The $2000 price point - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 07:41 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
It seems that there are a ton of high end receivers that cost between $1500-$2500. I'd like to consider any of these receivers and so I'm creating this $2000 price point, with being happy to save $500 or willing to spend an extra $500 if it is worth it.

I didn't see any threads directly comparing these receivers to each other so I thought I would start one. I'm mainly going to be using this receiver to watch HD television and blu-rays on my PS3. It will be going in my new home (moving in May) in the basement. I'm not very familiar with multi-zone setup, but I'm imagining I'll have other receivers for other rooms.

Some of the main ones I'm considering based on the reviews are:

Pioneer Elite 94TXH
Integra DTR-8.8
Yamaha RV1800 (slightly cheaper but that's not a bad thing)
Onkyo TX-SR875
Marantz SR8002
and I'm sure many others I've left out.

Also, if anybody thinks that there is a receiver in the 800-$1000 price range I should consider please let me know. I'm assuming that I'll be happier with one of these but I really don't know. I'm trying for a nice set up for movies in the basement and I'm willing to spend around $2k for the receiver (speakers are already built into the home). If the performance of lower end receivers are comparable I don't need to spend that money.

Thanks for the help.
ks_man is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 07:45 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
MichaelJHuman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 18,632
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked: 92
I would first ask yourself why you want to spend $2000 on a receiver. If you really want a lot of power get a receiver and an external amp.

There are some cool goodies on the most expensive receivers, but make sure you will actually use them.

As for sound quality, there is not guarantee that spending more money will give you better sound quality.

Not telling you NOT to spend they money. Just make sure you know what you are getting for that kind of jack.

"But this one goes up to 11"
MichaelJHuman is offline  
post #3 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 07:55 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman View Post

I would first ask yourself why you want to spend $2000 on a receiver. If you really want a lot of power get a receiver and an external amp.

There are some cool goodies on the most expensive receivers, but make sure you will actually use them.

As for sound quality, there is not guarantee that spending more money will give you better sound quality.

Not telling you NOT to spend they money. Just make sure you know what you are getting for that kind of jack.

Thanks for the response. I guess what I'm thinking is I'm willing to spend $2000 (and even willing to go to $2500 if it really seems worth it). That certainly doesn't mean I have to spend $2000. I currently have an Onkyo 601 (was about $500 when I got it), and it has worked fine but I'm ready to move up.

I've suffered from living in a condo building and needed to turn the volume and bass way down on movie nights for the past 5 years so in the new home I want to be blown away. I'm going to start with my current 56" DLP as the tv, but I could see going to a projector or dedicated home theater in the next 3-5 years. I'm imagining the receiver I get now, I'd still be able to use down the road. I don't really want to compromise now but if there are some top quality receivers for less, I'm all ears.
ks_man is offline  
post #4 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 08:03 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jsmiddleton4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Glendale, AZ
Posts: 3,246
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 40 Post(s)
Liked: 24
I'm very happy with denon 3808ci.

E.B. White said, "I arise in the morning torn between a desire to improve the world and a desire to enjoy the world. This makes it hard to plan the day."
jsmiddleton4 is offline  
post #5 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 08:07 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I was very impressed with the review of the Integra 8.8 in the latest issue of Home Theater and it seems that all the pros love anything that's called Pioneer Elite.

Did you look at either of those (probably not the Integra since it is almost $1k more) when you decided to get the Denon?
ks_man is offline  
post #6 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 08:09 PM
Senior Member
 
jd_cincy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 212
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I've got a Denon 4308ci and love it (Paid $1850). And to the guy that recommended separates, my plan is to keep the Denon for a year, buy a 5-channel amp, then maybe a preamp. Spreads the cost out over a couple years, but doesn't skimp much on overall experience at any point.

Things I like about the 4308ci
HDMI 1.3a
Wifi
Internet firmware updates
Ability to play Upnp sources
Internet radio
Flexibility in configuration of zones, bi-wiring, 7.1, etc.
jd_cincy is offline  
post #7 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 08:17 PM
Member
 
lakebum431's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Norris, TN
Posts: 164
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_cincy View Post

I've got a Denon 4308ci and love it (Paid $1850). And to the guy that recommended separates, my plan is to keep the Denon for a year, buy a 5-channel amp, then maybe a preamp. Spreads the cost out over a couple years, but doesn't skimp much on overall experience at any point.

