*OFFICIAL* Denon AVR 1910/790 Owner's Thread - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 9378 Old 07-05-2009, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RMcR View Post

The source is a FIOS set top box connected to the AVR via HDMI. I've tried AMP, TV, Source On, Source Off, etc., but the results are the same -- video passes but no audio.

You'll have to leave the AVR HDMI Audio Out setting to AMP if you're trying to pass the video/audio in Standby. You can try swapping the HDMI cable to the TV to a different jack if it has more than one HDMI input jack. Most likely you're experiencing an HDMI handshake issue which is common with cable STBs. At the very least, make sure you've got the latest firmware loaded on the FIOS box. In some instances, adding an HDMI switcher between the FIOS STB and the AVR solves the problem.

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post #722 of 9378 Old 07-05-2009, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

frank -- have you bookmarked and read my FAQ?

http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#audio

Question number 1 in the audio section is:

Its due to those icon lights I bought this receiver for.

When does lights come on sure looks good.

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post #723 of 9378 Old 07-05-2009, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

frank -- have you bookmarked and read my FAQ?

http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#audio

Question number 1 in the audio section is:

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankmar View Post

I have a non brand Mp3 player, Its got a mini usb to charge and download mp3 files and a ear plug connetion.

How and where can I plug this to the 1910.




I have wire which plugs in the earphone and at the other end has to rca jacks
Can I plug this in front of the receiver (aux input) if so I have to increase the vol to max in the mp3. tia

Well since I saw no reply, I plugged my MP3 player into the front auxialary connections.

It Works well.

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post #724 of 9378 Old 07-05-2009, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

See the instructions on pg 49 -- notice that step 5 is to turn the tv OFF! it should also turn the AVR off, and then when you power the TV back on the "standby source" should be passing through.

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

just to be clear -- does your response mean I was correct? is the HDMI passthrough working now?

yes it worked with the ps3 but i had to power off the ps3 so it could redo the audio out.. there is no on the fly switching from tv to amp.

however i didnt realize that the hdmi control was closely connected to the simple step of outing the audio to the tv speakers...
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankmar View Post

Its due to those icon lights I bought this receiver for.

When does lights come on sure looks good.


i am thinking about buying a dedicated blue ray player just for that blue light.. i didnt even know it was there until i reset the microprocessor.. then i was like... whoa. that is sweet!!!
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post #725 of 9378 Old 07-05-2009, 09:41 PM
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I'm having a finnicky issue with my 1910. I have an Oppo Blu-ray player, PS3, and my DVR connected via HDMI. I can confirm that on both my DVR and Blu-ray player, that occasionally I noticed a very very very slight noise in the speakers... pausing the material I'm watching and cranking the volume makes it sound like the static-ish noise you get when you put your speakers way higher than they need to be. However, it doesn't sound like this all the time from what I'm noticing. Changing the channel or somehow reinstituting some HDMI handshake or changing the kind of audio being fed through the thing (such as changing the blu-ray players output from PCM to bitstream) seemed to fix the issue until I noticed it again. This is quite bothersome. I am turning on my devices in the recommended order of TV, AVR, and then the piece of hardware I'm running to it. As I said, this is something I'm finding to be 'correctable' by accident really, so I know it's not the speakers or anything like that, and I never experienced this with my old Onkyo. Any ideas what the heck is going on here?

EDIT: Also getting this issue via my Xbox 360, which is connected with component cables, with audio running through an optical cable.
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post #726 of 9378 Old 07-05-2009, 11:08 PM
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Hi everyone,

Just wanted to thank you all for the tips regarding which Denon to look at as replacement for my old AVR-3600. I brought a 1910 and a 2809 home from Best Buy yesterday and spent the afternoon A/B-ing them both with my 3600. Since my speakers can be bi-wired, I was able to use an old video game switching box to flip between the receivers with basically one click.

All my tests were done using CDs, listening in 2-ch stereo mode. I used one song off American Beauty by The Grateful Dead and a couple of songs off Who's Next by The Who in my comparisons.

All the tone controls were flat. I didn't run Audyssey on either receiver, since I didn't have a mic, but I did make sure the mains were set to small, crossover at 80hz, and set the dB plus / minus of each channel equal to the levels on my 3600 from whenever I last attempted to calibrate it using an SPL.

