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post #6391 of 6403 Old 08-28-2014, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Dawn Gordon View Post
TRIAD SPEAKER MATCHING

Hi everyone,

I've been a Triad dealer for ten years, and have enjoyed it immensely because Triad does what no other speaker manufacturer can. They build speakers to order, paint them to match your d├ęcor or wall color, offer gorgeous veneers and gloss finishes, and even custom size or custom engineer a speaker for your specific requirements. Thanks to great design and engineering, Triad speakers have exceptional sound quality. In addition, unlike most mass-market brands, virtually all of Triad's models are manufactured right here in the USA in Portland, Oregon.

The only problem (if you actually consider this a problem) is that Triad has well over 100 different products to choose from -- spanning the very affordable to the ultra-high end. With this many models it can be difficult to figure out which Triad speakers match one another. In other words, how do you know which surround or effects speaker to use with a specific LCR? Or how to choose a subwoofer that would work best in a given system? Like pairing your meal with a compatible wine, it's not always an easy task.

I've spent some time designing a chart that will help you choose a Triad speaker system that is sonically matched. Keep in mind that your room plays a big role in the speakers you choose. For example, as common sense would dictate, don't expect a small Triad Mini speaker to fill a 10,000 cubic foot room. Conversely, Platinum speakers in the master bath is probably overkill. In any case, I'll be updating the chart very soon to include Triad's new Atmos models in the coming weeks and months.

I would like to thank Bruce Franklin (Triad's Director of North American Sales) for giving me the permission and encouragement to go ahead with this project. A special thanks goes to Sales Coordinator Bill Ruark. None of this could have been accomplished without him. The man is a walking Triad Encyclopedia, and he's very, very knowledgeable about audio theory and room acoustics. I've learned a tremendous amount from him and hope to continue to learn more.

If you have any questions please don't hesitate to contact me at my email address below. I'll be more than happy to help you select a Triad system based on your specific needs.

Dawn Gordon Luks
Egret Electronics
dawn@egretelectronics.com

Hi. I like your chart, but my only criticism would be that your list is mostly matching the Triad speaker names and not taking into account the various speaker options for subwoofer, surround, etc.

For instance, I have a system in my family room that is well matched with an OnWall Mini LCR 3.0 sized to fit perfectly under an LED TV for my main speakers, but I've installed InWall Bronze Surround speakers on the sides and an InRoom Mini Sub. In your chart, you only recommend direct radiating surrounds. I prefer dipoles and would select the InWall Bronze Surround as the smallest dipole surround speaker available. Also, you only list the Omni Subs and the Bronze Slim Sub with these main speakers. I prefer and selected the slightly higher quality "InRoom Mini Sub" which is modeled after the Mini, Bronze, Silver, Gold, and Platinum InRoom subs with a separate DSP Rack Amp.

I realize there are virtually thousands of combinations, but that is the beauty of Triad speakers. I think your options need to be a little more broad to include speakers from all product categories. Perhaps instead of making a single row for each main speaker, you could make broader groupings to show all speakers that match a group of front speakers. Clearly the Mini line is the lowest level followed by Bronze, Silver, Gold, and Platinum.

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post #6392 of 6403 Old 08-29-2014, 07:28 AM
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Hi. I like your chart, but my only criticism would be that your list is mostly matching the Triad speaker names and not taking into account the various speaker options for subwoofer, surround, etc.

For instance, I have a system in my family room that is well matched with an OnWall Mini LCR 3.0 sized to fit perfectly under an LED TV for my main speakers, but I've installed InWall Bronze Surround speakers on the sides and an InRoom Mini Sub. In your chart, you only recommend direct radiating surrounds. I prefer dipoles and would select the InWall Bronze Surround as the smallest dipole surround speaker available. Also, you only list the Omni Subs and the Bronze Slim Sub with these main speakers. I prefer and selected the slightly higher quality "InRoom Mini Sub" which is modeled after the Mini, Bronze, Silver, Gold, and Platinum InRoom subs with a separate DSP Rack Amp.

I realize there are virtually thousands of combinations, but that is the beauty of Triad speakers. I think your options need to be a little more broad to include speakers from all product categories. Perhaps instead of making a single row for each main speaker, you could make broader groupings to show all speakers that match a group of front speakers. Clearly the Mini line is the lowest level followed by Bronze, Silver, Gold, and Platinum.
Scott,

I understand what you're saying. There are hundreds of combinations possible in the Triad universe. Like playing with legos when you were a little kid, you can install almost any Triad speaker in just about any combination. But please keep in mind that the chart is designed to illustrate which Triad speakers match or sound similar to other Triad speakers. If we were make the selections broader then it would defeat the whole purpose of the chart.

