Official Denon AVP-A1HD/AVP-A1HDCI and POA-A1HD/POA-A1HDCI owners thread. - Page 877 - AVS Forum
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post #26281 of 26304 Old 07-12-2014, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by gsr View Post

Yes, but I don't remember the specifics. IIRC, you order the pro kit from a vendor and then get the license direct from Audyssey. Here's a link to 1 vendor, but they currently list the kit as being on back order. You may also find this thread handy for some Pro Kit info.
That vendor, Perfect Home Theater, pretty much always shows the Pro Kit as back ordered. But it really don't mean a whole lot either, because if you do order it from them they will then have it drop shipped to you direct from Audyssey. That's how they it did it for me and it only took about 5 or 6 days before it was delivered to me, and I'm pretty sure that's how it was for others that also bought the Pro Kit from them as well.
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post #26282 of 26304 Old 07-12-2014, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Johnla View Post
That vendor, Perfect Home Theater, pretty much always shows the Pro Kit as back ordered. But it really don't mean a whole lot either, because if you do order it from them they will then have it drop shipped to you direct from Audyssey. That's how they it did it for me and it only took about 5 or 6 days before it was delivered to me, and I'm pretty sure that's how it was for others that also bought the Pro Kit from them as well.
That makes sense. I'm pretty sure I ordered my pro kit from them too, but it was probably 3+ years ago now so I don't remember if they had it listed as back ordered back then.
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post #26283 of 26304 Old 07-12-2014, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by gsr View Post
That makes sense. I'm pretty sure I ordered my pro kit from them too, but it was probably 3+ years ago now so I don't remember if they had it listed as back ordered back then.
Same here. "Back ordered" but got it drop shipped in no time, about 2 years ago.
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post #26284 of 26304 Old 07-13-2014, 06:30 PM
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Well i have had the latest firmware update looking at me now for some time for the AVP and have been skeptical on downloading it, as i was weary on what it was for and now i just found out that it has something to do with the bass management(improving the bass) when listening to SACD via denon link. I think i will now go ahead and download it as it is only a 3min download. Has anyone noticed a difference in their bass after this update when listening to SACD via denon link.

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post #26285 of 26304 Old 07-14-2014, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by grassy View Post
Well i have had the latest firmware update looking at me now for some time for the AVP and have been skeptical on downloading it, as i was weary on what it was for and now i just found out that it has something to do with the bass management(improving the bass) when listening to SACD via denon link. I think i will now go ahead and download it as it is only a 3min download. Has anyone noticed a difference in their bass after this update when listening to SACD via denon link.
This update fixes the -10dB LF loss in the 0.1 channel when listening to SACD over DL3. It really makes a big difference. If you don't use Denon Link then maybe you don't need it.
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post #26286 of 26304 Old 07-14-2014, 08:59 PM
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This update fixes the -10dB LF loss in the 0.1 channel when listening to SACD over DL3. It really makes a big difference. If you don't use Denon Link then maybe you don't need it.
Thanks Paul,have not played an sacd disc since but plan on checking the results today sometime,

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post #26287 of 26304 Old 07-15-2014, 09:08 PM
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Did we ever figure out if a 3D/XT32 upgraded AVP supports Audyssey SubEQ HT, i.e. independent eq'ing of 2 (or 3?) subs?
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post #26288 of 26304 Old 07-16-2014, 05:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Sam S View Post
Did we ever figure out if a 3D/XT32 upgraded AVP supports Audyssey SubEQ HT, i.e. independent eq'ing of 2 (or 3?) subs?
I ran my 2 subs discretely when first got the xt32 update and it did ping, setup them all independently

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post #26289 of 26304 Old 07-16-2014, 04:48 PM
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I ran my 2 subs discretely when first got the xt32 update and it did ping, setup them all independently
The implementation of Sub EQ is left to the AV manufacturer.

The AVP only pings the subs separately and not together as the Audyssey Sub EQ does. This is not the best way to EQ subs. You need to set the levels and distances separately and then ping them all as one and EQ all the subs combined. This will generally result in the smoothest LF response curve. I have validated this approach as I also have the stand alone Audyssey Sub EQ HT, that does exactly what I have just described; I use 4 subs, two matched pairs equally set up about the MLP.
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post #26290 of 26304 Old 07-17-2014, 03:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Digione View Post
The implementation of Sub EQ is left to the AV manufacturer.