Anyhow -- the 1910 was significantly more harsh than my old 3600. For lack of a better word, there was a smoothness to the sound the 3600 was putting out that was simply lacking in the sound from the 1910. At louder volumes, the 1910 sounded almost harsh and fatiguing in comparison. It's entirely possible that some of the EQ magic from Audyssey could have helped -- my living room certainly isn't an ideal listening environment...

I asked my wife -- who enjoys music, but isn't as critical about it as me -- to do a blind comparison of the two, just to make sure I wasn't pooh-poohing on the cheaper unit, and she had a similar reaction; the 3600 was much more enjoyable than the 1910.

The 2809 was a much more balanced listening experience, right out of the gate. In fact, I think it had a bit more clarity in the sound than my 3600. Bass seemed less boomy, and the acoustic guitars and harmonies in songs like Behind Blue Eyes and Box of Rain seemed even more clear than on the 3600. We re-ran the blind listening test with my wife, and she thought they both sounded great, but actually picked the 2809 over the 3600! We had a winner!

I'm hopeful that after calibrating the 2809 with Audyssey and so forth, it will sound even better.

I just wanted to get the info out there for anyone who might be wrestling with the decision of which receiver to buy. 2809s / 989s can be found for between $250 and $400 more than 1910s, depending on if you're comfortable buying refurbs or not. Happy hunting! And thanks again for the advice!

Regards,
-Brian
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post #727 of 9378 Old 07-06-2009, 09:25 AM - Thread Starter
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good work I also agree that the 19XX level models are not great for higher volume, 2CH music listening. there is definitely a lack of "smoothness" or control/detail that I have noticed as well. I used to own a 3803 and my current 789 (same as 1909) does not have that lush, detailed, "transparent" sound with 2-Ch music when I really crank it up.

thankfully, most owners of a model in this price class (including me) are mostly watching HT or listening to music at more moderate volume levels, where the Dynamic EQ / Volume features really bring out a lot of lush warmth to the sound. but I don't think you can expect a modern, $500 AVR to have the same kind of 2-channel "chops" as a BEAST like the old 3600! I've heard that thing was a monster

I agree with SoM before that, post Audyssey calibration, the 1910 would probably actually sound BETTER than the 3600 with movies (again thanks to Audyssey + Dynamic EQ), but as you have found a 24-lb modern entry level unit isn't built like the old hoss receivers of old. Glad you found that the 2809 was up to snuff though, congrats and enjoy the new toy

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post #728 of 9378 Old 07-06-2009, 09:45 AM
 
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@ Brain K

I could beleive that a 2809 sounded better than the 1910 , but the 3600dts which is a power house @ 140 watt RMS per channel . makes me shake my head. I know you hear what you hear and I'm not saying your wrong in your judgement , but to be fair I would do a retest.. I would just keep the 3600dts for now if you are still going to use 5.1 or less... Unless you just got to have 7.1 and /or HDMI for use of HD blu-ray , a very good AVR like 3600dts should keep you happy till the next audio break though..

I have to agree that there is a open "air" with Audyssey + Dynamic EQ. But ( Brain K ) said he demo in 2 channel stereo. I would think and knowing what I've heard in the past, that the 3600 would put out a soild wall of sound would / should blow lesser amps away !!
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post #729 of 9378 Old 07-06-2009, 06:39 PM
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@tomuchtv

Yeah, it's all subjective. I posted a couple of pages back, feel free to look for more info, but the short version is I'm replacing my 3600 (no DTS) because the center channel amp died and it'll be $250 or so to fix through United Radio. So, it seemed like a good time to upgrade to all the new formats. Otherwise I'd just use the 3600 forever, since I'm a cheapskate and I love how it sounds.

I'm not in a big room, and with math being the way it is -- logarithmic decibel scale and all -- 25 watts isn't a huge issue. I lucked into a cheap 3600 10 or so years ago, basically, so my goal here was to basically not take a giant step back when listening to 2 channel music. (I kind of assume 5.1 movies will sound awesome with Audyssey and all if the 2ch stuff works for me.)

