Official Pioneer SC-05 and SC-07 Owners Thread - Page 425 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12721 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 05:53 AM
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Got my SC-07 on Wednesday to replace my Onkyo 804. Sounds great. Nice and clean. The only weird thing is that I have to turn up the volume at least 10db-15 db higher than my Onkyo even though my SC-07 has 35 watts per channel more power. I could play a movie like the Matrix at -25db on the Onkyo but have to set it at -10db on the SC-07. This is also true with my directv settings. All connections are HDMI. The loudness plus is on. The midnight setting is off. Any ideas why this is so?
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post #12722 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 05:56 AM
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You had to mention that the 07 are mostly made in Malaysia. Mine is too. Just checked. I assumed it was "made in Japan" as this is an Elite model. And my Panasonic DMP-BD60 BD player is "made in China". What can you do? Every one wants to save money and make more money. Just how it is.

Nikon, manufacturers most of the "point & shoot" and almost all DSLR's outside of Japan. Only their top 3 models are made in Japan still. Along with only their Pro lenses (gold band at the front of lens).

And I never really looked to make sure the equipment I was buying was "made in japan". That and today companies like Pioneer and Nikon do try to maintain a high quality control standard abroad. So I don't think we have much to worry about.

My Nikon D300 is made in...damn I forgot...too lazy to run upstairs and check...oh right it was in Thailand. Lots of happy D300 owners out there. No problems so far. No signs of bad build quality.

But given the choice of course I would prefer "made in Japan". I am also a little biased that way. I don't think too many receivers are still made in Japan (Japanese brands). And I think most of the more important assembly is robotic. It's the "simpler tasks" that are done by human hands.

Will try to remember to watch for "made in ______" in the future though.
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post #12723 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 06:00 AM
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This has been discussed in GREAT detail throughout the thread - I speak from experience since I am still trying to read all of it. Every receiver is different, in fact every movie or other media type can be different as far as listening levels. Some I have to turn it up to listen more than others. As others far more knowledgeable than I am have stated there is no correlation between receivers in regards to volume/db - they are all different. That being said, crank it up to the level you desire and enjoy your new receiver.

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post #12724 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post

This has been discussed in GREAT detail throughout the thread - I speak from experience since I am still trying to read all of it. Every receiver is different, in fact every movie or other media type can be different as far as listening levels. Some I have to turn it up to listen more than others. As others far more knowledgeable than I am have stated there is no correlation between receivers in regards to volume/db - they are all different. That being said, crank it up to the level you desire and enjoy your new receiver.

I appreciate your reply and I understand that there are differences. However the volume of some movies and shows have gone up to 0 or 1+ dbs not being overly loud. The top setting of the receiver is +12db. I guess I expected more headroom.
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post #12725 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 06:25 AM
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I've noticed something similar but not at those levels. I found that between -30 and -20 my 07 is relatively quiet. Not that I don't hear sound of course. It just doesn't really come alive till around -20. Depending on the BD being played.

I usually watch Dolby TrueHD encoded BD's @ -17 to -15. But when playing DTS HD MSTR encoded BD's -17 is actually loud. So I feel like dropping it to -18 or so. I keep it under -17. So far. I live in a town home. Perhaps when both neighbors are out will I crank it up higher. Perhaps on a weekend. But where it's at now...more than acceptable.
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post #12726 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 06:59 AM
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I'm seriously considering the SC-07 receiver but I can't find many specs on it.
Can anyone tell me the height of the SC-07 as I have 7.25in of space in my rack (which I can't adjust) ?
Thanks
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post #12727 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naughtybutnice View Post

I'm seriously considering the SC-07 receiver but I can't find many specs on it.
Can anyone tell me the height of the SC-07 as I have 7.25in of space in my rack (which I can't adjust) ?
Thanks

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post16988317
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post #12728 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 07:12 AM
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nbn, unfortunately, it's not going to fit...

dimensions are 16 7/8 X 7 7/8 X 18 1/8...

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post #12729 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 07:27 AM
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some of you are really cranking it, with an 05 listening to DD(as to not having a bd player) at -28 is a decent audio level and I'm hearing impaired(wearing hearing aids). Have you all loss your sense of hearing over time? hahahaha, you know what they say as to kids listening to all the booming loud sounds will take its toll years later in life.

edit: My 05 is installed and its heavy. Where would I find the info where my unit was produced at exactly? Would the info be stated on the original box?
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post #12730 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pkzaher View Post

any of you heard side by side comparrison?