The AVP only pings the subs separately and not together as the Audyssey Sub EQ does. This is not the best way to EQ subs. You need to set the levels and distances separately and then ping them all as one and EQ all the subs combined. This will generally result in the smoothest LF response curve. I have validated this approach as I also have the stand alone Audyssey Sub EQ HT, that does exactly what I have just described; I use 4 subs, two matched pairs equally set up about the MLP.
yes left up to manufacturer, worked well for my two 2 identical mirror placed subs. currently I utilise my subs separately i.e. one just extends my mains so they act as full range. and the other for LFE duties. the avp eqs both discretely and for excellent end result.

have just picked up the pro kit. will see how that adds to the mix

one thing to keep in mind is the many wide and varied options the avp gives for sub setup and config. am sure a choice there for all that will work well.

the thing I didn't like about the sub eq was that it hooked upto the subs and eqd so the av processor saw them as one. which is not much use for instance if you run them off the avp as L&R subs and then add another for LFE. you want them all eqd discretely. which is just what the avp will do

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Last edited by alebonau; 07-17-2014 at 04:01 AM.
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post #26291 of 26304 Old 07-17-2014, 11:14 AM
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yes left up to manufacturer, worked well for my two 2 identical mirror placed subs. currently I utilise my subs separately i.e. one just extends my mains so they act as full range. and the other for LFE duties. the avp eqs both discretely and for excellent end result.

have just picked up the pro kit. will see how that adds to the mix

one thing to keep in mind is the many wide and varied options the avp gives for sub setup and config. am sure a choice there for all that will work well.

the thing I didn't like about the sub eq was that it hooked upto the subs and eqd so the av processor saw them as one. which is not much use for instance if you run them off the avp as L&R subs and then add another for LFE. you want them all eqd discretely. which is just what the avp will do
Some time ago, I asked Audyssey about this and they told me that Denon deliberately decided not to deploy SubEQ HT. They didn't tell me the reason. May be this only works with two Subs and not three Subs? I don't know.

I am happy with this, because I didn't like SubEQ-HT with my former Onyko PR-SC5509. From the theoretical point of view, it seems correct to me, to measure the Subs together. However, from my listening impression, I like the independent measurement better.
I am happy of what the AVP does and I made already many measurements with my Pro kit.
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post #26292 of 26304 Old 07-17-2014, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by alebonau View Post
yes left up to manufacturer, worked well for my two 2 identical mirror placed subs. currently I utilise my subs separately i.e. one just extends my mains so they act as full range. and the other for LFE duties. the avp eqs both discretely and for excellent end result.

have just picked up the pro kit. will see how that adds to the mix

one thing to keep in mind is the many wide and varied options the avp gives for sub setup and config. am sure a choice there for all that will work well.

the thing I didn't like about the sub eq was that it hooked upto the subs and eqd so the av processor saw them as one. which is not much use for instance if you run them off the avp as L&R subs and then add another for LFE. you want them all eqd discretely. which is just what the avp will do
Congrats on the pro kit Al, hopefully i will not be far behind in getting mine although i might have to wait till after our Tax is done with. My amp is still going like the clappers and i am really enjoying the home theater experience now. Never been better

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post #26293 of 26304 Old 07-18-2014, 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Ganymed4 View Post
Some time ago, I asked Audyssey about this and they told me that Denon deliberately decided not to deploy SubEQ HT. They didn't tell me the reason. May be this only works with two Subs and not three Subs? I don't know.

I am happy with this, because I didn't like SubEQ-HT with my former Onyko PR-SC5509. From the theoretical point of view, it seems correct to me, to measure the Subs together. However, from my listening impression, I like the independent measurement better.
I am happy of what the AVP does and I made already many measurements with my Pro kit.
good to hear gany, am looking forward to using the pro kit, just on a massive learning curve with it...

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Congrats on the pro kit Al, hopefully i will not be far behind in getting mine although i might have to wait till after our Tax is done with. My amp is still going like the clappers and i am really enjoying the home theater experience now. Never been better
hi grassy, audyssey service is amazing. order was processed literally overnight, payment made and shipped very promptly to arrive in the next week ! can highly recommend. comes very well packed to double boxed and very well packaged. looks a really good quality piece of kit.

now just to register it and start down the path...one will have to wait on a while though...july is a very busy month for us ! yep tax time that is always a bonus
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post #26294 of 26304 Old 07-18-2014, 06:52 AM
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good to hear gany, am looking forward to using the pro kit, just on a massive learning curve with it...


Pro kit is awesome AL. You'll love it. I use mine and never looked back

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post #26295 of 26304 Old 07-18-2014, 01:12 PM
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good to hear gany, am looking forward to using the pro kit, just on a massive learning curve with it...
Yes, I was also going through this 'learning curve', especially regarding microphone placement. Also the program settings at the end, even there are only a few, can give you some headache. But this is individual and depends on your own set-up you have in your HT. If you need some help, there is a very good Pro thread in the forum with some very knowledgeable experts - not me only. You find it here The Audyssey Pro Installer Kit Thread (FAQ in post #1)
They have a lot of detailed information, collected from Audyssey directly or their own experience.