As for the A/B test, I definitely wasn't driving it at "reference level." as nebulous as that is for music. I think we had them both around -19dB from 10 or 12 ft, and that was as loud as I'd ever want to listen. It's entirely possible I was just hearing what I wanted to hear -- I wouldn't call myself an "audiophile," but more of an "enthusiast," and yeah, the 2809 had better mid / high clarity. The 3600 was a bit smoother, and the bass seemed a little more punchy. (Which surprised me, since the sub is external, I didn't change the sub's settings, and I tried to make sure that both of them were hooked up the same way.)

YMMV.

Regards,
-Brian
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post #730 of 9378 Old 07-06-2009, 08:41 PM
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I've got the AVR-790. I started playing with dynamic volume, and I realize there are three settings: DAY(low), Evening(medium), and Midnight (high). I was able to change these by the onscreen menu, and then after that via the LED display although its not obvious that way. Other than being able to turn dyn vol on and off via the remote, is there a way to change the dyn volume settings directly via the remote?
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post #731 of 9378 Old 07-06-2009, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbig119 View Post

Other than being able to turn dyn vol on and off via the remote, is there a way to change the dyn volume settings directly via the remote?

Nope, not on the std remote. You can program a Harmony to do this, but most folks just leave it on Eve and just toggle On/Off. Day is too light for much effect and MN too compressed unless someone's sleeping in the next room. I turn DynVol Off (red light=DynEQ is ON) for critical 2 Ch listening and for full dynamic effect on 5.1 movies.

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #732 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 04:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtv47lg70 View Post

i am assuming that you meant to type hdmi audio out setting needs to be set to TV

Actually no, I meant AMP as I indicated. Setting HDMI Audio Out to TV is only used when the AVR is ON and then only when HDMI Control is OFF. The OP is trying to use the HDMI Control feature in Standby which requires HDMI Audio Out set to AMP, HDMI Control set to ON, and Standby Source set to whichever HDMI jack is being used (HDMI1, HDMI2, HDMI3, HDMI4).

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post #733 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian K View Post

Hi everyone,

Anyhow -- the 1910 was significantly more harsh than my old 3600. For lack of a better word, there was a smoothness to the sound the 3600 was putting out that was simply lacking in the sound from the 1910. At louder volumes, the 1910 sounded almost harsh and fatiguing in comparison. It's entirely possible that some of the EQ magic from Audyssey could have helped -- my living room certainly isn't an ideal listening environment...

Anyone else want to chime in on SQ of 1910 vs. 2809.

The 1910 is pretty much exactly what I am looking for, but I do enjoy good audio quality. I am, however, no audiophile by AVS standards, and I will NEVER listen to the receiver at reference levels. Good quality low-to-moderate volume audio is what I am after. Add in good HT performance.

I'm looking to upgrade from an old (2000ish) Technics DX940 receiver, if that tells you anything (it probably should tell you that pretty much anything will be an upgrade in SQ!)

EDIT: more to the point, I'm not necessarily opposed to shelling out the $$$ for the 2809, but would much prefer to stick with the 1910 if the improvement in SQ for my needs would be marginal. Obviously, only I can conclusively answer that question, but I welcome opinions.
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post #734 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 05:01 PM
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gte, what're your speakers?

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #735 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 05:05 PM
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Sorry, meant to put that in there. Only running a pair of Sierra-1's now, but plan to add a Sierra-1 center, and then down the road to add surrounds and a sub,
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post #736 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 05:06 PM - Thread Starter
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at moderate volumes, you are unlikely to experience any major SQ benefits from the 2809. the MultEQ + Dynamic EQ system will be of far greater relative impact to your listening than the slight improvements in power / processing in the 2809.

if you want real SQ improvement, the extra money would provide more bang-for-the-buck if you used it to add that center channel, get a nicer sub, or add some room treatments.

speakers + room acoustics are 90%+ of the battle.... then MultEQ can help clean up some of the mess left over by correcting for your room's leftover acoustic anomalies. think of that extra little bit of pre/pro quality in the 2809 as the final icing on the cake (e.g. subtle gains in "detail" or "transparency"), but it's not going to provide nearly as large of gains as making sure the other parts of the equation are in place.