I had the 1019 for about 2 weeks and traded up once I got a deal on an 05. No, I did not do any sid-by-side comparisons. Like Chris mentioned, the amplification sections are in two different classes. You can guess which class I prefer. For me the 05 has opened up a whole new realm of audio in movies and music listening in general. The 1019 would be fine for 90%, but I'm glad and fortunate that I can be in the other 10%.
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post #12731 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 07:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naughtybutnice View Post

I'm seriously considering the SC-07 receiver but I can't find many specs on it.
Can anyone tell me the height of the SC-07 as I have 7.25in of space in my rack (which I can't adjust) ?
Thanks

Linked on first page: Downloads
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/St...AD_Drawing.pdf

"you're just jealous 'cause the voices only talk to me"
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post #12732 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:01 AM
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with a previous pio receiver to accomplish the above i put the imput to cd, and there was a video select button on the remote i could push until the xbox was output thru video and the CD was the audio.

how can you do that with this? input setup didnt seem to work.

cd player connected via analog, xbox via component, optical.
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post #12733 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pochoboy View Post

.. Where would I find the info where my unit was produced at exactly? Would the info be stated on the original box?

Yes. The original box. Mine was made in Malaysia. A few members seem concerned about where their 05/07 were made. Everything nowdays is made in Asia. Just the way it is. I wouldn't have cared if my 05 was made in Timbuktu! Nor, do I worry about Pioneers long term future. Things will turn around in time, and I'm sure Pioneer will survive. Like I've said on this thread before... The 05/07 IMO are exceptional AVRs for the price - at least what I paid. But then again, value is always relative. The last thing I bought where I was concerned where it was made, was my 1999 Nissan Maxima. I wanted it made in Japan, and that was the last year it was made there - then anyway. The newer 2000s were being made in America. No offense to cars made in America, just my preference.

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post #12734 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leeford View Post

with a previous pio receiver to accomplish the above i put the imput to cd, and there was a video select button on the remote i could push until the xbox was output thru video and the CD was the audio.

how can you do that with this? input setup didnt seem to work.

cd player connected via analog, xbox via component, optical.


No problem, leeford

One Option:
You'll need to set up two assignments.. one for your xbox and another for CD
Say, you assign CD and DVD.....

Goto your Input setup:
Select DVD input
Digital In, OPT 1-x
and Component IN (Comp 1-x)
That should set up your remote to switch for your Xbox for games or DVD

page 92:

Component inputs:


Now just make your analog connection for CD from your xbox into the CD inputs on your SC

You'll use CD on your remote to activate it.

cd input location:


default settings (page 93):


This is how I connected my DVD/CD players.

Hope this helps! Please let us know

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post #12735 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pochoboy View Post

.......................edit: My 05 is installed and its heavy. Where would I find the info where my unit was produced at exactly? Would the info be stated on the original box?

In addition to the box,
If you look at the brochure on the SC-07 (page 2) you'll see that's correct.
http://www.pioneer-america.com/ephox...iles/SC-07.pdf

Closeup from Brochure:


Malaysia has been one of Pioneer's main production plants for their receivers for decades.
Never heard of any issues on their receivers..
Until recently, I believe only their speakers, Kuros and Blu-ray players were made in Japan.

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post #12736 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gvatty View Post

I appreciate your reply and I understand that there are differences. However the volume of some movies and shows have gone up to 0 or 1+ dbs not being overly loud. The top setting of the receiver is +12db. I guess I expected more headroom.

This may of been caused by the MCACC, maybe the db of the individual speakers are lower on SC then the Onkyos.
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post #12737 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gvatty View Post

I appreciate your reply and I understand that there are differences. However the volume of some movies and shows have gone up to 0 or 1+ dbs not being overly loud. The top setting of the receiver is +12db. I guess I expected more headroom.

Were the connections to your Onkyo also HDMI?
I've read several posts about the differences in levels between DVD - DD+DTS vs. BD - DD+DTS Lossless codecs, where the Lossless are much quieter. I have not found that to be the case, but perhaps it depends on the discs used.

I have noticed that there is a very tight correlation between my Denon and new Pio SC07. Where I was playing a BD at -20 on my Denon, it would be about the same on my Pio SC07.

Maybe my Ascends are super efficient, but pretty much any source played louder than -10 is nearly painful!

shane

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post #12738 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamHandMan View Post

This may of been caused by the MCACC, maybe the db of the individual speakers are lower on SC then the Onkyos.

