Denon AVR-4310CI Thread - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

I'd think the 4310 has plenty of " ompf " for your sized room.

It was able to drive all 9 of my speakers plus all 6 of my subwoofers!

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post #182 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 12:37 PM
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Hi there,

I know the 4310ci can upconvert Analog > HDMI resolution, but can it also convert a 720p/1080i HDMI signal > HDMI (1080p) like the YAM RX-Z7? (see graph)

I'm also wondering if owners of the 4310ci are generally happy with their purchase. I own a RX-V2700 and can attest to the "brightness" issue and would like to change receivers. I love the Marantz Sound but the Denon 4310ci seems to have it all including a warmer sound. I've heard rumour of a Marantz SR6004 but couldn't get any spec info. Is the 4310ci the way to go at this particular time?

Many Thanks
LL
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post #183 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer
I'd think the 4310 has plenty of " ompf " for your sized room.

It was able to drive all 9 of my speakers plus all 6 of my subwoofers!

YIKES !! My 3806 has less power than the 4310, and with 9 speakers and only 1 SVS cylinder sub, people still look over at me during explosions as if to ask " did I really feel that ? ". 9 subs - ha ha !! Wish I could pop over for a listen !!

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post #184 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synch View Post

Hi there,

I know the 4310ci can upconvert Analog > HDMI resolution, but can it also convert a 720p/1080i HDMI signal > HDMI (1080p) like the YAM RX-Z7? (see graph)

Yes, the 4310CI has full video scaling for analog and digital inputs, any signal can be scaled up to 1080p (60 or 24) and this can be set separately for each input source.

there is a similar chart to the one you posted on pg 10 pf the 4310CI owner's manual:
http://www.usa.denon.com/AVR-4310CI-OM-E_000.pdf

Also see pg 49 of the manual for conversion/scaling settings, and pg 77 for picture adjust settings (both set by input)

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post #185 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Yes, the 4310CI has full video scaling for analog and digital inputs, any signal can be scaled up to 1080p (60 or 24) and this can be set separately for each input source.

there is a similar chart to the one you posted on pg 10 pf the 4310CI owner's manual:
http://www.usa.denon.com/AVR-4310CI-OM-E_000.pdf

Also see pg 49 of the manual for conversion/scaling settings, and pg 77 for picture adjust settings (both set by input)

I'm going to look that stuff over to see if I missed anything but maybe you or some owner could let me know about this real quick: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post16746209

Thanks.

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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post #186 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 02:11 PM
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if it has it, it's not in the manual. the settings on pg 77 are all you get beyond the standard HDMI settings for resolution, RGB range, etc.

I doubt they will implement every last feature of the ABT-2010 in an AVR like they would in a dedicated, external video processor.

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post #187 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

if it has it, it's not in the manual. the settings on pg 77 are all you get beyond the standard HDMI settings for resolution, RGB range, etc.

I doubt they will implement every last feature of the ABT-2010 in an AVR like they would in a dedicated, external video processor.

That's what I figured but it's pretty darned close!

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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post #188 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 03:19 PM
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Guess I am sorta an owner now... Just picked up one at BB for decent discount, but it's not going to be in until late Sat or sunday morning.

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post #189 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Q of BanditZ View Post

That's what I figured but it's pretty darned close!

I will play some games with my 360 later and report back.

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post #190 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by TenthScale View Post

Guess I am sorta an owner now... Just picked up one at BB for decent discount, but it's not going to be in until late Sat or sunday morning.


Congrats! Good move.

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post #191 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Yes, the 4310CI has full video scaling for analog and digital inputs, any signal can be scaled up to 1080p (60 or 24) and this can be set separately for each input source.

there is a similar chart to the one you posted on pg 10 pf the 4310CI owner's manual:

Also see pg 49 of the manual for conversion/scaling settings, and pg 77 for picture adjust settings (both set by input)

Hi, Thanks Batpig. I wasn't looking at the right page earlier and wasn't sure if it could upscale an HDMI input > HDMI output. The reason I would buy this receiver is to upscale a 1080i HD Satellite signal to 1080p on a new Panasonic TC-P46G1 plasma. The Marantz SR6003 didn't do this too well although I love the sound of it. The Denon 2308 sounded pretty darn nice at the AV store I went to and can only assume the 4310 would sound just as nice or even better along with enhanced upscaling.

I don't see anything else that quite compares to the 4310 other than the RX-Z7 but I am tired of the bright sound the Yamaha puts out when I play or stream music.

