Official Pioneer SC-05 and SC-07 Owners Thread - Page 509 - AVS Forum
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post #15241 of 17114 Old 01-09-2010, 06:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Shane,

Excellent review!

Thank you!
Added it to member's reviews
(linked on first page as page 3 of member's reviews and noted on bottom.)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post17583148

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post #15242 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shane55 View Post


Bottom line... if the 83SE's DAC's are very far superior to what the standard 83 has, maybe your results will be spectacular! But again... maybe not.

I'd be happy with the straight Oppo DAC sound, but I'm very happy with the 07's DACs and MCACC.

shane

(Yeah, that post probably didn't help you much... )

EDIT: Somehow missed Macfan's post. Obviously I agree completely.

nope this helps. if the default is close I have lots more confidence that the SE will be better. Now I may decide that the cost benefit is goofed but thats my problem. I will post when I have something useful. thanks all.
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post #15243 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 11:14 AM
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SC-05 HGM Update...

Bingo!

Hooked up my daughter's ipod Touch 2nd Gen. It would not play through the main speakers, only through the ipod speaker. I did the firmware update this morning.

It fixed it.

Thanks all for the guidance especially CHP_VR (Charles)

Mike

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post #15244 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOG9 View Post

...So if I use DIRECT when listening to two-channel audio (redbook cds) via the analog inputs on the SC-07, I would still benefit from the MCACC room calibration and processing, but the receiver would not be using the Wolfson DACs and the signal would have already been converted to analog (and then sent via the CD or Blu-ray's analog outs) in the CD or Blu-ray player prior to ever getting to the SC-07?

It's not entirely clear to me which processing functions are performed in the analog domain and which in digital, but in my (admittedly unscientific) tests Direct incorporated bass management functions (among other things) on two channel analog input and Pure Direct did not. This suggests that Direct may use the SC-07's ADCs to perform some processing in the digital realm, then use the DAC's to return the signal to analog. Obviously with 2 channel analog connections for CDs, D/A conversion is being done in the player, so it may be done twice using Direct.

This has been controversial as it is contrary to conventional wisdom, but a couple of us also observed that MCACC corrections seemed to be applied under Pure Direct. Another member's reading of the schematics suggested that this may be being done in the analog realm.
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post #15245 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan424 View Post

It can become complicated, but the short answer is that the extra processing generally adds channels. However, with a 5.1 setup and 5.1 source, there is nothing to add. The ones you mention would add rear channels so that a 5.1 source would provide rear channel sound to a 7.1 setup. You should be able to access THX Cinema, though (as well as THX Music and Games).

Pioneer used to include a multipage chart showing what is available with what sources with which settings. I think it confused as many people as it helped. In any case, they dropped it, but you can find it by downloading the SC-07 manual. It starts on page 128.

I'm one of the few people in these forums without an ipod , so I'll let someone else deal with that.

thanks so much....
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post #15246 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 12:41 PM
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[quote=CHP_VR;17889145]Video definitely works on the SC-09TX, Heckler..
Here's how it looks and how I have it set up on mine:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...d#post17359669

I don't think you can stream video from the iPod on the SC-05/07, but you should be able to display pictures, however.

With the SC-25/27 you should be able to play video according to the manual.
Make sure you have it connected with the supplied Pioneer cable as shown on page 43 of your manual...

Note compatibility on page 52:
This system is compatible with the audio and video of the iPod nano, iPod fifth generation (audio only), iPod classic, iPod touch and iPhone.
However, some of the functions may be restricted for some models. The system is not compatible with the iPod shuffle.
Compatibility may vary depending on the software version of your iPod and iPhone. Please be sure to use the latest available software
version.

Note on page 52, for video, you have to switch control from the receiver to the iPod from the remote.

1 Press iPod CTRL to switch the iPod controls.
This enables operation and display on your iPod, and this
receiver's remote control and GUI screen become
inactive.
2 Press iPod CTRL again to switch back to the receiver
controls.

This is similar to how the SC-09 works as well..



Also, on your iPod, make sure you have output to DISPLAY set.
On my nanopod its: VIDEO > SETTINGS > TV OUT
There's also settings for signal, screen and size you can play with.

