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post #631 of 6437 Old 01-07-2009, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by snweiler View Post

Thanks for the ultra fast response. I'll have to double check with my dealer, but I'm sure he said $2700 each yesterday. Could that have been for the veneer finish?

What is the price for the In wall Gold 4s?

Thanks,
Steve

I am giving you U.S. pricing. Are you in Canada?? In veneer, the InRoom Gold Center and InRoom Gold LCR is $2,500 each...with veneered Pedestals at $530 each.

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post #632 of 6437 Old 01-07-2009, 05:57 PM
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Oh, and there is no InWall Gold/4 LCR. Did you mean Surround?

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post #633 of 6437 Old 01-07-2009, 06:39 PM
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I live in Oregon. Not far from Triad factory actually.

I meant the InWall Gold/4 surrounds.

Steve
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post #634 of 6437 Old 01-08-2009, 04:55 AM
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Steve, Gold Surrounds are $1,600 each.

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post #635 of 6437 Old 01-14-2009, 11:07 AM
 
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Paul,


Just got a couple of questions for you:

How is the development of the Platinum Monitor going?

What price will it be and will there be a matching center?

Best Regards,


Paddy
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post #636 of 6437 Old 01-14-2009, 11:46 AM
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We are in the middle of heated discussion on the proposed Platinum Monitor, and I welcome input from everyone here on this subject. Our proposed driver vendors' viability may not be good, so we are looking at other sources, as a backup. (This gets harder than you can imagine in these tough times.) We always work with top driver manufacturers to develop drivers to our spec. Few are "off-the-shelf."

Our engineering department has proposed, based upon custom versions of drivers available to us, that the Platinum Monitor will be 2-3 dB more sensitive than the Platinum LCR, and it will be able to cover a 15,000 cubic foot room, or crush people to death in a 5,000 cubic foot room. We had considered ribbons or line source for the advantage of better "throw" to the back rows, but we are back to a single monster, high-sensitivity tweeter and an array of mids, with two or more midbass drivers. It will be designed for use with a subwoofer, in order to keep sensitivity high, probably 96 dB or higher. This speaker, based upon our dealer requests, must sound as good as anything, and play very loud, comfortably.

90% of installations with speakers such as this front speaker ($15,000 to $20,000 each) have the speakers hidden behind fabric or built into a false wall, as is the case with our Platinum LCR, JBL Synthesis, Genelec, etc. Rarely are the speakers standing out in the room. And rarely is a screen used where a low horizontal center is used. Fully half of these installations are with big acoustically transparent screens, with that number increasing all the time. Center channel speakers are a big compromise. I would expect to sell vertically-aligned speakers for the center, behind a screen. I see the traditional horizontal center under a screen...at least in ultra-high-end systems...disappearing.

Based on that, we'll probably not do a center right away, and we will not do a fancy, audio-jewelry (and more costly) freestanding version. We'll probably introduce a custom version first, and some sort of compatible surround next. New subs are still a few months off, but we're fooling with some "big stuff" I can't talk about yet.

I could use feedback, but please keep in mind that not quite 2% of our business is retail, and custom is almost all our business. And don't have unlimited engineering bandwidth, so we have to pick and choose our projects wisely.

Thoughts?

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post #637 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Scarpelli View Post

We are in the middle of heated discussion on the proposed Platinum Monitor, and I welcome input from everyone here on this subject. Our proposed driver vendors' viability may not be good, so we are looking at other sources, as a backup. (This gets harder than you can imagine in these tough times.) We always work with top driver manufacturers to develop drivers to our spec. Few are "off-the-shelf."

Our engineering department has proposed, based upon custom versions of drivers available to us, that the Platinum Monitor will be 2-3 dB more sensitive than the Platinum LCR, and it will be able to cover a 15,000 cubic foot room, or crush people to death in a 5,000 cubic foot room. We had considered ribbons or line source for the advantage of better "throw" to the back rows, but we are back to a single monster, high-sensitivity tweeter and an array of mids, with two or more midbass drivers. It will be designed for use with a subwoofer, in order to keep sensitivity high, probably 96 dB or higher. This speaker, based upon our dealer requests, must sound as good as anything, and play very loud, comfortably.