Once again many thanks. I'm glad to be aboard on this thread.
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post #192 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post

When running through the receiver, you cannot play sound through BOTH the TV speakers and your external speakers, the TV/AMP setting for "HDMI audio" is an either/or thing.

The most important question is.... why the heck would you WANT to??

You can do it via workarounds -- for example, running HDMI from cable box direct to TV, and then running an optical cable from cable box to AVR.


Yup, I thought it was an either/or thing.

That is the way I have had it connected for the last few years with my old Denon 4306. HDMI to tv, and then optical to avr.

I don't always like to have the sound coming through my main system. Late at night it's just too loud for anyone trying to sleep.

Anyway, thanks for the confirmation batpig. Much appreciated.
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post #193 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 09:03 PM
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Yup, I thought it was an either/or thing.

That is the way I have had it connected for the last few years with my old Denon 4306. HDMI to tv, and then optical to avr.

I don't always like to have the sound coming through my main system. Late at night it's just too loud for anyone trying to sleep.

Anyway, thanks for the confirmation batpig. Much appreciated.

I have my cable HD running to the 4310CI via HDMI and sound set to play on the AVR. I also have the standby source set for the cable box and when the power is off on the AVR the sound is passed through to the TV over HDMI. If I read this correctly this is what you are trying to do. I had the same concern but it actually works very good with only HDMI. Does this help?
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post #194 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by DouglasM View Post

FilmMixer, you say:

"Finally, when using HDMI control, the passthrough works when the 4310 is in standby, but the TV's speakers are turned off from HDMI control, so you have no sound without going back into the TV's menu and turning the speakers on again... "

I have the 2809. When in standby, the unit passes through a signal to my TV so I can listen to the TV without turning on the receiver. The HDMI control does not require me to turn the TV speakers back on. Is this something specific to the 4310?

My TV is a Panasonic plasma. What TV are you using?

Douglas

Douglas... had some time tonight to play some more... I have a Samsung A750 series DLP set...

I re-set it up and it is working better... when I turn off the 4310, the speaker are coming back on... however, I will say that tonight I had my TV "crash" in that the volume control locked up and I couldn't do anything without re-powering the set... I didn't have this issue at all with the Z7, but as I said, it didn't require CEC to be on to pass through in standby... I'll be putting this one on the Samsung for now.
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post #195 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 11:14 PM
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Howdy all,

Long-time listener....first-time caller....love the show

I'm a long-time lurker and decided to finally participate since I just ordered the 4310. I just wanted to thank everybody that participated in this thread, since your insights helped me make my decision.

Just for some background - I've been searching for a receiver for the better part of 8 months to a year...so I hope this one will be a keeper. Over the past year I've had several receivers through my house, each of them for at least a few weeks at a time so I was able to give them a thorough workout in my own listening/viewing environment.

All-told, I've been through the Denon 3808 & 4308, Onkyo 906, NAD 765, Marantz 6003 & 8002, and the Pioneer SC-07.

Unfortunately, even though all of them were quite good, I found something glaring that I didn't like about each of those units - and ended up not sticking with any of them. Although me being overly-picky about my HT gear contributed to that as well.

The one that came closest to staying from a sound + feature-set standpoint was the 4308 (and maybe the Marantz 8002) - but the video processing was so horrible on the 4308, even with the scaler turned off - it seemed to soften the PQ considerably. So I'm hoping the 4310 may be the answer.

I'll be very anxious to compare the 4310 to the previous models I've had. And if anybody has any questions on the Denon vs the other models I've spent time with...I'll be more than happy to answer.

Hopefully it will be here by Thursday so I can get it hooked-up and running by the weekend.

Best regards,

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post #196 of 5307 Old 06-30-2009, 11:33 PM
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I have a quick question about the new Audyssey DSX and the Dolby Pro Logic IIz... maybe someone can answer this...

Can the 4310 only run it 7 speakers at a time or can it do 9? I know it only has 7 amp channels, but it does have 9 terminals and shows that it can do a double set of side surrounds, but it does not show nine employing the new technologies...

On Audysseys site, they show 9.1 setups with either a 5.1 accented by the wide speakers and the height speakers, or 7.1's accented by either the wides or the heights. Can the Denon do this?

My thought was it would be awesome if via the 8/9 terminals and maybe some rca assignable outputs to a separate amp, you could run the Dolby Pro Logic IIZ to get the height speakers and run the audyssey dsx at the same time in the 9.1 setup with the wides and rear surrounds. This way you would have an 11.1 setup, which would be pretty engulfing, but I am assuming this is impossible...