Hope that helps. [/QUOT

Awesome.......
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post #15247 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan424 View Post

This has been controversial as it is contrary to conventional wisdom, but a couple of us also observed that MCACC corrections seemed to be applied under Pure Direct. Another member's reading of the schematics suggested that this may be being done in the analog realm.

This is interesting.
No matter what I do in "Pure Direct" mode, I cannot get MCACC to activate.

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post #15248 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perpendicular View Post

This is interesting.
No matter what I do in "Pure Direct" mode, I cannot get MCACC to activate.

I'm not referring to the panel indicators. The lights were out, as they are expected to be. It was the actual sound. At the time I had some settings that were very different from one another, and when cycling through them while listening to Pure Direct the sound clearly changed. I didn't believe my ears at first, as it was totally contrary to my expectations. I later repeated this several times with different source material. My observations were also confirmed by another member. I had similar results with both a VSX-01 and an SC-07. It's possible that it is a less than full MCACC correction, but, as I recall, changes speaker balance were especially obvious.
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post #15249 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan424 View Post

I'm not referring to the panel indicators. The lights were out, as they are expected to be. It was the actual sound. At the time I had some settings that were very different from one another, and when cycling through them while listening to Pure Direct the sound clearly changed. I didn't believe my ears at first, as it was totally contrary to my expectations. I later repeated this several times with different source material. My observations were also confirmed by another member. I had similar results with both a VSX-01 and an SC-07. It's possible that it is a less than full MCACC correction, but, as I recall, changes speaker balance were especially obvious.

I can clearly hear the change too because my speakers are on-wall.
I just performed a test between my 2-channel amp and SC-07 in "Pure Mode".
It sounds rather similair, if you take in account that I'm listening to the HDMI output of my Oppo player into the SC-07 and analog output of the Oppo into the 2-channel amp.
Have you or anyone performed an actual test to see if the MCACC circuits are being used in the SC-07?
When I get the time, I was thinking of testing this theory myself because I find it hard to believe.

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post #15250 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perpendicular View Post

I can clearly hear the change too because my speakers are on-wall.
I just performed a test between my 2-channel amp and SC-07 in "Pure Mode".
It sounds rather similair, if you take in account that I'm listening to the HDMI output of my Oppo player into the SC-07 and analog output of the Oppo into the 2-channel amp.
Have you or anyone performed an actual test to see if the MCACC circuits are being used in the SC-07?
When I get the time, I was thinking of testing this theory myself because I find it hard to believe.

I found it hard to believe too, but I don't have any good way to determine if the circuits are working other than what my ears told me. I even doubted them until someone else reported the same results.

My SMS-1 "scope" verified that bass management is bypassed in Pure Direct (""Small" R/L speakers revert to full range and the subwoofer is not active in analog stereo), but I have nothing similar that would objectively demonstrate MCACC's effect one way or the other.

On the other hand, as I mentioned before, I had some very different settings stored when I did this, so there was nothing too subtle about the changes. If it was my imagination, it was in overdrive.
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post #15251 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 04:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhrischuk View Post

SC-05 HGM Update...

Bingo!

Hooked up my daughter's ipod Touch 2nd Gen. It would not play through the main speakers, only through the ipod speaker. I did the firmware update this morning.

It fixed it.

Thanks all for the guidance especially CHP_VR (Charles)

Mike

Mike,

Glad it worked for you!

Added your name to the list
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post16631529

Thanks for following up with us!

Enjoy!

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Questions about the SC-07 or SC-05? start here
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post #15252 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHP_VR View Post

Mike,

Glad it worked for you!

Added your name to the list
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post16631529

Thanks for following up with us!

Enjoy!

Add me too - I updated my firmware this morning for HMG speed issues - no issues and seems a little more responsive now.

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post #15253 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan424 View Post

I found it hard to believe too, but I don't have any good way to determine if the circuits are working other than what my ears told me. I even doubted them until someone else reported the same results.

My SMS-1 "scope" verified that bass management is bypassed in Pure Direct (""Small" R/L speakers revert to full range and the subwoofer is not active in analog stereo), but I have nothing similar that would objectively demonstrate MCACC's effect one way or the other.

