Receiver for Paradigm Studio 100's - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 363 Old 02-04-2009, 10:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Not sure where to put this....I posted it in the speaker section too....
************************************************************ **

I just picked up a pair of Studio 100's and a 690 center. Not sure on the version, but they just came out with a new line, so what I got was the older one.

Anyway, I want a receiver for a dedicated theatre room, that is 15'x17'. We'll have 2 rows of chairs and a projector....not sure about screen size yet. Anyway, what kind of receiver would power this system up well? Need HDMI, power to use the speakers to their strength, and be able to receive all the HD audio via bitstream and decode in Receiver.

Anyone done this? I was initially looking at the Yamaha 3900...then started looking at the Z7....then started hearing about the Arcam AVR-600. I know the last one is a higher price range (my dealer said $5K) but I can't get it out of my head since I heard the ARCAM 350 at a dealer. It doesn't do HD audio, and all I watch is Blu-rays....no SD DVDs.

Is this ARCAM overkill? Will a Z7 be enough? I need advice, and I'm sure people have gone through this. I just want a rocking audio system for my theater. I feel I've got a solid front 3 speakers to start....but what now???

Thanks in advance for any input you can provide!!!

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post #2 of 363 Old 02-04-2009, 11:09 PM
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http://emotiva.com/ Have a look here. You don't have to spend 5K if you don't want too.If you are not in too big of a hurry, Emotiva is coming out with a new processor (UMC-1), It has a great feature set and will be $699. Cech out the XPA-5, XPA-3, xpa-2, XPA-1, or MPS-2. There are other companies too, but I don't have experience with them, so others can help you out there. My personal opinion is to go with seperates to get the best out of your speakers.
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post #3 of 363 Old 02-04-2009, 11:47 PM
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The Studio 100's have a dip below 4 ohms that makes them rather power hungry even at reasonable volume levels. Based on owning a set for several years and having a 110 WPC Sony HT receiver that was upgraded to a separates system you will most likely want a separate AMP. The Anthem MCA series I have heard on these speakers, think the rating is 225 WPC, drove them fine. There are I am sure a lot of alternatives, probably at a lower WPC rating, this is something I have heard sound good with these speakers.

I think, and this is an opinion, to get a receiver that will do well with the Studio 100's you will have to buy a lot more of other features than you really need which will push the price way up. Get a modest cost receiver with line out connections and put a decent AMP externally. Others have done this and used the receiver to drive the surrounds and used a two or three channel external amp for the fronts which does not throw away the receiver AMP and reduces the cost of the external AMP.. I would suggest a three channel as the center channel is where most of the dialog comes from and you want the gain on the AMP feeding the center to match the FR and FL speakers.





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Originally Posted by rottenkid View Post

http://emotiva.com/ Have a look here. You don't have to spend 5K if you don't want too.If you are not in too big of a hurry, Emotiva is coming out with a new processor (UMC-1), It has a great feature set and will be $699. Cech out the XPA-5, XPA-3, xpa-2, XPA-1, or MPS-2. There are other companies too, but I don't have experience with them, so others can help you out there. My personal opinion is to go with seperates to get the best out of your speakers.

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post #4 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by video_bit_bucket View Post

The Studio 100's have a dip below 4 ohms that makes them rather power hungry even at reasonable volume levels. Based on owning a set for several years and having a 110 WPC Sony HT receiver that was upgraded to a separates system you will most likely want a separate AMP. The Anthem MCA series I have heard on these speakers, think the rating is 225 WPC, drove them fine. There are I am sure a lot of alternatives, probably at a lower WPC rating, this is something I have heard sound good with these speakers.

I think, and this is an opinion, to get a receiver that will do well with the Studio 100's you will have to buy a lot more of other features than you really need which will push the price way up. Get a modest cost receiver with line out connections and put a decent AMP externally. Others have done this and used the receiver to drive the surrounds and used a two or three channel external amp for the fronts which does not throw away the receiver AMP and reduces the cost of the external AMP.. I would suggest a three channel as the center channel is where most of the dialog comes from and you want the gain on the AMP feeding the center to match the FR and FL speakers.

