NAD M15HD Surround Sound Processor - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

And now that you have failed to substantiate your own claim that you owned an Integra 9.9, all of a sudden it's time to forget about the Integra and move on? That might have been good medicine for the doctor, had he only taken it.

Roger, the Onkyo 9.9 (if that's the pre-pro and not the receiver - I don't even feel like looking it up) is old news, this thread is about the M15HD.

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post #182 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

Thanks much. I had not seen that thread. He certainly gave you sage advice.

"Sage" is the exact word I would use too.

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post #183 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post


Please practice what you preach and provide data to back-up your assertions.

I already did to a degree, I stated very clearly what the background was for my opinion, which is practical experience with the predecessors of the equipment in question. As for "data" I can pretty much guarantee you that most reasonable processors will be so far below the audible threshold of distortion and SNR as to be indistinguishable.
They may vary in their presentation but quantifying those differences as better or worse is purely a matter of subjective taste. And "huge difference" between any is optimistic at best.

You obviously value Kal's opinion based on the above posts - did you insult him when he praised the 9.8?

The environment that I have to assess this gear is a dedicated, acoustically treated and designed room. You?
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post #184 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

I already did to a degree, I stated very clearly what the background was for my opinion, which is practical experience with the predecessors of the equipment in question. As for "data" I can pretty much guarantee you that most reasonable processors will be so far below the audible threshold of distortion and SNR as to be indistinguishable.
They may vary in their presentation but quantifying those differences as better or worse is purely a matter of subjective taste. And "huge difference" between any is optimistic at best.

You obviously value Kal's opinion based on the above posts - did you insult him when he praised the 9.8?

The environment that I have to assess this gear is a dedicated, acoustically treated and designed room. You?

There's nothing wrong with the 9.8 but if you don't think that it's outclassed by the M15HD then you'll never be convinced (especially in terms of video processing - Arrested Development, Gob "C'mon" - I keed, I keed.).

To clear to deck of misconceptions, I assess gear based on what I think sounds good which is why I think my Conrad-Johnson-Tweaked, pre-production Sonographe CD player is superior to any Red Book CD transport/player on the market for the reproduction of live recordings. If you're ever in NYC: stop by for a listen.

John

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post #185 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

Well my best friend has a T175 so we can do a head-to-head. However, just from our experience (and him being over the other day) - the M15HD BLOWS AWAY the T175 - PERIOD.

I can believe the M15HD yields more refined audio than the T175, especially for analog. It has higher grade components (op-amps, DAC's, etc.,...). Just a matter of how much better.
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post #186 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:24 PM
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[quote=Roger Dressler;17582061]

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Not Bill, but when I went to your link, I didn't find info about your owning an Integra pre/pro. I did find:

Roger,

Thanks for the investigative work.

Quote:


So if it is your contention that you owned the Integra 9.9, you pasted the wrong link.

JohnNY-C,

So if you did not mention that you owned the Integra/Onkyo in this thread (which I took you for your word) then my reading skills are just fine. If that is the case I retract my apology. Now did you own the Integra/Onkyo or just demo it?

Quote:


You're kidding, right? How does measuring the noise in your room demonstrate a scientific approach to comparing the sound quality of two processors that are not even in the room at the same time?

My thoughts as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

Kal Rubinson told me to get the M15HD over the stand-alone SEQ as well - great advice.

I find it funny that you took Kal's advice to get the M15HD but you missed the many times he spoke highly of the 9.8 (which he owns) for M/C audio and HT use.

Bill

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post #187 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

There's nothing wrong with the 9.8 but if you don't think that it's outclassed by the M15HD then you'll never be convinced (especially in terms of video processing - Arrested Development, Gob "C'mon" - I keed, I keed.).

To clear to deck of misconceptions, I assess gear based on what I think sounds good which is why I think my Conrad-Johnson-Tweaked, pre-production Sonographe CD player is superior to any Red Book CD transport/player on the market for the reproduction of live recordings. If you're ever in NYC: stop by for a listen.

John

At no point did I suggest the 9.8 or any unit in particular would "outclass" the NAD - my point was that the difference won't be as dramatic as your advertising suggests.

You did not answer either of my questions;

You obviously value Kal's opinion based on the above posts - did you insult him when he praised the 9.8?

The environment that I have to assess this gear is a dedicated, acoustically treated and designed room. You?
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post #188 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

this thread is about the M15HD.

so did you purshase the Audyssey Pro Mic kit & EQ also?
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post #189 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

so did you purshase the Audyssey Pro Mic kit & EQ also?

Yes sir. Audyssey has been more-than-very helpful in getting an installer's set-up out to me. I expect to have it within the next 5-10 days but that's not up to Audyssey, it's up to me and shipping.