On the other hand, as I mentioned before, I had some very different settings stored when I did this, so there was nothing too subtle about the changes. If it was my imagination, it was in overdrive.

Hmmm...
When I did my comparisons I found that there was a sizable difference (on Analog feed from the BDP-83) between Pure Direct and Stereo with MCACC applied. Assuming MCACC is active in both cases, might that only have been because the sub (BM) is shut off in PD mode? Maybe that in addition to a minimized MCACC in PD mode?

Very interesting indeed.

shane

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My HT Setup:
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post #15254 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 06:36 PM
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My father's SC-05 was returned last week from repair. My original posts are dated 12/13/09. It did get a new HDMI board. If anyone remembers he had no video output from the 05. He also has 2 LED's out, the power button and one of the blue LED's. They did not get repaired, the repair center was told about them. No big deal but how hard are they to replace? My father does not want to send this beast back ot just for those but if they are not that hard to replace we would attempt it. Does a service manual come in handy?

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post #15255 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 10:26 PM - Thread Starter
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ThePrisoner,

Glad you got your father's SC-05 back and it's working!
(with the exception of the LEDs.. anyway)

At this point, we're not sure if it the contacts, bad LEDs or connections at this point.. If you don't want to send it in to Pioneer for that, I'd suggest waiting until someone else does..
Hopefully, they will post back with what the issue is..

I don't recommend opening up your receiver to try to repair it while it's still under warrantee.. But, of course, it's your call.. and if you do, please let us know what you find.

BTW, adding your name to list.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...d#post17121071

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post #15256 of 17114 Old 01-10-2010, 10:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJ7 View Post

Add me too - I updated my firmware this morning for HMG speed issues - no issues and seems a little more responsive now.

Your name added to list, TJ7
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post16631529
Thanks for letting us know!
Much appreciated!

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post #15257 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 04:09 AM
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Thank you. I'll keep checking this thread.

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post #15258 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 09:46 AM
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OK Next post is going to be my review and picture thread. It is quite a bit of stuff so may take me a few attempts to get it right

EDIT: OK looks like pictures came through, but none of the hyperlinks for the equipment -- will edit that one by one

EDIT -- CHP not going to tell you where to link me , but my setup while not a zone 3 setup yet does answer the problem that Geoff
posts in his zone 3 setup. I do believe it is worth linking to / adding a note that HDMI Out is either speaker / through HDMI and cannot be both at the same time for HDMI 1 and 2. This took me a while to figure out and just like Geoff I didn't know what was going on.
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post #15259 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 09:46 AM
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Here is my review and setup with pictures of the SC-07.
Review:

Sound: The sound is fantastic. The speakers are great, but I attribute at least as much to the receiver. I had crappy speakers and receiver before and even the “crappy” speakers sounded great with the SC-07. I am ecstatic when I watch movies. Music sounds fantastic as well and I really couldn’t be happier with the setup. The SC-07 is simple and even the dreaded manual makes sense to me

Setup

I have an audio closet that is VERY messy right now. I am running a Direct TV box and PS3 to the Receiver. I need a good RF remote and this will be bought sooner rather than later. I am still debating wired solutions as there are some cables in the walls that could be used for IR wiring.

I know the cables are a mess. I need to get junction boxes and that will fix the wires and then a little bit of dry-wall and it will look great. I wanted to leave it open as I wasn’t sure exactly which cable run terminated where.





Home-Theater Room

So this room takes up the 7.1 ports for Zone 1. I feed the video through HDMI 1 and audio through the speaker ports.
On the other side of the wall is a PJ JVC RS2 projecting onto a Da-Lite Contour Cinema Screen. The painting issues that looks weird in the pictures is not visible in the room (hadn’t seen it before I took the pictures, but will probably touch up now when I know it is there). Also the light is going out and LED light rope is going in.





