*Official* Denon AVR 1909/789 Thread - Page 172 - AVS Forum
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post #5131 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eriddler View Post

Thanks, never found that one....what exactly did you put in the search container?

You are most welcome. I just searched "channel level" in this thread. Of course, I knew we had covered this & pretty much knew what I was after so I was able to skip right to posts by batpig, which are predictably most definitive. It's been a steep learning curve but I'm catchin' on.

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post #5132 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

You are most welcome. I just searched "channel level" in this thread. Of course, I knew we had covered this & pretty much knew what I was after so I was able to skip right to posts by batpig, which are predictably most definitive. It's been a steep learning curve but I'm catchin' on.

Thanks SoM...

Confirm it doesn't completely destroy the audyssey setup? Just 'adjusts' the trim level for the C channel?
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post #5133 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 07:07 AM
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Absolutely, positively. I wrote down my settings before tweaking but there is a "restore" (as distinguished from "Restorer") function that resets to the auto setup values and puts the box back around "Audyysey MultEQ" on your FP Display (but that will reset crossovers, etc. so I just undo what I've done without using that function)

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post #5134 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 08:38 AM
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I just ordered my Denon 1909 and I was wondering if anybody has the Tekkeon Navdock hooked to the 1909? Does it work well with the 1909?
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post #5135 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eriddler View Post

But, where exactly do I go to adjust the center channel level in the menus?? I have run Audyssey and don't want to have to rerun it. Is this possible?

Fourth question in the FAQ, sir:
http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html

Any manual changes you make automatically override Audyssey settings, also see the Audyssey section of the FAQ:
http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#section_02

I do need to add a note in there that the "global" changes do not change your Quick Selects, we've had a few instances of confusion because of that. If you intend to use the Quick Selects as your primary source selector, make sure to RE-memorize them after you tweak things to your liking because otherwise it will just revert back to the default settings.


Quote:
Dialogue sections in movies is a little too low with surround affects being slightly too high right now.

Out of curiosity, have you played with Dynamic Volume on a mild setting like "Day" to deal with this? The goal with Dynamic Volume is to set the dialogue at the "floor" level you want it and then the rest of the sound stays there or above. The amount of compression of the other stuff is then determined by the day/eve/midnt setting. Since you say things are just slightly off, try Dyn. Vol =DAY and see if that helps.

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post #5136 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rpwheels View Post

I just ordered my Denon 1909 and I was wondering if anybody has the Tekkeon Navdock hooked to the 1909? Does it work well with the 1909?

I can't see why it wouldn't work, it just outputs standard video and stereo audio which any receiver can handle. It's not like the denon brand ipod dock that has a control interface with the recevier, it will just be like any other input device as far as your AVR is concerned like a DVD player or something.

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post #5137 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by de8212 View Post

Please let me know if you figure this out. I have a wii that I will be connecting to my 1909 in the next few days.

I have the Wii connected via component and have no issues, so hopefully mizzer's issue is isolated. Perhaps batpig's suggestions will help him.
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post #5138 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 07:49 PM
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My 1909 arrived on Wednesday eve. I connected all the cables on Wednesday eve. Thursday eve I ran the MultiEQ setup. Friday night, after two days of experiencing the genius of the Denon remote, I stopped by Best Buy, gulped, and dropped $150 on a Harmony 670 (hoping that the wife wouldn't kill me).

The Subwoofer was being way overdriven. My wife was on the warpath. Today I solved that by turning off Dynamic Volume. I spent some time tweaking the remote, and for now I'm loving it!

I spent more time reading the forum tonight. Wish I had done that earlier. Down the road, if I pick up the denon ipod dock, I may regret the input choices I made.

Oh well, for now, loving it -- but can't recommend the Harmony remote enough. Well worth the money. Really!

p.s. Before I got the Harmony, I had the HDMI control on, and suffered from the audio issues of sometimes not working when switching sources or turning things on. Now that I have the harmony, I don't need HDMI control, so it is off and all of that is a thing of the past.
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post #5139 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolok View Post

The Subwoofer was being way overdriven...

Did you run the Audyssey setup with the Gain on the sub at the same level as you were playing it at later? The whole point is it's supposed to balance it out. If it's still too loud you could reduce the gain on the sub so it will be lower, comparatively, than the other speakers... but still allow the dynamic volume feature to do it's thing.
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post #5140 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 08:42 PM
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Did you follow the newly revised Audyssey setup guide? Setup should be (re) done carefully with close mic placement around position#1 set at stereo center, QUIET house, tripod, etc. Did you check your trims? None are maxed (=+/-12), right? Speakers set to SMALL, right? Sub out of the corner? Keep in mind most people are not used to hearing the mix as bass rich as intended at lower volumes. It took me awhile, now I'm lovin' it.