90% of installations with speakers such as this front speaker ($15,000 to $20,000 each) have the speakers hidden behind fabric or built into a false wall, as is the case with our Platinum LCR, JBL Synthesis, Genelec, etc. Rarely are the speakers standing out in the room. And rarely is a screen used where a low horizontal center is used. Fully half of these installations are with big acoustically transparent screens, with that number increasing all the time. Center channel speakers are a big compromise. I would expect to sell vertically-aligned speakers for the center, behind a screen. I see the traditional horizontal center under a screen...at least in ultra-high-end systems...disappearing.

Based on that, we'll probably not do a center right away, and we will not do a fancy, audio-jewelry (and more costly) freestanding version. We'll probably introduce a custom version first, and some sort of compatible surround next. New subs are still a few months off, but we're fooling with some "big stuff" I can't talk about yet.

I could use feedback, but please keep in mind that not quite 2% of our business is retail, and custom is almost all our business. And don't have unlimited engineering bandwidth, so we have to pick and choose our projects wisely.

Thoughts?

Okay, I just quoted myself. Weird. If any of you have feedback, I would appreciate it. We're having a big Platinum Monitor meeting tomorrow, and I could use some comments from the field. Tony? Anybody? Bueller??

Also, another minor announcement. a few days ago, we launched our new $3,000 3-in-one LCR for use with flat screen TVs, the OnWall Mini LCR 3.0. Yesterday, we launched the custom sizing option for this speaker, with widths available from 42" to (at this time) 66" wide, in quarter-inch increments, at a $350 extra charge. When a custom size is done, the left and right LCRs are moved all the way to the left and right; we don't just add extra box. The drivers are all custom Seas drivers, similar to what's in the Gold LCR.

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post #638 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 09:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Okay, I just quoted myself. Weird. If any of you have feedback, I would appreciate it. We're having a big Platinum Monitor meeting tomorrow, and I could use some comments from the field. Tony? Anybody? Bueller??

I don't see the need for a horizontal Platinum center. As you say, they are almost always behind a screen and that is how i would propose the installation to a client. Now, I just need a few more of those clients!

Tony G. Cordova, President
Showplace Oklahoma - Showplace Theater & Sound
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post #639 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by ttowntony View Post

I don't see the need for a horizontal Platinum center. As you say, they are almost always behind a screen and that is how i would propose the installation to a client. Now, I just need a few more of those clients!

Thanks, Tony, good input. As much as we'd like to build an InRoom, an InWall, a center, etc., we have limited engineering resources. I think most gonzo installations now use three vertical LCRs through an acoustically-transparent screen. I still don't understand the $300,000 home theater installations that use a fixed screen with a horizontal speaker beneath the screen. I see this all the time, even with tiered seating so the center is aimed at some listeners' ankles. AT screens, especially weaves, have really gotten good.

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post #640 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by ttowntony View Post

I don't see the need for a horizontal Platinum center. As you say, they are almost always behind a screen and that is how i would propose the installation to a client. Now, I just need a few more of those clients!

I've seen a few installations with a platinum horizontal center. May not be the popular choice but I feel there is still a need and I wouldn't sugest eliminating it from Triads offering.


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post #641 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 10:11 AM
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I've seen a few installations with a platinum horizontal center. May not be the popular choice but I feel there is still a need and I wouldn't sugest eliminating it from Triads offering.

We have a $7,000 Platinum Center that matches the Platinum LCR, and at that level, we see some sales. I would expect to fill orders for less than a half dozen $15,000 centers a year, so the massive development time doesn't pass the ROI. It's not off the list, but it's far down the list.

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post #642 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Paul Scarpelli View Post

We have a $7,000 Platinum Center that matches the Platinum LCR, and at that level, we see some sales. I would expect to fill orders for less than a half dozen $15,000 centers a year, so the massive development time doesn't pass the ROI. It's not off the list, but it's far down the list.

Got it.. So the Platinum center will match with the Platinum monitors if a customer decides on a horizontal center?


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post #643 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 10:37 AM
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Got it.. So the Platinum center will match with the Platinum monitors if a customer decides on a horizontal center?