Things I like about the 4308ci
HDMI 1.3a
Wifi
Internet firmware updates
Ability to play Upnp sources
Internet radio
Flexibility in configuration of zones, bi-wiring, 7.1, etc.

I like all of those things (except for the wifi, but that doesn't matter because I have a wired connection close to my setup) about my 3808ci and it was just over $1k
lakebum431 is offline  
post #8 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 08:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cyberbri's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 8,095
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 52
What are you going to hook up to it? What's all your other equipment?
There are lots of receivers with 3 HDMI inputs. Sony's 5300ES has 6 HDMI inputs.
cyberbri is offline  
post #9 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 08:36 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

What are you going to hook up to it? What's all your other equipment?
There are lots of receivers with 3 HDMI inputs. Sony's 5300ES has 6 HDMI inputs.

I'll probably be hooking up an HD-DVR and my PS3 through HDMI. I may use my Denon DVD player as well if it does a better job with SD dvds than my PS3 (I'll test it out after everything is set up).

I don't think I have anything else at this point that I'll need to hook up to it, so I don't think I'll need more than 3 HDMI ports.
ks_man is offline  
post #10 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 09:13 PM
JVi
Advanced Member
 
JVi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ks_man View Post

I'll probably be hooking up an HD-DVR and my PS3 through HDMI. I may use my Denon DVD player as well if it does a better job with SD dvds than my PS3 (I'll test it out after everything is set up).

I don't think I have anything else at this point that I'll need to hook up to it, so I don't think I'll need more than 3 HDMI ports.

A lot of the higher end models have wireless or ethernet access to internet radio. Since you are using a PS3 that also streams audio from the internet, you may end up with redundant features. I use my PS3 to stream data from the internet wirelessly from laptops in the vicinity of the PS3..
JVi is offline  
post #11 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 09:18 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Obviously the most important thing for me is audio/video performance.

I'd also like the receiver to be able to interpret DD True HD and DTS Master HD through bitstream. I'm assuming that the PS3 will eventually be able to pass the codecs that way.
ks_man is offline  
post #12 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 09:25 PM
JVi
Advanced Member
 
JVi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ks_man View Post

Obviously the most important thing for me is audio/video performance.

I'd also like the receiver to be able to interpret DD True HD and DTS Master HD through bitstream. I'm assuming that the PS3 will eventually be able to pass the codecs that way.

The current PS3 internally decodes Dolby TrueHD but only passes the core DTS MA HD track. Rumor is that it will internally decode DTS MA HD with a firmware upgrade but this is just speculation at this point. The PS3 will not bitstream any HD track unmolested. Having tried this out with an internally decoding player and one that bitstreams the identical material, no difference in sound quality was detected by six unbiased listeners.
JVi is offline  
post #13 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 09:27 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
DaGamePimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: WA State
Posts: 15,495
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Liked: 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by ks_man View Post

Obviously the most important thing for me is audio/video performance.

I'd also like the receiver to be able to interpret DD True HD and DTS Master HD through bitstream. I'm assuming that the PS3 will eventually be able to pass the codecs that way.


That assumption would be wrong , the PS3 cannot and will not bitstream TrueHD or DTS-MA . It has been reported that it does not have the required hardware to do so .

--- Jason
DaGamePimp is offline  
post #14 of 25 Old 04-06-2008, 09:47 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post

That assumption would be wrong , the PS3 cannot and will not bitstream TrueHD or DTS-MA . It has been reported that it does not have the required hardware to do so .

--- Jason

Thanks for the info.

I'd probably still want to have those features in the receiver as in a couple of years I'm sure my second-gen blu-ray player will be able to do that. The PS2 was my first DVD player and it paled in comparison to later DVD players. I'm guessing the PS3 will be the same when compared to 3-5 year newer Blu-Ray players.

I'd sooner see myself with the same receiver rather than the same disc player, don't know why but it just seems like that would be the case for me.
ks_man is offline  
post #15 of 25 Old 04-07-2008, 07:31 AM
JVi
Advanced Member
 
JVi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ks_man View Post

Thanks for the info.

I'd probably still want to have those features in the receiver as in a couple of years I'm sure my second-gen blu-ray player will be able to do that. The PS2 was my first DVD player and it paled in comparison to later DVD players. I'm guessing the PS3 will be the same when compared to 3-5 year newer Blu-Ray players.