Just curious since I am getting a new receiver within the next few weeks...
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post #197 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjsullivan72 View Post

The one that came closest to staying from a sound + feature-set standpoint was the 4308 (and maybe the Marantz 8002) - but the video processing was so horrible on the 4308, even with the scaler turned off - it seemed to soften the PQ considerably.

That's disheartening to hear because I've often read that Denon AVRs do an excellent job of passing through HDMI video untouched without doing anything to hurt the PQ.

Were you using a Blu-ray 1080p source when you witnessed the softend PQ? I hope the 4310 works out for you and passes through the video transparently.

I've yet to upgrade to an HDMI AVR and I'm kind of a videophile so I'm nervous about sending my video through a receiver. I've always prefered to send video directly from the source to the display. Most AVRs seem to come with lots of fancy video processing these days but I plan to turn all that stuff OFF. 1080p/24 doesn't need additional video processing (IMO). I really want to upgrade to HDMI lossess audio though so I'm currently researching AVRs and the Denons look very promising - especially the 4310.
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post #198 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt C View Post

That's disheartening to hear because I've often read that Denon AVRs do an excellent job of passing through HDMI video untouched without doing anything to hurt the PQ.

Were you using a Blu-ray 1080p source when you witnessed the softend PQ? I hope the 4310 works out for you and passes through the video transparently.

I've yet to upgrade to an HDMI AVR and I'm kind of a videophile so I'm nervous about sending my video through a receiver. I've always prefered to send video directly from the source to the display. Most AVRs seem to come with lots of fancy video processing these days but I plan to turn all that stuff OFF. 1080p/24 doesn't need additional video processing (IMO). I really want to upgrade to HDMI lossess audio though so I'm currently researching AVRs and the Denons look very promising - especially the 4310.

I did an AB comparison on my 4310 connected directly to my Runco projector with 100 inch screen and compared it to running it through the receiver and I could not tell the difference on that big of a screen. Previously I was using a Geffen switcher and a ton of cords and opticals. What a joy to be able to take all those out and go with 3 HDMI cables! You said you wanted to get the new lossless codecs then you should get a new receiver for this alone! I upgraded from a Denon 3801 and could not believe the difference in sound between Dolby True HD and DTS Master Audio. From an audio perspective it is even bigger than going from DVD to blueray in my setup! The audio processing and corrections that the receiver made in my setup has been amazing. But as you are a videophile I think you will be happy with the Denon with no video changes on the passthrough.
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post #199 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 07:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt C View Post

That's disheartening to hear because I've often read that Denon AVRs do an excellent job of passing through HDMI video untouched without doing anything to hurt the PQ.

I can also say the of all the Denon's I have had in my system in the last 2 years (5308, 4308 and the 4310) that the 4308 was "softer" than the 5308, and the 4310 looks fantastic.
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post #200 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 07:39 AM
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Picked up my 4310 yesterday - from the first wave of them available in Canada... As usual, Dennon undershipped, so most pre-orders aren't getting filled. For example, my dealer was supposed to get 3 in, got 1, and already has a waiting list past the 3 pre-orders he'd already done. Glad I was #1 on the pre-order list!

Opened up the box last night and I can say this much so far: it looks very nice. Won't be able to set up or throw a review out here for another week (or two) at the least.

Still, very happy to have one of these beasts in my possession!
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post #201 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ruthrower View Post

I have a quick question about the new Audyssey DSX and the Dolby Pro Logic IIz... maybe someone can answer this...

Can the 4310 only run it 7 speakers at a time or can it do 9? I know it only has 7 amp channels, but it does have 9 terminals and shows that it can do a double set of side surrounds, but it does not show nine employing the new technologies...

On Audysseys site, they show 9.1 setups with either a 5.1 accented by the wide speakers and the height speakers, or 7.1's accented by either the wides or the heights. Can the Denon do this?

My thought was it would be awesome if via the 8/9 terminals and maybe some rca assignable outputs to a separate amp, you could run the Dolby Pro Logic IIZ to get the height speakers and run the audyssey dsx at the same time in the 9.1 setup with the wides and rear surrounds. This way you would have an 11.1 setup, which would be pretty engulfing, but I am assuming this is impossible...

Just curious since I am getting a new receiver within the next few weeks...