+1

Good point JamHandMan. I found that the MCACC decreased the overall volume of ALL channels. I increased those settings equally across the board.

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post #12739 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:10 AM
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I agree with CHP_VR. There isn't anything to worry about finding out our 07 are made in Malaysia. Have any of you been to Malaysia or seen any travel shows? It's a VERY modern city. Has been for decades. It's not some backwards Asian country. They also have some of the most impressive architecture. Noteably one of the tallest buildings in the world. Twin towers. Forget the name. So if they have the ability for world class architecture I'm sure they can find workers capable enough to assemble the receivers. That and as I said...I'm sure Pioneer has a very stringent quality control system setup.

It's not like finding out our gear was "made in China" (my Panasonic BD60 BD player was made in China...the 80 probably is too). Where it can still vary depending on the city. But having said that even China...they are advancing very fast. Almost at a geometric rate. Building up their major cities to the point of bettering some major North American cities in areas such as transportation. Visit Shanghai some time. Ride their Maglev train. I did. Takes you from central Shanghai to their airport. I think we were flying down the track at almost 400 kmph!! They also have their Porsche and Ferrari clubs! World class food too.

Having said that. "Made in Japan" is still where it's at IMHO. Though look how long it took for them to establish this reputation. Countries like Malaysia, Thailand and China are already producing very reliable products. In maybe 1/5 the time. Just have yet to establish their reps as Japan has done (which isn't do say there aren't duds made in Japan).
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post #12740 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:11 AM
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CHP_VR, thank you for the info and yes it was produced in Malaysia, does it matter? I don't think so now that I look back on it as there's not many complaints on the unit itself.

Do you all register your units online with Pioneer? I guess I'm going to have to breakdown my install to get the serial# off the sc for my product registration. And that being so I'm going to attach the rs232 db9 serial cable to the unit with a 20' usb cable to my pc in another room and leave it attached although I may just use it once or twice to view my MCACC settings.
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post #12741 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:19 AM
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Gee, I was gone all day yesterday and came home to over 3 pages of Posts. I thought something important had happened like you guys missed me and was talking behind my back.

Did I say how much I love this Thread??

I love you, man!
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post #12742 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gvatty View Post

Got my SC-07 on Wednesday to replace my Onkyo 804. Sounds great. Nice and clean. The only weird thing is that I have to turn up the volume at least 10db-15 db higher than my Onkyo even though my SC-07 has 35 watts per channel more power. I could play a movie like the Matrix at -25db on the Onkyo but have to set it at -10db on the SC-07. This is also true with my directv settings. All connections are HDMI. The loudness plus is on. The midnight setting is off. Any ideas why this is so?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gvatty View Post

I appreciate your reply and I understand that there are differences. However the volume of some movies and shows have gone up to 0 or 1+ dbs not being overly loud. The top setting of the receiver is +12db. I guess I expected more headroom.

First of all, I'll assume you have run MCACC. If you haven't, then the results you get at a given readout level are a function of your speaker sensitivity vs the assumption Pioneer made with their factory settings.

MCACC re-calibrates the sound levels so that 0 on its scale equals reference levels (with internally generated tones; external input can differ for various reasons). This generally results in the sound being softer or louder at the same numeric readout than it was pre-calibration, depending on the sensitivity of the speakers. Calibration to reference is mandated by THX to insure various processes work as they were intended. It does not affect the maximum volume the amp can put out. It just "corrects" the scale.

On non-THX receivers, the numbers on the display vary by manufacturer and often from year to year by the same manufacturer. They tell you nothing at all about the receiver's power output.

It once was fairly common for receiver manufacturers to set their volume control 0 point at some fixed value below the receiver's maximum output, frequently -10dB. In some, 0 was the maximum. This probably gave rise to the myth that the comparative settings told you something about the amps' relative power.

With the advent of automated level balancing systems such as MCACC, it became easy to apply some other standard, such as making 0 approximately equal to reference level. But manufacturers don't all follow the same practice and no industry-wide standards exist.

The volume control setting used to achieve a given listening level is affected by several other factors, such as the program content (not everything is recorded at the same level nor does it employ the same dynamic range) and the sensitivity of the output of the various connected components. MCACC uses internally generated tones and cannot account for these differences.

Bottom line is the numbers on the display are useful to help guide you to the same comfortable loudness level the next time you return to a source, but nothing to be concerned about beyond that.