I'd sooner see myself with the same receiver rather than the same disc player, don't know why but it just seems like that would be the case for me.

It's funny how we want to see the little red lights appear on the front panel of our AVR's that read Dolby TrueHD or whatever, but my experience is that the PS3, outside of DTS MA HD, which I have not tested on a bitstreaming Blu-ray player, sounds the same whether internally decoded by the player or bitstreamed to the AVR for processing. Some movies, such as 3:10 to Yuma have an uncompressed PCM track (7.1) that, I beleive, the PS3 is just passing to the AVR untouched. It surely is an acoustically dynamic movie.
JVi is offline  
post #16 of 25 Old 04-07-2008, 11:24 AM
Member
 
rmccully's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Towson, MD
Posts: 113
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I surprised this point hasn't been brought up: You mention the speakers are built-in to your new house. Are they any good? If it's a new home, builders often put in very cheap speakers unless you've specified something otherwise. They might not have built-in rear enclosures and just use the wall cavity as a cabinet. No matter how much money you plow into a receiver, it won't make lousy speakers sound good.

That being said, I like the Onkyo/Integra units and the Marantz at those price points based on both features and amplifier quality.
rmccully is offline  
post #17 of 25 Old 04-07-2008, 02:03 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Easyaspie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,310
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
I had a Rotel RSX-1056 and needed to get an HDMI receiver to hear lossless from my PS3, I considered the Rotel RSX-1058 but didn't want to spend $1800or so for it after taking a hit getting rid of the 1056. I picked up an Integra DTR-6.8 and use the biamp function for the mains in a 5.1 system. The Integra was "only" around $900 and I am very happy with it. I was skeptical at first. Its really only when listening to 2 channel music that I miss the Rotel.

IOWs I don't think you need to spend $1500 to $2000.
Easyaspie is offline  
post #18 of 25 Old 04-07-2008, 09:14 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmccully View Post

I surprised this point hasn't been brought up: You mention the speakers are built-in to your new house. Are they any good? If it's a new home, builders often put in very cheap speakers unless you've specified something otherwise. They might not have built-in rear enclosures and just use the wall cavity as a cabinet. No matter how much money you plow into a receiver, it won't make lousy speakers sound good.

That being said, I like the Onkyo/Integra units and the Marantz at those price points based on both features and amplifier quality.

This is actually something I'm wondering as well. I close on the home in about two weeks and then I'll have complete access and will check out the speakers. I'm assuming if I'm not happy with them I can always take them out and upgrade. I can also have those installed in a different room that doesn't currently have speakers.

Is it possible that he didn't even both putting in speakers? I didn't ask what the speakers were so for all I know he just cut out the hole and put on the grate rather than actually buy speakers. He never had music playing when I was there (though I don't think he would have had a source to play music anyway).

He never sold the electronics in the home as high end. He always sold the home as having all the wiring and the guts behind the wall so that I would be able to upgrade and do anything I wanted. There are a ton of blank wall plates with wiring behind them (so he says). He has been very honest through the process and built a very nice home so don't have any reason not to believe him at this point.
ks_man is offline  
post #19 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 03:42 AM
Advanced Member
 
erick granato's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: toronto area
Posts: 600
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
I'm in the same boat. I have narrowed down my search to two receivers. The Denon AVR-4308ci and the Pioneer VSX-94thx. I have just begun my search so I haven't done any listening tests yet, but both of these models have very similar feature sets so it is a wash for that. But I am really interested in the sound quality. I've read a couple of reviews of both units and they spent way too much time reviewing the bells and whistles and not enough time on the pure sound quality of these units. I have a good a/v set up currently, so I would like to compliment what I have with a new receiver to mainly decode the new high def audio codecs. But 2-channel sound is still very important to me through cd (I don't have an mp3). So if there are any audiophiles out there with some experience with these or any other units around the same price as the op originally posted, let us know. Sound quality, build quality, type of transformers, types of amplifiers, dac's etc.
erick granato is offline  
post #20 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 03:52 AM
AVS Special Member
 
dmcdayton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,314
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
You guys should check out the 7002/8002 thread, lots of happy owners. I have the 8002 and love it, does everything I want. Its also available for below your low end. Its a no-nonsense AVR, not a lot of bells and whistles but has the core of what you'll actually use, plus Toroidal amp section.