The fact that it's a horizontal speaker means, technically, that even if it were identical, it wouldn't perfectly match. Horizontal centers are to be used as a compromise when a fixed screen is used. But, the good news is, the InRoom Platinum Center is a flamethrower and it will keep up with the new Platinum Monitors up to the last 4 dB of output, so it will work as well as anything. And at least the midrange and tweeter are vertically-aligned for better performance. If we had 50 engineers, this wouldn't be an issue; or if we had a big parent company to fall back on. It's just us here.

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post #644 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Paul Scarpelli View Post

The fact that it's a horizontal speaker means, technically, that even if it were identical, it wouldn't perfectly match. Horizontal centers are to be used as a compromise when a fixed screen is used. But, the good news is, the InRoom Platinum Center is a flamethrower and it will keep up with the new Platinum Monitors up to the last 4 dB of output, so it will work as well as anything. And at least the midrange and tweeter are vertically-aligned for better performance. If we had 50 engineers, this wouldn't be an issue; or if we had a big parent company to fall back on. It's just us here.

While we are on the subject.. In the future I may go with speakers behind the screen installation. Do I have any trade up options for my current LCR gold center channel speaker?


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post #645 of 6437 Old 01-21-2009, 11:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Do I have any trade up options for my current LCR gold center channel speaker?

That is up to your dealer. But, some do as do I, give my clients the ability to trade-up within a year. We make it as painless as possible, though.

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post #646 of 6437 Old 01-28-2009, 09:31 PM
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Paul,

I just picked up a used set of Gold LCRs and could use some setup help, such as minimum distances from front and side walls, etc. The information in the "manual" is very sparse.

Now to start saving for the Gold inwall surrounds and a pair of inwall Silver minimonitors for the rears!

Thanks,
Steve
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post #647 of 6437 Old 01-29-2009, 12:19 PM
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If your seats are close to the back of the room, you may want to think about the Silver Surrounds rather than the Silver Minimonitors.

CJ

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post #648 of 6437 Old 01-29-2009, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by snweiler View Post

Paul,

I just picked up a used set of Gold LCRs and could use some setup help, such as minimum distances from front and side walls, etc. The information in the "manual" is very sparse.

Now to start saving for the Gold inwall surrounds and a pair of inwall Silver minimonitors for the rears!

Thanks,
Steve

Newer Gold LCRs or the older ones with the horn? Either way, these speakers are like any other LCRs as far as placement near side and back walls. The best thing to do is to use treatments behind and adjacent to the speakers to fool them into thinking there are no walls there. (Speakers are really stupid.) The closer to a side wall, the more you need acoustical panels. To determine where they go, do the "mirror trick."

CJ may be right about the surrounds. It depends upon the room, but it's good advice.

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post #649 of 6437 Old 02-04-2009, 08:06 AM
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Paul or anyone who can provide an opinion;

Do you see an issue with using a center channel stand for the Triad GOLD LCR Center channel speaker with a stand with the same diameter (width and depth) as the speaker itself? Stand is solid all around with no openings. It's been suggested this could cause the speaker to resonate since it has a solid face in front to the floor. I have the stand provided by Triad but it's too tall to install under my screen. See pic below to get a visual...



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post #650 of 6437 Old 02-04-2009, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by adidino View Post

Paul or anyone who can provide an opinion;

Do you see an issue with using a center channel stand for the Triad GOLD LCR Center channel speaker with a stand with the same diameter (width and depth) as the speaker itself? Stand is solid all around with no openings. It's been suggested this could cause the speaker to resonate since it has a solid face in front to the floor. I have the stand provided by Triad but it's too tall to install under my screen. See pic below to get a visual...

I would think there is an opening or hole that would allow that stand to be filled with foam, sand, cat litter, or some other damping substance. If there is, it'll work fine. Look at the back or bottom to see if there's a hole, door, etc. If not, you may want to make a hole in the back big enough to stuff the stand with open-cell upholstery foam (get scraps for dirt cheap), or sand or cat litter (fresh litter works best ). You may also want to prop the front of the InRoom Gold Center up a few degrees to put listeners on-axis.

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post #651 of 6437 Old 02-04-2009, 11:00 AM
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Thanks Paul. There is an opening for me to fill it with sand. The stand weighs about 25lbs on it's own. As for angle, the stand is 1 inch taller in front vs the rear which gives it some upward angle. My biggest concen is the fact that it's not an open design like most stands. It's just a box. Will that cause any diffraction since it's just solid wall from the tweeter down to the floor.