Agree with 100%. Go for a Marantz 6003 or 5003 or a Pioneer Elite and a very good amp from Emotiva. The XPA3 is all you need for the fronts and use the Receivers amps for the surrounds. Have you looked at Emotiva offerings. They build quality amps for a very good price. Also while on the subject of amps start reading the thread here.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1114207

See what the real pros are saying. Those guys know what they are talking about. Emotiva also makes a monster 7 channel amp the MPS 2 that will make those Paradigms sound excellent. But IMHO I would go for the XPA3 and a good receiver that has all the features you want and need. Should be able to do this for way less than $2500. Hope this helps.
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post #5 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 07:15 AM
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I agree that the Yamaha is not the way to go, too bright sounding for Studios. Pioneer Elite SC07 would offer a better sound. But I would also look at what NAD has to offer as well, simply based on the quality of sound and the warmer sound quality to them. It would match up excellently with the 100s.

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post #6 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 07:45 AM - Thread Starter
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This is awesome...thanks for the input....I've got some more research to do but this points me in the right direction....thanks again!

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post #7 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 08:43 AM
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I have an SC-07 powering all Paridgm's with Studio 100 v.2's as mains. Very loud, never have hit reference level on AVR yet in a room that is 14x22

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post #8 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 10:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snownut View Post

I have an SC-07 powering all Paridgm's with Studio 100 v.2's as mains. Very loud, never have hit reference level on AVR yet in a room that is 14x22

No amp?

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post #9 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 10:36 AM
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I must agree with all but one of the post in response to your question Mookie. There is a MAJOR difference between powering that speaker line with a receiver vs. a pre/pro-amp combination. You might can get away with two-channel music listenning to elevator music, but when you move to movies and music that covers a wide range of octaves: Forget it. When I moved from a receiver to separates, it was as if I had purchased a new set of speakers. The folks in this thread are giving you excellent advice.
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post #10 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mookie b View Post

No amp?


correct, only AVR. I am not saying that you can't get better, but the pio is quite impressive. Not sure what version your 100's are though. I have also powered mine using a Yamaha V800(??) with a carver TFM-45. They sounded pretty good with lots of power through them (and no sub). I have only had the pio for 6 weeks so I am playing around with it still. I also have all speakers set to small and I am using a servo 15 for the bottom end. If you intend on driving these full range, then more power is better.

I have owned Luxman, Carver, Yamaha and now the Pioneer.

I do believe that power counts for a lot, but it comes down to what you can afford and when enough is enough. LOL

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post #11 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snownut View Post

correct, only AVR. I am not saying that you can't get better, but the pio is quite impressive. Not sure what version your 100's are though. I have also powered mine using a Yamaha V800(??) with a carver TFM-45. They sounded pretty good with lots of power through them (and no sub). I have only had the pio for 6 weeks so I am playing around with it still. I also have all speakers set to small and I am using a servo 15 for the bottom end. If you intend on driving these full range, then more power is better.

I have owned Luxman, Carver, Yamaha and now the Pioneer.

I do believe that power counts for a lot, but it comes down to what you can afford and when enough is enough. LOL

With the price of the Emotiva gear and the quality of today's AVR's I feel that the price between a dedicated pre-pro and a quality AVR is approaching the field of diminishing returns. Yes several years ago to me it would have been better to go the complete separates route. At that time it was worth it. I don't feel the same today. As a matter of fact if you look at today's pre-pro's a lot of them don't offer near the connections that a receiver does, but you do have to pay a premium for that. The makers of pre-pros are lagging behind by a few years. For what? The nameplate on the front. I mean take a look at the prices for even the new Marantz and Denon separates. That's ridiculous. Don't even bother to look at Anthem, Krell,and the "other" pre-pro's. Those things are for people that have dedicated Home Theaters and money to give away. I am not saying these pieces aren't worth the money, what I'm trying to say is for the regulars here looking for very good sound systems you don't need to lay out a years income to get it in your living room or den. Like I stated above a good AVR, speakers that sound great to you, and a well built amp with the power you want or feel you need will suffice for most of us. Those looking to go semi-separates would be served just fine with a decent or very good receiver and the amp. It all depends on what you want spend. There a lot of very good options that you didn't have even just a few years ago. Okay I'm through ranting for now.
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post #12 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 11:41 AM
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Emotiva has a 10% sale on the XPA-2 plus free shipping if you just need an amp for the mains..http://emotiva.com/xpa2.shtm

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post #13 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 12:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taxman48 View Post

Emotiva has a 10% sale on the XPA-2 plus free shipping if you just need an amp for the mains..http://emotiva.com/xpa2.shtm

Why would their 2 channel Amp cost more than their 3 Channel Amp? And the same price as their 5 channel one? Is the extra 50 watts per channel that applicable in a situation like mine with 2 studio 100s?