I am afraid not. According to the manual, you cannot run IIz and Audyssey DSX at the same time. And if I am not mistaken, you can only run the run the unit in a 7.1 configuration mode whether using out board amps or not (the 4310 has 7.1 preamp outs) based on how its surround back/amp assign is set up. {pages 11,12,34,76} You may want to see what the 4810 has to offer when it comes out later this year, suppose to be a 9 channel receiver. It is something I am considering myself. I just pulled the trigger on a 4310, either consider keeping it myself (not even out of the box yet) or send it back and hold off for the 4810.
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post #202 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 09:19 AM
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the ability to power 9 channels at once is probably the biggest "step up" feature of the 4810CI. It is spec'd as a "9.3" receiver, so it will have 9 channels of amplification and three subwoofer outputs which will (presumably) be EQ'd separately by Audyssey.

Just a quick note on this:

Quote:


My thought was it would be awesome if via the 8/9 terminals and maybe some rca assignable outputs to a separate amp, you could run the Dolby Pro Logic IIZ to get the height speakers and run the audyssey dsx at the same time in the 9.1 setup with the wides and rear surrounds.

From what I understand, you would never run PLIIz and DSX at the same time, they are competitors and doing the same thing. It would be like running DTS Neo and Pro Logic at the same time. If you have a 5.1 soundtrack, you can use PLIIx to generate "rear" channels, PLIIz to generate "height" channels... or you can use Audyssey DSX to generate your choice of "height", "wide", or "rear" channels. So it would be one or the other.

4310 owners -- could you run a "faux" 9.1 with A+B surround speakers? Does it allow Surround A+B operation with PLIIz or DSX engaged?

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post #203 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 11:57 AM
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Do we have an idea on the price for the 4810? I am waiting for my 4310 but after looking at the 3310 there does not seem to be much compelling reason to stick with it. However, if the 4810 is not way more it might be worth waiting on that? Otherwise I need to decide if I want to save a bunch of money and get the 33.
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post #204 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 11:58 AM
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4810CI will have a $3000 msrp according to the initial release info.

see this post for full specs:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post16693375

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post #205 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 12:11 PM
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Quote:


Can the 4310 only run it 7 speakers at a time or can it do 9? I know it only has 7 amp channels, but it does have 9 terminals and shows that it can do a double set of side surrounds, but it does not show nine employing the new technologies...

I just read the 4310 manual and it can run 9 speakers. I am running 9 speakers right now with my older 3806, LCR, surround pair A, surround pair B, and a pair of rear surrounds. Let me tell you this - adding the second pair of side surrounds ( and properly spacing both pairs of side surround speakers ) made a big improvement in envelopment as far as I'm concerned. I'm running Axiom QS8 surrounds. No problems. I'm going to hook up the 4310 the same way. Best tweek I've done recently ( other than reading tips from Batpig's Denon manual )!!

WARNING - even if they had the ability to hook up 9 speakers, I wouldn't try this with an under powered AVR. But the 3806 doesn't even break a sweat in my theater, and I'm sure the 4310 wouldn't either.

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post #206 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 12:13 PM
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Quote:


4810CI will have a $3000 msrp according to the initial release info.

Correct - 1K more than the 4310's MSRP.

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post #207 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

I just read the 4310 manual and it can run 9 speakers. I am running 9 speakers right now with my older 3806, LCR, surround pair A, surround pair B, and a pair of rear surrounds. Let me tell you this - adding the second pair of side surrounds ( and properly spacing both pairs of side surround speakers ) made a big improvement in envelopment as far as I'm concerned. I'm running Axiom QS8 surrounds. No problems. I'm going to hook up the 4310 the same way. Best tweek I've done recently ( other than reading tips from Batpig's Denon manual )!!

WARNING - even if they had the ability to hook up 9 speakers, I wouldn't try this with an under powered AVR. But the 3806 doesn't even break a sweat in my theater, and I'm sure the 4310 wouldn't either.

I am running 9 speakers and 6 subs with my 4310. No issues.

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post #208 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 01:47 PM
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So you do have 5.1, with two additional "height" speakers and then Surround A+B simultaneously in the sides/rears, correct? The Surround A+B speakers produce the same signal, right?

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post #209 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 01:49 PM
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Any opinions on 2-channel audio quality? I may have missed it in the thread - but I haven't seen comments regarding audio quality for music which is very important to me.

Thanks
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post #210 of 5307 Old 07-01-2009, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by akopperl View Post

Any opinions on 2-channel audio quality? I may have missed it in the thread - but I haven't seen comments regarding audio quality for music which is very important to me.

Thanks

+1 and SACD/DVD-A also. Thanks in advance.
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Denon Avr 4311ci 9 2 Channel Network Multi Room Home Theater Receiver With Hdmi 1 4a , Denon Avr4310ci Receiver , Denon
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