The Official Salk Sound Owner's And Discussion Thread - Page 247 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 06-01-2012, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guf View Post

Who knew when we purchased these speakers that it was just the beginning. I thought I'll go ahead and spend more on the speakers than I want to because they are the most important. Life was simpler before my my HT2-TLs. Now after just a few weeks, Its all I do is research new stuff, trying to figure out the best combination of products, while keeping in check financially, wanting clean natural sound. Its over whelming. There's AV, and two channel. I went from 50/50 to about 90/10. Heavy on the music. Most of us start with the av receiver, I did. I bought a Parasound 2250 to pre out from. I'm 100% mac mini sourced. It keeps thing simpler for me. (except of course there is the software factor). So I'm experiencing some of the best sound I personally have heard. But you want more and better. My path then took me to a DAC to clean up the signal and I chose the w4s dac 2, I bought locally and used. This is where it starts getting over whelming. When should I start adding tube stuff? The DAC, the pre amp? or the amp? My thoughts changed after I realized I could use my DAC as my pre amp, and it has HT bypass, and I can control it with my harmony 1. I think It sounds great. ( but I thought is was great before!) I was prepared to get the ava hybrid pre amp. But thats Like 3 grand If you want remote. Thats a hell of a lot of money. I'm hoping my new dac/pre combo will hold me over. I've read that separating your 2 channel from the av is a major step in the right direction, not sure if I'm properly doing that. Maybe now my next step could be get get a tube amp to warm up the sound a little? then add a tube pre? If it wasn't enough? Not sure if there is a question there or if I'm just sharing my experience with the aftereffects of purchasing new Salk speakers.

Man I can relate!!! Constant upgradeitis!! Constantly reading up on new amps..etc...etc..etc...;-)
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Old 06-01-2012, 04:59 PM
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Wyowolf - I'll MSG you offline to answer you direct vs pure question
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Old 06-01-2012, 06:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guf View Post

Who knew when we purchased these speakers that it was just the beginning. I thought I'll go ahead and spend more on the speakers than I want to because they are the most important. Life was simpler before my my HT2-TLs. Now after just a few weeks, Its all I do is research new stuff, trying to figure out the best combination of products, while keeping in check financially, wanting clean natural sound. Its over whelming. There's AV, and two channel. I went from 50/50 to about 90/10. Heavy on the music. Most of us start with the av receiver, I did. I bought a Parasound 2250 to pre out from. I'm 100% mac mini sourced. It keeps thing simpler for me. (except of course there is the software factor). So I'm experiencing some of the best sound I personally have heard. But you want more and better. My path then took me to a DAC to clean up the signal and I chose the w4s dac 2, I bought locally and used. This is where it starts getting over whelming. When should I start adding tube stuff? The DAC, the pre amp? or the amp? My thoughts changed after I realized I could use my DAC as my pre amp, and it has HT bypass, and I can control it with my harmony 1. I think It sounds great. ( but I thought is was great before!) I was prepared to get the ava hybrid pre amp. But thats Like 3 grand If you want remote. Thats a hell of a lot of money. I'm hoping my new dac/pre combo will hold me over. I've read that separating your 2 channel from the av is a major step in the right direction, not sure if I'm properly doing that. Maybe now my next step could be get get a tube amp to warm up the sound a little? then add a tube pre? If it wasn't enough? Not sure if there is a question there or if I'm just sharing my experience with the aftereffects of purchasing new Salk speakers.

Great post.

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No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
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Old 06-06-2012, 03:27 AM
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Some set up questions for my Song Towers.

I have gotten some rather underwhelming bass response and was wondering what I might be doing wrong?

I have them setting appx 18 inches from the wall about 8 feet apart. there is an entertainment center in between them. Right now I just have the two STs and a sub hooked up. A BW 608 I believe.

I ran the MCAAC thing, and didnt really like it, so i turned it off. It just killed the top end. I have my speakers set to LARGE and the SUB set to PLUS running in DIRECT MODE. As I understand it, this sends all the freq to the sub and the speaker. I had the Xover set to 80 ...

didnt make any improvements... so moved the Xover to 50 and that seemed to make it better... but I think the set up is still not quite right.

I have an audio test cd i ran, but am not sure how to use it correctly. I have an RS soundmeter as well...

the room is appx 18x20 w a floating HW floor and the back is open to the kitchen.

the amp is a PIO Elite SC35

any info on how to properly use the test tones?

Thanks in advance... Frank
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Old 06-06-2012, 03:31 AM
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Here is the setup... sorry for the crappy pic!