Just curious....

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post #14 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mookie b View Post

Why would their 2 channel Amp cost more than their 3 Channel Amp? And the same price as their 5 channel one? Is the extra 50 watts per channel that appicable in a situation like mine with 2 studio 100s?

Just curious....

No, wait for the XPA-3. The cost difference is not in just the wattage. If I remember correctly the MPS series are built like monoblocks(each amp with its own power supply) Not sure though. Of course the advantage being if one channel goes out just send the bad one in and get a replacement. Their gear from what I've read is all good so I would wait for the XPA3 so the fronts will be all powered equally. That's where most of your sound is coming from anyway. If your really into 2 channel music the other amp is the way to go.
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post #15 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 01:09 PM - Thread Starter
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No, wait for the XPA-3. The cost difference is not in just the wattage. If I remember correctly the MPS series are built like monoblocks(each amp with its own power supply) Not sure though. Of course the advantage being if one channel goes out just send the bad one in and get a replacement. Their gear from what I've read is all good so I would wait for the XPA3 so the fronts will be all powered equally. That's where most of your sound is coming from anyway. If your really into 2 channel music the other amp is the way to go.

Thanks! I e-mailed them and asked about the 3 channel and they said they're not in stock. Guess I'll try to find out when they'll get them....

This has been an awesome thread for me. Thanks guys!

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post #16 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 01:20 PM
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How about the Emotive UPA-7? They rate it at 125 watts into 8 ohms, 7 channels driven. Is this enough to drive a Studio 100/690 set-up?
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post #17 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by DigsMovies View Post

How about the Emotive UPA-7? They rate it at 125 watts into 8 ohms, 7 channels driven. Is this enough to drive a Studio 100/690 set-up?

Yes it is. These amps are not rated like a receiver. Very few receivers actually put out the wattage claimed. Most are tested with 2 channels rated. If you can find the specs on most of them you will see a drop in output after that.
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post #18 of 363 Old 02-05-2009, 03:59 PM
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I was just auditioning Paradigm Studio 20, 40 and 60s last week and I found them to be bright on the top end, not as bright as the Monitor series (own Paradigm Titan) but still a bit bright. That's why in the end I opted to buy Totem Sttaf instead, they have a warmer sound with smooth top end. The store was using Yamaha to drive them too so perhaps I would have liked the Paradigm Studio with a different amp better. I really like Paradigm and have owned three different pairs in the past, just seems to me their tweeters are a bit bright now compared to what they made in the mid 90s. I just made a post asking for list of receivers with warm sound so hope you guys reply with some good suggestions.
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post #19 of 363 Old 02-06-2009, 04:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Harker View Post

I was just auditioning Paradigm Studio 20, 40 and 60s last week and I found them to be bright on the top end, not as bright as the Monitor series (own Paradigm Titan) but still a bit bright. That's why in the end I opted to buy Totem Sttaf instead, they have a warmer sound with smooth top end. The store was using Yamaha to drive them too so perhaps I would have liked the Paradigm Studio with a different amp better. I really like Paradigm and have owned three different pairs in the past, just seems to me their tweeters are a bit bright now compared to what they made in the mid 90s. I just made a post asking for list of receivers with warm sound so hope you guys reply with some good suggestions.

Marantz. You can read the thread for these receivers. The 5003 or 6003. Are the Totems 4 ohm speakers? I don't know just asking. Also what is your budget for the gear your'e wanting. For these speakers or any for that matter I would still recommend the Marantz + Emotiva combo. Are you looking for 5.1 or 7.1 system? Or just a very good 2 channel from the fronts. This combo would work for anything you really want to do. If you really want those Totems to sound their best and can afford it go for the AVR+Amp combination. The problem you are presenting is you bought the Totems for their warm sound and now you are trying to add a receiver that is also "warm" . You need to audition a few different receivers for those Totems to truly get the sound you want. What other brands does your dealer sell other than the Yamaha? If it were me and your dealer would let you I would bring home the receiver with the features I like(choose several) to try them ay home. Not at their store because it's very likely your home is not setup like the store. The dealer I use let's me audition anything I want at home because he also realizes my home is different than all the treatments they use in order to sell their gear. I would try the Marantz's,Yamaha's,Onkyo's, or the Pioneer Elites. Also another question, when you auditioned the Totems were they using the same Yamaha as the Paradigms? Just like to know.
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post #20 of 363 Old 02-06-2009, 05:25 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mookie b View Post

Not sure where to put this....I posted it in the speaker section too....
************************************************************ **

I just picked up a pair of Studio 100's and a 690 center. Not sure on the version, but they just came out with a new line, so what I got was the older one.