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post #737 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 05:14 PM
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Thanks batpig. That's what I was thinking. I just don't think I'm going to push the receiver hard enough to justify a 2809 at this point. I do, however, really want all of the Audyssey features, especially Dynamic Volume, so that's why I ultimately picked the 1910 vs. a more audio-centric receiver like the Marantz 5003.
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post #738 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 06:49 PM
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Hi,

Great thread, thanking many of the helpers here. I just got a new Denon 1909 and was trying to set things up. I've tried to follow the guidelines on this tread as much as possible but still need help. Here are the current problems:

1. I don't seem to be getting enough volume out of my speakers. I'm using a 7.1 setup with polk audio speakers (RT3, CS175i, RM6751 on surrounds) w/ JBL PB10 subwoofer. The fronts and woofer are pretty old but look new and the surrounds are brand new. I have to raise the volume from -80 all the way to -15dB just to get regular "room" level sound (albeit I don't hear any hissing). I'm using brand new Monster in-wall speaker wires (Model: XP-CI100). What is wrong?

2. Other things I've noticed is receiver getting pretty hot in short amount of time, specifically on the top right side. Is that normal?

3. As I change the cable channels, sometimes the voice cuts out for a couple of seconds and then comes back in while on other channels, the video cuts in and out. Why is this happening?

4. Also as I change channels, the audio-in shows different modes (FL-FR, 5.1) and the output to speakers usually matches that. Shouldn't the output to the speakers always be 7.1 since that's what I have connected? If not, can I change that?

FYI, I've not yet used Audyssey setup, instead opting for the manual setup but I doubt the current problems have anything to do with that right?

I realize this a 1910 thread but since they're essentially the same unit, I'm hoping you can help out here.

Thanks.
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post #739 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Actually no, I meant AMP as I indicated. Setting HDMI Audio Out to TV is only used when the AVR is ON and then only when HDMI Control is OFF. The OP is trying to use the HDMI Control feature in Standby which requires HDMI Audio Out set to AMP, HDMI Control set to ON, and Standby Source set to whichever HDMI jack is being used (HDMI1, HDMI2, HDMI3, HDMI4).

a couple more days of pm's between you and batpig and i should have a handle on it.. lol.. thank so much you guys...
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post #740 of 9378 Old 07-07-2009, 11:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pamnyc2010 View Post

I realize this a 1910 thread but since they're essentially the same unit, I'm hoping you can help out here.

Thanks.

yet you double posted in the 1909 thread??

I already answered you there.

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post #741 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 02:09 AM
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hi all:

as reading through 25 pages, I see alot of no audio for DVR cable box. My box is Motorola DCX3400 connect to AVR through HDMI input 4 as indicate on the AVR. no audio for TV when swiching back and forth between DVD/PS3. The DVD/PS3 are fine in both sound and video but NOT the DVR box. just NO sound. HDMI set to TV in AVR. the only way to have sound it to go back to manual setup and HDMI setup and re-select audio to TV (already at TV).

any suggestion what might cause the issue? this is another brand new AVR 1910. strongly believe the setup between DVR and AVR cause the problem.
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post #742 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by na_tra View Post

hi all:

as reading through 25 pages, I see alot of no audio for DVR cable box. My box is Motorola DCX3400 connect to AVR through HDMI input 4 as indicate on the AVR. no audio for TV when swiching back and forth between DVD/PS3. The DVD/PS3 are fine in both sound and video but NOT the DVR box. just NO sound. HDMI set to TV in AVR. the only way to have sound it to go back to manual setup and HDMI setup and re-select audio to TV (already at TV).

any suggestion what might cause the issue? this is another brand new AVR 1910. strongly believe the setup between DVR and AVR cause the problem.

I presume your dvr is your cable box receiver, if so, in my cable box(pace 4250) setting, I changed the audio to HDMI . If I wanted the audio to toslink, I had to change to Dolby Digital.

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post #743 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankmar View Post

I presume your dvr is your cable box receiver, if so, in my cable box(pace 4250) setting, I changed the audio to HDMI . If I wanted the audio to toslink, I had to change to Dolby Digital.

yes, it's the comcast cable box. how do you change to dolby digital in the AVR. i have not read through the avr manual yet.