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I would think there is an opening or hole that would allow that stand to be filled with foam, sand, cat litter, or some other damping substance. If there is, it'll work fine. Look at the back or bottom to see if there's a hole, door, etc. If not, you may want to make a hole in the back big enough to stuff the stand with open-cell upholstery foam (get scraps for dirt cheap), or sand or cat litter (fresh litter works best ). You may also want to prop the front of the InRoom Gold Center up a few degrees to put listeners on-axis.



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post #652 of 6437 Old 02-04-2009, 11:06 AM
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Thanks Paul. There is an opening for me to fill it with sand. The stand weighs about 25lbs on it's own. As for angle, the stand is 1 inch taller in front vs the rear which gives it some upward angle. My biggest concen is the fact that it's not an open design like most stands. It's just a box. Will that cause any diffraction since it's just solid wall from the tweeter down to the floor.

I wouldn't be concerned about the bulk of the stand. The speaker will be in open space on the other three sides.

Also, if the opening is big enough to stuff foam remnants inside, that will work as well as sand or (God forbid) lead shot. There are some real whackos out there that insist a speaker stand must be packed with an element that has the density of a black hole, or the weight of one of Oprah's thighs. Ignore them. Foam, clean sand, or cat litter. It's amusing that the biggest zealots for lead shot in stands often have awful sounding rooms that mitigate the material choice for filling a stand. The difference is akin to one grain of salt added to a gallon of soup. (Flame suit on...)

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post #653 of 6437 Old 02-04-2009, 07:37 PM
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Tim, thanks for the great drawing. Because of the narrow spacing of your fronts (because of the fireplace), side surrounds are mandatory, or you'll have imaging like you're in a long hallway. And because of the size of the room and your seating, you can actually use direct-radiating surrounds. I would do four InCeiling Silver/6 Omni speakers for surrounds, at $550 each. That is within your budget, I assume. Your Paradigms are nice speakers, and they'll work well for now...at least.

Send me a PM and tell me where you are, and I'll try to help with the dealer coordination by getting my rep involved. I seem to be able to get their attention. And because we have almost no retail dealers, a demo is hard to come by. But read Cajun_Mike's comments on buying Triad without a demo. If the most appropriate Triad products are selected and the installation isn't botched, the results are usually better than anticipated.
Paul,
I wasn't able to make my home theater purchase last year, but am looking back into it this year. I just wanted to check back with you and see if the Silver/8 Omni's (I see that the silver/6 has been replaced) were still what you would suggest for the surrounds in my room. I don't know if Triad has anything new in that area that I would want to consider. Can you just take a quick look and make sure that is still the direction I would wan to go in. The other option I was considering would be either all bronze/silver/4 surrounds or a combination of the surrounds on the sides and the omni's for the rear, however, you felt the Omni's all around would be optimum setup.

Also, I think I am going to hold off on a receiver purchase and continue to drive them with my Pioneer Elite VSX-45TX, the receiver is only 100W per channel at 8 Ohms, will that be enough power for Triad speakers or will I find issues with that? I know most people tend to you use more power with the other Triad setups I've seen on this board, but hopefully this will last for a while.

As usual, thanks for the advice.
tim

 

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post #654 of 6437 Old 02-05-2009, 06:33 AM
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Paul,
I wasn't able to make my home theater purchase last year, but am looking back into it this year. I just wanted to check back with you and see if the Silver/8 Omni's (I see that the silver/6 has been replaced) were still what you would suggest for the surrounds in my room. I don't know if Triad has anything new in that area that I would want to consider. Can you just take a quick look and make sure that is still the direction I would wan to go in. The other option I was considering would be either all bronze/silver/4 surrounds or a combination of the surrounds on the sides and the omni's for the rear, however, you felt the Omni's all around would be optimum setup.

Also, I think I am going to hold off on a receiver purchase and continue to drive them with my Pioneer Elite VSX-45TX, the receiver is only 100W per channel at 8 Ohms, will that be enough power for Triad speakers or will I find issues with that? I know most people tend to you use more power with the other Triad setups I've seen on this board, but hopefully this will last for a while.