The best thing for me with the Pro kit is, that you can load your measurements and then play with the parameters - target curves, x-over values. This is really great and I used it quite often.
Looking forward to read about your experiences.
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post #26296 of 26304 Old 07-18-2014, 04:57 PM
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yes left up to manufacturer, worked well for my two 2 identical mirror placed subs. currently I utilise my subs separately i.e. one just extends my mains so they act as full range. and the other for LFE duties. the avp eqs both discretely and for excellent end result.

have just picked up the pro kit. will see how that adds to the mix

one thing to keep in mind is the many wide and varied options the avp gives for sub setup and config. am sure a choice there for all that will work well.

the thing I didn't like about the sub eq was that it hooked upto the subs and eqd so the av processor saw them as one. which is not much use for instance if you run them off the avp as L&R subs and then add another for LFE. you want them all eqd discretely. which is just what the avp will do
Whilst I agree that the AVP gives the flexibility to EQ each sub separately, that is not how you listen to them. The interactions between combined subs is very complex and not terribly predictable so I do not see how EQ'ing each sub separately can provide the best overall response. Having said that we each have are own experiences based upon our very different rooms. Even Chris at Audyssey never recommends EQ'ing subs separately.

I have spent many hundreds of hours comparing the two approaches in my purpose built music/HT room using Pro. My room is heavily acoustically treated with significant bass trapping and absorption, and without exception EQ'ing all subs as one alway produces the best frequency response AND decay response at the MLP.

I will not elaborate any further as this is not the correct thread to do so.

Just fixed my link, apparently the recent site upgrade broke it.

Last edited by Digione; 07-19-2014 at 11:47 AM. Reason: Broken Link
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post #26297 of 26304 Old 07-20-2014, 12:05 AM
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Pro kit is awesome AL. You'll love it. I use mine and never looked back
thanks Frank, can't wait to get going….now just need an evacuated quiet house ….. might takes months for that to happen !

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Yes, I was also going through this 'learning curve', especially regarding microphone placement. Also the program settings at the end, even there are only a few, can give you some headache. But this is individual and depends on your own set-up you have in your HT. If you need some help, there is a very good Pro thread in the forum with some very knowledgeable experts - not me only. You find it here The Audyssey Pro Installer Kit Thread (FAQ in post #1)
They have a lot of detailed information, collected from Audyssey directly or their own experience.

The best thing for me with the Pro kit is, that you can load your measurements and then play with the parameters - target curves, x-over values. This is really great and I used it quite often.
Looking forward to read about your experiences.
thankyou Gany, for the links etc, partly your experience sealed it for me to to get there pro kit.

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Whilst I agree that the AVP gives the flexibility to EQ each sub separately, that is not how you listen to them. The interactions between combined subs is very complex and not terribly predictable so I do not see how EQ'ing each sub separately can provide the best overall response. Having said that we each have are own experiences based upon our very different rooms. Even Chris at Audyssey never recommends EQ'ing subs separately.

I have spent many hundreds of hours comparing the two approaches in my purpose built music/HT room using Pro. My room is heavily acoustically treated with significant bass trapping and absorption, and without exception EQ'ing all subs as one alway produces the best frequency response AND decay response at the MLP.

I will not elaborate any further as this is not the correct thread to do so.

Just fixed my link, apparently the recent site upgrade broke it.
thanks, however would beg to differ, the avp does a fine job in Equing my full range mains (mains - sub pair) … each one individually just as it measures and eqs my sub. had no issue with dual subs either. but I respect your view and understand what your wishing to achieve. however no plans here in getting a subeq myself but certainly looking forward to utilising the pro kit just received

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post #26298 of 26304 Old 07-20-2014, 01:23 AM
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thanks Frank, can't wait to get going….now just need an evacuated quiet house ….. might takes months for that to happen !
I do mine around 1am-2am in the morning once the neighbourhood is asleep.

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post #26299 of 26304 Old 07-20-2014, 04:22 AM
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I do mine around 1am-2am in the morning once the neighbourhood is asleep.
now theres an idea frank ! not sure what the wife would think. or the cat that tends to prowl the house at those hours

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post #26300 of 26304 Old 07-20-2014, 08:27 AM
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now theres an idea frank ! not sure what the wife would think. or the cat that tends to prowl the house at those hours
Yeah mine does that too. Once I did it at 03"00 am got scared of the sound chirps , and destroyed the first set of measurments.
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post #26301 of 26304 Old 07-20-2014, 09:11 AM
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thanks, however would beg to differ, the avp does a fine job in Equing my full range mains (mains - sub pair) … each one individually just as it measures and eqs my sub. had no issue with dual subs either. but I respect your view and understand what your wishing to achieve. however no plans here in getting a subeq myself but certainly looking forward to utilising the pro kit just received
I have never run my 1038's as a full range main/sub pair like yourself so your approach maybe more suitable and obviously works well for you.