Now, if all that is fine but you want less bass, then here's a neat trick fresh from Chris (mr. audyssey) so you can still enjoy that DynEQ delicious sound:

Make sure wife is not home or WAF will tank. Crank it up to 0 (reference) on some 5.1 source with lots of bass. Tweak the sub down in the Denon till you find happy place. You can use the Channel Select/Enter button technique for ease of use first, then later enter your custom trim, say -5dB or whatever, via the menu route: menu-manual setup-Speaker setup-channel level-SW->-5 as this will then apply the trim it to all modes/inputs. Then, when you turn it down from reference and use DynEQ it will maintain that same bass balance. Voila!

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post #5141 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phdeane View Post

I have the Wii connected via component and have no issues, so hopefully mizzer's issue is isolated. Perhaps batpig's suggestions will help him.

Would you please post your settings? I'm going to tweak the receiver tomorrow and I'd like to know what you've got "on" or "off" etc.

Thanks
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post #5142 of 11340 Old 02-07-2009, 11:48 PM
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I upgraded my system last week and purchased the 789 to go with my RF-63. I havent messed with audessey or any set ups, just plugged it and took her for a test run. Does it normally sound like crap before any setups? It almosts sounds 'muffled'.
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post #5143 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 01:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mizzer View Post

Would you please post your settings? I'm going to tweak the receiver tomorrow and I'd like to know what you've got "on" or "off" etc.

Thanks

Input Setup > Video > Video Select = "Source"

Input Setup > Video > Convert = "On"

Input Setup > Video > i/p Scaler = "A to H"

Input Setup > Video > Resolution = "Auto"

Input Setup > Video > Progressive Mode = "Auto"

Input Setup > Video > Aspect = "Normal"

Let us know how it goes.
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post #5144 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 03:54 AM
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Denon refuses to start,last night everything was OK i was watching DVDs went to sleep and now Denon when i switch it on goes to stb mod and blinks every sec or less ,anyone knows how can i bring him back to life?

Denon is connected to Sony46w4000(HDMI out) and SamsungDVD(HDMI in) speaker system is 5.1 (no sub) I have tried almost everything ( un-plugg and re connect everything on him) but it seems as manual says protection circuit is on -dont know why-and i dont know how to turn it off

Sry for the off-topic post
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post #5145 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 05:03 AM
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First off ... a troubleshooting question is never off topic as that is part of what this thread is meant to do .. provide assistance in troubleshooting. Congrats on having read the manual enough to know that your issue involves the protection circuit kicking in. As it also indicates, if it keeps coming on when you believe there are no issues (eg. no crossed wires, good ventilation), your next step is to call Denon (or the place you purchased it at) as you may have a defective unit.

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post #5146 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 05:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnk19 View Post

I upgraded my system last week and purchased the 789 to go with my RF-63. I havent messed with audessey or any set ups, just plugged it and took her for a test run. Does it normally sound like crap before any setups? It almosts sounds 'muffled'.

The only reason it would sound like crap is if you are starting with crap speakers as a number of posters in this thread have tried to do with cheap HTIB speakers. Although, the sound at this point (before AUTO Setup) is far less important than "after" you run AUTO setup.

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post #5147 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 07:14 AM
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This is my second weekend with my new 789, and I had the weirdest issue pop up:

I have a Motorola 6416 Fios box hooked up via HDMI, and run HDMI from the AVR to my TV. While watching some DVR stuff last night, the audio would completely drop out during commercials, but come back on during the 'show' (except for a very, very slight bass signal (sub?)). I went back and viewed a snippet of a superbowl commercial break I was saving in order to use to tune my dynamic audio settings later on, and most of the blockbuster commercials worked, but not the NBC Heroes promo. This was not an issue replaying the same clip earlier this week.

I assume this had something to do with the audio encoding of the commercials, as previously I would get a lot of 'chirps' as shows went into and out of commercial breaks. These dropouts did not correspond with any changes on the front display as to input type, and happens regardless of whether audessey in on or off.

I went to bed pretty frustrated, and got up this morning just wanting to listen to 'Flashback' on the radio while reading the newspaper. Now my tuner had dropouts -- the FM audio would play for a second, then drop out for a couple seconds, then play for a second, then drop out . . . all on a consistent pattern. I sifted through the manual and pressed all the buttons I could, but nothing would fix this previously fine radio signal.

I turned on the TV so I could review some of the setup menus, and as soon as I did, the dropouts stopped. I played the Superbowl clip, and it is fine. I turned off the TV, and the radio dropouts didn't return.