Anyway, I want a receiver for a dedicated theatre room, that is 15'x17'. We'll have 2 rows of chairs and a projector....not sure about screen size yet. Anyway, what kind of receiver would power this system up well? Need HDMI, power to use the speakers to their strength, and be able to receive all the HD audio via bitstream and decode in Receiver.

Anyone done this? I was initially looking at the Yamaha 3900...then started looking at the Z7....then started hearing about the Arcam AVR-600. I know the last one is a higher price range (my dealer said $5K) but I can't get it out of my head since I heard the ARCAM 350 at a dealer. It doesn't do HD audio, and all I watch is Blu-rays....no SD DVDs.

Is this ARCAM overkill? Will a Z7 be enough? I need advice, and I'm sure people have gone through this. I just want a rocking audio system for my theater. I feel I've got a solid front 3 speakers to start....but what now???

Thanks in advance for any input you can provide!!!

Hi mookie b,

Your Paradigm Studio 100 love a lots of power. You are looking for a good match for them, so they can sing along. Save yourself a load of money, and check out the Onkyo TX-SR906, or for less but as good the Onkyo TX-SR876. Also the Integra DTR-8.9, which is more money. Any of those will be a good match, with the SR876 the best value of the trio. Try one, it's free, you got 30 days, if you don't like it; but your Studio 100 and Center 690 will be mad at you if you take the Onkyo away!
That's what I think, and that's what I will do. Give it some real consideration, because your Paradigm deserve it and will probably love you for it.
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post #21 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lordoftherings View Post

Hi mookie b,

Your Paradigm Studio 100 love a lots of power. You are looking for a good match for them, so they can sing along. Save yourself a load of money, and check out the Onkyo TX-SR906, or for less but as good the Onkyo TX-SR876. Also the Integra DTR-8.9, which is more money. Any of those will be a good match, with the SR876 the best value of the trio. Try one, it's free, you got 30 days, if you don't like it; but your Studio 100 and Center 690 will be mad at you if you take the Onkyo away!
That's what I think, and that's what I will do. Give it some real consideration, because your Paradigm deserve it and will probably love you for it.

I will be using an Integra DTR 9.9 to drive my new Studio 100 v5's here shortly when they arrive. The Integra has a monster amp in it but it is also a $2,600 msrp receiver. Still I am sure I would notice a difference if I went w/ a seperate 2-channle amp just be because an AVR has so many things going on inside of it to get in the way of clean sound (video processor, tuner, etc.). To me that is the real luxury of going w/ seperates. I simply went with Integra because I have a local dealer that gives great deals. otherwise I probably would have gotton a good $1,000 receiver and seperate 2 or 3 channel amp.

Nonetheless I love my Integra beast and I will post review of this receiver paired with the new S100's soon. FWIW driving my Studio 60v4's, the speakers would run out of steam LONG before the amps in my Integra and the 60's are not slouch. Hope this helps...
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post #22 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Harker View Post

I was just auditioning Paradigm Studio 20, 40 and 60s last week and I found them to be bright on the top end, not as bright as the Monitor series (own Paradigm Titan) but still a bit bright. That's why in the end I opted to buy Totem Sttaf instead, they have a warmer sound with smooth top end. The store was using Yamaha to drive them too so perhaps I would have liked the Paradigm Studio with a different amp better. I really like Paradigm and have owned three different pairs in the past, just seems to me their tweeters are a bit bright now compared to what they made in the mid 90s. I just made a post asking for list of receivers with warm sound so hope you guys reply with some good suggestions.


I can attest that I can't stand bright speakers; Paradigm would not risk their reputation on buidling a bright speaker at this price point. Bad room acoustics and / or components = bright
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post #23 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 12:07 PM
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I went with the onkyo 876 and have bridged the two channels for front giving 210 watts per. Even when I have it normal 140 watts they sound fine to me. Maybe one day I'll pony up for a 250 watt amp or something but not any time soon.