Go Giants!!!

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post #190 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

At no point did I suggest the 9.8 or any unit in particular would "outclass" the NAD - my point was that the difference won't be as dramatic as your advertising suggests.

You did not answer either of my questions;

You obviously value Kal's opinion based on the above posts - did you insult him when he praised the 9.8?

The environment that I have to assess this gear is a dedicated, acoustically treated and designed room. You?

1. No. 2. My room - duh. That was barely a question.

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post #191 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

The environment that I have to assess this gear is a dedicated, acoustically treated and designed room. You?[/b][/i]

Can you PM me links to your "environment" and reviews? Sounds cool!

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post #192 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 12:55 PM
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[quote=Bill Mac;17582686]
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Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

Now did you own the Integra/Onkyo or just demo it?

Bill

I owned it, what's your point? If I purchased it an had to return it because it sounded bad, what's the difference?


Better yet, Bill, tell me what equipment, and how, you want me to review it for you because, as they say, "money ain't a thang."

"No one can have an idea once he really starts listening" - John Cage
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post #193 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

My room - duh.

Yet another childish response.

The room is the single most important component in the audio chain. Judging by the posted pics, it seems you've completely overlooked that important detail. The reason I bring that up is still to debate your "massive difference" assertion. I'd be surprised if you could tell the difference between your irrelevantly referenced Conrad Johnson and a $100 cd player in that room.
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post #194 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

Yet another childish response.

The room is the single most important component in the audio chain. Judging by the posted pics, it seems you've completely overlooked that important detail. The reason I bring that up is still to debate your "massive difference" assertion. I'd be surprised if you could tell the difference between your irrelevantly referenced Conrad Johnson and a $100 cd player in that room.

First, I'm sorry if I can't afford an apartment that costs more than $800k - my bad. Second, that's no $100 CD player, chief.

Please start posting about the NAD Masters M15HD or send me (or your S.O./boyfriend/etc...) a PM with your open items regarding your existence on this planet or any other off-topic items you feel like airing-out with strangers.

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post #195 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

Can you PM me links to your "environment" and reviews? Sounds cool!

You can start with the link in my signature.
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post #196 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

You can start with the link in my signature.

I like the Police too

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post #197 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post

Sorry if I can't afford an apartment that costs more than $800k - my bad. That's no $100 CD player, Chief.

Please start posting about the NAD Masters M15HD or send me (or your S.O./boyfriend/etc...) a PM with your open items regarding your existence on this planet or any other off-topic items you feel like airing-out with strangers.

LOL, you're a real piece of work!

Keep on avoiding relevant debate with useless and childish rebuttals that'll get you far in the world...
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post #198 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

Yet another childish response.

I can play this game too, here, "you're 11 years old."

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post #199 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

LOL, you're a real piece of work!

Keep on avoiding relevant debate with useless and childish rebuttals that'll get you far in the world...

What do you want to discuss? I don't get it, I'm sorry.

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post #200 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

You can start with the link in my signature.

I started with a P.O.S. Pre/Pro: what should I finish with? A lot changes in 6-months, sorry.

See: Moore's Law

You don't get to play the "digital from start-to-finish- is #1 - YES!" card and then expect to mock the M15HD without, "act'n the fool." I'm sorry.


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post #201 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:24 PM
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[quote=JohnNY-C;17582821]

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I owned it, what's your point? If I purchased it an had to return it because it sounded like, "Pipp farting on a snare drum (Airheads reference)," what's the difference?

Once again your maturity level shines through.

My point is if you did not post in this thread that you owned the 9.8 your remark of, "You might want to work on your reading comprehension" you then owe me an apology. So if you would show me a post from this thread that shows you owned the 9.8.

Quote:


Better yet, Bill, tell me what equipment, and how, you want me to review it for you because, as they say, "money ain't a thang."[/b]

I do not have any desire for you to review anything. Why would you think that?

My SACD collection, watch it grow and my wallet shrink ;-).

 

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post #202 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

Looks like a) you're doing a pretty poor job of adopting a neutral tone in the very post in which you pledge to so do, and b) if anyone's nerves got struck, they're your own, as evidenced by the bold type and accusatory attitude.

If it is of any concequence, I indeed read all about your room's high ambient noise problem and the TV's backlight emission noise, and my question still stands--how that is relevant to the SQ of a prepro as you claim?

And now that you have failed to substantiate your own claim that you owned an Integra 9.9, all of a sudden it's time to forget about the Integra and move on? That might have been good medicine for the doctor, had he only taken it.


Seriously, cant you see that Johnny and the others has moved on? Why do you bring this up again? To be honest, now you are coming of as somebody that would like this argument to continue.