As usual, thanks for the advice.
tim

Tim, if the room is fairly dead (full carpeting, upholstered furniture, etc.), you could stay with the InCeiling Silver/8 Omni for your four surrounds. They're $550 each. Or, if the budget allows, you could upgrade to either the InCeiling Gold/6 Omni ($600 and a bit more bass extension), or the new InCeiling Silver/8 Omni SE which is $900. The drivers in the SE version are proprietary Seas drivers, and the tweeter costs us around six times more. Detail is better. If the budget is set at varound $2,000 for the four surrounds, stay with the original InCeiling Silver/8 Omni.

Pioneer seems to work fine with Triad, even though we tend to make 4 ohm speakers. All our 4 ohm speakers, other than the Gold LCRs, are a very benign 4 ohm load. Gold LCRs also work well with most Pioneer receivers.

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post #655 of 6437 Old 02-05-2009, 01:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Triad Gold Room update: Room is almost done. All the cabinetry is in and has been stained and sealed as well as all the crown molding and trim. All painting is now done. What's left to do?......Granite bar-tops go in next week as well as the carpet. Final electrical should be completed today. Then all we have is the furniture, odd-and-ends, then the electronics and projector hookup. Whew almost done and time to enjoy.

I SUCK as a photographer, so I brought in a pro. I will share some updated pics when they are forwarded to me.

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post #656 of 6437 Old 02-05-2009, 02:46 PM
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Triad Gold Room update: Room is almost done. All the cabinetry is in and has been stained and sealed as well as all the crown molding and trim. All painting is now done. What's left to do?......Granite bar-tops go in next week as well as the carpet. Final electrical should be completed today. Then all we have is the furniture, odd-and-ends, then the electronics and projector hookup. Whew almost done and time to enjoy.

I SUCK as a photographer, so I brought in a pro. I will share some updated pics when they are forwarded to me.

I can't wait until it's calibrated and dialed in.

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post #657 of 6437 Old 02-05-2009, 06:41 PM
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Triad Gold Room update: Room is almost done. All the cabinetry is in and has been stained and sealed as well as all the crown molding and trim. All painting is now done. What's left to do?......Granite bar-tops go in next week as well as the carpet. Final electrical should be completed today. Then all we have is the furniture, odd-and-ends, then the electronics and projector hookup. Whew almost done and time to enjoy.

I SUCK as a photographer, so I brought in a pro. I will share some updated pics when they are forwarded to me.

Congrats Tony. It looks like your room will be finished before mine. My GC is dragging his feet big time on my trim. Will likely copy your wrap the stair for trimwork by the stage and step. Thanks for posting it in my thread. Looking forward to your pics.


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post #658 of 6437 Old 02-05-2009, 06:44 PM
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Congrats Tony. It looks like your room will be finished before mine. My GC is dragging his feet big time on my trim. Will likely copy your wrap the stair for trimwork by the stage and step. Thanks for posting it in my thread. Looking forward to your pics.

I just now realized you have a thread about your theater that's ALMOST AS BIG AS THIS ONE!! Nobody tells me anything.

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post #659 of 6437 Old 02-06-2009, 06:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Congrats Tony. It looks like your room will be finished before mine. My GC is dragging his feet big time on my trim.

Sorry to hear that. I've been dragging my feet on my project as well, however, I'm not getting paid on this project....I'm paying for it!

How is your JVC projector working out? As you know I'm going with the same projector minus the anamorphic option.

I really like how my project is turning out. This is one room I completely designed myself (every detail)! I'm working with roughly a 600sq.ft. space. It's a dual purpose room to play poker, entertain and watch movies. I'm sure the photographer will get better pics than I to give everyone a better perspective. Will post soon.

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Showplace Oklahoma - Showplace Theater & Sound
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post #660 of 6437 Old 02-06-2009, 06:53 AM
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I really like how my project is turning out. This is one room I completely designed myself (every detail)! I'm working with roughly a 600sq.ft. space. It's a dual purpose room to play poker, entertain and watch movies. I'm sure the photographer will get better pics than I to give everyone a better perspective. Will post soon.

So, with an 8' ceiling, that's 4,800 cubic feet...fairly big room. What sub setup are you using? You need to pump some WATTAGE into that COTTAGE.

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