For example, can you use Silver LCRs with Bronze surrounds, of course. But Silver surrounds would be a better match. Speaking of surrounds, Triad recommends that dipole Surrounds only be used with 5.1 systems, or when you have a very narrow or small room. Again, you may prefer dipoles and wish to use them in larger venues, but it's not what Triad is recommending -- especially with the new Dolby Atmos format.

As far as subs go, I do have an asterisk next to all the sub recommendations that goes with the key at the bottom of the document. It states: " Subwoofer listings are general recommendations. Room size and room configuration will dictate the type and number of subwoofers needed."

I will be updating the chart with Atmos models as soon as I have more info from Triad.

Authorized Dealer Sales: Triad Speakers, NHT, Marantz, Denon, JVC, Stewart Filmscreen, Screen innovations, Panamorph and Control4.

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post #6393 of 6403 Old 08-29-2014, 09:12 AM
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Speaking of surrounds, Triad recommends that dipole Surrounds only be used with 5.1 systems, or when you have a very narrow or small room. Again, you may prefer dipoles and wish to use them in larger venues, but it's not what Triad is recommending -- especially with the new Dolby Atmos format.
That's an interesting comment because I have my four InWall Silver Surrounds installed in the ceiling on the sides and back (can't install in the side walls). I've been contemplating upgrading these to InCeiling Gold Mini Monitors which would hit my seating area perfectly and provide more direct and powerful sound.

My room is 3,000 sq feet and I have InRoom Gold Monitors across the front and InRoom Gold Mini Monitors for the height channels. I also have 4 Silver Subs.

The benefit of going to Gold Mini Monitors for the surrounds is that all speakers would match with the Scan Speak drivers. Surrounds would be about 10 feet from the listing position. Fronts are about 12-13 feet.

Any thoughts of moving from dipole to direct? I know a number of Triad users here have multiple Gold or Silver Surrounds on the sides and back of their theaters.

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post #6394 of 6403 Old 08-29-2014, 01:20 PM
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The InCeiling Gold Mini-Monitors would be an excellent match for your Gold Monitors.

I have a similar setup in my great room, except that my rears (IR Gold MiniMonitors) are in a bookcase at the back of the room. Love my Gold Monitors. :-)
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post #6395 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 02:52 PM
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I will be moving forward with Gold Mini Monitors for the side surround and back surround speakers. I was thinking of picking up Atmos ceiling speakers at the same time. Based on what I read about the ceiling speakers, I almost think that the InWall Silver Mini Monitors mounted on the ceiling may be the best bet for the height channels. These are supposed to have very wide dispersion.





Or course, the other option would be going with Triad InCeiling Rounds.

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post #6396 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 02:54 PM
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I will be moving forward with Gold Mini Monitors for the side surround and back surround speakers. I was thinking of picking up Atmos ceiling speakers at the same time. Based on what I read about the ceiling speakers, I almost think that the InWall Silver Mini Monitors mounted on the ceiling may be the best bet for directional sound. These are supposed to have very wide dispersion.


No one seems to be able to hold on for a couple weeks to find out the exact installation needs of Dolby Atmos, and get an idea of what Triad (and other manufacturers) are debuting that will comply more closely to those requirements.

Patience as a virtue seems to have been lost somewhere along the way.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #6397 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 03:05 PM
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Here's Triad CEDIA 2014 advertisement. I'm not sure you're going to see much more than the Bronze Atmos speakers, although these R series are interesting.











How about some Atmos Ceiling Speakers for those of us who can put speakers in the ceiling!! The reason why I'm not holding my breath is this press release:


Quote:
Triad will display the Bronze LR-H at its CEDIA Expo 2014 booth (#448). The Dolby booth (#180) will include two live presentations of Triad speakers, one using four InRoom Bronze LR-H (built-in Dolby enabled upward firing speakers), and another using four Triad InCeiling Bronze/8 LCRs for the overhead sound.

They are utilizing four Triad InCeiling Bronze/8 LCRs for overhead in another booth. If they had new InCeiling Atmos speakers, wouldn't they demo those?

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post #6398 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 04:45 PM
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$1,000 a pop! Ouch. For some those Pioneer Atmos "enabled" speakers are going to be a bit more tempting.
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Here's Triad CEDIA 2014 advertisement. I'm not sure you're going to see much more than the Bronze Atmos speakers, although these R series are interesting.