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post #24 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 12:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPowered View Post

I will be using an Integra DTR 9.9 to drive my new Studio 100 v5's here shortly when they arrive. The Integra has a monster amp in it but it is also a $2,600 msrp receiver. Still I am sure I would notice a difference if I went w/ a seperate 2-channle amp just be because an AVR has so many things going on inside of it to get in the way of clean sound (video processor, tuner, etc.). To me that is the real luxury of going w/ seperates. I simply went with Integra because I have a local dealer that gives great deals. otherwise I probably would have gotton a good $1,000 receiver and seperate 2 or 3 channel amp.

Nonetheless I love my Integra beast and I will post review of this receiver paired with the new S100's soon. FWIW driving my Studio 60v4's, the speakers would run out of steam LONG before the amps in my Integra and the 60's are not slouch. Hope this helps...

This is super great. With your excellent DTR-9.9, your new 100s should
really sing along. I can't wait to read your review!
GPowered, you better stay in touch buddy.
Great to revive this thread, isn't it?

Till then, you take care my friend, if you don't mind me, calling you.
Nice getting to know you.

Bob
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post #25 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 12:17 PM
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This is super great. With your excellent DTR-9.9, your new 100s should
really sing along. I can't wait to read your review!
GPowered, you better stay in touch buddy.
Great to revive this thread, isn't it?

Till then, you take care my friend, if you don't mind me, calling you.
Nice getting to know you.

Bob

Shouldn't you be out planting some more trees? Damn it man we're starving for clean air down here.
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Originally Posted by hdtv00 View Post

I went with the onkyo 876 and have bridged the two channels for front giving 210 watts per. Even when I have it normal 140 watts they sound fine to me. Maybe one day I'll pony up for a 250 watt amp or something but not any time soon.

Great rig. You must be proud of your 876 and Paradigm 100s. I know
that I will be. Actually, your entire set of Paradigm all around is quite a feast.
Hdtv00, tell us more about your experiences with your setup.
I am for one very interested on your feedback of your 876 vs your 100s.

Take care man.

Bob
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post #27 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 12:31 PM
 
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Originally Posted by phantom52 View Post

Shouldn't you be out planting some more trees? Damn it man we're starving for clean air down here.

Hey phantom52, nice to see you again buddy.

Ho!... Well I did my part already. I'm happy to do what I'm doing right
now. It's great, man, to be able to share with others about your passion.
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post #28 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Lordoftherings View Post

Hey phantom52, nice to see you again buddy.

Ho!... Well I did my part already. I'm happy to do what I'm doing right
now. It's great, man, to be able to share with others about your passion.

Well, I've a bad upgrade bug I can't get over right now. Another bad part is I can't decide what I want. Pioneer SC-07 or 05,Yamaha RZ7, Onkyo 906B, Marantz 8002,6003,5003. Right now I'm leaning towards the Onkyo 906B. Tomorrow it will be the Marantz's. Already have a Yamaha 2600 and Parasound 2205AT amp. Just never satisfied my friend. Oh well, guess I'll go take a couple of aspirin. Those damn 906B's are such a bargain right now its hard to pass em up. Can't tell you how many times I've been within seconds of pushing that buy button.
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post #29 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 01:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom52 View Post

Well, I've a bad upgrade bug I can't get over right now. Another bad part is I can't decide what I want. Pioneer SC-07 or 05,Yamaha RZ7, Onkyo 906B, Marantz 8002,6003,5003. Right now I'm leaning towards the Onkyo 906B. Tomorrow it will be the Marantz's. Already have a Yamaha 2600 and Parasound 2205AT amp. Just never satisfied my friend. Oh well, guess I'll go take a couple of aspirin. Those damn 906B's are such a bargain right now its hard to pass em up. Can't tell you how many times I've been within seconds of pushing that buy button.

Well, if you do buy it, you will have the right to be here. Because it have
to do with Paradigm 100s and a good matching amp/receiver Onkyo; so you
can expand your horizons.
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post #30 of 363 Old 02-10-2009, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Lordoftherings View Post

This is super great. With your excellent DTR-9.9, your new 100s should
really sing along. I can't wait to read your review!
GPowered, you better stay in touch buddy.
Great to revive this thread, isn't it?

Till then, you take care my friend, if you don't mind me, calling you.
Nice getting to know you.

Bob

Definitely Bob. Send me a pm and we'll exchange contact info
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