Amazingly enough I just realized that I forgot to take a picture of the seating….. so no pictures of that, but we have couches and not HT-chairs. They are oversized couches and very comfortable

I built a shelf for the Center speaker and on the side one side is the subwoofer and on the other side there will be rooms for DVD’s and Bluray discs. The room has no audio treatments so that will also change in the future as I build some. I will also cover up the remaining areas up front with black cloth

I am running Aperion speakers up front including their Subwoofer

My Towers are: Intimus 6T Tower Speakers http://www.aperionaudio.com/product/...10,28,255.aspx
My Center Channel is: Intimus 6C Center Channel Speaker
http://www.aperionaudio.com/product/...12,29,259.aspx
My Subwoofer is: Bravus 10D – Dual powered subwoofer
http://www.aperionaudio.com/product/...05,66,243.aspx



My in-ceiling rear speakers in the HT are four and there are two models. The cut-outs for the speakers were done to far up-front (long story, but I am now stuck with it) and I don’t plan on changing this right now. I compensated by buying two front speakers that can be aimed and they are angled towards the back of the room: Speakercraft AIM8 ONE.http://www.speakercraft.com/#Products:65:AIM8 One
Then for the rear back I have two speakers that pushes the sound both back and forth to work with the two rows of seating. Speakercraft AIM WIDE ONE. http://www.speakercraft.com/#Products:410:AIM Wide One

Room 2 – this is NOT Zone 2.

This room is getting video through HDMI 2. I am running 2 cat5’s in the wall that goes to a monoprice cat5 to HDMI face-plate. The setup works fantastic and the picture is great. It is a 720p plasma and it proves the point that asks why people buy 1080p…. Now this is just a gym so I don’t watch movies etc so I will get the sound through the TV. I love the clean look of no cables
Issues: The SC-07 either pushes sound through the amps or the HDMI. It cannot do both at the same time. Solution here is either analog sound directly from the cable box and PS3 through a component switcher http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2 (thanks CCOTENJ) that pushes the sound through two RG6 cables out to the back of the TV using a RG6 to RCA adaptor.
The analog solution allows sound in Room 2 and HT room at the same time. Alternative is an HDMI splitter right after the cable box which would only give me Cable / DVR to this TV – this is probably what I will do.



Room 3 / Zone 2

This is the pool-table room and future bar room (either build myself or have built not sure yet). I have four speakers running through a simple amplifier.
Speakers: Two of these monoprice speakers http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2 that will push sounds both directions (going in the middle of the room) and then two of these monoprice speakers http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2 that will push the sound back towards the back of the room (going in front of the room above future bar seating area). Click on the speaker to get additional pictures that shows the inside of them and how they work.

Amplifier: I am using this AudioSource Amplifier http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2 - the room is just “easy listening” / TV watching so not too concerned about quality.

TV: A second 720p TV that is getting HD through a component setup. The component setup is Zone 2 video so it can have its own signal. I am thinking of sending this straight from the DVR so that I don’t need to turn on the receiver for video, but probably will not. I also have the ability to push the same video signal to the back corner of the room (RG6 is in the wall) and I can use the component switch mentioned earlier if I ever wanted a TV there.





Zone 3 – final zone is outdoor speakers on the deck. Plan on getting another AudioSource Amplifier for that and some outdoor rated speakers.Darn it should have bought a second amplifier before they almost doubled the price

All in all I am extremely happy with how one AVR can manage all these rooms. The SC-09 would have been nice not to run external amps, but they are cheap enough that it is not a big deal. The sound is fantastic. Passing HD video on three different outs is something I couldn’t find on any other unit out there (not that I could afford). The funny thing is that in the end I may not pass HD Video through the receiver for all the zones / rooms, but it is always an option

Pro SC-07 – Versatility, Sound,
Very Happy Customer here. Thanks everyone for different advice along the way.
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post #15260 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 10:38 AM - Thread Starter
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mhdiab,

WOW!

That's one awesome setup!!

It shows you put an awefull lot of work into your system!
Looks like it's all coming together. What a fun place!

Thanks for sharing this with us!
GREAT work!!

So, when do we all get to do an Alaskan roadtrip?

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post #15261 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 10:41 AM
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Thanks CHP - not sure the pictures are doing it justice but I do love it.

