*Official* Denon AVR 1909/789 Thread - Page 40 - AVS Forum
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post #1171 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 11:35 AM
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Are the 1909 and 789 exactly the same? Why 2 different model numbers?
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post #1172 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 11:41 AM
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The search function will reveal those answers sooooo many times in this thread.

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post #1173 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 11:51 AM
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It would be awesome if HDMI_13 would collect some info and edit his original post to include a brief FAQ, including.

1. What's the difference between 789/1909?
2. Why isn't the Dolby TrueHD light going on when I play a Blu Ray on my PS3?
3. Why does it say MULTICH IN?
4. Links to Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume explanations

etc.

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post #1174 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

It would be awesome if HDMI_13 would collect some info and edit his original post to include a brief FAQ, including.

1. What's the difference between 789/1909?
2. Why isn't the Dolby TrueHD light going on when I play a Blu Ray on my PS3?
3. Why does it say MULTICH IN?
4. Links to Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume explanations

etc.

I am sure you would do the best job of compiling that and then it would just be a matter of getting it into the first post by the OP or Moderator.

Gary J
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post #1175 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

It would be awesome if HDMI_13 would collect some info and edit his original post to include a brief FAQ, including.

1. What's the difference between 789/1909?
2. Why isn't the Dolby TrueHD light going on when I play a Blu Ray on my PS3?
3. Why does it say MULTICH IN?
4. Links to Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume explanations

etc.

Then we could scold them to do a search AND check the first page!
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post #1176 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary J View Post

I am sure you would do the best job of compiling that

You know, my boss really would like me to actually do some work now and then

If anyone has other suggestions for FAQ's, throw them out there, maybe I'll whip it up and then HDMI_13 can copy/paste into the first post.

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post #1177 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

You know, my boss really would like me to actually do some work now and then

If anyone has other suggestions for FAQ's, throw them out there, maybe I'll whip it up and then HDMI_13 can copy/paste into the first post.

Uhhh...what's the meaning of life? Do PS3's go to heaven??
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post #1178 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

You know, my boss really would like me to actually do some work now and then

If anyone has other suggestions for FAQ's, throw them out there, maybe I'll whip it up and then HDMI_13 can copy/paste into the first post.

Probably incorporate a link the the Audyssey thread somehow. An excellent FAQ has been assembled in the Audyssey thread and an attempt is being made to contact the OP whose appears to be MIA. We will see what happens there.

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post #1179 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:27 PM
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No I do not. Picture quality is great. I was curious as to whether a HDMI connection via the 789/1909 would show the PQ that much better.
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post #1180 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

You know, my boss really would like me to actually do some work now and then

If anyone has other suggestions for FAQ's, throw them out there, maybe I'll whip it up and then HDMI_13 can copy/paste into the first post.

batpig,

I just got my first Denon and your post on how to assign inputs really helped me out last night. Thanks!
(http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post14445722)
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post #1181 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:37 PM
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No I do not. Picture quality is great. I was curious as to whether a HDMI connection via the 789/1909 would show the PQ that much better.

The PQ difference between HDMI and component video is negligible. The benefits of HDMI are:

1. single-cable connection for audio+video (simplifies hook-up)
2. access to hi-res audio codecs from blu ray / hd dvd

Also, many sources will only upscale via HDMI out -- if you want to use the video processing of the 1909/789 you need to be using an analog source to hdmi out (the processor cannot touch digital video).

I still run my cable box on component because I can't see any difference in PQ, and I get faster channel changes and a much more reliable interface (HDMI is prone to hiccups, "handshake" errors, syncing issues that can be annoying when changing channels).

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post #1182 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

The PQ difference between HDMI and component video is negligible.

Dunno but that 60Mhz component bandwidth isn't even enough for 1080p if my calc is correct, let alone losses in the chain...
ALso when your sources are all digital you don't want to insert unnecessary DA-AD conversions, along with its quality losses - if source is digital (STB, HD DVD, BD) then digital all the way to the end makes more sense IMO (sans the case when your PS3 or STB refuses to ouput 480i over HDMI so you stuck with 480p for 480i DVDs or broadcasts.)
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post #1183 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 01:05 PM
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That's true, theoretically keeping everything all-digital is better, I just can't bring myself to care that much about cable TV for some theoretical 2% increase in PQ when the horrible compression/blocking of HD cable will just dwarf any miniscule PQ gain. I'd rather have quicker channel changes and no worries about my wife calling me up because the HDMI handshake barfed and the screen is blinking. I would definitely recommend HDMI for PS3, HD DVD, etc.

As to the 60MHz thing, you can't even do 1080p component > 1080p HDMI on the Denons, so unless you are using an Xbox with 1080p component in/out that won't matter as much. It should be plenty of bandwidth for 1080i/720p. Plus, the analog>digital conversion tends to do a slight high freq. rolloff on luma/chroma so you will get some softening anyway, even with 100MHz component (as the reviews of 3808ci show).