Does anyone have an idea as to what happened here? I've searched on 'audio drop outs', but all of the old postings seem to relate to random issues, while mine follow a distinct pattern.
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post #5148 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 07:35 AM
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I wonder if turning your HDMI control "OFF", if it is currently "ON", may help.

Also:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post15742014
"This may be "HDMI handshake" related. A variety of measures have been offered on the threads including checking the order components are powered on, output settings in the cable box, etc. You could try using component/optical to AVR (or if you prefer, your HDMI from cable directly to tv with optical out to AVR) which should solve it."
This fellow has a Fios box:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post15732061
"Two thoughts.
1) My Verizon/Fios box is setup to output everything at 1080i so I'm not forcing the TV to switch between different rates. Not sure if this can be done on TWC.

2) Connect the STB to the Denon via component cables and use HDMI from the Denon to the TV. The Denon will upscale the component signal and present one rate to the TV. I also do this and have no HDMI handshake problems. The component connection is not distinguishable from HDMI."

also search batpig's posts in this thread

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post #5149 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 08:25 AM
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there definitely seems to be a problem with tuner drop-outs being caused by HDMI Control. Totally bizarre why the HDMI video connection to the TV would affect the Denon's tuner, but who knows? Didn't somebody cure the problem by switching to a different HDMI input on their TV?

Also try a microprocessor reset, there was somebody in the 2309 thread who was getting similar weirdness (certain commercials would make no sound except for the sub) and a microprocessor reset set things straight.

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post #5150 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 03:09 PM
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I just purchased a set of 4 Mirage Nanosat Prestige speakers and a Nanosat CC center channel. I'm using my existing Infinity PS-8 subwoofer. I ran the Audyssey set up (3 different times so far) and here are my results:

Crossovers: Front - 150 Hz
Center - 150 Hz
Surrounds - 120 Hz

Trim Levels: FR - +12.0
FL - +12.0
C - +7.5
SR - +12.0
SL - +12.0
SW - +2.5

I have a pretty large room - approximately 25 ft x 20 ft - with vaulted ceilings and it is also open to the kitchen/dining area. I have fronts and surrounds mounted from the ceiling at the corners (inverted since they're above 6 ft).

I'm just concerned that the trim levels on the fronts and surrounds are maxed out, although I'm not sure what I can actually do about it. The sound, I think, is very good. I tested out a couple of Blu-Rays (Iron Man and Transformers) and was amazed at the sound compared to my previous "cheapie" speakers (M&S Systems MNC's).

Any opinions?
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post #5151 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 03:40 PM
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I just purchased a Sharp 42", 1080P, LCD 120 HZ . Does anyone know if my Denon 1909 will support 120 HZ ? Everything looks and seems fine, but when I went to HDMI setup, I could only find 60 HZ.
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post #5152 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 03:48 PM
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Tiger, good to know it's soundin' good-that's what it's all about! Maybe someone with those quite unusaul nanosats can bring more knowledge, but here's my theory. Looks like that's a big room for those little satellite speakers. It's possible Audyssey is boosting your satellites to try to match your center and sub, which are louder at position 1. To assure yourself that you are not at max trim and get those 12's on the sats down you can try varying position 1, the height of the mic and try turning the sub volume knob down just a bit and see how it comes out.

I, as always, have questions. What's the distance measurements, what mic pattern did you use, where was pos #1? Could you clarify if you ran it 3 times and got the same exact results or what were the variables in terms of mic placement, etc. and the results?

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post #5153 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 04:41 PM
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"tiny speakers, huge room" is probably the correct diagnosis. since your receiver has Dynamic EQ it attempts to calibrate your speakers so that "reference" is when volume = 0. Unfortunately, getting those tiny nanosats to put reference volume out in that large of a space is tough.

Since four speakers are maxed out, Audyssey is unable to balance the speakers out completely. It is unlikely that both fronts and both surrounds are actually supposed to be at the identical speaker trim levels.

What you may have to do is get an SPL meter and manually balance the speaker levels after running Audyssey. Perhaps you should post your issue in the Audyssey thread and see what Chris (founder/CTO of Audyssey) suggests?

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post #5154 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonnieD View Post

I just purchased a Sharp 42", 1080P, LCD 120 HZ . Does anyone know if my Denon 1909 will support 120 HZ ? Everything looks and seems fine, but when I went to HDMI setup, I could only find 60 HZ.

120Hz is a TV marketing gimmick, it's not an input signal type. There is nothing for your receiver to "pass", it's just extra processing that is done in your TV.