That said, if you have run MCACC and still have to listen at or near 0, something is wrong, as most people would find that ear splitting (85dB average, with 105dB peaks). This first thing I'd do is run MCACC again to see if the condition corrects itself.
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post #12743 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:31 AM - Thread Starter
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pochoboy
I register all my stuff, including Pioneer.. I like the Pioneer registration 'cause it keeps a list of your equipment and serial numbers you can look up quickly on those rare occasions you might need it.. Once in while they'll send you some news emails and notices pertaining to your registered equipment.

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Yeah, we were talking about you, but we changed all the posts early this morning

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post #12744 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:44 AM - Thread Starter
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MacFan;

Thanks again for the well written explaination!!
I'm going to be changing the front page because of lack of space, time permitting...
I'll be adding this to it.

Thanks for the time and effort!

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post #12745 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

nbn, unfortunately, it's not going to fit...

dimensions are 16 7/8 X 7 7/8 X 18 1/8...

Thanks guys. Just my luck...finally a receiver I like...and it won't fit

Oh well.. back to the drawing board...........
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post #12746 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perpendicular View Post

Gee, I was gone all day yesterday and came home to over 3 pages of Posts. I thought something important had happened like you guys missed me and was talking behind my back.

Did I say how much I love this Thread??

I love you, man!

We missed you perp. See what a difference a day can make? Hum... something about that 'perp' abbreviation.

rickybob
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post #12747 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan424 View Post

First of all, I'll assume you have run MCACC. If you haven't, then the results you get at a given readout level are a function of your speaker sensitivity vs the assumption Pioneer made with their factory settings.

MCACC re-calibrates the sound levels so that 0 on its scale equals reference levels (with internally generated tones; external input can differ for various reasons). This generally results in the sound being softer or louder at the same numeric readout than it was pre-calibration, depending on the sensitivity of the speakers. Calibration to reference is mandated by THX to insure various processes work as they were intended. It does not affect the maximum volume the amp can put out. It just "corrects" the scale.

On non-THX receivers, the numbers on the display vary by manufacturer and often from year to year by the same manufacturer. They tell you nothing at all about the receiver's power output.

It once was fairly common for receiver manufacturers to set their volume control 0 point at some fixed value below the receiver's maximum output, frequently -10dB. In some, 0 was the maximum. This probably gave rise to the myth that the comparative settings told you something about the amps' relative power.

With the advent of automated level balancing systems such as MCACC, it became easy to apply some other standard, such as making 0 approximately equal to reference level. But manufacturers don't all follow the same practice and no industry-wide standards exist.

The volume control setting used to achieve a given listening level is affected by several other factors, such as the program content (not everything is recorded at the same level nor does it employ the same dynamic range) and the sensitivity of the output of the various connected components. MCACC uses internally generated tones and cannot account for these differences.

Bottom line is the numbers on the display are useful to help guide you to the same comfortable loudness level the next time you return to a source, but nothing to be concerned about beyond that.

That said, if you have run MCACC and still have to listen at or near 0, something is wrong, as most people would find that ear splitting (85dB average, with 105dB peaks). This first thing I'd do is run MCACC again to see if the condition corrects itself.

Thank you all for your explanations. Yes, I did run the MCACC. All connections are HDMI. My bd player is a ps3 which can explain slightly lower volume on blurays. But volume is also low on my directv satellite box. My main speakers are Polk Monitor 70s, Center channel Polk CS2, surrounds Polk R50 and rear surrounds are Polk Monitor 40s. My subwoofer is a Klipsch Synergy Sub-10. I will rerun the MCACC this weekend and see if that changes anything.
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post #12748 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shane55 View Post

+1

Good point JamHandMan. I found that the MCACC decreased the overall volume of ALL channels. I increased those settings equally across the board.

shane

You should always take caution when doing that, however....

Remember that MCACC is adding gain to all channels by virtue of EQ, so that is usually the reason why there isn't always a channel at unity and others are adjusted against that... when adding DSP processing, the headroom decreases in most cases, and raising channel levels back up could cause clipping.
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post #12749 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 11:11 AM
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Guys a simple question , do I use " Dual ch1" or ch2 or "ch1 and 2", to watch tv or movies, I read the description on the manual, but it did not say where to leave it at. Thanks. one more I know I have to turn "control on" to adjust bass and treable, but I can't see it anywhr=ere , I know I go under MACC, but is not there? , I see everything else but that.
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post #12750 of 17123 Old 08-14-2009, 11:21 AM
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llep64,
You cant be in DIRECT or PURE DIRECT modes almost any other,AUTO SURROUND,STEREO,ALL CH STEREO,etc. you should see TONE available
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