We had the drywall, electrical and baseboard outsourced - besides that all the painting, flooring, cabling etc is all on me and the father-in-law. Been a long road, but 95% there now. Some touch-up painting, patching (you are bound to hit walls with 16ft long baseboards), final touches in the HT and oh yeah fixing the cabling mess and I am good to go

Alaska roadtrip is recommended to everyone. Especially if you like nature / fishing like we do.
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post #15262 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 10:47 AM
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I forgot - in zone 2 I am ordering a wall unit for volume control. If anyone thinks this will be an issue / something I need to think of let me know. Running four speakers to the amplifier and the amp connected to zone 2 so figured I just put the volume control in the "middle of the chain". Anything to consider / any reason it won't work when I use an amplifier. Set the receiver to fixed / variable? Rotary or slider volume control - any pre/con with either?

It is a double face plate spot (the dry-wall is done to far down so will cut some) so going to put some mesh up and patch over one spot and just put all four speakers on one speaker controller.

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post #15263 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhdiab View Post

..........................EDIT -- CHP not going to tell you where to link me , but my setup while not a zone 3 setup yet does answer the problem that Geoff
posts in his zone 3 setup. I do believe it is worth linking to / adding a note that HDMI Out is either speaker / through HDMI and cannot be both at the same time for HDMI 1 and 2. This took me a while to figure out and just like Geoff I didn't know what was going on.

I'll try to get time tonight, mhdiab

I'm thinking right now on the first page, as "a working setup example of Zone 2 and Zone 3" and of course, a link on the member's review.

Thanks again for putting in all that work and effort and sharing with us !!

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post #15264 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 11:14 AM
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No thanks is needed. The setup is a result of years on the avsforum and me posting my setup is really just a way to show what can be done and if others have question I hope they ask them.

I had help from the receiver forum, this thread, the speaker forum, the Aperion thread (and other speaker threds that represented speakers I considered such as the AV123, Axiom etc), AVS themselves with the PJ and some ceiling speakers, automation thread, HT building thread.

Now I am in a better position for when I build the next HT 2.0 -- seriously there are several things I would have done different, but thanks to the AVS forum I could "overcome" a lot of mistakes and make the best of things. Next go around will get more sound insulation in the HT room, better cabling routs, some different cables and more conduit, more locations pre-wired etc

Either way just posting to share and try to give back to everyone - same reason I think you spend a lot of time on this thread CHP - which is appreciated by everyone
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post #15265 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhdiab View Post

..Either way just posting to share and try to give back to everyone - same reason I think you spend a lot of time on this thread CHP - which is appreciated by everyone


mhdiab,

Second a WOW!

Really nice room. Do you make room consultation calls

Like you said, we sure do learn a lot from the forums. I know I would do my room quite differently if I knew 17 yrs ago when the house was built what I know now. Even 6 yrs ago when we started a big upgrade

And it's nice to have a mancave to play in
And I agree with you, CHP is a champ!

ss9001
Steve

Steve
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post #15266 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 12:09 PM
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ss9001 - in regards to equipment or design?

Wife picked the colors, basement is mine (any doubt considering what is in there) so I had veto rights to all her picks. I actually picked out the pool-table and she about vetoed it until she saw it in person - perfect match.

Seriously though there are two high-end AV stores here in AK and they both lack seriously in several areas and are way way overpriced. I have considered helping people with picking their equipment, cables, advice on running it etc (but not do the work ) for a small % of the overall spend........ we shall see. I would tell them the stores can probably do it better, but the total cost will be at least twice as much (I know I checked)
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post #15267 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 06:31 PM
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* nevermind *
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post #15268 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 09:20 PM - Thread Starter
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drats, and was gonna put pictures and everything

Glad you got it sorted, ratmice!

"you're just jealous 'cause the voices only talk to me"
Questions about the SC-07 or SC-05? start here
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post #15269 of 17114 Old 01-11-2010, 09:23 PM - Thread Starter
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added:

member's reviews/pictures, page 3
mhdiab
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post17583148

page one:
 
- working setup example of Zone 2 and Zone 3 by mhdiab

"you're just jealous 'cause the voices only talk to me"
Questions about the SC-07 or SC-05? start here
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post #15270 of 17114 Old 01-12-2010, 10:40 AM
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Hey guys do you know if the sc-05 can be remotely turned on and off some how? If not how much electricity is used if it sits there on without any music playing through it? Or does it go into a sleep mode then wakes up if music plays? The reason I'm asking is I have a Sonos player that works beautifully with it but I have to manually switch the sc-05 power off and on.

Thanks
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