How about some Atmos Ceiling Speakers for those of us who can put speakers in the ceiling!! The reason why I'm not holding my breath is this press release:





They are utilizing four Triad InCeiling Bronze/8 LCRs for overhead in another booth. If they had new InCeiling Atmos speakers, wouldn't they demo those?
That's a good catch. I hadn't see that press release verbiage.

Previously I was hopeful since they spoke of comparing reflected sound versus ceiling mounted speakers. I thought the ceiling speakers might also be something new.

Now we know what they meant by ceiling mounted speakers.

But here's the thing: Triad doesn't tend to cut corners on specs. If they are implying that the in-ceiling bronze speakers meet the dolby spec, that is very interesting.....
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post #6399 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 05:10 PM
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That's a good catch. I hadn't see that press release verbiage.

Previously I was hopeful since they spoke of comparing reflected sound versus ceiling mounted speakers. I thought the ceiling speakers might also be something new.

Now we know what they meant by ceiling mounted speakers.

But here's the thing: Triad doesn't tend to cut corners on specs. If they are implying that the in-ceiling bronze speakers meet the Dolby spec, that is very interesting.....
The overhead monopole speakers, compared to the wall surrounds, should have a 90 degree dispersion pattern or greater according to Dolby's own white papers. Timbre matching is also highly recommended. We may get more details by CEDIA.

And irrespective of what some speaker manufacturers are saying, the overhead and wall surrounds are just as important as the fronts. They can carry sound effects of tremendous frequency range as well as dialog. Atmos ain't your average surround format, when mixed correctly.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!

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post #6400 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 05:14 PM
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The overhead monopole speakers, at the very least, should have a 90 degree dispersion pattern or greater according to Dolby's own white papers. Timbre matching is also highly recommended.
The in room LCR don't have that. Horizontally, yes, but not vertically, because of their M-T-M configuration. This is intentional. However, the in ceiling LCR are not M-T-M along a single plane, so maybe they meet that Dolby spec?
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post #6401 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 05:16 PM
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The in room LCR don't have that. Horizontally, yes, but not vertically, because of their M-T-M configuration. This is intentional. However, the in ceiling LCR are not M-T-M along a single plane, so maybe they meet that Dolby spec?
Hard to say how much design compromise Dolby is willing to accept in order for the speaker to be certified as Atmos friendly. Hopefully, it's not as loose as THX.

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post #6402 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 07:12 PM
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The majority of Triad's InCeiling speakers have a dispersion of 60 degrees vertical, which consists of from directly underneath, to 30 degrees down from the ceiling surface. Although the speakers are placed at a 45 degree angle, they are inset in the ceiling and are partially blocked by the baffle which comprises the 2nd angle of the speaker. Given this, I think any of their InCeiling drivers can be expected to have close to a 90 degree horizontal disperson and could be used for Atmos.


Here is their own quote from the FAQs:


Quote:
InCeiling speakers have their drivers on a 45 degree angled baffle, which should be generally aimed at the listening area. The useable vertical dispersion angle is approximately 60 degrees. That is, they can be used from directly underneath, to 30 degrees down from the ceiling surface. The rule of thumb is if you can see the tweeter, you are within desirable parameters. To be more precise, use the InCeiling Speaker Distance Calculator in the Dealer Download section of our website.

I think that any of their InCeiling models, when properly placed in relation to the seating area, would be good Atmos in ceiling speakers. After all, shouldn't they be directional so that the listener can pinpoint the sound to above?

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post #6403 of 6403 Old Yesterday, 07:43 PM
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The majority of Triad's InCeiling speakers have a dispersion of 60 degrees vertical, which consists of from directly underneath, to 30 degrees down from the ceiling surface. Although the speakers are placed at a 45 degree angle, they are inset in the ceiling and are partially blocked by the baffle which comprises the 2nd angle of the speaker. Given this, I think any of their InCeiling drivers can be expected to have close to a 90 degree horizontal disperson and could be used for Atmos.


Here is their own quote from the FAQs:





I think that any of their InCeiling models, when properly placed in relation to the seating area, would be good Atmos in ceiling speakers. After all, shouldn't they be directional so that the listener can pinpoint the sound to above?
The trick is getting a happy medium of diffusion and localization,especially with the top surrounds. There are a number of Atmos mixes that have dialog coming from the ceiling speakers, not just effects and some music spill to heighten the soundstage.

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