399
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Old 06-06-2012, 05:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

Some set up questions for my Song Towers.
I have gotten some rather underwhelming bass response and was wondering what I might be doing wrong?
I have them setting appx 18 inches from the wall about 8 feet apart. there is an entertainment center in between them. Right now I just have the two STs and a sub hooked up. A BW 608 I believe.
I ran the MCAAC thing, and didnt really like it, so i turned it off. It just killed the top end. I have my speakers set to LARGE and the SUB set to PLUS running in DIRECT MODE. As I understand it, this sends all the freq to the sub and the speaker. I had the Xover set to 80 ...
didnt make any improvements... so moved the Xover to 50 and that seemed to make it better... but I think the set up is still not quite right.
I have an audio test cd i ran, but am not sure how to use it correctly. I have an RS soundmeter as well...
the room is appx 18x20 w a floating HW floor and the back is open to the kitchen.
the amp is a PIO Elite SC35
any info on how to properly use the test tones?
Thanks in advance... Frank

We need to see your in-room bass response. If you're using a subwoofer I wouldn't send the bass to both the speakers and the sub; just send it to the subwoofer below the crossover. Try moving your subwoofer around until it sounds best, as it's likely a room issues; the room dominates the frequencies below 200-300Hz.

Can you try using your test tone CD through your CDP in conjunction with your SPL meter? You'll need to plot the different output frequencies so we can get a good idea of what your in-room response is below 200Hz.

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
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No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
sounds good. - Dr. Floyd Toole
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Old 06-06-2012, 06:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

We need to see your in-room bass response. If you're using a subwoofer I wouldn't send the bass to both the speakers and the sub; just send it to the subwoofer below the crossover. Try moving your subwoofer around until it sounds best, as it's likely a room issues; the room dominates the frequencies below 200-300Hz.
Can you try using your test tone CD through your CDP in conjunction with your SPL meter? You'll need to plot the different output frequencies so we can get a good idea of what your in-room response is below 200Hz.

ok, how do i get that info? you mean the MACCA plot? I do have that at home... will try to figure a way to paste it here tonight.

not sure what you mean by running test tone through my CD player, & SP meter?
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Old 06-06-2012, 06:08 AM - Thread Starter
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I've attached a speadsheet you can use that already includes SPL meter correction values.

You'll play each test tone through your cd-player or music streamer while your SPL meter sits at ear level at your listening position. Enter the decibel level displayed on the screen for each frequency into the attached excel spreadsheet, then post the graph when you're finished. Use only column "F" in the spreadsheet. Be sure your SPL meter is set to "slow" and "C-weighted." Post the graph when you're finished.

Good luck. FreqResp.xls 26k .xls file
Attached Files
File Type: xls FreqResp.xls (26.0 KB, 24 views)

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
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Old 06-06-2012, 06:23 AM
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Thank you very much, so i just enter what I read off the SP meter in C and it will make the graph?

silly question, how "loud" should i turn up my reciever? is there a standard setting?

sorry it now... use only F correct?
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Old 06-06-2012, 08:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

Thank you very much, so i just enter what I read off the SP meter in C and it will make the graph?
silly question, how "loud" should i turn up my reciever? is there a standard setting?
sorry it now... use only F correct?

Yes sir - just enter the reading into column "F."

I'd play the 50Hz test tone and turn your receiver up to 85dB or so; then hopefully none of the tones get much louder than that. After that start from the beginning and have at it.

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Old 06-06-2012, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Yes sir - just enter the reading into column "F."
I'd play the 50Hz test tone and turn your receiver up to 85dB or so; then hopefully none of the tones get much louder than that. After that start from the beginning and have at it.

ok, just so i understand correctly, play the 50HZ tone, and turn my Receiver up to 85db at the meter correct? ok that I will do , thank you again...

Frank
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Old 06-06-2012, 10:21 AM - Thread Starter
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^ Yup, that's correct.

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
Dr. Olive's Blog

 

 

No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
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Old 06-06-2012, 03:30 PM
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ok here is what I got... didnt look as nice as the one you had frown.gif
I didnt have the numbers you did... only multiples of 5. so i changed the first column to reflect this...
just the speakers without the sub... with 50 hz being 85db

Frank

FreqResp-1.xls 12k .xls file
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File Type: xls FreqResp-1.xls (12.0 KB, 30 views)
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Old 06-06-2012, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
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I responded at Audio Circle since you're getting more eyes on your thread there. smile.gif

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
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No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:54 PM
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Nuance, BillMac, Chris et al. I am strongly considering getting a Salk setup to go with my NEW Denon 4311 & BDPA100 for MC Music, movies etc which I will run via Denonlink (Thanks SOM). I am currently using a 10 year old 5.1 M&K speaker setup that has peerless & Vifa drivers. I am not happy whatsoever with the sound for music; specifically lack of crisp top end and muddy mids. I am using a Denon 3808 to drive this system and have followed your advice to bypass Audyssey on my L&R. To the point: can those running similar components tell me what to expect with the Salks vs. what I've got now? Also which model do you suggest? I do NOT listen loud, and not always from the sweetspot, but am interested in detail & Clarity from Jazz, Rock (75%) & Movies (25%). I appreciate your advice. Thanks, Will
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Will,

May I ask what your budget is?