On a side note, I tested my friend's old Yamaha receiver (component bandwidth spec of 30Mhz) and there was some serious softening of the image on HD signals (1080i/720p), comparing resolution test patterns vs. straight to the TV. I think with 60Mhz you'll be ok for 720p/1080i.

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post #1184 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

The PQ difference between HDMI and component video is negligible. The benefits of HDMI are:

1. single-cable connection for audio+video (simplifies hook-up)
2. access to hi-res audio codecs from blu ray / hd dvd

Also, many sources will only upscale via HDMI out -- if you want to use the video processing of the 1909/789 you need to be using an analog source to hdmi out (the processor cannot touch digital video).

I still run my cable box on component because I can't see any difference in PQ, and I get faster channel changes and a much more reliable interface (HDMI is prone to hiccups, "handshake" errors, syncing issues that can be annoying when changing channels).

So I should save my $$$ and not bother replacing my Pioneer Elite 36 with a Denon 1909 because running HDMI would barely creat a difference in PQ? I'm not a big DVD watcher and I do not have PS3
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post #1185 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 02:23 PM
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Honestly, the biggest reason to get a new receiver is the HDMI audio. If you have no blu ray or hd dvd sources, the only advantage you will gain is fewer cables. Sound quality for legacy audio (dolby digital and dts) will be identical whether it's transmitted by hdmi or optical. In terms of basic functionality and SQ/PQ, you won't gain anything from an HDMI receiver with your components.

The only other reason to get a new receiver would be for the new Audyssey trifecta of MultEQ, Dynamic Volume and Dynamic EQ. From the reviews, those might be worth the price of admission.

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post #1186 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Honestly, the biggest reason to get a new receiver is the HDMI audio. If you have no blu ray or hd dvd sources, the only advantage you will gain is fewer cables. Sound quality for legacy audio (dolby digital and dts) will be identical whether it's transmitted by hdmi or optical. In terms of basic functionality and SQ/PQ, you won't gain anything from an HDMI receiver with your components.

The only other reason to get a new receiver would be for the new Audyssey trifecta of MultEQ, Dynamic Volume and Dynamic EQ. From the reviews, those might be worth the price of admission.

Thanks for your advice. I do have a Pioneer Elite DV-37 (Progrssive Scan) hooked up via component, however, since I do not watch a lot of DVD's I would not replace it with a Blu-Ray
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post #1187 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post

If anyone has other suggestions for FAQ's, throw them out there, maybe I'll whip it up and then HDMI_13 can copy/paste into the first post.

- Temperature readings.
- Power consumption.
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post #1188 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 03:51 PM
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The main reason I started looking for a new receiver was to get multi-zone capability. Then I found out about HDMI, HD codecs, single cable to TV, Audyssey, Dynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume, etc. So, depending on what you have and what you want, there can be many reasons to upgrade your AVR.

Brian
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post #1189 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Hmm, I guess if you have a 7.1 setup the Denon assumes the "default" position is DD + PL IIx when you are receiving 5.1 material. Sorry, it never even occurred to me as I don't run 7.1...

I guess that's what it is. However the odd thing is it never switches to DD no matter however may times you push "STD"..

Odd
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post #1190 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post


As to the 60MHz thing, you can't even do 1080p component > 1080p HDMI on the Denons, so unless you are using an Xbox with 1080p component in/out that won't matter as much.

Please explain. I am thinking about getting a 1909 and my Xbox 360 is component. Are you saying that if I run the Xbox 360 through the Denon, I will not get 1080p?

Will I be better off connecting the Xbox 360 directly to the tv and just sending an optical back to the receiver?
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post #1191 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 05:42 PM
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Most new AVR's (including these Denons) that do component>hdmi transcoding have a limit of 1080i. They can do 1080p via component, they just can't output it over HDMI.

So if you connect your Xbox 360 via component, your choices are:
1. Set the 360 to 720p or 1080i
or if you really want 1080,
2. Run a component cable from the denon to the TV and use that monitor output for analog signals
3. component straight to TV, optical to Xbox

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post #1192 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 05:51 PM
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Just finished running auto setup and was wondering if its possible to adjust the subwoofer channel setting under manual settings without affecting Dynamice Eq. The subwoofer is a tad to strong for my taste
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post #1193 of 11355 Old 08-28-2008, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GQFireGuy View Post

I have the latest PS3 firmware and i have set my PS3 to Linear. I still don;t see MultiCH In anywhere on the display. The only thing i see on the display is DIG, HDMI auto, and AudysseyEQ. I even tried to set it to bitstream to let the reciever do the decoding and i saw nothing diffrerent!

What am i doing wrong?

Being new to the PS3, I had a problem getting multi-channel LPCM until I had a closer look at one of the PS3's menus.

When setting up your audio under "Sound Settings / Audio Output Settings / HDMI / Automatic / Manual" you're presented with another menu called the "Settings List" which lists various audio output formats. Whichever formats you select, you must hit the "x" button to save the settings. Failing to hit the "x" button resulted in 2 ch. LPCM for me.

I had been in the "Settings List" several times and it all looked good, but instead of saving the settings, I simply exited the menu. It's a sloppy mistake on my part and perhaps you've done the same thing.

