the speakers I listed above...
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post #322 of 330 Old 01-05-2008, 04:47 AM
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What about Seas Thor towers? I've heard they're really good despite their relatively low price.
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post #323 of 330 Old 01-05-2008, 06:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve. View Post

I've always thought Def Techs are what Bose owners trade up to when they build a man cave and WAF is no longer as issue.

I went thru the whole line of Definitive Tech speakers back when I first got into H/T and IMO they are fantastic for that and sound OK for music but lack the accuracy and detail that I was looking for when I switched over to mainly music. The wife misses them tho. She said they had a big full, rocking sound she misses. What does she know?
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post #324 of 330 Old 01-15-2008, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by otk View Post

whatever you do, stay away from that Tyler Acoustics trash


Have you actually heard or owned a Tyler Acoustics product?...

Why do you call them "trash"?...Did you have a bad experience?

I could think of a number of speakers that could be called "trash", but not Tylers.
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post #325 of 330 Old 01-15-2008, 12:33 PM
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check out GamuT L5. Very good as well.
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post #326 of 330 Old 01-17-2008, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bqv1910 View Post

Have anyone listen to the RBH T2 ?
How would it compare to the speakers listed above like Dali Euphonia MS4, Thiel CS 3.7, Dynaudio Contour S5.4, Focal 1037Be ?

I currently just have the Thiel 3.6, and have been thinking of upgrading. I am looking for any opinion on the speakers I listed above...


I prefer to bass, mid bass and sound stage of the RBH vs. DALI MS4, however the high end and upper mid range on the DALI would win out there. So if you systems was split between home theater and two channel I'd go RBH.

HOWEVER the Thiel CS3.7 blows the list away (note I've not listened to the Focal 1037Be). This speaker will also have sharp increase in MSRP in the very near future. PM me if you need more info.

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post #327 of 330 Old 01-27-2008, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Hawk_Eye View Post

Hello.

I am getting tired of my existing Arcam/Paradigm Studio v3 setup. I am looking to build a new 2ch system for music only.

Unlike my previous system purchase, I want to spend sometime on researching before I purchase the new system (and I am willing to spend much more than my existing setup). I listen to different types of music and my existing setup sounds flat when it comes to reproducing a large orchestra or live concert music. I feel that those types of music are hard to capture with realism by average loud speakers. I am looking for speakers that can handle orchestra and live music well.

My maximum budget for speakers are ~$10,000 (cheaper the better of course). Feel free to make suggestion. Please don't bash other person's suggestions.

Thank you!

My vote would be BnW 803d, and I think you will be hard pressed to hear anything better up to 10k. They need plenty O clean power to reallly do their thing, so an upgrade to the amp may be required to really get the most from these speakers.
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post #328 of 330 Old 01-28-2008, 03:01 PM
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I'd throw Sonus Faber Cremona into the mix here, I don't think they have been mentioned yet.
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post #329 of 330 Old 01-29-2008, 10:42 AM
 
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Check out PMC IB1's.. Retail for about 9k a pair... Do an A/B test with anything in that range and they can't beat. You will doing yourself a favor by taking the time to hear them.
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post #330 of 330 Old 01-29-2008, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nagthragarthoth View Post

Check out PMC IB1's.. Retail for about 9k a pair... Do an A/B test with anything in that range and they can't beat. You will doing yourself a favor by taking the time to hear them.

I think he might be a dealer/troll. This is like the third different thread today he has recommended these speakers.
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