Its not just a hobby, its a 401K reduction plan.
dmcdayton is offline  
post #21 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 10:18 AM
Advanced Member
 
Filthy McNasty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 687
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by erick granato View Post

But 2-channel sound is still very important to me through cd (I don't have an mp3). So if there are any audiophiles out there with some experience with these or any other units around the same price as the op originally posted, let us know. Sound quality, build quality, type of transformers, types of amplifiers, dac's etc.

Different game in Canada with pricepoints.

Denon/Marantz/Onkyo are way.... way overpriced.

You can almost buy an Arcam for these prices in Canada.
Look for upcoming models:
Cambridge Audio R740
B&K AVR707
These 2 will certainly offer better 2 ch SQ than the models you are looking at.
Sherwood Newcastle R972 will offer Trinnov room correction
All at msrps within 10% of US prices - not the +50% nonsense some others are doing
Filthy McNasty is offline  
post #22 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 12:05 PM
Member
 
rmccully's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Towson, MD
Posts: 113
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ks_man View Post

This is actually something I'm wondering as well. I close on the home in about two weeks and then I'll have complete access and will check out the speakers. I'm assuming if I'm not happy with them I can always take them out and upgrade. I can also have those installed in a different room that doesn't currently have speakers.

Is it possible that he didn't even both putting in speakers? I didn't ask what the speakers were so for all I know he just cut out the hole and put on the grate rather than actually buy speakers. He never had music playing when I was there (though I don't think he would have had a source to play music anyway).

He never sold the electronics in the home as high end. He always sold the home as having all the wiring and the guts behind the wall so that I would be able to upgrade and do anything I wanted. There are a ton of blank wall plates with wiring behind them (so he says). He has been very honest through the process and built a very nice home so don't have any reason not to believe him at this point.

I didn't mean to suggest that you were being misled in any way, rather just pointing it out so you can keep it in mind. If your budget is $2K for any/all equipment you might need to finalize your system, then I would allocate more money into better speakers before buying a high-end receiver. If you have more money to upgrade the speakers, great.
rmccully is offline  
post #23 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 03:12 PM
Advanced Member
 
erick granato's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: toronto area
Posts: 600
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
dmcdayton- i hadn't considered Marantz but I will look into. Aren't they just lower end from Denon?
Philthy-is that the bar/restaurant? Anyway, good suggestions. I own a Cambridge CD player and a 2-channell amp and pre-amp and they are both great for the money. B&K is very interesting, I'll have to find a dealer in my area and put them on my audition list.
Thanks
erick granato is offline  
post #24 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 04:26 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
ks_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 87
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmccully View Post

I didn't mean to suggest that you were being misled in any way, rather just pointing it out so you can keep it in mind. If your budget is $2K for any/all equipment you might need to finalize your system, then I would allocate more money into better speakers before buying a high-end receiver. If you have more money to upgrade the speakers, great.

I didn't think you were suggesting that, more just throwing it out there. I've been thinking about possibly upgrading the speakers b/c I'd guess he didn't put high end ones in.

A small part of me almost hopes that he didn't put any in (I know it sounds crazy), but that would justify needing to buy speakers and then I can get decent ones. My wife will probably question why I would need to buy new speakers if there already are some in there, but if they don't have any, she wouldn't question it if I bought $600/speaker rather than $200/speaker.
ks_man is offline  
post #25 of 25 Old 04-08-2008, 04:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
dsmith901's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 8,966
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 20
If I were the OP I would get a decent receiver for now, one with full preouts (I like H/K receivers), and mate it with a good power amp (I recommend the Sherwood Newcastle A-965 that sells for about $1k). When the newer HDMI/HD audio codec receivers and processors come out in a few months (Emotiva UMC, H/K AVR354, among others) and after they work out the inevitable bugs, I would consider which one I liked best to use with the power amp. Money saved in the meantime would go toward a SVS subwoofer.

PS: A great deal on refurb H/K receivers with full 2 yr warranty can be had at harmanaudio.com (see Specials). Just be sure you get the 2XX or 3XX model or higher, the lowest models (1XX) do not have the preouts needed to connect to a separate amp.

"The truth is out there!"
dsmith901 is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off