TIA
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post #744 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by na_tra View Post

yes, it's the comcast cable box. how do you change to dolby digital in the AVR. i have not read through the avr manual yet.

TIA

In my cable box,
Audio Setting
Dolby Digital refers to Toslink(optical )

Hdmi, Sound coming from the HDMI

In other words, I can have the video through Hdmi but sound could come within hdmi or tosling wire.

But in your case its not the AVR you should look into your Cable box setting.

Or even better, take your Ps3 hdmi(that is working fine) remove it from the ps3 and connect it to your Cable box. If it works, than its in the AVR if not than its in your Cable box

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post #745 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 10:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by na_tra View Post

My box is Motorola DCX3400 connect to AVR through HDMI input 4 as indicate on the AVR. no audio for TV when swiching back and forth between DVD/PS3. The DVD/PS3 are fine in both sound and video but NOT the DVR box. just NO sound. HDMI set to TV in AVR.

Why is HDMI Audio set to "TV" and not "AMP"? Are you trying to listen with the TV speakers? Do you not have external speakers?

Anyway, if you are going to use the Denon as an HDMI switch essentially to pass the audio to your TV, you need to FORCE YOUR SOURCES to output 2-ch PCM audio over HDMI or you will keep getting this problem.

With HDMI equipped devices, they negotiate a "handshake" where each device reports its capabilities (EDID info) to the other device. When you switch away from the cable box, and then back, the cable box "sees" a multichannel AVR and probably starts outputting Dolby Digital, which is passed through to your TV but your TV is stereo and cannot accept multichannel audio!! Thus, the audio disappears.

When you go to the "HDMI Audio Out" setting and switch it back to AMP and TV again, the cable box probably "renegotiates" the handshake and properly sees the TV and goes back to 2-ch output.

So go to your "Audio out" or "HDMI Audio" settings in your cable box and set it to "PCM" or "2-CH" or something like that. It should cure the issue.

These AVR's are not intended to be used as HDMI switches to pass audio to your TV! As a temporary solution while you are waiting for your speakers to show up or something, it's fine, but the whole point is to hear great sound from external speakers!! If you occasionally want to watch some TV without surround sound and just using the TV speakers, that is why you have the HDMI Control passthrough feature.

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post #746 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 11:37 AM
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thank you both frankmar & batpig. I will try it again tonight. Batpig. I dont have external speakers yet. just want to use the TV speaker for now.
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post #747 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 11:40 AM - Thread Starter
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gotcha -- in that case, I bet that "forcing" the cable box to 2-CH output over HDMI will resolve the issue.

please do report back and let us know if that is successful!

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post #748 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Why is HDMI Audio set to "TV" and not "AMP"? Are you trying to listen with the TV speakers? Do you not have external speakers?

Anyway, if you are going to use the Denon as an HDMI switch essentially to pass the audio to your TV, you need to FORCE YOUR SOURCES to output 2-ch PCM audio over HDMI or you will keep getting this problem.

Keep in mind this is the same guy that has been posting on this issue for the past 3 weeks with this same audio issue. His recent post just made it seem like it was a new issue. Although, switching to 2-ch PCM might work in his case, it depends on what the cable/satellite box is sending over the HDMI when DD 5.1 is selected. With my DirecTV HD DVR, I can only choose PCM 2.0 or DD 5.1. When DD 5.1 is selected, my Panny has no audio issues with the HDMI cable running straight to the Panny.

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post #749 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Keep in mind this is the same guy that has been posting on this issue for the past 3 weeks with this same audio issue. His recent post just made it seem like it was a new issue. Although, switching to 2-ch PCM might work in his case, it would be unique to his HDTV, as HDTVs generally can receive a DD 5.1 signal over HDMI without issue.

you r corret. it's me. i just post it again because electronic-expo just exchange for me another brand new one after denon rep told me that the 1st avr was defective. it happens the same with this one. so i know for sure not the avr fault. just the set up between the DCX3400 box.
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post #750 of 9378 Old 07-08-2009, 04:06 PM
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Yeh .. I got that. However, you never indicated whether you changed the HD DVR audio output setting to L-PCM?

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