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Old 06-07-2012, 01:42 PM
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I assume SongTowers(4ohms) and center with Denon 2112CI(best 8ohms) is not right combo. Am I right? If not I am strongly considering for the front and surrounds I will pick up cheap. 30%TV 50%movies 20%music. anyone??
Thank you.
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:58 PM
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Songtowers and Center sound great powered by my Denon 2109. I presume it has similar specs to you 2112. I do have a powered subwoofer that takes the very low range but I have seen no power issues at all with 5.1 for movies/music/TV.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:03 PM - Thread Starter
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The Denon stuff should handle 4 ohms just fine. 90 watts should be okay too, but obviously the more power the better. smile.gif I'm sure SongTower's would sound great matched with the Denon 2112C.

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Old 06-07-2012, 02:26 PM
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Thank you harrihuss & Nuance, for your inputs.

Sub, I am planning to get one of the ID subs. Definitely sealed. is it fine?

can I go full volume and no trouble? Can they fill 3000cft?
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:27 PM
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Nuance, I was hoping to spend around 5k for the front end. But I'm flexible...


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Old 06-08-2012, 11:27 AM
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Question about wiring, have SCSTs on order that come with the "premium" binding posts.
I'm currently using a Tara cable that has 4 strands in one jacket, it's terminated with dual stacking bananas at the amp end and 4 pins on the speaker end to bi-wire Vandersteens.
I'd rather not pull new wire. Question is can I use it with the pins as is, or should I clip them off and use bare wire or get stacking banana plugs.
I would rather not bi-wire the new speakers.
I'm thinking I can use one strand through the binding post hole and wind the other around the post.
Suggestions?
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackscorpio View Post

Thank you harrihuss & Nuance, for your inputs.
Sub, I am planning to get one of the ID subs. Definitely sealed. is it fine?
can I go full volume and no trouble? Can they fill 3000cft?

Yes, they can be cranked without issue. For that sized room check out Rythmik, Salk, SVS, HSU and Outlaw. Ported will fill larger rooms easier, but one 15" sealed sub should do the trick for you. I don't know your budget, but Seaton Sound and Funk Audio are great too.

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No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guillermorb73 View Post

Nuance, I was hoping to spend around 5k for the front end. But I'm flexible...
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

How about Super-Charged SongTowers and matching center? That'd be one heck of a system.

How large is your room and what subwoofer will you be using?

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No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Yes, they can be cranked without issue. For that sized room check out Rythmik, Salk, SVS, HSU and Outlaw. Ported will fill larger rooms easier, but one 15" sealed sub should do the trick for you. I don't know your budget, but Seaton Sound and Funk Audio are great too.

budget is $1500 for two subs.
one is for the HT and another one is for 2.1 music(100%) setup with stereo amp for a different room. so, obviously I think $1000 for the HT sub and $500 for the other.
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Old 06-12-2012, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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budget is $1500 for two subs.
one is for the HT and another one is for 2.1 music(100%) setup with stereo amp for a different room. so, obviously I think $1000 for the HT sub and $500 for the other.

Sorry for the delayed response - been very busy.

Well, how about the HSU VTF-15H for the theater and a Rythmik FV12 for music? Otherwise an Epik Legend for music if you prefer sealed.

How many cu. ft. for the theater and music room?

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Old 06-14-2012, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post

Question about wiring, have SCSTs on order that come with the "premium" binding posts.
I'm currently using a Tara cable that has 4 strands in one jacket, it's terminated with dual stacking bananas at the amp end and 4 pins on the speaker end to bi-wire Vandersteens.
I'd rather not pull new wire. Question is can I use it with the pins as is, or should I clip them off and use bare wire or get stacking banana plugs.
I would rather not bi-wire the new speakers.
I'm thinking I can use one strand through the binding post hole and wind the other around the post.
Suggestions?
You could probably put both pins in the binding post--one through the top and one through the bottom--if they're long enough and the pins aren't too thick. They're both going the same place so there shouldn't be an issue, right? In a worst case scenario Jim would probably work with you on finding a terminal that works with what you have.

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Old 06-14-2012, 11:22 AM
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"You could probably put both pins in the binding post--one through the top and one through the bottom--if they're long enough and the pins aren't too thick. They're both going the same place so there shouldn't be an issue, right? In a worst case scenario Jim would probably work with you on finding a terminal that works with what you have."

Okay, thanks. I haven't talked with Jim about this, I don't want to change things based on what I have, I'd rather not be tied to bi-wiring. It sounds like I should be able to make the cables I have work one way or the other. I'll try with the pins intact before I get my wire cutters out.
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Old 06-14-2012, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post

"You could probably put both pins in the binding post--one through the top and one through the bottom--if they're long enough and the pins aren't too thick. They're both going the same place so there shouldn't be an issue, right? In a worst case scenario Jim would probably work with you on finding a terminal that works with what you have."
Okay, thanks. I haven't talked with Jim about this, I don't want to change things based on what I have, I'd rather not be tied to bi-wiring. It sounds like I should be able to make the cables I have work one way or the other. I'll try with the pins intact before I get my wire cutters out.

If it has biwire capable terminals, just bridge them and it will be like a single connection. You can also get bananas that will piggy back, ie, one plugs into the back of the other.

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. . . . . . . . . . . Peter
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Old 06-14-2012, 02:48 PM
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The terminals aren't bi-wire/bi-amp capable.

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