HTH
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post #1194 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 01:01 AM
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Question time!

I am currently using cheap HTIB Sony Satellite speakers. They create a weird static sound when used with my new 1909 receiver. Of course, I decided to turn down the bass all the way to zero and then I had crystal clear sound at good volume levels - just no bass at all. This was quite frustrating. Although a different problem from the humm/buzz of the Onkyo 606 I returned to get this, I am starting to get really annoyed by it all.

Anyway, the Sony speakers are supposedly 6 ohm. According to the owners manual 6 ohm is an accepted input. However, I was wondering if that was perhaps part of the problem? Would 8ohm speakers make the weird sound go away?

Right now I am looking at a way to fix this issue without spending too terribly much. I might upgrade the speakers to the Onkyo SKS-HT540 7.1 Channel Home Theater Speaker System if that would solve my problem.

Does anyone have any suggestions? I really could use some help in this area and soon. It has been driving me nuts and I really want to start enjoying my receiver!
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post #1195 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 04:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOBUG View Post

Just finished running auto setup and was wondering if its possible to adjust the subwoofer channel setting under manual settings without affecting Dynamice Eq. The subwoofer is a tad to strong for my taste

There is that setting somewhere where it says "Subwoofer attenuation" it can be set to ON or OFF. it is OFF by default. Setting it to ON may be is what you wanted.
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post #1196 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GenPion View Post

Question time!

I am currently using cheap HTIB Sony Satellite speakers. They create a weird static sound when used with my new 1909 receiver. Of course, I decided to turn down the bass all the way to zero and then I had crystal clear sound at good volume levels - just no bass at all. This was quite frustrating. Although a different problem from the humm/buzz of the Onkyo 606 I returned to get this, I am starting to get really annoyed by it all.

Anyway, the Sony speakers are supposedly 6 ohm. According to the owners manual 6 ohm is an accepted input. However, I was wondering if that was perhaps part of the problem? Would 8ohm speakers make the weird sound go away?

Right now I am looking at a way to fix this issue without spending too terribly much. I might upgrade the speakers to the Onkyo SKS-HT540 7.1 Channel Home Theater Speaker System if that would solve my problem.

Does anyone have any suggestions? I really could use some help in this area and soon. It has been driving me nuts and I really want to start enjoying my receiver!

Did you check your speaker wires? Sometimes if the wire is not connected properly may produce static sound. Try hook up the speakers with other receiver if still hear weird sound then it is the speaker may be you should replace it.
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post #1197 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 05:30 AM
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Originally Posted by kulims View Post

There is that setting somewhere where it says "Subwoofer attenuation" it can be set to ON or OFF. it is OFF by default. Setting it to ON may be is what you wanted.

No. That is not correct. That sub attenuation is while using Ext. Inputs.
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post #1198 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 06:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Honestly, the biggest reason to get a new receiver is the HDMI audio. If you have no blu ray or hd dvd sources, the only advantage you will gain is fewer cables. Sound quality for legacy audio (dolby digital and dts) will be identical whether it's transmitted by hdmi or optical. In terms of basic functionality and SQ/PQ, you won't gain anything from an HDMI receiver with your components.

The only other reason to get a new receiver would be for the new Audyssey trifecta of MultEQ, Dynamic Volume and Dynamic EQ. From the reviews, those might be worth the price of admission.

thats the reason I upgraded my Onkyo 602 plus the good deal to be had on the Denon 1909. i didnt have any HD-audio capable devices at the time (xbox 360, directv hr21, and oppo 981) but the thought of connecting everything through HDMI with a single cable and those new audyssey features, i couldnt pass up. and with the live cashback through ebay, i picked up a used but excellent condition ps3 despite not having any games or BR movies lol. i still have the 360 connected to tv through VGA and to receiver through optical. its not working right now though due to overheating so i still need to fix it
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post #1199 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOBUG View Post

Just finished running auto setup and was wondering if its possible to adjust the subwoofer channel setting under manual settings without affecting Dynamice Eq. The subwoofer is a tad to strong for my taste

I have the same issue after auto setup...sub is way too strong on some material, especially on some tv shows that seem to have a background 'rumbling' going on. I have tried turning the volume control on the back of the sub down, which tames it down, although it loses some punch on explosions etc. I guess we have to find a happy medium here.
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post #1200 of 11355 Old 08-29-2008, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBuck View Post

I have the same issue after auto setup...sub is way too strong on some material, especially on some tv shows that seem to have a background 'rumbling' going on. I have tried turning the volume control on the back of the sub down, which tames it down, although it loses some punch on explosions etc. I guess we have to find a happy medium here.

I see quite a bit of difference between sources. The most common adjustments I make to Audyssey are to raise the center channel and lower the SW.

My current strategy is to use Quickset 1 as my default setup, with the adjustments straight from Audyssey. When I have a source that needs to have the center channel or the sub tweaked, I just press Enter on the remote until C or SW comes up and then make my adjustments for the specific source/material. When I switch inputs or channels, I hit Quickset 1 to return to my starting point and make adjustments as needed.
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