The Pro kit is a great tool (especially when used in conjunction with something like REW) in that you can easily re-load, add to and extensively edit previous measurements; it also "tailors' the speakers LF roll off in order to match the selected crossover frequencies, something that XT32 in the AVP cannot do. You can have hours/days/weeks of "fun" tweaking, refining and optimizing.

Have fun
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post #26302 of 26304 Old 07-20-2014, 08:42 PM
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Unhappy Finally getting up to speed... Doh! Maybe not...

Back in Sept. 2009 I purchased the AVP (due to my sincere desire to hear and see what composers, directors and other artists had intended). Planning to build my first home theater, but then shifting priorities to focus on my two children and work, those plans were placed on hold. Having utilized the hardware in a very limited way the past few years, I started looking online and realized there were available firmware updates to install. Hmmm…. interesting... updates. Cool!

So, I connected to the network and started to install the available update (from 2009 presumably). Big mistake!! I now see, I’m not the only one who has ever run into the “DSP1 Firm updating - 24 min.” issue the unit can’t seem to get past. I managed to perform the task three years after the unit was out of warranty... -NICE!

I doubt I’ll be able to use the option others have (3 years ago!) by requesting the upgrade (XT-32), and having the service center address the firmware issue during the process.

I’ve contacted two service centers (via email since they are closed now), but don’t expect they’ll be willing to do much, without me forking over another $1k (likely without the upgrade). We’ll see.

Any suggestions from any of you? Anyone willing to share how to address the firmware issue (further than resetting the micro-processor, disconnecting all other cables and having a direct network connection)? There has to be a way to install a prior firmware version and try again. (?)

Best regards,
Josh
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post #26303 of 26304 Old Yesterday, 11:38 AM
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Back in Sept. 2009 I purchased the AVP (due to my sincere desire to hear and see what composers, directors and other artists had intended). Planning to build my first home theater, but then shifting priorities to focus on my two children and work, those plans were placed on hold. Having utilized the hardware in a very limited way the past few years, I started looking online and realized there were available firmware updates to install. Hmmm…. interesting... updates. Cool!

So, I connected to the network and started to install the available update (from 2009 presumably). Big mistake!! I now see, I’m not the only one who has ever run into the “DSP1 Firm updating - 24 min.” issue the unit can’t seem to get past. I managed to perform the task three years after the unit was out of warranty... -NICE!

I doubt I’ll be able to use the option others have (3 years ago!) by requesting the upgrade (XT-32), and having the service center address the firmware issue during the process.

I’ve contacted two service centers (via email since they are closed now), but don’t expect they’ll be willing to do much, without me forking over another $1k (likely without the upgrade). We’ll see.

Any suggestions from any of you? Anyone willing to share how to address the firmware issue (further than resetting the micro-processor, disconnecting all other cables and having a direct network connection)? There has to be a way to install a prior firmware version and try again. (?)

Best regards,
Josh
I wish you good luck with this issue. There are - IMO - more than one problem related to your firmware problem. As far as I am aware, you cannot get the firmware except via the Internet. Only service centers may have it - read very mixed experiences here with service centers from others.
The upgrade is definitely not available any more. I guess only a service center can help you in your case.

Sorry not having better news for you. This is what I know, but may be somebody else has an idea or more knowledge?
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post #26304 of 26304 Old Yesterday, 04:19 PM
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I wish you good luck with this issue. There are - IMO - more than one problem related to your firmware problem. As far as I am aware, you cannot get the firmware except via the Internet. Only service centers may have it - read very mixed experiences here with service centers from others.
The upgrade is definitely not available any more. I guess only a service center can help you in your case.

Sorry not having better news for you. This is what I know, but may be somebody else has an idea or more knowledge?
^^^^^

Only a service center can reload your firmware, it is not available anywhere else, and you need a suitable driver in order to connect to the AVP in order to reload the entire firmware suite.

I do not know where you are located but if you are in North America I would strongly advise you to send it to one of the major service centers preferably Panurgy in NJ with who I have had extensive dealings, all of which have been very positive. If it is just a firmware re-load due to a glitch the biggest cost will most likely be the freight charge not the re-load labor.

I have fairly close connections with Denon Corporate in Mahwah NJ and Panurgy. Please PM me if you need more help.
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