Let us try and keep this thread focused on the NAD M15 HD, not arguing.
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post #203 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

I can believe the M15HD yields more refined audio than the T175, especially for analog. It has higher grade components (op-amps, DAC's, etc.,...). Just a matter of how much better.

Right, and that refinement should manifest itself with music reproduction, and my point here, and in reference to the 9.9 earlier, is that for predominantly HT use those differences aren't likely to be as relevant.

Based on past experience with the M15, if I was buying a pre-pro today the M15HD would easily be at the top of my list.
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post #204 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 02:09 PM
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[quote=Bill Mac;17582933]
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post




Once again your maturity level shines through.

My point is if you did not post in this thread that you owned the 9.8 your remark of, "You might want to work on your reading comprehension" you then owe me an apology. So if you would show me a post from this thread that shows you owned the 9.8.



I do not have any desire for you to review anything. Why would you think that?

If the 9.8, as opposed to the 9.9, is the pre/pro that I had, I owe you an apology: I'm sorry. I'm sure the 9.9 sounds like Carnegie Hall.

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post #205 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

Right, and that refinement should manifest itself with music reproduction

exactly, which is a major interest to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

and my point here, and in reference to the 9.9 earlier, is that for predominantly HT use those differences aren't likely to be as relevant

probably, especially using HDMI for, both, audio and video processing. I guess the different Audyssey implementations would yield the final result in one's room? I'm a little concerned with paying additional (2k -3k) for Audyssey EQ and special mic, is this mandatory?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

Based on past experience with the M15, if I was buying a pre-pro today the M15HD would easily be at the top of my list.

yeah, I'm very intrigued so far. I figure NAD has learned some big lessons in regards to HDMI/DSP implementation from the T175. Hopefully this is a much cleaner design.

I'm glad I have waited (on jumping for a current model pre-pro), I may opt for an M15HD later. HDMI-based technology is still relatively new.
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post #206 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Loooogical View Post

Seriously, cant you see that Johnny and the others has moved on? Why do you bring this up again? To be honest, now you are coming of as somebody that would like this argument to continue.

Let us try and keep this thread focused on the NAD M15 HD, not arguing.

You first. Show us the way. Seriously.
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post #207 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

exactly, which is a major interest to me.

probably, especially using HDMI for, both, audio and video processing. I guess the different Audyssey implementations would yield the final result in one's room? I'm a little concerned with paying additional (2k -3k) for Audyssey EQ and special mic, is this mandatory?

yeah, I'm very intrigued so far. I figure NAD has learned some big lessons in regards to HDMI/DSP implementation from the T175. Hopefully this is a much cleaner design.

I'm glad I have waited (on jumping for a current model pre-pro), I may opt for an M15HD later. HDMI-based technology is still relatively new.

Ditto.

I thought NAD was going to supply a kit for the Pro implementation, or planning on it.. The calibrated mic of the Pro kit is an important part of the process, it increases accuracy. IMO Audyssey is worth it for both music and movies, and that benefit is enhanced with some attention to basic room acoustics before running it.

I can't speak for the 175, but I'm pretty sure they omitted it in the M15 because they weren't confident they could produce the sound they wanted from it back then. The resolution requirements for the hi-rez codecs has had a positive effect on HDMI audio all the way down to $500 units, as has room correction actually.

I think HDMI has stabilized, and again back to the hi-rez codecs, that lossless transfer has eliminated jitter as an issue, and music recorded in DTS HD MA and the likes is simply exceptional, on par with SACD if not better.
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post #208 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 03:01 PM
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[quote=Bill Mac;17582933]
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Originally Posted by JohnNY-C View Post




...

I'm glad I have waited (on jumping for a current model pre-pro), I may opt for an M15HD later. HDMI-based technology is still relatively new.

I'm of the same mindset: it's evident that pre/pros with HDMI v1.3 cost a substantial premium, in terms of price/performance (which was the inspiration for my M15 "best value in audio" thread), but, at least the head aches, in terms of the A/V 1's and 0's being where they need to be, have FINALLY been ironed out with the M15HD (no relay-clicks or lack-of-signal/bad-handshakes via HDMI with the Masters HD).

All that I have is effortless switching between sources. All with one remote & a few interconnects... Thank you 2009!


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post #209 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

You first. Show us the way. Seriously.

Do you think that quality sound is axiomatic of NAD's offerings? ...as failure is axiomatic of hemp T-shirt companies.

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post #210 of 751 Old 11-22-2009, 03:28 PM
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Do you think that quality sound is axiomatic of NAD's offerings?

No more than that of any other competent manufacturer at a similar price point.
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