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post #5155 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 05:07 PM
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OK, I have had the 789 for a little more than a week, and I definitely have not got everything figured out. The audio sounds great, but I am a little disappinted with the video.

I have a Samsung 1080i TV, and a run-of-the-mill panasonic DVD player. No BluRay, yet. I run component video from the DVD to the AVR, and then HDMI to the TV.

The image on the TV screen comes out slightly squashed... clearly somewhere in the video processing the aspect ratio is not preserved. My understanding (as a newbie) from reading this thread is that the 789 does not process the video, but passes it along. However, if I run the component directly to the TV, then it looks much better...

Am I missing something? Is there some way to control on the 789 how the video image gets processed?

I mainly bought the 789 for the audio, and so this is not a big deal, but I would like to figure it out. I am sensitive to aspect ratio and so it seems that preserving the aspect ratio would be the first constraint when processing an image.

Will this issue not arise, if I finally get a BluRay player?

Thanks for help, and sorry if I missed any relevent info in the 172 pages of this thread.
...Rick
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post #5156 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 05:11 PM
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Quote:


My understanding (as a newbie) from reading this thread is that the 789 does not process the video, but passes it along.

incorrect, this is only for HDMI VIDEO that it is passthrough-only. It will scale/process analog > HDMI.

You should read through the video scaling section of my website, I'm willing to bet there is a combination of settings on your DVD player (make sure you have told your DVD player that you have a 16:9 TV) and the receiver (you can set video scaling options by input in INPUT SETUP > VIDEO) that will get it to work:
http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#section_03

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post #5157 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

What's the distance measurements, what mic pattern did you use, where was pos #1? Could you clarify if you ran it 3 times and got the same exact results or what were the variables in terms of mic placement, etc. and the results?

Yes, got pretty much the same results each time.

As far as mic placement, position 1 was basically at speaker center of the room. The next 2 were approximately 1.5 ft to the left (each). Positions 4 and 5 were 1.5 ft to the right of position 1 (each). Position 6 was about 1 ft in front of position 1.

The distances are: FL = 15.0 ft; FR = 16.0 ft; C = 9.4 ft; SW = 10.1 ft; SL = 11.2 ft; SR = 12.4 ft

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

"tiny speakers, huge room" is probably the correct diagnosis. since your receiver has Dynamic EQ it attempts to calibrate your speakers so that "reference" is when volume = 0. Unfortunately, getting those tiny nanosats to put reference volume out in that large of a space is tough.

Since four speakers are maxed out, Audyssey is unable to balance the speakers out completely. It is unlikely that both fronts and both surrounds are actually supposed to be at the identical speaker trim levels.

What you may have to do is get an SPL meter and manually balance the speaker levels after running Audyssey. Perhaps you should post your issue in the Audyssey thread and see what Chris (founder/CTO of Audyssey) suggests?

I will also post in the Audyssey thread. Thanks. I agree with both of you that these are small speakers for such a large room. This is our living room and not a dedicated home theater, so "larger" speakers wouldn't meet the WAF. My previous speakers (which I had also set up with Audyssey on the 1909) were small mini-cubes, 4 ohms, 250 Hz - 15 kHz, rated at 35 W continuous, 70 W max, and were located in the same exact spots as now. With them the trim levels were all in the 7.0 - 7.5 range. I just thought that with the better Prestige speakers, the trim levels would be a little lower, if not about the same. Didn't think they would be that much higher.
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post #5158 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Did you follow the newly revised Audyssey setup guide? Setup should be (re) done carefully with close mic placement around position#1 set at stereo center

I was conflicted on what Position #1 in "Audyssey Setup- One Step at a Time" guide should be.

Pg 1, Item II, G : "Place the microphone in the primary listening position for the first measurement." G1. ...the microphone should be placed in the seating position used the most." (20" right of center for my setup)

Pg 3, V, E : "When calibrating only for a primary listening position, ..."
E,1 : "The first microphone position (#1) must always be in the center of the listening area."

Since I am calibrating for more than one seat in the listening area, I placed the mic. for position #1 in the listening position used the most (20" rt of center). For physical reason of ease, I used 2'6" spaces to the recommended mic. locations and order.

So in my setup there is walking space between two couches. Pos. #1 is is on the right couch, pos # 2 is on the left couch.

Questions:
1) Should I make pos. #1 in the actual center of the 'listening area/stereo center stage"?
2) If it is important for all the reference distances to be 2' (as opposed to all being 2'6"), I can do that.
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post #5159 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 06:10 PM
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1) yes
2) no, it's just an approximation

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post #5160 of 11340 Old 02-08-2009, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

1) yes
2) no, it's just an approximation

Thanks Batpig (and my wife loves the 670! )
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